Reformed other women

[jj33]

Jennie thank you for this thread. It has helped me to see it all in a different way. I have been struggling and struggling with the aftermath and seeing the various responses helps put it all into place.

 

And Pure its really nice to know that I am not the only one to have a "clone" experience.

[JustJoe]

Pure, "to learn compassion", such an important lesson. When I was 27 and became very sick with a neurosis, I realized that we do not know what other people have gone through and what has made them into the persons they are. Life is so much more complicated than I realized when I was young.

 

This is the closest I have ever come to forgive my mother who is a total narcissist and has a very compulsive/obsessive personality. My entire family of origin suffered the consequences of her abusive behaviour and we still do. Yet I do realize that I have not lived her life and therefore I try not to judge her.

Learning compassion is indeed a very important lesson in life. An even more important lesson is to learn to apply that same compassion to ourselves. I didn't show up well in the honesty department, and that's one of the main reasons that I ended the affair, to get my self-respect back. I forced D-day onto my AP, so now I have to forgive her and forgive myself for our human failings, and proceed to the future , sans baggage. I left a really good girl , to enter the affair, maybe she will have a little compassion on me.

[bentnotbroken]

Learning compassion is indeed a very important lesson in life. An even more important lesson is to learn to apply that same compassion to ourselves. I didn't show up well in the honesty department, and that's one of the main reasons that I ended the affair, to get my self-respect back. I forced D-day onto my AP, so now I have to forgive her and forgive myself for our human failings, and proceed to the future , sans baggage. I left a really good girl , to enter the affair, maybe she will have a little compassion on me.

 

 

Question? Does that imply by having compassion on you, she should allow you to be a part of her life again?

[JustJoe]

I doubt that is possible, on a romantic level, but hopefully on a friendly level. Don't get me wrong, IF she could forgive me, and we COULD go back to the way we were, I would be very happy. But that's another life lesson, it's true that you don't know what you've got , til it's gone. Anothe blow to the head of Joe.

[2sure]

Good question.

 

I was OW multiple times. I preferred it at the time for a bunch of reasons. I had failed past relationships and didnt feel like doing that again. I was focused on my job and daughter and didnt want a relationship mostly because I didnt want more of my time to be obligated elsewhere. I wanted the advantages of having a part time romantic relationship with none of the disadvantages. For years, this worked for me.

 

Eventually however, my attitude started to change - again for a bunch of reasons. I began seeing how similar one MM was to the next. I began seeing them all as spoiled brats. I began wondering if they were so special, successful, brilliant...why couldnt they fix their own lives? lol.

 

Also, as I had more time in my life and because I really enjoyed these relationships...I wanted one of my own. I eventually once again felt up to the challenge.

[JustJoe]

Miss 2sure, you had multiple affairs? I don't think my heart or self-respect could take multiple affairs. BTW if the MM's were that bad, what does it say about you, the AP. I mean no offense, but it does take two to have an affair, right? This is very interesting, and I'm going to return later.

[2sure]

Miss 2sure, you had multiple affairs? I don't think my heart or self-respect could take multiple affairs. BTW if the MM's were that bad, what does it say about you, the AP. I mean no offense, but it does take two to have an affair, right? This is very interesting, and I'm going to return later.

 

Oh Trust Me. I got what was coming to me. I have very sincerely come to regret my actions, change my perspective, and learned life lessons.

 

In answering this post, I tried to simply honestly state what my reasons were for ending the affair(s) at that time.

[donnamaybe]

An affair CAUSES natural drugs to enter your system which causes the euphoria AKA "the fog." Once an AP is free from those natural drugs, they are finally able to think clearly once again.

[ladydesigner]

An affair CAUSES natural drugs to enter your system which causes the euphoria AKA "the fog." Once an AP is free from those natural drugs, they are finally able to think clearly once again.

 

Amen to the above statement...from a reformed MOW:D

[donnamaybe]

Because if they remember fondly the love and beauty that did exist in the relationship they had, then they would miss the person who broke their heart. Being angry and warning others against what they percieve as the mistakes they made is a way of saving themselves from the pain of admitting they really did love, and they really were loved and it just didn't work out.

