Still strugling

[trippi1432]

The answer to question 2....do you believe he gave you the same in return? Most likely, he tried to be the best partner he knew how to be to you....the problem doesn't just lie in them, it is within us as well. Until you know that he did his best and you did your best, you will not be able to get to forgiveness and let go in love so you can be free.

 

Trippi,

 

Thank you for your response, it's good to know I am not alone. The answer to the second question though for me must be no, because he didn't try and he wasn't the best he knew how to be, not one little bit. I will never be able to forgive him, I know that, never.

 

 

Willow - you missed the point of question 2 sweetie...by nature, we are all human...no..in your mind he didn't give you the best he had...he should have and that may feel unforgivable....to you. On the other side, riddled with compassion and forgiveness, you will one day realize that you can't fix him...that he will only see truth as he sees it...and you will only see truth as you see it...that's when you will let go.

 

It is with maturity and true love and ambivalence that you will move forward in life....and allow yourself to become unstuck. Not unstuck to be with another person again...but unstuck to be able to love yourself again.

[Yasuandio]

On Being Replaced So Soon

 

In my case, she was already there - I just didn't see it, even though she was right under my nose. I first met her about four years ago at Starbucks. While my husband and I waited for our coffees to be prepared at the service counter, a blonde haired young lady bumped into him, and then stated, "Oh, don't I know you?"

 

She seated herself and two teenage kids right next to our table outside. The next thing you, she recalls where she knows H, and strikes up a big convo. We were about to purchase a major restaurant in town that she apparently frequented. I bragged on how proud I was of him. She gave him all sorts of comliments, and ideas. Then the girl talk. I did say I wished he had the energy after his hard work each day to offer my that nice smile. She advised perhaps some "candlelight dinners" would do the trick.

 

During the entire convo, he was wiggling like a worm. Then suddenly heexclaimed that he wanted to go to Pier 1. I'm like, honey, we haven't even finished our coffees, he got up, and it was by-by time.

 

I told a nieghbor/friend about it. She confessed once to being the "other woman" before remarrying. She told me, this sounded like the classic other woman placing herself in a situation where she could meet the competition. This friend/neighbor knew I had my antenna up, and that I was tracking him with a GPS system.

 

Fast forward, post separation, several times I believe I have seen this girl driving one of our Z3 on a particular street at a particular time. There is no doubt in my mind that I have seen her with him in the Z, top down, at least a half dozen times.

 

Last Easter, we both had out Z3 top down, and happened to be turning at the same time at the entrance of a ritzy sub-division. (Side Note. He used to take me there on such holidays. I'm sure he was shocked that I might have a friend in a nearby gated neighood, that required a code.). Anyway, the blonde was there in the convertable with him. By know, I had memorized her interesting posture and profile. There was no way I could even gaslight myself, as both our cars had to slow down so much to make the turn, and I had my glasses on.

 

When we had passed on other streets at 45 MPG, I always had a little doubt. I even questioned and doubted my own viewing of the front vanity plate. But not after Easter.

 

The point is, it is very possible, that this woman your X is with has been around for some time. You just didn't see it. Now you see it. And, you are believing that sheis new in the picture. How do you know that?

 

Picture this. After seeing him with HER with my own two eyes, absolutely no doubt in my mind, husband told me that "I really didn't see it, that I just imagined the whole thing.". Now picture this. I still yearn for him. Isn't that pathetic, considering the previous story I told you?

 

Carefully check computer, telphone, cell records. There may really be a chance that not only this gal and many others have been in his life over the years.

Edited March 27, 2011 by Yasuandio

[willowthewisp]

Willow - you missed the point of question 2 sweetie...by nature, we are all human...no..in your mind he didn't give you the best he had...he should have and that may feel unforgivable....to you. On the other side, riddled with compassion and forgiveness, you will one day realize that you can't fix him...that he will only see truth as he sees it...and you will only see truth as you see it...that's when you will let go.

