Wife's Crush on Colleague?

[Cobra_X30]

You should expect a better marriage. But you need to keep an open mind to what is accomplished in each session. This isnt just about hammering your wife into saying/doing what you want. This is about understanding her and communicating better with her.

 

Essentially you will only get out of MC what you put in. If you put in nothing but selfishness and obsessive stubborness, you will be left with only that and its a waste of you time.

[fxj05]

My W is still working at the job where all this started, but she is leaving next week, so what I'm asking is more hypothetical and about future situations, rather than to do with whether it indicates anything more about the present situation.

 

She still tells me about some of the banter that goes on within the open plan office of 8 women and 4 men, my W being the oldest at 34 and the only one with kids except for 2 managers based in a different office.

 

The good looking colleague, in his early 20's sits at the opposite end of the office from my W shouted up the office one day looking her attention. She replied what are you boys looking now and he replied that they weren't boys but men!

 

Her response was a snort of derision saying that they aren't men until thay have proven themselves! ie their sexual prowess by producing offspring.

 

His response was that this was a dangerous statement to come out with. ie That she had challenged his manhood and he may have to prove his manliness to her.

 

She says this is all said in front of the whole office and that every body joined in the cheering at this banter and that it is just good humoured and innocent.

 

Am I over reacting by saying that a married woman shouldn't talk like this to another man especially one she is attracted to.

 

I never talk to other women like this as I feel that it is inappropriate. I'm tempted to think sometimes if she can do it why shouldn't I. I would love to get that sort of attention from an attractive women especially at the minute when I feel ugly and my self esteem has been knocked.

 

But If she thought I was talking to other attractive women like that she would be jealous as hell. But she still thinks when she does it, its innocent and just friendly banter, good fun nothing else.

 

She even had the nerve to accuse me of thinking that everything is based around sex, it doesn't always have to be about sex, and that you can just be friends. But when you make comments like that at work the words pot, kettle and black come to mind.

 

She also says that I think our relationship has to be about sex and why can it not be just about love.

[Ladyjane14]

Am I over reacting by saying that a married woman shouldn't talk like this to another man especially one she is attracted to.

 

Yes... I think you are. If there was any REAL sexual tension, she wouldn't have filled you in. I mean, seriously, how would you KNOW anything about banter at the office if she wasn't sharing it with you.

 

This guy sounds like 'one of the girls' to me. And I think you're probably destroying emotional intimacy within your marriage when your wife has to weigh and measure every spoken word with precision lest she set off your insecurities.

 

Good emotional intimacy is like a bubble which encapsulates just the two of you. It's supposed to be a safe place, where you can share communications as well as life's joys and tribulations. If you want to strengthen your marriage... THIS is where you need to put in the work.

 

Worry is wasted energy.

[fxj05]

LJ, I suppose it comes down to what we as a couple think is an acceptable way to talk to the attractive members of the other sex.

 

I have never talked to other women like that out of respect for my wife and because she has been more insecure than I have been in the past.

The mere act of an innocent conversation with an attractive lady would have her running to my side to protect me.

 

Therefore I would avoid that sort of sexual banter like that as it felt a bit like cheating in a way.

 

And I know that she has shared this with me, therefore I should take that as a positive and as I have said before i don't think this goes further than the office.

 

But it doesn't change the fact that she went out of her way to improve her appearance etc along with all the other things mentioned, for the benefit of someone else.

