Star Gazer Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 Jerber, you're also incorrect. "Not a good fit" was an obvious pretext for discrimination, particularly given the temporal proximity between her disclosure and termination. At best, this is a mixed-motives case and thus they still violated PA's anti-discrimination statutes. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Lauriebell82 Posted May 7, 2011 Author Share Posted May 7, 2011 HIPPA says I DON'T have to disclose I have Epilepsy, even moreso because the disability does not interfere with the essential functions of my job (which it doesn't) and since I don't need reasonable accomodations because of it. On a questionare I listed that I had a medical condition but did not disclose what it was, and legally they can't ask me what it is. Doesn't even matter that they kept it "vague" you can't legally fire someone after they disclose they have a disability, especially since there was no previous reasoning or justification for it. No disciplinary reports, no negative reports whatsoever. They even have the order form which I signed THAT MORNING for a filing cabinet. Clearly they weren't planning on firing me prior to my disclosure. They already told me it wasn't because of my performance and I only worked there for 2 weeks. They don't have a leg to stand on actually. And even if they DID fire me for not disclosing I have Epilepsy, I don't legally have to so they STILL broke the law. Link to post Share on other sites
Star Gazer Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 Well, HIPAA's really not relevant in this instance. That protects against your employer's disclosure of your medical condition to others (aka maintaining your privacy) - not your disclosure to your employer. That said, fact is, they find you to be "not a good fit" because of your disability. THAT is discrimination in its purest form, both under PA law and Title VII. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Lauriebell82 Posted May 7, 2011 Author Share Posted May 7, 2011 Well, HIPAA's really not relevant in this instance. That protects against your employer's disclosure of your medical condition to others (aka maintaining your privacy) - not your disclosure to your employer. That said, fact is, they find you to be "not a good fit" because of your disability. THAT is discrimination in its purest form, both under PA law and Title VII. Yep, that's what the lawyer said. You are right about it not being HIPAA, I'm pretty sure I DON'T have to disclose that I have Epilepsy though and legally they can't ask me right? Link to post Share on other sites
Star Gazer Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 Yep, that's what the lawyer said. You are right about it not being HIPAA, I'm pretty sure I DON'T have to disclose that I have Epilepsy though and legally they can't ask me right? All they can ask you is whether you have a disability or medical condition which impacts your ability to perform the essential functions of your job, or you have a disability which requires some sort of reasonable accommodation. If, and only if, you say yes, they are duty bound to engage you in an "interactive process" to find out what essential functions you're unable to perform, and/or what reasonable accommodations they can provide. Failure as to either of these items subjects them to liability in a discrimination suit. Link to post Share on other sites
Star Gazer Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 So everyone knows, LB and I are talking off-LS about this... and it's insane. She has the world's stupidest ex-employer I've ever heard of. She couldn't have a better case. Link to post Share on other sites
2sunny Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 what if it was true - not a good fit - could mean anything. maybe they didn't prefer something after having you there. i can understand you focusing on this - but it may not be the reason at all. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Lauriebell82 Posted May 7, 2011 Author Share Posted May 7, 2011 They might have fired you to cover themselves against lawsuits from clients. If you accidentally hurt someone during a seizure, they could be sued. It probably was not worth the risk to them. I do not see the relo money as hush money. They probably felt bad themselves about having to let you go, but they must think of the safety of their clientele first. It doesn't matter if you've not had a seizure in ages. The risk was there, and in this sue-happy world, it was a risk they probably felt they couldn't take. If they really wanted to discriminate against you, they would fight your unemployment claim. So they decided to open themselves up to a law suit from their employee instead? And anyway, if they wanted to protect themselves from me hurting a client then they legally have to provide reasonable accomodations for me (such as if I am interacting with a client and have a seizure, they get a nurse and intervene immediately) to prevent that from happening. They can't just fire me and avoid the whole thing! Link to post Share on other sites