 

It is with maturity and true love and ambivalence that you will move forward in life....and allow yourself to become unstuck. Not unstuck to be with another person again...but unstuck to be able to love yourself again.

 

But Trippi, he admits he was wrong but did it anyway? He told me he took full responsibility for not raising his feelings earlier, but walked without trying anyway. No fighting, no arguing leading up to it. He doesn't see the truth himself, my IC says he is in denial, like I said he didn't try. He even said to me "I can't be bothered to try, it's too much hard work". He didn't do his best and HE knows that, he just pushes it to the back of his mind.

 

On Being Replaced So Soon

 

In my case, she was already there - I just didn't see it, even though she was right under my nose. I first met her about four years ago at Starbucks. While my husband and I waited for our coffees to be prepared at the service counter, a blonde haired young lady bumped into him, and then stated, "Oh, don't I know you?"

 

She seated herself and two teenage kids right next to our table outside. The next thing you, she recalls where she knows H, and strikes up a big convo. We were about to purchase a major restaurant in town that she apparently frequented. I bragged on how proud I was of him. She gave him all sorts of comliments, and ideas. Then the girl talk. I did say I wished he had the energy after his hard work each day to offer my that nice smile. She advised perhaps some "candlelight dinners" would do the trick.

 

During the entire convo, he was wiggling like a worm. Then suddenly heexclaimed that he wanted to go to Pier 1. I'm like, honey, we haven't even finished our coffees, he got up, and it was by-by time.

 

I told a nieghbor/friend about it. She confessed once to being the "other woman" before remarrying. She told me, this sounded like the classic other woman placing herself in a situation where she could meet the competition. This friend/neighbor knew I had my antenna up, and that I was tracking him with a GPS system.

 

Fast forward, post separation, several times I believe I have seen this girl driving one of our Z3 on a particular street at a particular time. There is no doubt in my mind that I have seen her with him in the Z, top down, at least a half dozen times.

 

Last Easter, we both had out Z3 top down, and happened to be turning at the same time at the entrance of a ritzy sub-division. (Side Note. He used to take me there on such holidays. I'm sure he was shocked that I might have a friend in a nearby gated neighood, that required a code.). Anyway, the blonde was there in the convertable with him. By know, I had memorized her interesting posture and profile. There was no way I could even gaslight myself, as both our cars had to slow down so much to make the turn, and I had my glasses on.

 

When we had passed on other streets at 45 MPG, I always had a little doubt. I even questioned and doubted my own viewing of the front vanity plate. But not after Easter.

 

The point is, it is very possible, that this woman your X is with has been around for some time. You just didn't see it. Now you see it. And, you are believing that sheis new in the picture. How do you know that?

 

Picture this. After seeing him with HER with my own two eyes, absolutely no doubt in my mind, husband told me that "I really didn't see it, that I just imagined the whole thing.". Now picture this. I still yearn for him. Isn't that pathetic, considering the previous story I told you?

 

Carefully check computer, telphone, cell records. There may really be a chance that not only this gal and many others have been in his life over the years.

 

Can you believe

 

I don't know for sure, but it is highly unlikely. He wasn't working late or going out on weekends, particularly in the last year we were together as his business trips, client meetings etc got cut back due to the economy. In addition he made a comment about "no one else would want me would they?" a few days before he left. Why would someone be fearful that no one else would find them attractive if they knew others would bc they had or were having an affair. He only had one GF before me.

 

I can't check his computer etc, I haven't lived with him for two years and I haven't spoken to him in 20 months at his request.

[trippi1432]

And to quote John Gray, PhD, Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus....in his book Starting Over...sometimes we just are with the wrong person...."to forgive our ex partner does not mean we have to return to the relationship".

 

It is also true what he says..."When a relationship fails, men get most stuck by blaming their partner, while women blame themselves."

 

"The reason I told you that story is to demonstrate to you that being in a bad relationship, with the wrong person, with a person that treats you poorly/abusively can ruin not only your self-esteem but your health."

