Talk about Starting Fresh in the New Year...

[Grrlish]

So, after exchanging a few emails during the week after New Years, he asked if he could take me to dinner that Friday night so that we could talk. I said no, that I probably wouldn't feel much like eating during such a conversation. So, instead, he came over to my home and we talked for close to three hours. To summarize, he told me that he was there because he was hoping that we could reconcile. He did most of the talking, apologized, acknowledged how selfish his actions were, and said that he was really hoping that I felt that we could get past this. He said that I am a 'strong willed woman' and that's what he needs.

 

To digress, it became clear to me during our email exchange that he was surprised that I hadn't been calling or emailing him while he was out of town (i.e., sounds to me like he expected me to be 'chasing' him). I also made it clear to him that I felt that he had walked out on this relationship.

 

After he made a comment about me motivating him to do some self-reflection and to look at his issues, I responded "It's too bad that you didn't feel that you could do some self-reflection before you walked out on this relationship". To which he responded: That's what I've been doing. Clearly, he was off thinking that I was sitting here waiting to hear what his decision about the relationship would be. And I made it clear that he had made a huge mistake and I wasn't the type to sit and wait and leave it up to him to decide about the relationship.

 

We talked about his need to feel trusted as well as him acknowledging that some of his actions probably provoke certain responses from me. He acknowledged that it had been a long time since he had been in a real relationship where there things mattered.

 

I was very clear about what I did and did not want and would and would not deal with in my life. I told him that if he ever ran out on me like that ever again instead of talking to me that it would not be likely that I would be able to step back into this relationship.

 

It ultimately came down to him asking me if I felt that we could get past what had happened. It was a struggle. Not because I don't love him and not because I don't think that we could get past it, but because him leaving town like that was bullsh*t. But, I do love him and we decided to reconcile and go forward.

 

Whew. Very difficult stuff.

 

We spent most of that weekend together (weekend before last), then he was gone all week for work. We spent all weekend together this weekend, and he's gone for work for the next 10 days. So, we've had to 'make up'/honeymoon weekends and he's been gone in-between. It doesn't really allow for us...me...to get a handle on how things really feel. I mean, the last two weekends have been really, really great. But most of our weekends together have been that way anyway - so is it just 'honeymoon' after the fight phase? Because it feels more 'back to normal' -ish to me.

 

 

I have other questions that have grown out of this experience. I hope that some of you will give me some input.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/showthread.php?t=110132

[Texan]

While I agree with the majority of the advice that has been given, I do think the "make him come crawling back with his tail between his legs" is one of the biggest problems between the sexes... from either side. If he's man enough to admit he made a mistake and is willing to step up and make the changes needed, compassion should rule.

 

It suggests, to me, a mentality of punishment and payback... Seems to me that if the relationship is meant to be (and he is willing to make the changes necessary for it to do so) that a more compassionate attitude would be forthcoming. For myself, if I knew this was the mentality that was being followed, that would tell me that the relationship wasn't worth the time for either of us...

 

Just my two cents....

[dropdeadlegs]

While I agree with the majority of the advice that has been given, I do think the "make him come crawling back with his tail between his legs" is one of the biggest problems between the sexes... from either side. If he's man enough to admit he made a mistake and is willing to step up and make the changes needed, compassion should rule.

 

It suggests, to me, a mentality of punishment and payback... Seems to me that if the relationship is meant to be (and he is willing to make the changes necessary for it to do so) that a more compassionate attitude would be forthcoming. For myself, if I knew this was the mentality that was being followed, that would tell me that the relationship wasn't worth the time for either of us...

 

Just my two cents....

 

Your 2 cents is worth more than that. And the good news is that Grrlish has rectified her situation in her own way and on her own terms. I hope to be so lucky in the same situation.

[Guest]

While I agree with the majority of the advice that has been given, I do think the "make him come crawling back with his tail between his legs" is one of the biggest problems between the sexes... from either side. If he's man enough to admit he made a mistake and is willing to step up and make the changes needed, compassion should rule.

