Marriage "Boundaries"...is there such a thing?

[quankanne]

guys, don't dicker.

 

WAHHHHH!!!! Because I don't want to see either of you get sent into time-out, it'd get lonely without your input *pouts*

 

can we agree to disagree, and leave it at that?

[a4a]

Why are you after me? FWIW, I've been married to my husband much longer than you've been with your BF.

 

The thread is about MARITAL boundaries. BF/GF boundaries are not the same thing.

 

Holy crap, lady!

 

I have to agree and I am not a big marriage fan.

but I think this is off topic?

(don't want to get slapped)

 

Perhaps some people who consider M more than just a piece of paper do see things differently and take those M ideals into a different place? So their boundaries can or would be dictated by a different set of rules of sorts.

[lonelyandfrustrated]

I'm SO not after you, but why in the world you feel that because you signed a piece of paper your relationship is worth discussing while others' are not is beyond me. We live together. That's as far as a relationship can go, other than the legalities of a piece of paper. On this forum, and even this thread, it's plain that the paper doesn't do anyone any good.

 

Holy crap yourself.

 

The thread is about Marital boundaries. Not Living Together boundaries. You have questioned my age and experience. All I said was that I suggest you discuss boundaries before marrying! Why you have a personal problem with that suggestion is beyond me.

[a4a]

Well, this person sees it differently. I've been married AND in long term relationships. BOTH require an understanding on the part of those involved in the relationship of the wants/needs of their partner. Both can be terminated if those wants/needs are not met. So the difference is - the paper and the $$ involved to terminate one versus the other. Big deal.

 

No because for some it is a huge deal to ever even contemplate a divorce once married. So that would cause a significant change of boundaries from BF/GF and M relationships for those people that believe M is the grand finale.

[a4a]

No? lol I said I see it differently. Are you now going to tell me how I feel about a subject? If others want to see it that way (and obviously some do), fine.

 

cripes Donna why?

[Lizzie60]

I just don't appreciate someone's attempt to stifle my input in a thread with the word "marriage" in the title JUST because we didn't put rings on our fingers. Good gawd. As if a relationship isn't a relationship until you pay a preacher and sign some documents.

 

 

I agree... I was 18 years common-law.. I had the same rights when I left.. less the priest, the stupid vows and the 'contract'...

 

Long term common-law is the same as marriage.. come on people.. (subject of this thread)

[carhill]

What boundaries do you have in your marriage...if any?

 

A very important boundary is any shoes I trip over walking through a room or down the hall go into the trash. The other relevant one is that any replacements do not come out of the household budget.

 

I put the toilet seat down.... an equally important boundary with an elongated toilet bowl.

 

'nuff said

[lonelyandfrustrated]

Oh yeah, the toilet seat is a big deal. I can always tell when H's upset...he leaves it up. Someone called it "passive-aggressive toilet warfare" lol.

[Dawn1]

We lived together and I thought were committed to each other as if marriage, but I moved out because he would not accept any boundaries. First, he doesn't believe in marriage since he has had numerous relationships while he had been married in the past. He said he is committed to me, but he continues to have communication with a couple of ex-girlfriends, who he had affairs with during marriage. I want there to be a boundary that he does not communicate with ex-girlfriends or to flirt with or get too personal with other women -- because of his past. I feel that respecting boundaries is a way to keep from possible temptation. He insists there will be no boundaries. So, I moved out, yet we still are together. He wants me to move back in, but I won't because of our inability to see eye-to-eye on this issue.

[OWoman]

This came up in another thread, and I promised I would start a thread about it.

 

What boundaries do you have in your marriage...if any?

 

For instance, some say that there should be two checking accounts. I disagree.

 

Some say that each person should make his or her decision about his or her own body. I agree unless it impacts the other person (ie vasectomy or abortion).

 

Some say that it is no one's business if the husband wants to go out with his friends. And if he decides that he wants women friends, his wife should have no say in the matter. I disagree.

 

Anyhow, thoughts?

