should I leave my menopausal wife because the sex has stopped?

[carhill]

Along with the lack of libido goes all the lesser aspects of sex - no more kissing, no more hugs, no more sitting with me, no more wanting to do anything with me, no more compliments or saying anything nice or kind to me, no more talking (other than practical matters) to me, no more holding hands and so on.

 

I'm a middle-aged gentleman and I must say that's a cr@p way to get treated by anyone, menopause or not. That's a global meltdown. Sorry, but I don't see any upside here. A living, breathing woman is more than the sum of her hormones.

 

Personally, I wouldn't stand for it.

[marlena]

Forever in Love,

I must say I'm amazed at your assertion. How do you account for it? Can I suggest that you look at a few menopause websites and see how rare you really are? OK, I believe you, but you really do represent a tiny percentage, most women really won't share your experience and would be very jealous of you.

 

Well, it does happen. I can assure you of that. Be a trite more patient, menopause varies form woman to woman and in some cases it can last for years. It seems to hit some woman harder than others.

 

I fully empathize with your situation but because you do love her, try to be a bit more patient, wait it out a bit and see what happens.

 

If she were a woman who was not into sex to begin with (yes, there are women like that) then I could perhaps understand her stance. I find it very hard to believe that a sensual woman, a tactile woman, one who enjoys giving and taking pleasure can suddenly find the act of intimacy repulsive.

 

Could there be other causes for her emotional and physical withdrawal? If only she would communicate her feelings to you.

 

Wait and if in time things to not improve,then, you can see what to do.

 

M

[foreverinlove]

Forever in Love,

I must say I'm amazed at your assertion. How do you account for it? Can I suggest that you look at a few menopause websites and see how rare you really are? OK, I believe you, but you really do represent a tiny percentage, most women really won't share your experience and would be very jealous of you.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I don't know about that, but because of my husbands love and caring, and because I felt totally loved, I was able to take care of my husband's needs even when I didn't have much of a libido. My hands and my mouth still worked.

 

And again, because of his understanding I looked for answers and discovered natural progesterone cream, which made a lot of difference battling the symptoms of menopause. I still use it to this day and it made a world of difference. Now I would love to have sex every day, but have to settle for twice a week, But I don't mind because now it's my turn to be supportive and caring, and we are working on his lowered testosterone levels to increase his sex drive. I think love can do miracles. It just depends how much you really love each other and are willing to sacrifice for that love. We have been married for 42 years and have had more serious challenges than menopause.

[foreverinlove]

I left my wife and children for this woman, 7 years ago. It was the hardest most terrible thing I have ever done. I'm not religious but I feel that what I did has left a stain on my soul.

 

 

Maybe she can feel that. Women are much more sensitive than men give us credit for.

 

 

 

 

Sex was a large part of why my wife and I got together. We both knew and agreed on that.

 

 

Again, maybe now when things are getting a bit tough she feels you only married her for the sex and not love.

[Mr. Lucky]

Yes, I agree with you, Sally4Sara, but there's a minor difference...

 

For the woman it's a serious issue of self-esteem and personal image. Thjis is a particularly vulnerable time for any woman, and with hormones raging and going berserk, it's tough knowing which way is up sometimes...

For the man (who should be loving, reassuring and supportive) to be behaving this way is just - well, it's beyond words, really.

The OP claims that he understands all about menopause and what it means...

 

 

 

Cerebrally, maybe. But emotionally? Sympathetically? he might as well be on a different planet.

He's got noooo idea.

Especially with the last comment....

"....how little there is that anyone can do about it."

 

The menopause is a biological occurrence and is largely unavoidable. but there is a great deal one can do about it.

masses.

 

All it needs is a bit of love, understanding, discussion and support.

 

Not callous disregard and thinking with your little nether trouser friend.....

While I agree the OP needs to be more sensitive to what his partner is going through, your post is staggeringly one-sided in its view of the world. You seem to forget that there are two people's needs being discussed here...

 

Mr. Lucky

[Geishawhelk]

And I would be discussing both sides if his wife had posted as well. I may be looking at it from only one side, but that's all I've got.