 

It suggests, to me, a mentality of punishment and payback... Seems to me that if the relationship is meant to be (and he is willing to make the changes necessary for it to do so) that a more compassionate attitude would be forthcoming. For myself, if I knew this was the mentality that was being followed, that would tell me that the relationship wasn't worth the time for either of us...

 

Just my two cents....

 

Thank you, Texan. And I agree.

 

I did not approach the situation with the intent or desire to "make him come crawling back with his tail between his legs".

 

I am aware that a lot of people do this to each other, and it's wrong. It can result in a lot of residual

[Grrlish]

While I agree with the majority of the advice that has been given, I do think the "make him come crawling back with his tail between his legs" is one of the biggest problems between the sexes... from either side. If he's man enough to admit he made a mistake and is willing to step up and make the changes needed, compassion should rule.

 

It suggests, to me, a mentality of punishment and payback... Seems to me that if the relationship is meant to be (and he is willing to make the changes necessary for it to do so) that a more compassionate attitude would be forthcoming. For myself, if I knew this was the mentality that was being followed, that would tell me that the relationship wasn't worth the time for either of us...

 

Just my two cents....

 

I hear you, Texan. He did 'step up'. I believe that this relationship is important to him and that he's genuinely interested in going forward together. He acknowledged that his M.O. in the past has, indeed, been to simply extract himself from relationships when things got tough.

 

Texan, I also agree with your other comment. And I did not approach the situation with the intent or desire to "make him come crawling back with his tail between his legs".

 

I see people try to do this to each other all the time. I've had men do it to me. It often results in resentment that infects the relationship, as well as a feeling of 'unequal power' in the relationship.

 

I respect the fact that he came to me and initiated and participated in some intense discussion. I know he was, for lack of a better word, a bit afraid. As was I. He is a strong and compassionate man. I do not want to 'make him crawl' - any more than I would want him trying to do this to me. There is no need (or desire) to do so. Dealing with tough situations with sincerity and compassion is all that is necessary. I personally do not understand the 'upper hand' games that so many people play with each other.

 

He did, in fact, at one point, even with everything else he was saying, refuse to apologize. I hadn't asked for an apology; he initiated the comment. I believe it is because of what you are saying. Then, later in the conversation, he said something to the effect that he wasn't going to come crawling to me. Maybe he didn't use those exact words but that was the gist of it. Understand, we were having a relatively calm interaction - it wasn't a fight...it was a conversation with the intent of resolution (whether that resolution was reconciliation or parting ways).

 

I told him that I was not that kind of person and that I would never expect or want him to do that. Ultimately, I believe that this helped him feel secure enough to apologize. He even said that doing so was hard for him. And I gave him the acknowledgement that "I know", said with absolute sincerity and, as you suggested, compassion.

 

I did not take his comment about apologizing being difficult as an insult or a caveat. I just know that we are both independent (and stubborn) individuals. As a mature man who has lived quite an independent life, I'm certain that he was a bit worried that his coming to me would wind up making him feel, oh...compromised?

 

I have not and will not throw this situation, his apology, etc. in his face.

 

And DDL, I would just like to add that I believe that we did it on 'our' terms. I believe that it's really important to keep things in balance as we go forward. We both feel wronged. He came to me to initiate reconciliation and wants to make sure that he doesn't feel like 'less of a man' for doing so. I accepted his apology and agreed to reconciliation and want to make sure that I don't feel that I have opened the door to more of the same treatment.

 

There was, in fact, evidence of a little residual hostility on his part, which I'm guessing that he's been used to having in the past after 'making up'. A lot of of people 'make up' and then jab at each other for a while anyway. I've done it with partners in the past. I think that there's a bit of a knee-jerk reaction for people when they 'make up' after a tough situation. Extending one's Self in this way means exposing one's Self and feeling vulnerable. When the conversation is over and people step back, they reach for the covers again so they don't feel totally exposed as they re-group. He was being snippy with me, just a little, last Monday (last week). I called him on the carpet about it. I directly addressed the futility of aiming residual hostility at each other. I told him that we both probably had some but that I was not going to aim mine at him. I was going to let it go because the relationship is worth it to me. I told him that since we are choosing to go forward, that releasing residual hostility is part of making that choice (and not at each other).