 

If I had another chance, and I could be you (at the 20 year mark, 10 years ago for me) based on solely your own assessments, I would get on my knees right now, and kiss the ground that I am not married to this man, and he has not yet influenced my health.

 

On those points...Yes...and Yes....in all honesty...stress hurts our health....living under unacceptable circumstances hurts our health....and I have to agree with Yas.....(yes Yas, I am agreeing with you again...and yes, I read your thread..hugs!!)....sometimes there is a time to thank the heavens that you dodged a bullet. I did it for 15 years...I wish I could just have my life back some days.

[willowthewisp]

There was something weird though, when we were drawing up the guest list for the wedding, he said he didn't want to invite anyone from work to the evening function (which is traditional in the UK), not even his boss who had been very supportive of his career for over 5 years and had invited us to his recent b'day (I couldn't go, but my ex did). Anyway, he got really p****y about it, said he prefered to keep work and home life seperate. This women is from work. Makes me wonder if it is possible he had had an affair, it had ended and he planned on marrying me? But then the committment phobic literature says that CP's like to keep work and home life seperate because they need distance in order to experience intimacy, it's like keeping work seperate allows them to be close in a relationship.

[willowthewisp]

Willow.........soon you are going to be able to get out from your bad living situation. Soon you are going to be able to have a career. Soon you are going to have the freedoms of your own place and money and be able to decide what to do with those things. You are still young, you have a very good chance of having another better relationship.

 

Now you need to decide when you are going to let go of the past and start obsessing about why he did this or why he did that, HE doesn't matter anymore and for your sake just STOP beating yourself up. Yes he rejected you, yes he hurt you, he was a ****. He is gone.......let it be the end of the story now. It happens to most of us.......if the truth be told. Don't give him and it any more of your life. Enough!

 

How? I don't want to feel like this, I don't wnat to think about him or why or try and figure it out, but until I do I keep thinking it's my fault. I can't stop him being in my dreams, I can't stop him coming into my thoughts when I wake up or throughtout the day, I wish I could! I am sick of this, that is why I asked how do I get over this? I don't see that ever happening and I KNOW I can't face the next 40 or 50 years feeling like this everyday, the point will come where I won't be able to hold on anymore.

[willowthewisp]

And to quote John Gray, PhD, Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus....in his book Starting Over...sometimes we just are with the wrong person...."to forgive our ex partner does not mean we have to return to the relationship".

 

 

He wasn't the wrong person, he was the right person, that is the problem, I would take him back in a second.

[trippi1432]

But Trippi, he admits he was wrong but did it anyway? He told me he took full responsibility for not raising his feelings earlier, but walked without trying anyway. No fighting, no arguing leading up to it. He doesn't see the truth himself, my IC says he is in denial, like I said he didn't try. He even said to me "I can't be bothered to try, it's too much hard work". He didn't do his best and HE knows that, he just pushes it to the back of his mind.

.

 

Honey...men don't try...once they are ready to give up...they just do. When there is a man who thinks you are worth fighting for...that is the man you keep..that IS the man you fight for as well, until they prove it isn't worth it anymore. Your man got GIGS and CP...that is denial...there is nothing wrong from moving forward in your life from that. You did the best you could do...he didn't prove it to you....and you know the really crap deal...they think the same of you...that truly is what is laughable on these forums where all this strategy and innuendo is concerned. The simple truth is books are made to sell...life, emotion and truth....well, that's reality.........it isn't in Chapter 3 of Life. Love isn't about manipulation...sometimes love is just letting go so you can get on with being you.

 

said he prefered to keep work and home life seperate. This women is from work. Makes me wonder if it is possible he had had an affair, it had ended and he planned on marrying me? But then the committment phobic literature says that CP's like to keep work and home life seperate because they need distance in order to experience intimacy, it's like keeping work seperate allows them to be close in a relationship.

 

You have stated that you really don't know if that is true....quit playing into your fears....I know where my exH is every time I drop our son off at the "ho's" house...You are much smarter than this. Believe me....when a man makes a legitimate statement about another woman and then moves on with her...then you have evidence. There is also gut instinct...and yes, you have it. What does that tell you?