And I don't like his side much.

[nevstan]

Well now, from what I've heard here but, on the other hand, read elsewhere, there seem to be two contradictory views of the whole menopause:

 

Both seem to agree that it's a time of great upheaval where women go in search of pills and potions but the disagreement seems to come after that. Let's assume, for argument's sake, that the upheaval takes two years but stops after that. One school of thought seems to think that although the traumatic events have stopped, nevertheless the changes that were wrought (mostly a lowering of everything including libido) are there to stay. In other words, the upheaval of the menopause marks a permanent change in a woman. The other view seems to be that the menopause is just something you go through but you can come out the other side and "recover", so to speak.

 

Now if I thought the latter was the case, it would make a vast difference to my thinking, but my understanding is that these changes are permanent. Now I could be wrong and I'd be happy for someone to tell me where to look to find out the opposite. I appreciate that people have personal experiences but they don't demonstrate a trend as each of them might be one in a million. I need than just one person's word that I'm wrong, to convince me.

[carhill]

The most accurate constant is that there is none. Everyone is different, has different genetics, physicality and psychology.

 

My mom went through menopause when I was an adolescent. No one ever even knew. She gave no outward signs of change. Her personality was always a bit stoic, and it remained so.

 

My wife is going through it now, likely the early stages. She's mad at the world. I just happen to be part of it . She has aches and pains and everything bothers her. She does still acknowledge my existence and occasionally makes me feel valued, so I guess I'm doing "better" than you. Unfortunately, our marriage was strained from other issues long before this started so it's just another burden I have to deal with. After taking care of a mentally ill mother for 4 years, I'm about spent. In that regard, I can empathize with you. I'd just like to find a deserted island and live off the land for a few years.

[marlena]

Nevstan,

 

If you truly want your wife to be a part of your life, then, you will just have to wait this one out and help her with this transition as lovingly and as patiently as you possible can. It is after all a transition and you have no way of predicting what the final outcome will be after all this has passed. No amount of research, although good for you for wanting to be intelligently informed, will give you your answers beforehand for as Carhill pointed out each woman is different and unique.

 

Be positive and hope for the best.

[Geishawhelk]

It might help to find out her mother's experience, and whether she has older sisters who might have gone through it. Occasionally, it's sequential and hereditary. You may be able to glean some kind of better picture by looking at their circumstances.

In my mother's case, she had an early menopause down to a prolapsed uterus, which necessitated an hysterectomy. Before the op, she was a complete nightmare. Fluctuating moods don't cover it.

After her op, and a short period of physical recovery, she was back to her normal self.

He ovaries remained intact, and her menopausal phase was much easier for her to negotiate. So I can't actually take her case as a help to bette seeing mine....

I am 51, and have just entered my menopausal phase (what doctors and so-called experts call 'perimenopausal'.)

 

An exceptional book you could get for her is a book titled 'Elderwoman'. It's got nothing to do with age, but is an extremely well- documented and informative book on the experience - physical, mental and spiritual, if you will - of the whole process.

This is the Aurthor's website. She is an accomplished and well read author, and I would also point your wife into the direction of the website. It may well help her.

It may also well help you.

 

The menopause is not an illness or a condition. It's a natural phase. It's not something you recover from, per se.

 

The reason this has made me so angry, and i'm sorry for that - is that the vibes you have given off and the demands you have made, imprint a sense of failure and uselessness on your wife. There's nothing worse than going through something natural but inevitable, and feeling that you are entirely responsible for the pleasure - or lack thereof - of your partner. It's an awful and unnecessary burden to bear.

 

I hate to further add - but I don't think I'm mistaken (though clearly, I might be) - if we've had women on here talking about their man's impotence, or inabiltiy to maintain an erection, for whatever reason, I don't think we've ever had one turn round and say "If he can't get it back up, I'm going to have to find someone else!"

 

Whilst I understand that your initial mutual attraction was sexual, and brilliant at that, I think it's important to also realise that nothing stays the same. Situations change, people change, circumstances change, hormones change, views change, tastes change, likes and dislikes change.... it's all part of the evolutionary process of being a human being.