 

I really think that this was something that no one had ever put right out there to him in this way. I could tell this by the look on his face. He verbally agree with me about letting go of the residual hostility.

 

It's important for us both to feel secure. I believe that one way in which he needs to feel secure is that as a couple, we will have disagreements (big and small, perhaps). And when he makes mistakes (as will I) that I'm not going to beat him over the head with them...that we will be able to resolve conflicts with some maturity, and again, compassion, and go forward, still loving and respecting each other.

 

Over the weekend, at one point we were talking and cuddling up in the living room. He said to me that he wants me to respect him. I did not hesitate and told him that I did, in many ways.

 

 

I have to honestly say that I am feeling that more is and will be required of me as we pull things back into place. I have much more time logged into long term relationships (several years each) than does he. I've worked through difficult situations and all of the nuances that I'm yammering about above in other relationships. I don't believe that he's done much of this. So, I am required to be more patient, more supportive, more of lots of things in order to make him feel secure about this new experience (new...or at least very rare experience for him) so that we can go forward.

 

I am still struggling with the 'disappearing act'. It threw me into quite a depression, and I don't think that he really understands how much it affected me. I talked to a counselor a bit about it yesterday, so I'm trying to work through it with her so that he and I aren't beating a dead horse. This action on his part has put this little seed in the back of my brain of "Is he going to do it again?".

 

Only time can heal such an action. Time and consistency.

[Island Girl]

If you go back and read the original message I did not use the phrase "crawl back with his tail between his legs".

 

That is misquoting - I did say "come back with his tail between his legs. And what I meant is he would come back to you - humbling himself.

 

He DID!!! His reach out and willingness to participate in a discussion was just what I was talking about.

 

The difference is sometimes a guy comes back with the "I'm here and you're lucky because it's not my problem it's your problem" attitude.

 

So he did humble himself as he should have.

 

I know you mentioned he wants you to trust him and was challenged by the fact that you seemed not to.

 

Does he understand that, by the way he handled this whole situation, he took a step in the wrong direction? I think it is important for him to know that.

 

It could be why you are having a difficult time with the whole honeymoon/getting back to normal stuff that is going on now.

 

As you explained the relationship seemed fine before this whole episode. Then all of a sudden it wasn't.

 

Of course that is going to create some insecurity on your part. Part of you may be "waiting for the other shoe to drop" in a sense.

 

You have a good head on your shoulders. You know there will be other problems or differences that WILL come up as they do in any relationship.

 

It is perfectly natural and certainly something you both can fix together. Both of you just have to know it's there and work through it.

 

As you said time and consistency

 

He seems very willing and so do you. Nothing but greatness there!

 

By the way, the post where you explained how you two worked it out -- well I just have to say "Good For You".

You certainly made your expectations of how you will be treated clear without beating him over the head with it (a mistake often made) and he probably felt great after it was over. Many women don't understand that part. The discussion is supposed to be productive not destructive to either party. Congratulations on knowing that.

[Texan]

That is misquoting - I did say "come back with his tail between his legs. And what I meant is he would come back to you - humbling himself.

 

My intention was to convey the concept, not a direct quote. If it came off that way then I certainly apologize.

[Island Girl]

awww Texan - apology accepted but there was no need for it.

 

I was just clarifying what I had originally said. I agree that breaking someone down is not constructive.

 

Thank you for apologizing anyway.

[Grrlish]

Island Girl:

 

Yes, he did seem to realize that he handled the situation poorly, and many of the things that you said in your post are/were true. We had some ups and downs over the first few months, but all-in-all, things seemed to continue to grow stronger until that episode.