 

But this so called "love and beauty" is often a false reality created by the MM/MW to keep their OW/OM dangling on puppet strings. Once true reality sets in, of course people will be angry at finding they were played like a fiddle. And why would they not want to keep others from falling victim to the same trap? Unless, of course, they just don't care.

[Spark1111]

Yes, as a fBS, I and the OW fell in love with the same man, had wonderful memories, and were both ultimately lied to and betrayed; ME, when he started his affair, and SHE, when he ended it.

 

I think we could both remember the beauty of love, and the devastation of betrayal.

 

And as is so often the case when life hands you a particulary cruel lesson, we can both say.....NEVER AGAIN, it was not worth it.

 

The love was not worth the pain of ever attempting that path again.

 

And that may be the purpose of the perspectives offered here as a warning of what may lie ahead....

[torranceshipman]

I am curious about why some other women, at least it seems so to me, completely change their minds and opinions about the affair once it is over. I can't believe that the former other women who are posting here on LS about all MM being liars and manipulators and having sex all the time with their wives and NC being the only way etc believed this while they were still actively in the affair.

 

My own thinking is that if you are not grounded enough in yourself during the affair, you might have to rethink it all afterwards. Or your MM might have been one of the MM who actually has purposely fooled you and lied to you, I do understand those exist. Or...

 

If you are one of these women who has changed her mind, I would be interested to hear why.

 

This is how I see it. I did drugs when I was young. I would never do it again. I can see all the dangers and bad consequences of it now. But I can sure as hell admit that I had fun while I did it!

 

I think a lot of ex-OW never liked it when they were in the A to start with! I reckon that a lot of MM lay on the lies thick about how they're about to leave the W, because the OW in question states how much they hate the lying, and views the whole situation as a bit sordid, and actually wants the MM to leave the W so they can have an out in the open, regular R and NOT be involved in something sordid (more than actually wanting necessarily a life long R with the MM). Then the MM drags his feet and the OW leaves, kinda disgusted at the fact that she compromized her boundaries in the 1st place. Then they see a bunch of other women on this board making the same hideous mistakes, all saying that 'my MM is different' (how many times will we hear that!!!!) and want to save them the heartache and bother - and wish they could see what a jackass they are involved with. Hence them posting here...

[torranceshipman]

Forgiveness is so good. Resentment is heaviest for the person who carries it.

 

Indifference is even better

[Tough2]

as opposed to those of us who own and are not ashamed of what we've done in our lives, because those make us who we are (and we're happy and comfortable with that, and not in denial about any part of our history).

 

Is it not possible to own who you were and what you did and still have shame around it? I would think that this is not denial of history, but rather a level of growth and maturity.

[RedDevil66]

Is it not possible to own who you were and what you did and still have shame around it? I would think that this is not denial of history, but rather a level of growth and maturity.

 

I agree, but not everyone is capable of this sort of growth and maturity.

They would rather be veiled in a fog of denial.

 

It's much easier to live in denial than face shame

[JustJoe]

Miss 2sure, you had multiple affairs? I don't think my heart or self-respect could take multiple affairs. BTW if the MM's were that bad, what does it say about you, the AP. I mean no offense, but it does take two to have an affair, right? This is very interesting, and I'm going to return later.

Mis 2sure, I really hope that I didn't give offense, as that was NEVER my intent. It's just that coming off my first and (hopefully ) only affair, I simply can't imagine being the OM more than once. Being somebody's "stud on the side", was terribly demeaning. You interest me, I'll look for more of your posts. How did you maintain your self-esteem? I'm not trying to be judgemental, I really don't understand what you must have been feeling. This is fascinating.

[ladydesigner]

Mis 2sure, I really hope that I didn't give offense, as that was NEVER my intent. It's just that coming off my first and (hopefully ) only affair, I simply can't imagine being the OM more than once. Being somebody's "stud on the side", was terribly demeaning. You interest me, I'll look for more of your posts. How did you maintain your self-esteem? I'm not trying to be judgemental, I really don't understand what you must have been feeling. This is fascinating.