[willowthewisp]

Honey...men don't try...once they are ready to give up...they just do. When there is a man who thinks you are worth fighting for...that is the man you keep..that IS the man you fight for as well, until they prove it isn't worth it anymore. Your man got GIGS and CP...that is denial...there is nothing wrong from moving forward in your life from that. You did the best you could do...he didn't prove it to you....and you know the really crap deal...they think the same of you...that truly is what is laughable on these forums where all this strategy and innuendo is concerned. The simple truth is books are made to sell...life, emotion and truth....well, that's reality.........it isn't in Chapter 3 of Life. Love isn't about manipulation...sometimes love is just letting go so you can get on with being you.

 

 

 

You have stated that you really don't know if that is true....quit playing into your fears....I know where my exH is every time I drop our son off at the "ho's" house...You are much smarter than this. Believe me....when a man makes a legitimate statement about another woman and then moves on with her...then you have evidence. There is also gut instinct...and yes, you have it. What does that tell you?

 

He didn't give up...he ran, he was having anxiety attacks, my gut says CP. Affair? Don't know.

[trippi1432]

He didn't give up...he ran, he was having anxiety attacks, my gut says CP. Affair? Don't know.

 

Same thing....it is...whether affair or CP...doesn't matter.

[willowthewisp]

Same thing....it is...whether affair or CP...doesn't matter.

 

It matters, one means that he did love me once, the other means he never did, it matters to me it was nearly 20 years of my life.

[trippi1432]

It matters, one means that he did love me once, the other means he never did, it matters to me it was nearly 20 years of my life.

 

 

Willow...no man is with you for 20 years and didn't love you at one time or another. Rest assured.....he loved you, and you him.

[willowthewisp]

Willow...no man is with you for 20 years and didn't love you at one time or another. Rest assured.....he loved you, and you him.

 

He said he never did.

[trippi1432]

He said he never did.

 

 

Willow..shall we start at square one...come on...you are smarter than this!!! GET REAL Damm*t...I am planning a trip to your country and you and I are going to square off on this if you are still there.....I was with my exH for 15 years....I KNOW he loved me..I have no doubts in that....you should not either. When he walked out that door...it did not define the 20 years of your life...it only defined a few weeks of the 20 years....

[willowthewisp]

Willow..shall we start at square one...come on...you are smarter than this!!! GET REAL Damm*t...I am planning a trip to your country and you and I are going to square off on this if you are still there.....I was with my exH for 15 years....I KNOW he loved me..I have no doubts in that....you should not either. When he walked out that door...it did not define the 20 years of your life...it only defined a few weeks of the 20 years....

 

Well, the way it was explained to me by him after (about 4 months after) was he wasn't even sure if he knows what love is because he hadn't felt like that about me in a really long time. 18 years was mentioned! If it was just a few weeks then why leave? He pretty much made it sound like he had been doing me a favour by being with me at all, hoping things would get better, realsing there was better out there and wanting what other couples had. See, my fault Gotta go to sleep, more stress at school tomorrow, tax planning and testimentory wills, death, should be a jolly day then...oh joy...

Edited March 27, 2011 by willowthewisp

[trippi1432]

Yeah...calling it a night too...hang in..this is not about just you...believe it.

[tojaz]

Willow! Why will you not let yourself find peace????? You and you alone have condemned yourself to reliving this over and over again looking for some magic bullet, the one moment, the one conversation that will explain it all to you. IT DOESN"T EXIST AND THATS THE WAY HE WANTS IT! Even if you find the solution dead to rights and confront him with it, he will deny every bit for his own benefit.

 

The man that you would take back in a second has willfully done this to you, but while he caused you all this hurt, your here keeping it alive and I'm not about to help you do it. So as you rehash the past, I want to introduce you to my new standard response... STOP!