There's no question in my mind that your attitude is making things much worse for her, and part of her process, and being able to come out the other side a well-adjusted, happy post-menopausal woman, is to know her man is 100% behind her, regardless.

 

if you two can't see this one through together, side by side and on equal footing, I actually see little to indicate that things were so mutually perfect in the first place. A partnership is equal, even in a companionship, on all levels. And should remain so.

The sex will inevitably disappear one day, altogether.

If you grow old and frail and dependent on her care and support, I would imagine that having sex will not be your priority.

In which case, it seems a misguided focus to make it one, now.

[Kasan]

The reason this has made me so angry, and i'm sorry for that - is that the vibes you have given off and the demands you have made, imprint a sense of failure and uselessness on your wife. There's nothing worse than going through something natural but inevitable, and feeling that you are entirely responsible for the pleasure - or lack thereof - of your partner. It's an awful and unnecessary burden to bear.

 

I hate to further add - but I don't think I'm mistaken (though clearly, I might be) - if we've had women on here talking about their man's impotence, or inabiltiy to maintain an erection, for whatever reason, I don't think we've ever had one turn round and say "If he can't get it back up, I'm going to have to find someone else!"

 

I couldn't put my finger on what was bothering me about the tone of the OP's post. I thank you for putting into words for me what the problem is/was.

 

Nevstan, I think that you would be surprised at how many women who have responded to you are in their 50's and have gone though menopause or are going through this.

 

You can take our experiences for what they are...............but I do wonder, how your partner would be dealing with this if the shoe was on the other foot.

[nevstan]

I can't go on like I am with every day being a rollercoaster ride. Not a ride with joy and despair but merely one that sinks underground, into the depths, for most of the time and occasionally emerges into the dull grey light of an ordinary day. Do rollercoasters reach dizzying heights? I wouldn't know, it's so long since I was there.

 

Can't go on in what sense? I wish I knew. All I know is that the weight of the life I have is crushing me, pushing me towards a precipice. Each day is an exercise in damage limitation, a struggle just to get through it whilst fending off hopelessness.

 

I'm trapped by lack of money. I simply can't afford to remedy the situation by any means that might involve spending money. I can see no way of increasing my income and I'm too old to get anything else.

 

If I disappeared tomorrow and went to sit on the beach for a few days, what would it achieve? Would anyone be worried about me? And if they were, and they were relieved to have me back, how would that relief translate into anything different? It wouldn't. The relief would soon turn to annoyance that I'd inconvenienced them.

 

The greatest thing I wanted in my life was a beautiful girl who'd love me. Both mentally, emotionally and physically and I think I deluded myself that my partner was that girl. I do think she's beautiful but I know it's a vision coloured by remembering her from school but that's alright, it works for me. But she no longer loves me physically because the menopause has robbed her of her libido, and she never loved me mentally, which leaves only emotionally and, oh, what meagre crumbs that is. She loves me in her own way, just as my ex-wife did, but it's so little and so distant and so unreciprocal. I have to earn her love, virtually pay her for it, bribe her for it, beg her for it, every day. Every hour indeed, as anything I do isn't even enough to guarantee her affection for a whole day.

 

And I've tried and tried to work my way around this, mentally and philosophically, but I cannot get past the fact that, for me, other people can make me happy or sad. I cannot generate my own happiness. I wish I could. I know that when my partner loved me enough to have sex with me three times in a week, back in April (2008) - a very very rare thing - it made me so happy that my whole outlook on life changed. Even weeks after (after the sex had stopped as suddenly as it had appeared), I was able to go on a diet and lose a stone. And believe me, successful diets are a clear indicator of my happiness.

 

If you're a woman reading this then you'll probably feel quite superior to me, slightly pitying me for the fact of sex making such a difference to me. Poor hopeless man, you'll think, little better than an animal, just like all men, always thinking with their dicks. If you're a man though, you'll understand this.