Star Gazer Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 what if it was true - not a good fit - could mean anything. maybe they didn't prefer something after having you there. i can understand you focusing on this - but it may not be the reason at all. Not based on the details she's described. No way, no how. They were smitten kittens with her and her performance up until the moment she told them about her condition...and then just three effing hours later, they fired her and refused to give a reason other than "not a good fit," even commending her performance and personality and such as she was being shown the door! This is TEXTBOOK. It's blatant it's almost unbelievable... but yet, it's true. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Lauriebell82 Posted May 7, 2011 Author Share Posted May 7, 2011 what if it was true - not a good fit - could mean anything. maybe they didn't prefer something after having you there. i can understand you focusing on this - but it may not be the reason at all. The point is they didn't SAY anything about me not being a good fit prior to my disclosure, OR after. They just all of the sudden fired me without a single word or anything a few hours later. I never saw it coming at all, I was so confused when they told me they were firing me. Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 Are they going to rehire for your position or is your position being absorbed into the company ?.. If they absorb it and don't rehire they could claim they didn't need her anymore and cutbacks are why she was let go, she would get unemployment. Link to post Share on other sites
Star Gazer Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 My heart's actually beating a little faster and harder over this! And it's not even me! So I can't imagine how LB must feel! Link to post Share on other sites
Star Gazer Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 Are they going to rehire for your position or is your position being absorbed into the company ?.. If they absorb it and don't rehire they could claim they didn't need her anymore and cutbacks are why she was let go, she would get unemployment. They were in the process of spending money on her literally hours before they found out and let her go. And if it was a financial reason or just didn't need her because someone else could absorb the work, they'd have no reason to hide that fact from her. But nope... There's no escaping this. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Lauriebell82 Posted May 7, 2011 Author Share Posted May 7, 2011 They were in the process of spending money on her literally hours before they found out and let her go. And if it was a financial reason or just didn't need her because someone else could absorb the work, they'd have no reason to hide that fact from her. But nope... There's no escaping this. They are actually expanding their facility to accept more clients, which actually WHY they hired me! So they are even more stupid that they fired me because now they have to spend time hiring someone else! I can still get unemployment anyway, right SG? They didn't inform me prior to firing me they just all of the sudden did it. My lawyer said I should qualify for it. The laws may be different in PA though about unemployment? Link to post Share on other sites
Star Gazer Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 I can still get unemployment anyway, right SG? They didn't inform me prior to firing me they just all of the sudden did it. My lawyer said I should qualify for it. The laws may be different in PA though about unemployment? Yeah, not sure about unemployment. I can speak to disability discrimination because most states' anti-discrimination statutes/laws follow the feds' Title VII closely (including CA and PA, as I understand it). But unemployment is a separate beast. Typically speaking, however, you can get unemployment benefits if you were terminated unless you did something really bad - such as steal, or get into a fist fight at work, etc., or abandoned your job and effectively quit. If you're "not a good fit," or even just suck at your job, you're eligible for benefits. Link to post Share on other sites
jerbear Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 LB, good luck in the endeavors. Jerber, you're also incorrect. "Not a good fit" was an obvious pretext for discrimination, particularly given the temporal proximity between her disclosure and termination. At best, this is a mixed-motives case and thus they still violated PA's anti-discrimination statutes.Actually I agree to the temporal between her disclosure and termination. Compartimentalized, probationary period and "not a good fit" may make sense. The temporal between disclosure and termination, that is fishy. Doesn't even matter that they kept it "vague" you can't legally fire someone after they disclose they have a disability, especially since there was no previous reasoning or justification for it. No disciplinary reports, no negative reports whatsoever. They even have the order form which I signed THAT MORNING for a filing cabinet. Clearly they weren't planning on firing me prior to my disclosure. They already told me it wasn't because of my performance and I only worked there for 2 weeks. They don't have a leg to stand on actually. And even if they DID fire me for not disclosing I have Epilepsy, I don't legally have to so they STILL broke the law.With this clarity, I agree they don't have a leg to stand on. Especially if they told you not because of performance. I really hope their HR has seen this, if not they are not very bright. I actually have an HR background, worked in and with HIPAA covered entities, and implemented HIPAA in the entity. I know of a similar HR scenario, where prior to termination, the person will claim/have an addiction so the employer can't fire them. The employee gets sent to rehab then gets put on short term and then long term. My HR told me if I pulled that, they will shoot me. That said, fact is, they find you to be "not a good fit" because of your disability. THAT is discrimination in its purest form, both under PA law and Title VII.I have to say yes from the HR point of view operating in PA. Just presenting the HR view. Link to post Share on other sites