 

Unfortunately, now, things seem to be getting weird again.

 

He's been out of town working every single week since we reconciled, including one work weekend and a couple of weekends with his family.

 

Last Thursday (not 2 days ago, the one before), he came home from working in the field for 10 days straight. It was still relatively early so we decided to have a cocktail before heading home. Well, one cocktail turned into several and we wound up in this huge discussion that lasted for a couple of hours. Some of it was about his disappearing act. Some of it was about the work-related traveling. Some of it was about how we feel about each other. Somehow, at the end of the conversation, we felt warm and fuzzy with each other.

 

Then, he was then gone last weekend to be with his family since his mom is still in the hospital.

 

Last week, he was gone again for work. I was feeling pretty low about things. I said something to him on Tuesday night when he called. I told him that with all of this traveling, I did not feel like we'd even had a chance to try and get things back on track. I told him that I'd already dated someone in the past who traveled a lot and I did not want that in my life. (I had said this to him a few days before, as well.) (Understand, that while this amount of travel was not the norm for him, he is taking a lot of training right now, in part, because he would like to travel a bit for work and these classes will help him do that.) I realized that the conversation was not one to pursue in-depth over the phone and I suggested that we postpone it until he got home (which was a tact that we both had agreed about in the past). He pushed to pursue the conversation, and it was a mistake. However, the conversation ended with us agreeing to finish discussing it when he returned home.

 

He called me for the next two days while he was out of town, and everything seemed fine.

 

Then, on Thursday when he returned home in the afternoon, I didn't hear a peep from him. We normally are looking forward to seeing each other when he has been out of town and we get together. No call to let me know he was on his way home and to make plans. No return phone call when I called in the early evening. Not a peep until 10 p.m., after he had been home for a few hours, had dinner and basically just been home hanging out.

 

NOW, he was angry about the conversation that we'd had on Tuesday night. I asked him why we weren't having this conversation in person and he said he wasn't ready to have this conversation. So, I suggested that we say good night and continue when we could do so, in person. He agreed.

 

I was quite distraught, actually. I started falling apart again, at home alone. I think it was the shock factor (again). Him acting like everything was fine and then surprising me this way. This fed into work yesterday and it was all I could do to focus and make progress. I turned my cell phone on silent and left it in my briefcase because I knew that any conversation with him was going to throw me off for the rest of the day. (I'm still trying to catch up on all of the stuff I got behind on over the holidays. I'm under the gun. My scr*w ups over the holidays did not go unnoticed.)

 

So, he called and left a VM in the middle of the afternoon yesterday. I'm glad I didn't listen to his message at work.

 

He apologized for 'breaking contact' on Thursday and said that it was wrong, and said some other positive sounding things. So, I felt a little relief at first.

 

However, he went on to say that he was leaving again to go to his mom's, which means that he won't be home until tomorrow night.

 

He said that this was a 'failed attempt'. Said that he was 'taking things to heart' that were said the other night. Said that he wants to see things get better before they get worse. I have no f-ing idea what most of this is supposed to mean. He said that we could talk when he gets home, if I want to.

 

He sounded nervous or unsure or something like that in his voicemail. (I deleted it out of frustration. Now I wish I'd saved it so that I could listen to it again.)

 

I have no idea what to say to him at this point. I feel as if he is pushing me to be the one to call it off for good.

 

I also have no idea how things got to this point again. It seems that when we have these in-depthconversations, they are part of the attempt to get things back on track. I am now, seriously, totally confused.

 

I seems that he thought that making the decision to reconcile was all that needed to be done, and there was no conscious new effort that would need to be put out..?

 

So, he'll probably be home on Sunday. If he doesn't call, that's fine. I'm going to let it go. If he calls, like I said, what can I possibly say at this point?

 

I'm tired. I know that people go through things when they are trying to move from the 'honeymoon' stage to more of a reality, and I know that people go through some weird sh*t at this stage. But...I'm tired.