 

How? I don't want to feel like this, I don't wnat to think about him or why or try and figure it out, but until I do I keep thinking it's my fault. I can't stop him being in my dreams, I can't stop him coming into my thoughts when I wake up or throughtout the day, I wish I could! I am sick of this, that is why I asked how do I get over this? I don't see that ever happening and I KNOW I can't face the next 40 or 50 years feeling like this everyday, the point will come where I won't be able to hold on anymore.

 

Willow, love what was, but accept what is, sounds simple but is anything but. Love who he used to be, love the man he tried to be, and cherish all the good times you were able to spend together, they were good, and there was love for both of you. Accept what he is now, and do not allow his callous and cold version of events taint your memories, your values or your beliefs.

LOVE WHAT WAS, ACCEPT WHAT IS!

TOJAZ

[trippi1432]

LOVE WHAT WAS, ACCEPT WHAT IS!

TOJAZ

 

Jesus...don't shove it down her throat...what is the rush?? Hidden agenda?? Yeah.. I know those..had them pulled on me more than once...even recently...

Edited March 28, 2011 by trippi1432

[Yasuandio]

Dear willowthewisp,

 

I am a fresh pair of eyes. I am purposely not informing myself on your long thread so I won't be influenced. I will gladly read everything if this idea doesn't work. But I do want to try it out.

 

PS when I wrote "kiss the ground" I think I meant be relieved you don't have to go through the divorce process.

------------------------------------------------------------

I regret I had trouble with the quoting system. It was either lose what I wrote, or do it the way Ive done below:

 

(Quote 1) "For me, my ex was not abusive and wasn't a bad relationship, I was extremely happy with him and I htought he felt the same, he said he had hidden his unhappiness on purpose."

 

Can you tell me how hiding ones feelings on purpose makes for a happy relationship? Is it possible that this might be considered deception?

 

Quote 2) "A few days before he left, I remember sitting on my couch and thinking how I was the luckiest girl alive to have such a wonderful loving man."

 

Why did you believe this? Did he give you the impression this is where you stood? Has your position changed as of recent events? Would you still characterize him as a "wonderful loving man?" If so, can you love him enough to let him go, and allow him to be happ(ier) with another person?

 

Can you look back on the past 20 years, and continue to believe, that, at least, during that period of time, YOU FELT LIKE THE LUCKIEST GIRL ALIVE, therefore you were? That IS your history, your memory, no one can take it from you.

 

Quote 3) "Now my life is ****."

 

I know exactly how you feel.

 

Quote 4) "Every day pales into insignificance compared to the happiness I had. How am I ever going t(to get over this?)" (Sorry, messed up quote, and can't look back).

 

Debtman and Steadfast are always reminding us of how lucky we are to have another day. I mean, I read somewhere, "if you think you got problems, go visit some patients in a cancer ward that are about to take a dirt nap." Who ever said this gives excellent advice. Something tells me it is Gunny I'm quoting.

 

One thing that has entered my mind is the notion that we really, really want what we can't get. September 21, 2008 I was done with him, that was the last straw that broke the camel's back. When i started showing a desire for him again, he wanted nothing to do with me. Now I a quivering bowl of unrefridgerated, unwanted, rejected, lime green jello.

 

Ballerfamily has a 25 year story. He told me, in my case it could take 4/5 years.

 

One more question for you. Married or not married, did it ever occur to you that he may return one day? Do you have a plan in this event?

 

I am a believer of the following theory - although I am becoming more and more aware that I am in denial:

 

Despite the issues in relationships, the connection between a couple that has endured decades is a flame that is none so easy to extinguish. I call it sometimes a "deep love," only time together can nurture. Therefore, it's not possible to recapture it again without the significant period of time. A new person, new marriage, new family, at some point, is going to be subject to reconsideration, due to this body/soul connection.