 

If my W is uncomfortable with me flirting with other women, is it not reasonable for me to feel the same way and ask to be treated like she would like to be treated

[fxj05]

My W is leaving her job to come work with me, so whatever happened is in the past. As I have said I'm sure it didn't get physical, for various reasons that I won't go into.[/COLOR]

 

Just to recap what my thoughts on the whole thing are

The timing suggests to me that initially from May it was an attraction to the good looking younger colleague, but from September she had a lot of contact with an older colleague by telephone who she says provided her with emotional support, but who she was not physically attracted to

 

Just to put into context the situation for people who think I may be possessively jealous etc. My W is quite bubbly, friendly and flirty which is what attracted me to her in the first place. But I feel this sort of thing has happened before

 

In the past when we were teenagers, there was a situation, that I mentioned in my first post, where flirting took place with several of my friends. This happened in front of my face and my friends thought she was fair game to grope and carry on with

 

My W passively encouraged this, which we had a lot of fights about at the time as I felt she was loving the attention and was letting it develop. In hindsight I should have been man enough to tell my friends that it was unacceptable behavior

 

This developed into what I felt was a strong attraction to my best friend, who I didn't really trust, and who later made out with another friends girlfriend when he was away on holiday

 

There were things about her relationship with him that I didn't like, I went away for a weekend to watch a game of football and my friends took my W (then girlfriend of 4months out to a club).

 

When I came home there was a lot of innuendo about what had happened, maybe they were winding me up but it made me uncomfortable

 

Some of her girlfriends, who were also there, said some things in a jokey, but chastising way that concerned me also. Maybe it was nothing but I felt they were just getting too friendly

 

Later she spent a night walking around the town with him (So she says), when I was away playing football. She walked about a mile in the dark to his house, walking past her girlfriends houses to go to his, when it would have been easier to call in for one of the girls

 

Maybe nothing happened, but she was attracted to him, I know because she had a one night thing with him before we got together and she told others that she was attracted to him before we got together.

 

We had rows about this because I felt she was enjoying the extra attention and giving signals that she was interested, which I felt she shouldn’t be doing, but we got over it

 

Although she denied at the time she was doing anything wrong, she recently admitted it was inappropriate

 

Anyway what I’m trying to point out is that was 15 years ago and I haven’t had those feelings again up til now. There have been times since when I know she has been attracted to others including co-workers with banter etc, but it has never been an issue.

 

Back to the present situation and I am not sure whether you would call it an emotional affair, but things feel a bit better and I feel like I want to forgive my wife, so that we can move on

 

But what can I forgive her for if she won’t admit there was anything in the first place. Even though I have no proof, I know by the way she said and done things that it was something.

 

Whether it was just a bit of flirting that she found exciting or whatever, it affected the way she reacted to and treated me. She also made an effort to impress someone else and lied about it. Given time and an opportune moment, or the inclusion of alcohol, it could have lead to something

 

How do I forgive her so that I don’t hold resentment and destroy our relationship

 

I don’t know if I have forgiven the first time 15 years ago, because she never really admitted to it either

 

As I said we are attending MC but after the first session I felt worse than ever. It put me into a bad mood as I felt that it wasn’t getting anywhere. I couldn’t sleep that night and got out of bed and drank to reading LS with tears rolling down my face

 

I have dragged myself out of that bad mood after a couple days and we had great sex last night, which probably helped

 

I don’t want to feel this way again, the last 4-5 months have been pretty hard, feeling at times unloved, unattractive, uncertain about what was going on and angry about the lies

[Cobra_X30]

Oh, man. You need to find a way to seperate your own anxiety and mental issues from your wife's actions.

 

1st, you seem to place too much of your own self worth on how she views you! You lack self confidence. Its not her job to provide that to you. She cant provide that to you. The best she can do is plug that hole in your heart for a time.

 

As to your wife... it sounds like she has self esteem issues also. You cant prove she is lieing. The only thing you have to hold onto is the fact that she treated you different and you felt she was emotionally distancing herself from you.

 

As for forgiveness. That will happen naturally once you start to love yourself. She doesnt need to admit anything for you to forgive her. You need to forgive her for what you think happened... you dont need her to admit to something for that to happen.

[fxj05]

My wife finally admitted that something was going on. It happened when she realised that I may walk out if she didn't start being honest with me.

 

She has admitted being infatuated with the OM, a 23yo colleague, and felt like she was falling in love. She says she realises tht she wasn't in love and she is remorseful for the hurt she has caused.