 

I can't help it though. Probably wouldn't change it if I could. Sex represents something glorious to me, life's most amazing experience and the ultimate expression of love between man and woman. To those who insist that "there are other ways of showing love", I say yeah, but nowhere near as powerfully, as transcendentally as sex does. I realise that for some people and for many women, sex can be meaningless or of meagre importance, but it's not that way for me.

 

Several times a day I have to fight back tears as the hopelessness of this envelopes me. Sometimes I give in to them but it doesn't make me feel any better, the sense of oppression just goes on. So much, these days, all these worries make it impossible for me to work or think creatively. I spend hours, days even, worrying about this, trying to find some tiny chink in the problem's armour, some way out that I haven't thought of. I spend hours on the internet, looking at message boards trying to find an answer that hasn't occurred to me but all I find is people in a similar position with people replying to them who really don't understand.

 

Without the sexual love of someone I love my life will be meaningless and, at the end, will have been meaningless. i know my friends will not judge me in this way. they'll judge me as the person I was to the outside world but I know I've failed. I know I've made mistake after mistake and there's something in me that seems to go on making them. There are so many points in my life that I wish I could go back to and change, so many different directions that I wish my life had gone. I can't bear the thought that my whole life will have been a mistake, that I will never have learned, never have got it right enough to be happy for more than five minutes.

 

Can I see myself just the same as this in five years time? No. But I don't know how it'll change apart from catastrophically. As I said at the beginning, "can't go on" in what sense? I'm not a believer in suicide and I have always believed that where there's life there's hope, but as each day just dies by fizzling out, I don't know how much more of this unrelenting smallness and hopelessness I can take. I'm not moving anymore, just stagnating. All the contents of my mind and heart just turning rotten.

 

There's no one who's going to save me is there? I'm not important. I do appreciate that the universe collapsing in my head is not visible to anyone else. Only I'm experiencing this. It's like going to sleep in a noisy place, or dying. You notice that the outside world has lost its reality and then everything shrinks to a single point of light which then dims and goes out. I can understand why Kenneth Williams' last words were "Oh what's the bloody point?". That's exactly how I feel. I go on because I feel some artistic/creative duty to do so and because I feel, in some small way, that my children might need me but those two things are almost like tools that I carry, they're not the core of me. The real me, the one I live within, has run out of energy, is dead in the water. It's only the tools pushing me along and I find myself getting angry at the future, thinking "Leave me alone! Don't make me live through another day!" If only I knew if there was a purpose to my still being here but there doesn't seem to be. Going through the motions, that's what I do, that's all I do.

 

Sometimes I think my partner has the power to save me and, since it's my only hope, I direct all my energies in that direction, hoping that she'll understand what she can do. But I think it's hopeless. She neither sees nor understands. I've tried and tried to tell her how I'm feeling but, ultimately, how I'm feeling doesn't really seem to bother her. Things I do for her, how much money I've got, how much I worship her or flatter her, those are the things which generate her "love" for me. There doesn't seem to be anything deeper. There's certainly no reservoir of compassion in her for me that doesn't have to be paid for, in advance. There is for her children, millions of gallons of it, but not for me.

 

After all that though, if I won the Lottery, my thought would be stay with her, to see if everything we could then have and do, and the worries it could remove, would allow her to love me. Maybe this is another mistake, I don't know.

 

I just don't know what the future holds apart from more of the bloody same.

[TrustInYourself]

Haha, I love your poetry over not having your sexual needs met. Man power baby, man power. It's funny how much physical we are when it comes to loving another human.

 

As far as leaving your wife. Perhaps communicating in a blunt fashion. Something along the lines of...

 

"If we do not **** right now, I'm going to divorce you" or perhaps..

"I need vagina on a regular basis or get all EMO"

 

Thoughts? I don't think you are pathetic at all, btw. I think you are just reaching out in the wrong ways. If something doesn't work during communication, evaluate and adjust until something does work.

[ahah2322]

i think that you are suffering from depression, nevstan.

[Ronni_W]

Without the sexual love of someone I love my life will be meaningless

Nevstan, have you considered how that belief came about? - that sex is what brings meaning to your life? - that your life would be otherwise meaningless?