 

I think the vasectom / abortion thing is one where there should absolutely be boundaries! No one should be forced to create / have a child they do not want. I've seen far too many people (men and women) guilt tripped into spawning, or not aborting, a child they've said clearly all along they don't want - and having to pay the very high price for the rest of their lives. For me, that is an absolute non-negotiable.

 

I also agree finances should be separate. I believe there shoudl be a discussion of what are shared expenses, and what are individual expenses, and an amount should be agreed for contributions to a shared account from which the shared expenses are covered. I think this is particularly important in blended families - I do not want my SO absolving me of my financial responsibility to my kids; nor do I want to be paying for things I don't believe ar necessary - or desirable - because he and his kids' mother feel that darling Tarquin needs a third trip abroad this year because all his friends are going. I don't care if my SO wants to spend his money on silly gadgets but he's sure as hell not spending my money on them. And, similarly, if I have to buy two newspapers every day and he gets his news fix from the TV, I don't expect him to be subsidising my dead tree news habit.

 

Friends likewise - unless you've been together since you were kids and work in the same field and share hobbies and interests, it's likely you'll have friends that belong to one rather than both. Unless the impact of the friends is very destructive - eg you always get blind drunk when you're out with them and drive dangerously as a result - that should be your business. Obviously there's a fine line in there between "destructive" and "threatening to my peace of mind because I feel left out", but that kind of thing needs negotiation, IMO.

 

Same with religion, politics or any other matters of conviction. If I want to shave my head and wear saffron robes, that's my call. He wants to vote Tory, his call. Either of us doesn't like it, we're free to say so - and vote with our feet if we can't live with it.

 

On the other hand, I think there needs to be negotiation and agreement on areas of commanlity - like common standards of home hygiene, or nutrition, or child rearing principles, or recycling. It's not going to work if one party feels that chores should be divided up fairly and performed to a schedule and the other feels that their integrity would be invaded by having to hoover when they're in the mood for vegging in front of Mock the Week, or if one person finds dead animal bits in the fridge offensive and the other considers green vegetables to be an assault on their masculinity.

 

And, of course, there needs to be agreement on how much should be "together" and how much should be "own business". At my age, I lean far towards the "own business" side but I guess everyone is different.

[angie2443]

This came up in another thread, and I promised I would start a thread about it.

 

What boundaries do you have in your marriage...if any?

 

For instance, some say that there should be two checking accounts. I disagree.

 

Some say that each person should make his or her decision about his or her own body. I agree unless it impacts the other person (ie vasectomy or abortion).

 

Some say that it is no one's business if the husband wants to go out with his friends. And if he decides that he wants women friends, his wife should have no say in the matter. I disagree.

 

Anyhow, thoughts?

 

It has been my observation and experience that for long term relationships to survive, bounderies are required. They may differ some what from couple to couple, but there seem to be some almost universal ones that are present in happy, long term relationships.

 

When I married, I was pretty young and very naive. I had little sense of bounderies and how they protect a relationship. My husband had few bounderies also. It came to a point where the lack of bounderies were letting my husband walk all over me. The more he walked, the more confortable he became with it. The more I let it happen, the weaker I became. Now, I have certain bounderies in place and so far he has respected them. I will never tell him what he can and can't do, but I will tell him what my bounderies are and what actions I will take if those bounderies are crossed.

[lonelyandfrustrated]

I also agree finances should be separate. I believe there shoudl be a discussion of what are shared expenses, and what are individual expenses, and an amount should be agreed for contributions to a shared account from which the shared expenses are covered.

 

How about in families where only one spouse works? Having separate accounts when one partner leaves the working world to tend the children just doesn't work. Unless you'd suggest that the at-home partner receive an 'allowance', a stipend placed into his/her account--and judging by the tension over money in my bff's marriage where this happens, I'd say that option doesn't work, either.

 

Or what if one spouse is laid off?

 

What has worked best in our marriage (while we have loads of issues, money is not one of them) is to have shared checking and savings, and each of us has a set amount of discretionary money to spend. If either of us wants to blow a wad on something (for me it's furniture, for him it's vehicles), we don't unless the other supports the purchase.