 

Is this why we are in such hidious pain? A piece of us has been torn away? We are no longer whole? Does it really matter if the relationship was good, bad, or indifferent? The other partner became a part of you. If they hurt, you could feel the pain in your own body. When they had good experiences, you heart swelled with a feeling of goodness for them also. THERE IS NO WAY a feeling that is so magical and yet feels so REAL, universally felt by others, has simply evaporated into thin air on one side of the equasion. I just can't wrap my head around that. There is still a real tangable flame, feeling, sensation - there is something there. The puzzle pieces have just been torn apart for some reason, that we yet to comprehend.

 

Again, sorry if I made any mistakes on quotes. Did best I could with resources I have at the moment.

[Yasuandio]

 

I don't know for sure, but it is highly unlikely. He wasn't working late or going out on weekends, particularly in the last year we were together as his business trips, client meetings etc got cut back due to the economy. In addition he made a comment about "no one else would want me would they?" a few days before he left. Why would someone be fearful that no one else would find them attractive if they knew others would bc they had or were having an affair. He only had one GF before me.

 

I can't check his computer etc, I haven't lived with him for two years and I haven't spoken to him in 20 months at his request.

 

I am so loving the fact you are getting my read on this before I read the whole story. 20 months, hmmmmm. Sounds familiar. You're not sure another woman was in the picture? OR at least it was highly unlikely? Actually, I'd like to have a nickle for every time I said "it's highly unlikely."

 

You know, one time my doctor told me the same exact answer to an entirely different question, though, about the same subject. I had finially come to the conclusion that I must inquire about a particular matter directly, and cease dancing around it and/or denying the distinct possibility of the situation that actually existed. Therefore, I asked the doctor, "Based on your medical opinion and professional experience, can a 49 year old man, that is in outstanding health, that works out at the gym no less than an hour per session (lifting weights, treadmill, rowing machine, etc.), five out of seven days a week, not an ounce of fat on him, a normal drinking habit, moderate/normal stress at work (he's the boss and owner) eats pleatiful, balanced meals prepared by myself (no cans, no microwave, no frozen -- he was extremely high maintence to feed and launder), has absolutely no restrictions from wife, does as he pleases -- total freedom, no stress at home -- can this man live without sex for years at a time? Again, just to get your mind back on the topic, the doctor's response was "it's highly unlikely." Sometimes statements such as DON'T REALLY KNOW FOR SURE & HIGHLY UNLIKELY, suggests a bit of hesitation or reservation. Anyway, it sounds like you may have some doubt.

 

**"No one else would want me, would they?"**

 

That statement may be very telling, indeed. It could be characterized as rhetorical, sarcastic, playful, mysterious, perhaps even sadistic. When it was stated, if you were concerned, the advice you would have recieve from me is "keep your eyes open, investigate to the max, and really time will tell."

 

Hope this is useful. Yas

Edited March 28, 2011 by Yasuandio

[debtman]

willow,

I actually met the OM before my wife because she met him online to go "biking" with and wanted me to check him out to make sure he wasn't a creep before she went biking with him. He came and played volleyball with me and a group of my friends and then, after I told my W that he seemed like a decent guy (to go biking with), they started dating and, within 2 weeks, she told me our marriage was over, we just weren't compatible and it had nothing to do with OM.

 

So, people can change, dramatically, quickly, at the drop of a hat, without looking back. They can get caught up in a new relationship and completely disregard everything they had up to that point in their lives. They can find someone who puts them on a pedestal, tells them how great they are and they can lose focus on their family, their kids and themselves.

 

You can't take that personally...it's THEIR problem/fault, not yours. It's SO hard to move on, to accept that the other person moved on so easily but, it's not worth giving them any more power/control over you. They're SO not worth it if they can treat you that way.

 

At this point, he will say and do anything to justify his actions to himself. To be able to tell himself that he made the right choice...only to find, months or years down the road that he has NEVER face the problems that he has that will make everything fall apart again.

 

Don't let his problems keep affecting you. He's not worth it...you're worth more than that...

 

Good luck and keep posting...

[robf1971]

felt like that about me in a really long time. 18 years was mentioned! ...