 

I often wonder if my XOM felt this way. He ended things with me and kept on with his relationship with his long-time girlfriend. What is strange though is what started as my "stud on the side" as you have stated became much more to me than I ever thought possible and when he ended the A I felt like the whore on the side. It is an awful feeling as I commiserate with you, but from a woman's perspective.

[2sure]

No offense taken, all valid questions. I dont want to thread jack but to answer your main question:

 

At the time I was having affairs with MM, I thought I was in control, I thought I was making the rules. Eventually I realized that I was simply copping out, and using justifications to accept less from life and relationships than I should have.

[JustJoe]

I'm Sorry Jennie, I guess I thread-jacked too. Thank you, Ms. 2sure for your answers, I hope that things are better for you now.

[JustJoe]

I often wonder if my XOM felt this way. He ended things with me and kept on with his relationship with his long-time girlfriend. What is strange though is what started as my "stud on the side" as you have stated became much more to me than I ever thought possible and when he ended the A I felt like the whore on the side. It is an awful feeling as I commiserate with you, but from a woman's perspective.

Miss LD, That's another of the problems. We started out as total passion, but the affair "evolved ", soon it was as if our affair was more real than her marriage, even though her H was wealthy, and I knew that she would never leave that wealth, no matter what she said. I'm in th Army, and I really think that had I been a man with a regular job, the affair would have been over long ago. It's sooooo stupid, but whenever I was deployed, I would wonder if she was cheating on me, then think Damn! I'm the boyfriend, she's got a husband!!

[LucreziaBorgia]

May I ask you if you believe all WS are hardcore cakeeaters or if this applies to a section of the WS? If you are talking about a section (however large), I agree with you about the manipulating and the lying.

 

No, not all WS are hardcore cakeeaters - not by a longshot.

[wheelwright]

An affair CAUSES natural drugs to enter your system which causes the euphoria AKA "the fog." Once an AP is free from those natural drugs, they are finally able to think clearly once again.

 

Love and fog are just viewpoints and feelings. Those drugs are love drugs. You had the same fog when you fell in love once.

 

Your love is not more real than others. You may view it as others love in fog only and you love in true if you like. Equally, they could say yours is the same illusion.

 

Please stop saying love in an A is just fog in all situations.

 

Yes love causes drugs etc. In an A or in any love situation. Yours too,

[ladydesigner]

Love and fog are just viewpoints and feelings. Those drugs are love drugs. You had the same fog when you fell in love once.

 

Your love is not more real than others. You may view it as others love in fog only and you love in true if you like. Equally, they could say yours is the same illusion.

 

Please stop saying love in an A is just fog in all situations.

 

Yes love causes drugs etc. In an A or in any love situation. Yours too,

 

It would be interesting to start a thread on fog vs love. When I was in my A I could have sworn it was love. After ending I hurt so bad, and still do some days, that I feel it is easier to say it was the "affair fog." I still do not know what it was. It felt like love, but maybe it was the hormones, or the fog. Love is so confusing in an A.

[wheelwright]

It would be interesting to start a thread on fog vs love. When I was in my A I could have sworn it was love. After ending I hurt so bad, and still do some days, that I feel it is easier to say it was the "affair fog." I still do not know what it was. It felt like love, but maybe it was the hormones, or the fog. Love is so confusing in an A.

 

I swear we know it when we see it.

 

When I was trying for a baby, there were many months I thought I was pregnant but no.

 

When I was, I JUST KNEW. Without doubt. Love is like that.

 

I agree love is confusing in an A. But I swear it's unmistakable. 40 years on this earth before I found it? I'm sure it might have been fog though - they all say so!

[NoIDidn't]

How interesting. I never did start my thread idea about the hierarchy, but it seems to be rearing its head again.

 

This time its the "Happy" OW against the "Reformed" OW.

 

Very interesting.

 

I doubt that being "reformed" is about not accepting one's own personal responsibility. There are quite a few former posters and current that have never accepted personal responsibility for their part in an A, and they have NEVER once come off as "reformed".

 

Seems to me that "Happy" OW simply don't like the reformed OWs because they can't shoot them down as being "BWs". So they get another label, from those that say they hate labels BTW.