D-Lish Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 Why would they see Epilepsy as a problem? That's outrageous! I have someone that works for me that has arthritis, and it totally affects her ability to do her job. It's a really fast paced environment, and not only can't she keep up- she complains openly she can't keep up (often cries). We cut her shifts back a bit after witnessing her bawling her eyes out in the stockroom saying the job was too stressful and it was too hard on her body- and lo and behold she threatened to take her case to the labour board citing discrimination. I'm between a rock and a hard place because she really can't do the job she was hired for- but the situation is delicate and I don't want to get my butt in hot water! (sorry I highjacked!) What I meant to illustrate is, what issue would they have with your condition? It obviously doesn't affect your performance in any way, and never has in the past.... But it's obvious the disclosure had something to do with the firing given the prior feedback and swift reaction after the disclosure. LB, how are you going to proceed? Link to post Share on other sites
jerbear Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 I can still get unemployment anyway, right SG? They didn't inform me prior to firing me they just all of the sudden did it. My lawyer said I should qualify for it. The laws may be different in PA though about unemployment?Most PA employers grant unemployment unless as SG mentioned; abandon your job, fight, theft, destruction of property, documented insubordination, and the list goes on. Now even with that, I've seen PA employers grant COBRA and unemployment anyway. They do it because it really doesn't cost much to the employer and they avoid a battle. This is from the HR view. You'll probably get your unemployment. The COBRA and unemployment portion is pittence compared to a discrimination suit. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Lauriebell82 Posted May 7, 2011 Author Share Posted May 7, 2011 Why would they see Epilepsy as a problem? That's outrageous! Some employers are scared of Epileptics, they think they will have a seizure at anytime and effect their business or freak out their clients. It's about reputation. You'd think that in a human service field they would be understanding, but this specific facility is run more like a business/hotel then a drug and alcohol rehab. Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 I see you're in good hands with SG... Good luck LB.. which ever way you go.. it sure does show you how much they suck though.. It's probably for the best anyhow now that you know what kind of people they really are. Hugs.. and I hope you find placement somewhere else quickly. Link to post Share on other sites
2sunny Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 The point is they didn't SAY anything about me not being a good fit prior to my disclosure, OR after. They just all of the sudden fired me without a single word or anything a few hours later. I never saw it coming at all, I was so confused when they told me they were firing me. you touched briefly of a scenario that happened right before you disclosed your personal info... what exactly happened during that scenario? was something happening at that point... how did you participate with the situation that happened? Link to post Share on other sites
Star Gazer Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 FWIW, I don't think LB should continue to discuss details publicly on a forum. you touched briefly of a scenario that happened right before you disclosed your personal info... what exactly happened during that scenario? was something happening at that point... how did you participate with the situation that happened? Given what she's told me, the answers to these questions really have no impact on what happened. Link to post Share on other sites
thehead Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 FWIW, I don't think LB should continue to discuss details publicly on a forum. Given what she's told me, the answers to these questions really have no impact on what happened. Go get them SG. Lauriebell sorry for others' ignorance. Link to post Share on other sites
D-Lish Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 Some employers are scared of Epileptics, they think they will have a seizure at anytime and effect their business or freak out their clients. It's about reputation. You'd think that in a human service field they would be understanding, but this specific facility is run more like a business/hotel then a drug and alcohol rehab. Which is crazy, because I worked as a Child and Youth Counsellor for many years- and the majority of my co-workers came from a broken home, a background of abuse, and a litany of other issues that actually made them more qualified to help people. As I said in my earlier post, I have an associate that can't function because of her disability- and she brings that to her supervisor's attention, her co-worker's attention, my attention, on a daily basis... And I have to treat her with kid gloves because I don't want to create a law suit for my company. You, on the other hand didn't do anything wrong here. Epilepsy isn't a condition that would have any bearing on day to day operations. It seems ridiculous to me they'd take issue with it. Isn't the whole premise of Rehab providing a safe, compassionate, non judgemental environment? Glad you're chatting with SG offline. She's a smart cookie. Link to post Share on other sites
Star Gazer Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 Glad you're chatting with SG offline. She's a smart cookie. Ha, thanks. She has an attorney too, and it sounds like she's in very good hands. Link to post Share on other sites
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