[Island Girl]

Last week, he was gone again for work. I was feeling pretty low about things. I said something to him on Tuesday night when he called. I told him that with all of this traveling, I did not feel like we'd even had a chance to try and get things back on track. I told him that I'd already dated someone in the past who traveled a lot and I did not want that in my life. (I had said this to him a few days before, as well.) (Understand, that while this amount of travel was not the norm for him, he is taking a lot of training right now, in part, because he would like to travel a bit for work and these classes will help him do that.) I realized that the conversation was not one to pursue in-depth over the phone and I suggested that we postpone it until he got home (which was a tact that we both had agreed about in the past). He pushed to pursue the conversation, and it was a mistake. However, the conversation ended with us agreeing to finish discussing it when he returned home.

 

Great tact - discussing those things in person.

But you say he pushed to pursue which was a mistake - how quickly did you realize that and what happened exactly - ?

 

It has importance due to the rest of the post...

 

He called me for the next two days while he was out of town, and everything seemed fine.

 

Then, on Thursday when he returned home in the afternoon, I didn't hear a peep from him. We normally are looking forward to seeing each other when he has been out of town and we get together. No call to let me know he was on his way home and to make plans. No return phone call when I called in the early evening. Not a peep until 10 p.m., after he had been home for a few hours, had dinner and basically just been home hanging out.

 

Grrrrrrr. I HATE that! It doesn't necessarily mean anything by itself - guys just can step away from emotions in ways we sometimes can't. It is infuriating.

 

And in this case it doesn't seem like a promising move on his part.

 

NOW, he was angry about the conversation that we'd had on Tuesday night. I asked him why we weren't having this conversation in person and he said he wasn't ready to have this conversation. So, I suggested that we say good night and continue when we could do so, in person. He agreed.

 

So he told you he was angry? Did he tell you what exactly he was angry about? Because it seems like you covered a lot of ground...was he angry about the comparison to your other relationship or the discussion about travel..., etc.?

 

I was quite distraught, actually. I started falling apart again, at home alone. I think it was the shock factor (again). Him acting like everything was fine and then surprising me this way.

 

It is no wonder. Of course it is shocking. I would be very upset at being blind-sided after days of being normal that way.

 

This fed into work yesterday and it was all I could do to focus and make progress. I turned my cell phone on silent and left it in my briefcase because I knew that any conversation with him was going to throw me off for the rest of the day. (I'm still trying to catch up on all of the stuff I got behind on over the holidays. I'm under the gun. My scr*w ups over the holidays did not go unnoticed.)

 

I'm so sorry it had gotten you off track at work. It is hard sometimes to separate that crap.

Glad you are getting it together though.

Just focus and you'll be fine - it is a good move not to have your cell in sight or ringing. That kind of distration is something you really don't seem able to afford right now.

 

So, he called and left a VM in the middle of the afternoon yesterday. I'm glad I didn't listen to his message at work.

 

He apologized for 'breaking contact' on Thursday and said that it was wrong, and said some other positive sounding things. So, I felt a little relief at first.

 

However, he went on to say that he was leaving again to go to his mom's, which means that he won't be home until tomorrow night.

 

I am going back to read through your posts again. It has been a while but isn't this whole thing due to him breaking contact before...?

 

It really doesn't speak well of him.

 

He said that this was a 'failed attempt'. Said that he was 'taking things to heart' that were said the other night. Said that he wants to see things get better before they get worse. I have no f-ing idea what most of this is supposed to mean. He said that we could talk when he gets home, if I want to.

 

It sounds like he is talking in circles. GAWD how frustrating!

 

And then he leaves you holding the bag so to speak - "both of you can talk -- if you want to"

Kind of a cop-out right? I mean he leaves this vague jibberish message and that is supposed to be his side of it all - after breaking contact and being angry but not speaking with you directly about it?

 

Again - it doesn't speak well of him.