 

And this is not directed at you, owoman, but more of a general observation: I think that people who have the belief that they should remain in total control of who their friends are, how they spend their money, and all other manner of 'personal decisions' should just do other people a favor and stay single, unless they find that certain someone who wants to be a 'married single' too.

[Trialbyfire]

How about in families where only one spouse works? Having separate accounts when one partner leaves the working world to tend the children just doesn't work. Unless you'd suggest that the at-home partner receive an 'allowance', a stipend placed into his/her account--and judging by the tension over money in my bff's marriage where this happens, I'd say that option doesn't work, either.

 

Or what if one spouse is laid off?

Some of us don't believe in one income or believe in getting married, where one partner supports the other. That's my view and works for me. Whatever works for someone else is fine. It's their choice but more importantly, it's the "couple's" choice.

 

What has worked best in our marriage (while we have loads of issues, money is not one of them) is to have shared checking and savings, and each of us has a set amount of discretionary money to spend. If either of us wants to blow a wad on something (for me it's furniture, for him it's vehicles), we don't unless the other supports the purchase.

I'm sincerely glad that this works for you but it would not work for me. I think it overly-optimistic to comingle funds and with my subsequent divorce, am eternally grateful that never happened.

And this is not directed at you, owoman, but more of a general observation: I think that people who have the belief that they should remain in total control of who their friends are, how they spend their money, and all other manner of 'personal decisions' should just do other people a favor and stay single, unless they find that certain someone who wants to be a 'married single' too.

That's an interesting observation, one that could easily be rebutted by someone like myself saying "Anyone who needs to consume their spouse, has codependency issues".

[lonelyandfrustrated]

Trial, it could be said that the simple act of getting married is 'overly optimistic' in itself, no?

[Trialbyfire]

lone, it could easily be said that there are many different personality types, in different social categories, therefore it's up to the individuals to create a functional relationship. Boundaries must be acceptable to both parties.

 

Point blank, the type of marriage you seem to have would make me run away screaming because it appears to be a highly controlled environment. I NEED a lot of freedom and independence. That's the type of man I also NEED. This doesn't mean either one of us is neglectful, lacks caring, depth of emotion or commitment to each other.

 

The type of marriage I want, would make you feel incredibly insecure and run away screaming. That's okay too!

[lonelyandfrustrated]

Trial, yep, that's why I stated earlier in the thread that it is wise to discuss boundaries before doing the deed. People put on Faces while courting to woo a partner, making that person think that This Is The One! Only to find out later that what they thought they were getting wasn't as it appeared at all.

 

I was totally transparent while dating my husband. My husband wooed me with false promises. As you can imagine, that has been a problem! We did discuss the things that are now a problem, before we married. But one of us was being dishonest, not only with me, but with himself.

 

So here I am, nearly eight years later, trying to get to know the person I married. Not an ideal environment, but I'm willing to wait for him to be comfortable to let himself be known, and then I'll decide whether or not I like him.

 

I also think that children bring their own interference into the mix of how much independence is too much in a marriage. If one spouse is expected to always be there for the kids, while the other is out being independent, it creates a different dynamic, brings a different set of expectations. Kids have to be cared for. That shouldn't just fall to one parent.

[Trialbyfire]

When people make the decision of having children, especially women, they have to take into consideration if they're capable of raising the children on their own, financially and emotionally. Anything can happen to your partner, be it divorce, infidelity or accidental death.

 

Having said that, the discussion of kids or no kids, "how to raise them" should have happened previous to marriage. Similar goals and compatible attitudes in life are very important.

 

For example, for myself, I believe in family first. I want a spouse who feels the same way, one who wants at min. 1 child, at max. 2 children. He needs to believe in an extremely healthy lifestyle, eating right and maintaining a fitness level for everyone in the family. I really want a family situation where we're all enjoying skiing/boarding, snow or water, or some other kind of family athletics.