 

It is as if you are making your (sexual) partner responsible for YOUR life's meaning...YOUR purpose for being. Individuals are not born, it is not our 'meaning' to validate others in the way that you appear to be needing meaning/validation.

 

Can you imagine what a burden that is, to place on someone else? "I need you to do this specific and exact thing so that I can prove to myself that I am worth something; that I have value, meaning and purpose."

 

That is not about menopause. If it was a case of chemotherapy robbing her of her libido, you would be in exactly the same spot in which your beliefs about your own meaning have now placed you.

 

This is not about her, whether she loves you or does not; whether she has sex with you or does not. This is about you, and only you.

[marlena]

Sometimes I think my partner has the power to save me and, since it's my only hope, I direct all my energies in that direction, hoping that she'll understand what she can do.

 

No, the only person who has the power to save you is you. It is unfair to put this burden on your wife or anyone else for that matter. If you are this depressed, you need help from a professional. Not that you can´t do it alone but it will be extremely hard.

 

Take responsibility for your actions or inactions as the case may be. Lose the weight, improve your self-image, reinforce your self-esteem, do things that you enjoy and then get out of your marriage if it is causing you such extreme emotional and mental distress. Or work on reigniting the fire in your marriage.

Have you ever stopped to consider that your depression and apathetic stance towards life itself could be repsonsible for your wife´s lack of libido?

 

I agree with the above poster. This is not about menopause. It is about you.

[Geishawhelk]

I Sometimes I think my partner has the power to save me and, since it's my only hope, I direct all my energies in that direction, hoping that she'll understand what she can do. But I think it's hopeless. She neither sees nor understands.

 

Well that's it, in a nutshell.

You don't understand her, and she doesn't understand you.

I think if the account of her attitude is accurate, (and I'm not doubting that it is - purely from your POV....) then forget the fact that there's no sex.

I get the distinct impression this is not just hormonal. I suspect it's also emotional, and that she may well have fallen out of Love with you.

She won't engage, she won't talk, she won't explain cryptic remarks.

Something has to give....

There is the possibility that she's afraid that if she does sit and discuss thins with you, she may have to tell you the truth.

Now. As I said earlier. We only have your side of things. What would she find to say, to discuss, to confess if we had her account of things?

Is your record in this completely unblemished - from HER POV - ?

.....

I just don't know what the future holds apart from more of the bloody same.

As others have quite clearly indicated - when it comes to 'You' only you can take responsibility for that. So, the choice is yours. You have no right to put any of 'you' on her shoulders.

But hey, it cuts both ways. She has no right to put any of 'her' on you....

 

So whatcha going to do about 'you'?

[TrustInYourself]

Well that's it, in a nutshell.

You don't understand her, and she doesn't understand you.

I think if the account of her attitude is accurate, (and I'm not doubting that it is - purely from your POV....) then forget the fact that there's no sex.

I get the distinct impression this is not just hormonal. I suspect it's also emotional, and that she may well have fallen out of Love with you.

She won't engage, she won't talk, she won't explain cryptic remarks.

Something has to give....

There is the possibility that she's afraid that if she does sit and discuss thins with you, she may have to tell you the truth.

Now. As I said earlier. We only have your side of things. What would she find to say, to discuss, to confess if we had her account of things?

Is your record in this completely unblemished - from HER POV - ?

.....

 

As others have quite clearly indicated - when it comes to 'You' only you can take responsibility for that. So, the choice is yours. You have no right to put any of 'you' on her shoulders.

But hey, it cuts both ways. She has no right to put any of 'her' on you....

 

So whatcha going to do about 'you'?

 

Write more poetry and base his future happiness on whether or not he's getting his loving. Hell yes.

[Geishawhelk]

Nope. (where did you get that from, in my post? why quote me? )

If things really have gotten to this stage, instead of sitting there and moping about it, it's about time he stopped treading on eggshells and sought a solution.

He's definitely depressed. he needs professional help. Heck, they both do. But if (according to him, she won't "play the game" then all he can do is to deal with himself.

The word 'ultimatum' comes to mind.

Not about having sex now, or else.

About doing something to salvage what's left, if the desire and effort to do so are there.