 

Almost every one of these situations is the same, the leaving partner hasn't been happy for 18 years, 5 years, never been happy, in my she mentioned 2 years. Actually the number fluctuated from 5 years to 2 years. It's all BS!!

 

The leaver is justifying what they are doing to themselves. It's a way of not facing up to it. That is why it's certainly no reflection on you.

[willowthewisp]

Dear willowthewisp,

 

I am a fresh pair of eyes. I am purposely not informing myself on your long thread so I won't be influenced. I will gladly read everything if this idea doesn't work. But I do want to try it out.

 

PS when I wrote "kiss the ground" I think I meant be relieved you don't have to go through the divorce process.

------------------------------------------------------------

I regret I had trouble with the quoting system. It was either lose what I wrote, or do it the way Ive done below:

 

(Quote 1) "For me, my ex was not abusive and wasn't a bad relationship, I was extremely happy with him and I htought he felt the same, he said he had hidden his unhappiness on purpose."

 

Can you tell me how hiding ones feelings on purpose makes for a happy relationship? Is it possible that this might be considered deception?

 

Quote 2) "A few days before he left, I remember sitting on my couch and thinking how I was the luckiest girl alive to have such a wonderful loving man."

 

Why did you believe this? Did he give you the impression this is where you stood? Has your position changed as of recent events? Would you still characterize him as a "wonderful loving man?" If so, can you love him enough to let him go, and allow him to be happ(ier) with another person?

 

Can you look back on the past 20 years, and continue to believe, that, at least, during that period of time, YOU FELT LIKE THE LUCKIEST GIRL ALIVE, therefore you were? That IS your history, your memory, no one can take it from you.

 

Quote 3) "Now my life is ****."

 

I know exactly how you feel.

 

Quote 4) "Every day pales into insignificance compared to the happiness I had. How am I ever going t(to get over this?)" (Sorry, messed up quote, and can't look back).

 

Debtman and Steadfast are always reminding us of how lucky we are to have another day. I mean, I read somewhere, "if you think you got problems, go visit some patients in a cancer ward that are about to take a dirt nap." Who ever said this gives excellent advice. Something tells me it is Gunny I'm quoting.

 

One thing that has entered my mind is the notion that we really, really want what we can't get. September 21, 2008 I was done with him, that was the last straw that broke the camel's back. When i started showing a desire for him again, he wanted nothing to do with me. Now I a quivering bowl of unrefridgerated, unwanted, rejected, lime green jello.

 

Ballerfamily has a 25 year story. He told me, in my case it could take 4/5 years.

 

One more question for you. Married or not married, did it ever occur to you that he may return one day? Do you have a plan in this event?

 

I am a believer of the following theory - although I am becoming more and more aware that I am in denial:

 

Despite the issues in relationships, the connection between a couple that has endured decades is a flame that is none so easy to extinguish. I call it sometimes a "deep love," only time together can nurture. Therefore, it's not possible to recapture it again without the significant period of time. A new person, new marriage, new family, at some point, is going to be subject to reconsideration, due to this body/soul connection.

 

Is this why we are in such hidious pain? A piece of us has been torn away? We are no longer whole? Does it really matter if the relationship was good, bad, or indifferent? The other partner became a part of you. If they hurt, you could feel the pain in your own body. When they had good experiences, you heart swelled with a feeling of goodness for them also. THERE IS NO WAY a feeling that is so magical and yet feels so REAL, universally felt by others, has simply evaporated into thin air on one side of the equasion. I just can't wrap my head around that. There is still a real tangable flame, feeling, sensation - there is something there. The puzzle pieces have just been torn apart for some reason, that we yet to comprehend.

 

Again, sorry if I made any mistakes on quotes. Did best I could with resources I have at the moment.

 

Don't kid yourself Yas, the reason they can walk away and it not bother them is because they never felt for us the way we felt for them. When they say they never loved us they mean it, they didn't. Think about it, if they felt an ounce of the pain and hurt we feel they would be with us. Sorry to be so harsh, I wanted to try and put it delicately but there really wasn't any way to say it other than striaght. Have I considered he will return? No. He will never return because he made the right decision for him, he didn't love me, never did, so why on earth would he come back? He won't.