 

She has said that they had very little interaction and that it was all one sided, that they never had a conversation alone, intimate or otherwise.

 

Some of this I find hard to believe as how do you fall in love with someone if they are ignoring you?

 

I have scoured telephone bills etc, and to my knowledge she was never in contact with him outside of work and the relationship never became physical.

 

I'm not really sure what I'm feeling. I'm definitely relieved that she is no longer gaslighting me. If she had kept denying it then I don't think I could have continued with our marriage or kept loving her for much longer.

 

I just want to thank everybody for their replies, even if I didn't agree.

[whichwayisup]

She has said that they had very little interaction and that it was all one sided, that they never had a conversation alone, intimate or otherwise.

 

Do you believe this, what she's told you?

 

The truth still has to come out...There's more of it, she's just scared now to come clean completely. Her past actions and the way she was reacting to you just doesn't seem to fit what she's told you so far..

 

Have you installed a keylogger to see if she has a secret email account you don't know about?

 

I don’t know if I have forgiven the first time 15 years ago, because she never really admitted to it either

 

What about this?

 

Marriage counselling hopefully will get her to own up more to what she's done to you and fix herself as well with individual counselling.

[fxj05]

No I don't believe she has told me everything, i know from some of her past conversations she was having fun and banter with the OM.

 

I have installed a keylogger and checked her phone logs and for various other reasons I believe it never progressed to a PA.

 

How one sided it was, like shes making out, I can't be sure.

 

She hasn't really been forthcoming as anything she has admitted to, like the infatuation and in love feelings, I was able to prove to her, by her actions towards me and the things she was doing.

 

She has really only nodded in agreement or said 'I didn't realise I was feeling that way until you pointed it out' which is obviously BS. How do you not know you're falling in love?

 

I can't believe that at the very least she wasn't flirting quite a bit and at least attempting to spend her lunches with him as she didn't want to spend them with me or would never have time to contact me when I wasn't about for lunch.

 

I don’t know if I have forgiven the first time 15 years ago, because she never really admitted to it either

 

 

Shortly after we first started dating, she was attracted to my best friend and although I couldn't prove it, she seemed to be infatuated with him.

 

It seems she has always needed the approval and attention from other men to make her feel special.

[LucreziaBorgia]

Welcome to the 'truth trickle'. The first truth is never the whole truth. It takes a long time for a WS to admit what really happened.

[Chrome Barracuda]

I'd say divorce her and find someone else. You dont need the disrespect. Her friends are not trustworthy and your wife is in a place where she is weak to her own emotions and feelings of other people.

 

Noboddy ever said marriage was easy, that's granted but it takes two.

 

Now that she knows theirs a problems is she gonna do the right thing and refocus on you? or continue with her crush? What's more important.

 

There's more to the story. That much I know for certain.

 

She knows she did you dirty.

 

I still say detach and go out by yourself more often. Live your life for you. A quick 180 is in order.

 

Her friends and her life is more important than her marriage right? Damn that crap!

Edited January 2, 2008 by Chrome Barracuda

[StillSame]

fxj, are they still working together? Do they still have any type of contact whatsover?

[Rooster_DAR]

My point of view comes from my past - being the bad cheater. I see more red flags than others, because I was often where your wife is now. She may not have actually followed through with anything, but I know the "too busy to have lunch with you/late from work/lying/lack of sex/missing important family milestones" routine. Its what you do when you set your sights on someone else and you want to test the waters without losing what you already have.

 

I'm not sure why you would be concerned with whether or not she actually f*cks him. Its bad enough that she has turned her back on your emotionally in favor of him. Even if she never actually does the deed - she has shifted the focus of her attraction, attention, and emotional investment to him, and while he gets the good stuff, you get the sulking, the lies, the "late for work/can't make lunch" excuses. She is obviously prioritizing him over you, regardless of whether or not they are actually having a physical affair.