 

This was exactly what my ex-H wanted so we proceeded down that road, although I delayed it until I could become self-employed, therefore, be able to work from home. I'm eternally grateful for delaying it. Otherwise, the divorce would have been even worse with children, when it hit the fan over his infidelity. Someone was looking out for me...BIG TIME!

 

I will say that even if we had children, my financial situation wouldn't have stopped me from walking from the marriage. To me, it's extremely important to always have choice and freedom.

[lonelyandfrustrated]

Living with my boyfriend, whether we ever marry or not, has provided us both LOTS of insight into how well we mesh. We've had lots of conversation about things that have happened in our past relationships and why it wasn't working, respectively, and we found each other on the same page so many times it was scary. We don't try to control each other, though, which works quite well.

 

Yep. Me and H did the exact same thing. That's why I'm so freaking mad now.

 

lol, he says, "How do you remember conversations from way back then?" and I'm all, "It's how I fell in love with you!" Idiot. Never underestimate the length and depth of a woman's memory.

[lonelyandfrustrated]

It can be very frustrating dealing with the male of the species. They are from Mars after all, and women are from Venus. We're all about feelings (emotions) and they're all about feelings (genitalia). lol

 

I figure if I can put in the effort to tend his genitalia, he can put in the effort to tend my emotions, lol.

 

Okay, so maybe my job is effortless, but it doesn't let him off the hook.

[Walk]

My big boundary: don't walk in on me while I'm using the bathroom.

[Curmudgeon]

I was never married but common-law.. so in my book, it's the same, except for the piece of paper.. and the stupid vows..

 

You should have stopped at, "I was never married." That would have been more sensible, thoughtful and mature than insulting the billions of us world-wide who have taken vows and adhere to them. That you are incapable of doing so does not make it stupid.

 

Your inappropriate comment says far more about you than it does about any of us.

[Trialbyfire]

James, I was thinking about boundaries in general because of your thread, so I thank you for creating this thread.

 

It's made me realize more and more, how much I need someone who also has strong boundaries and who will respect mine. No boundary pushers for me, anymore!

[JamesM]

James, I was thinking about boundaries in general because of your thread, so I thank you for creating this thread.

 

It's made me realize more and more, how much I need someone who also has strong boundaries and who will respect mine. No boundary pushers for me, anymore!

 

 

I agree.

 

I think the biggest thing about boundaries is that both people agree on what and how they are defined. For me to marry someone who thought mine were too controlling would make for difficult times. And maybe I would view someone who wanted complete privacy as attempting to hide something.

 

As an example, early on in our marriage, we decided that we never open each other's mail, and that includes junk mail.

 

Now if she felt that I was hiding something by not letting her see my mail or if I though that of her, then we could have some big issues over this one simple boundary.

 

Yet I have a friend who is on her second "marriage." (I don't know if she ever actually got married). He first husband was extremely controlling. So in this relationship, she has a very difficult time giving up control of her life. For the two of them it has seemed to work out. If she had not such a controlling first marriage, it is highly likely that she would be different.

 

Boundaries must be decided before marriage and the first time they come up after marriage.

[Walk]

Boundaries must be decided before marriage and the first time they come up after marriage.

 

I've found boundaries change some what after marriage. For instance, hubby did not believe in joint bank accounts pre-marriage. He had no issue with it post.

 

I really don't believe the issue is so much with what the boundary is, as much as respecting your partner enough to accept and (attempt) to understand it. Like TBF stated she wants to find someone who respects her boundaries, but didn't say she wanted someone who shared all the same boundaries as she holds.

[JamesM]

Good point, Walk.

 

I remember my wife saying that she would never quit work for children...before we had children. Yet when she was pregnant with our first child, she figured out our bills so she could stay home full time.

 

Boundaries do change, and as you said, we must respect our partner when they desire change.

 

However, this brings the point that if your partner suddenly wants his or her calls kept private, mail kept private, or emails in a private account...all of these can indicate something more than changing boundaries.

 

When do we consider boundary changes more than just a personal desire change with nothing more behind it?