[willowthewisp]

I am so loving the fact you are getting my read on this before I read the whole story. 20 months, hmmmmm. Sounds familiar. You're not sure another woman was in the picture? OR at least it was highly unlikely? Actually, I'd like to have a nickle for every time I said "it's highly unlikely."

 

You know, one time my doctor told me the same exact answer to an entirely different question, though, about the same subject. I had finially come to the conclusion that I must inquire about a particular matter directly, and cease dancing around it and/or denying the distinct possibility of the situation that actually existed. Therefore, I asked the doctor, "Based on your medical opinion and professional experience, can a 49 year old man, that is in outstanding health, that works out at the gym no less than an hour per session (lifting weights, treadmill, rowing machine, etc.), five out of seven days a week, not an ounce of fat on him, a normal drinking habit, moderate/normal stress at work (he's the boss and owner) eats pleatiful, balanced meals prepared by myself (no cans, no microwave, no frozen -- he was extremely high maintence to feed and launder), has absolutely no restrictions from wife, does as he pleases -- total freedom, no stress at home -- can this man live without sex for years at a time? Again, just to get your mind back on the topic, the doctor's response was "it's highly unlikely." Sometimes statements such as DON'T REALLY KNOW FOR SURE & HIGHLY UNLIKELY, suggests a bit of hesitation or reservation. Anyway, it sounds like you may have some doubt.

 

**"No one else would want me, would they?"**

 

That statement may be very telling, indeed. It could be characterized as rhetorical, sarcastic, playful, mysterious, perhaps even sadistic. When it was stated, if you were concerned, the advice you would have recieve from me is "keep your eyes open, investigate to the max, and really time will tell."

 

Hope this is useful. Yas

 

It was said with sadness, pity for himself, I realise now it was because he wanted to go and was worried no one else would want him. My reply, "of course they would, you are a wonderful man" and he is.

[willowthewisp]

Willow! Why will you not let yourself find peace????? You and you alone have condemned yourself to reliving this over and over again looking for some magic bullet, the one moment, the one conversation that will explain it all to you. IT DOESN"T EXIST AND THATS THE WAY HE WANTS IT! Even if you find the solution dead to rights and confront him with it, he will deny every bit for his own benefit.

 

The man that you would take back in a second has willfully done this to you, but while he caused you all this hurt, your here keeping it alive and I'm not about to help you do it. So as you rehash the past, I want to introduce you to my new standard response... STOP!

 

 

 

Willow, love what was, but accept what is, sounds simple but is anything but. Love who he used to be, love the man he tried to be, and cherish all the good times you were able to spend together, they were good, and there was love for both of you. Accept what he is now, and do not allow his callous and cold version of events taint your memories, your values or your beliefs.

LOVE WHAT WAS, ACCEPT WHAT IS!

TOJAZ

 

Have I? I thought I was trying really hard to get over this, obviously my inability to get over it is my fault along with the relationship ending and the state of my life now.

 

He is still the same person, he hasn't morphed into someone new! If I love the man he was, I love the man he is, there aren't two different men here. Every walk away is the person they have always been, perhaps it is just deciet that kept that part of their personality hidden for so long, or maybe we did not see it because they never had REASON to show it to us before and now we gave them REASON to show it. All I know is my IC tells me it is fanciful when people say they have changed, they haven't, they were always who they are now, "you just now see him for who he really is" my IC's exact words. If someone doesn't love who they are now then they don't love them period. It is not possible to cherish any memories, I no longer know if they were real or not due to the deception. I have nothing, no memories. I also know he never loved me, love does not just disappear, it was never there to begin with. He stole nearly 20 years of my life through deciet and now I am too old to find anyone else. Yes, TOO OLD. I have meet no one and am constantly told how ugly and old I am and how I am worthless by people around me.