 

 

 

Do not ever underestimate the lengths people will go to have an affair if they want one. Trust me on this one... when people have affairs, they make time. Whether it be a stolen fifteen minutes here at work, some lunch break time, some after work lingering, emails, phone calls, etc. When I was cheating around back in the bad old days, I always found time... ALWAYS. If I wanted it bad enough, there was always some time for it. Maybe not much, but...

 

I guess what I'm saying is that she may or may not be having an affair, but her heart is certainly in it, and that is bad enough on its own. You have to ask yourself if you want to stay married under these circumstances, where you have a wife who stays with you but wants someone else. If its not him, it will be someone else.

 

You'll need to target what it is that led her mind astray before it gets to the point where her body and her heart follows suit.

 

Listen to LB, she is a wise woman.

 

What she is saying here needs to be heard by you. LB followed my through my ordeal and everything she suggested to me I found out was indeed right on. There is always a possibility that there is nothing going on, but the red flags are all there. After reading "Womens Infidelity", I discovered that many men never knew there wives were actually having an affair even well after the divorce was over.

 

Cheers!

[justice]

I'm sorry for what is happening between you and your wife. It sounds somewhat similar to what happened in my relationship with my now ex husband. It may be that she isn't having a physical relationship with this guy just yet, but it certainly sounds like she may be having an emotional affair with him. If you honestly want to keep her, it all needs to come out in the open somehow, your hurt feelings, and her even more hurtful remarks. You need to let her know how you feel both, about how she's hurting you with her actions and remarks and then you need to let her know what you want from your relationship with her and get everything straight and in order. I wish you the best of luck.

[kkthxbye]

So we talked at length the other night, and yes there is a lot of resentment at me for the amount of free time that I spend out of the house playing sport (Couple nights a week and 4hours every Sat or Sun)

 

She feels that sport come before our marriage, and yes I sacrificed family time often for the committment to sport.

 

We have fought about this down the years and I suppose I never really listened. I always felt that she was being unreasonable as it wasn't like I was going to bars or drinking.

 

When I am at home I know I am a good husband, I cook, clean, help with the kids, tell my wife she looks pretty and that I love her more now than ever.

 

But I realise now that she has felt neglected and lonely at times over the sport issue and said I would like to make it good, i just don't know how.

 

Now with her work taking up more time (She has started in the past few weeks working full time, with promotion and extra responsibility) she feels that it is her time to have a life outside of the home.

 

She says that she doesn't want to lose me and that she loves me. She says that some of the spark has gone, although I never felt this way.

 

To be fair for a few years we didn't go out much, with the kids and all.

 

We also spoke again about my feelings that she was attracted to someone at work and she denied this and I told her I didnt believe her.

 

She accused me of not trusting her and I said that I don't trust her on some issues.

 

I am at a loss on what to do from here, Do I just wait and see?

 

Have you considered Marriage counseling? If she doesn't want to lose you , and is interested in helping solve some trust issues, this avenue is a great way to start. It may work, or not for some couples, but it will give W the opportunity to tell a professional stranger how she feels about you, and it may give her the courage to face what is lacking, to herself, then to you. Therapy doesn't solve all problems everywhere, there is no guarantee, but its a fresh start, something new to try, and you may do well with results. The therapist might tap into why she feels the need for lies.

 

For example, I lost a baby with my first marriage, and had problems coping with not having natural children with my second marriage, H is an only child whom desired a great big family full of kids.

 

I found out in therapy, that I suffered from seasonal depression, of which I can now remedy naturally, and I learned about myself in more ways than I had paid the therapist for. I learned how to communicate with my new husband, how to be honest with myself, and how to bring happiness to both of us. How to identify shifts in mood and curb them before they take hold and cause me great suffering. I feel more well rounded with balance than ever before. I wanted to do this, and when my mind opened up, so many things happened at once it was a great awakening.