 

He sounded nervous or unsure or something like that in his voicemail. (I deleted it out of frustration. Now I wish I'd saved it so that I could listen to it again.)

 

Don't worry about it. Deleting it is better. You just would have over-analyzed it and first reaction is the best reaction. Just try an remember how you were feeling when you first heard it and hold on to that feeling.

 

I have no idea what to say to him at this point. I feel as if he is pushing me to be the one to call it off for good.

 

I also have no idea how things got to this point again. It seems that when we have these in-depthconversations, they are part of the attempt to get things back on track. I am now, seriously, totally confused.

 

I seems that he thought that making the decision to reconcile was all that needed to be done, and there was no conscious new effort that would need to be put out..?

 

If you do speak with him, I would tell him you have no idea what to say to him.

And let him know why. That he act fine - breaks contact - pulls away - decides to reinitiate contact - and that it is ridiculous.

Tell him it starting to seem like he is really unsure about a relationship with you and, if that is the case, then don't do you any favors --

Something along those lines.

 

He really has got to be in it or out of it because this is crap.

 

Me -- well, my whole take is, "I am fantastic -- and I am not about to explain it to you or prove it to you if you are too a**-backwards to get it."

And I really do believe that.

I wish other women would.

 

So, he'll probably be home on Sunday. If he doesn't call, that's fine. I'm going to let it go. If he calls, like I said, what can I possibly say at this point?

 

I'm tired. I know that people go through things when they are trying to move from the 'honeymoon' stage to more of a reality, and I know that people go through some weird sh*t at this stage. But...I'm tired.

 

Again, I would say the above - and tell him you are tired. That he is making this more work than it has to be.

I would say,"if you can't communicate effectively then I can't keep helping you with your problem."

 

Seriously. I mean he is so in and out of this whole thing and it does NOT have to be such a big ordeal. He seems like a drama queen. I wouldn't be afraid to call him on his crap.

 

If it ends, what have you lost? His yo-yo behavior? "Thank you for the gift buddy"!

 

And if you get down to brass tacks well, better that he understands you can walk away at any time and that he needs to treat the relationship as something worthwhile NOT disposable. Because he is never going to get better, right girlfriend? -- He is NEVER going to find better -- just remember that.

 

If he is a freak and can't have a normal relationship - he is going to keep repeating his crap and will never be happy.

 

A guy who treats you this way is easily replaced. There are tons of guys that'll treat you badly out there - he isn't special.

What makes a man special is the ability to treat you right - those are the ones to hold on to.

 

Now girls -- we are the gentler sex - we bring softness and caring to their lives. We ARE irreplaceable ---

The good ones anyway. We ARE hard to find. Diamonds in a sea of coal.

 

As long as you keep that in mind you should be okay. You are a diamond and if he doesn't get it - that you should be valued and cherished - so be it.

"Next!" Another man is right around the corner to audition for his position, right?

[Grrlish]

Yes, the big deal last time was him breaking contact for nearly three weeks. So, yes, this does not speak very well of him.

 

I realized that having the conversation was a mistake to pursue over the phone because it was getting pretty heavy. I feel that important conversations should be had in person.

 

When we spoke on Thursday night, yes, he was clearly angry by his words and he was raising his voice, which is not typical of him. He said that he was taking a lot of things ‘to heart’ that I had said on Tuesday night.

 

Mostly what I was saying was that the idea of being in a relationship with someone who travels a lot was not attractive to me. And that my feelings were hurt that he seemed so oblivious to the fact that we had just been through a really bad time and that we hadn't spent any time together trying to get things back on track. Also, he has told me how unhappy his mother was because his father was gone a lot (being in the Navy), and how his father was so completely focused on work and not available to his mother and the children, even when he was home because he was always just waiting to go back out to sea. I brought this up because it surprised me that he did not see any similarity developing. He did not appreciate be bringing this up. I made very little commentary about my past relationship, except for the travel.