It's time to give her a bit of a poke in the chest, and see what she comes back with, by being challenged.

[Mz. Pixie]

And I've tried and tried to work my way around this, mentally and philosophically, but I cannot get past the fact that, for me, other people can make me happy or sad. I cannot generate my own happiness. I wish I could.

 

Wow, this says alot about you. Have you ever sought counseling for this???

 

If you're a woman reading this then you'll probably feel quite superior to me, slightly pitying me for the fact of sex making such a difference to me. Poor hopeless man, you'll think, little better than an animal, just like all men, always thinking with their dicks. If you're a man though, you'll understand this.

 

Actually I'm a woman but I do get this. Many women do not understand that when they reject their man sexually they are in fact rejecting who they are deep inside.

 

Several times a day I have to fight back tears as the hopelessness of this envelopes me. Sometimes I give in to them but it doesn't make me feel any better, the sense of oppression just goes on.

 

This is another reason why I think you could benefit from counseling.

[JasonMJones]

Nevstan,

 

You express yourself very well. My sympathies.

 

I've been there, done that. It went on for 8 years. I was miserable.

 

I've learned that many women, my SO included, don't really understand how important sex is to many men. They understand horny, but not the deep connection, afirmation, and support that comes from loving sex.

 

You might try going together to a marriage counselor, one that specializes in sexual issues. We have, it is helping. It's a slow process, no guarantees, but its better to try before throwing away what you have.

 

The very best of luck to you. You are not alone.

[TrustInYourself]

Nope. (where did you get that from, in my post? why quote me? )

If things really have gotten to this stage, instead of sitting there and moping about it, it's about time he stopped treading on eggshells and sought a solution.

He's definitely depressed. he needs professional help. Heck, they both do. But if (according to him, she won't "play the game" then all he can do is to deal with himself.

The word 'ultimatum' comes to mind.

Not about having sex now, or else.

About doing something to salvage what's left, if the desire and effort to do so are there.

It's time to give her a bit of a poke in the chest, and see what she comes back with, by being challenged.

 

You asked what he's going to do and I gave you the most likely answer. He's too feeble to even address his own depression and most likely a contributing cause to the reason his wife won't consider sleeping with him.

 

I agree with you on your point that he needs to deal with himself.

 

I totally disagree on ultimatums or trying to challenge her. That's wasted energy.

 

His sole purpose right now should be to address his issues and heal from his pain and suffering. That depression should be addressed before he starts demanding sex.

 

It's creepy and weird to think about a depressed person demanding that you sleep with them so that they can feel alive? How is that going to work if he's single? It's pathetic to be honest.

[Geishawhelk]

Thanks, TrustInYourself, I appreciate your clarifying... I take your point.

 

It's very difficult, actually, to really know exactly what to say or advise.

if for no other reason that it's too one sided, and I think Nevar is depressed to the point that he's in despair, I wish somehow we had her POV, just to be able to give something more concrete. At he moment, I think insoite of all our good and honest intentions, I don't think we're really getting anywhere.....*sad emoticon*.....

[TrustInYourself]

Agreed, I see a lot of emotion and venting going on in the post. I sometimes do the same thing and it's hard for people to recommend anything when I'm just letting out all my frustration.

 

Constructive criticism is hard when the situation is presented in emotional terms rather than a factual presentation.

 

It's also easier when the person posting is a lot more objective. Nevar seems deeply entrenched in dealing with the situation. I know being that emotionally invested borders on codependence. It's extremely unhealthy for both partners in any relationship, when someone's total happiness is dependent on the actions of the other partner.

 

Any ways, I hope things work out for the OP. I'm sorry if I've come across as judgemental. Best wishes!

[SingleDad]

I agree with TIY (as always). But I think I'll be more judgemental.

 

A wife's purpose is not to satisfy the insatiable sexual "needs" of her husband. Sexual satisfaction is just one of many aspects of a marrriage.

 

Nevstan is in a state of depression due to his insatiable sexual "needs" not being met. He needs to talk with a counselor and maybe get some meds (and maybe a blow-up doll).