 

Often people look outside the marriage for signs of hope and happiness, because they feel stuck, or rutted, and just want a glimmer of hope that it will pass. Quick Fixes, we call them. Although we never cheated, we quick fixed down times in our marriage in other ways, equally destructive to our home.

 

Looking back, and reading how you are feeling, you're ready like I was to make the leap and fix it. Your job is to relate gently to W the need to fix these issues the best you can. Therapy is my advice. W might not like the idea of seeing a therapist for anything, but the right one will help unlock parts of her, to herself, so that she can find her own happiness. It sounds to me like she is unhappy, ready to be herself again, outside of motherhood, outside of the wife role, and gain back her independence. This is important. A piece of independence when you are a working mother and wife is very important to a balanced life, IMHO. Your W may be still adjusting to her new role in her life, a professional, in a business setting, of which times may have changed since she knew it last.

 

Give her time to adjust, suggest counseling if you're up to it. A good way to break the idea would be to suggest it, for the purpose of helping her adjust to her busy lifestyle, and still be healthy in her life. She wants to lose weight for health? Suggest this avenue as a Mental diet, for mental cleansing and well being.

 

You see red flags that you can't ignore, and don't let them become swept under the table. The best thing you can do as a father and a loving husband, is to find ways to help the best you can, so you can begin feeling trustworthy and good again. In the end, if it doesn't work out, just knowing you did what you could will suffice, because out of love you tried your best. Don't forget, your happiness has to come first for you, its not her job to make you happy, and vice versa, she needs to find her happiness, and where this unhappiness is stemming from, if from you, and why. It may not be an easy road, especially if she is not ready to look inward to fix the problems. She probably thinks there are no problems, as I did for years I could not see outside of my dark cloud. Thank Goodness the rain has passed. I wish clear skies for you soon!

[fxj05]

We are going through good days and bad days. Today bad.

 

When she opens up and is honest I relax and know we're going to be fine. But sometimes she tries to minimize everything and goes back to gaslighting saying she hasn't actually done anything wrong.

 

At times she doesn't seem to see, minimizes or denies the lies, her motives, the loss of interest, the distracted periods, the forgotten birthday/anniversary, the effort in her appearance for work, along with all the other red flags.

 

This drives me crazy and we have had some huge fights over it, with walkouts by both of us.

 

I'm relying on my intuition, which hasn't been wrong so far, along with what I have witnessed and heard and I know it was never a PA. She left the job 6 weeks ago and there has been no contact, never really has been outside of work.

 

She tells me that he was young arrogant and cocky and in the end she realised she didn't really like him because he could be rude and insensitive.

 

I believe most of this, but I also think she was infatuated with him initially, tried to impress him etc, had feelings and probably felt like she was in love, as he showed her some attention even though she tries to minimize this. Initially when she opened up she admitted all these things.

 

But she now says I wasn't in love/not sure what I felt/only fancied him/was on a high because of new job/ make up, perfume, weight loss was nothing to do with it.

 

When exactly does a crush/infatuation cross the line to an EA?

[bish]

We are going through good days and bad days. Today bad.

 

When she opens up and is honest I relax and know we're going to be fine. But sometimes she tries to minimize everything and goes back to gaslighting saying she hasn't actually done anything wrong.

 

At times she doesn't seem to see, minimizes or denies the lies, her motives, the loss of interest, the distracted periods, the forgotten birthday/anniversary, the effort in her appearance for work, along with all the other red flags.

 

This drives me crazy and we have had some huge fights over it, with walkouts by both of us.

 

I'm relying on my intuition, which hasn't been wrong so far, along with what I have witnessed and heard and I know it was never a PA. She left the job 6 weeks ago and there has been no contact, never really has been outside of work.

 

She tells me that he was young arrogant and cocky and in the end she realised she didn't really like him because he could be rude and insensitive.

 

So basically if he wasn't arrogant and cocky, she'd be all over him.

 

Have you thought about excising this cancer from your life?