 

He did ask me what this particular boyfriend did for a living that required him to travel. Well, the other boyfriend (and the relationship ended over three years ago) is a rocket scientist, for lack of a more complicated way to explain what he does. He commented that ‘it sounds like he had a very important job’. My current boyfriend is very intelligent but his work history is more labor-related and his background is somewhat, well, to use his word, poor. (My boyfriend has a good job, owns his own home, vehicles, etc. He's not poor.) I only told him what my ex does because he pushed me for the information; I tried to decline, because I didn’t think it was important to the conversation and, I guess, I was thinking that he might feel intimidated by the information. Maybe he did..? But, geez, we're not kids. We're in our FORTIES for gosh sakes. And he felt that I was not communicating by not telling him the information, so I did.

 

Yes, his VM was gibberish…like his emails several weeks ago. Yes, he left me holding the emotional bag again. He tells me Thursday night that he’s not ready to talk about it, which I tried to be fair about since it was 10 p.m., but then he leaves town again for a couple of days.

 

IG, I agree with your ""I am fantastic -- and I am not about to explain it to you or prove it to you if you are too a**-backwards to get it." I’m not going to jump through any hoops or do any dance to try and prove my worth to him. First and foremost: I’m not in doubt of my worth. If he is, then that’s his loss.

 

He is a bit of a drama queen. I am beginning to wonder if, like you said, he can’t have a ‘normal’ relationship. I think that his most recent serious relationship was fraught with drama, from what little I know.

 

I’m not a perfect diamond, but I’m certainly a diamond. I’m educated, intelligent, attractive, employed and not a drama queen. I do feel that I’m a good person, a good woman, and a good partner.

 

And you’re right. I can look in any direction and find someone that will treat me like crap, which is why I don’t date much anymore. (Well, I don’t date outside of my relationship at all but I mean before that.)

 

Yes, if he doesn’t call, what have I lost? Even though I love him very much, if he doesn’t love me enough to quit the drama cr*p and quit running away, then I haven’t really lost his love, now have I? And again, if he does call, I really don’t know what to say to him. He put a serious dent in any stability that I was feeling, over the holidays. He has to know that this has only made it worse. Which is why I feel like he’s pushing ME to lower the final boom.

 

If he does feel that the relationship is disposable, then I’m ready to dispose of it. I’m willing to struggle over these hurdles with someone. But I’m not going to struggle through them ALONE when we’re supposed to be trying to get over them TOGETHER.

 

IG, I owe you a glass of wine.

[Island Girl]

A friend of mine was in only a few lengthy relationships and they were all completely disfunctional. The women were insane -- don't get me wrong - I think you know I am proud of my sex -- they were really psychotic.

 

He realized that he had come to feel this was "normal". That is, if the girl was crazy it felt like a relationship and if she was not it felt "wierd".

 

He has since done a whole lot of changing to his credit and he can finally start a new adventure into a normal loving relationship.

 

If this is this guy's problem there isn't any helping him from the inside.

 

If he expects certain reactions from you to his dramatic actions for it to feel real it isn't ever going to be better.

 

You are too stable for that crap. ---- Thankfully!

 

I really applaud your mindset.

 

I like you came to a point where I didn't date a lot. Well, I dated but the second I spotted a red flag that was it. There just isn't time to waste with these guys that have such big problems.

 

Cutting off contact and withdrawing is something we deal with when we are communicating with children.

 

Whatever you decide I would just make it very clear he has to step up now or step off now - period. You could be doing more worthwhile things with your time than pondering about him - which at this point would be just about anything wouldn't it.

 

He needs a serious reality check or nothing. Up to you which one he gets.

 

I may take you up on that glass of wine! ha!

[Grrlish]

I have reacted out of shock at times. I’m now aware that he has this expectation and since I am generally not the reactive type, now that I’m aware of this expectation, I’m better equipped to be in control my reactions.

 

I think you're right, IG. He's used to either a certain 'type' of woman, or a certain type of reaction from women, because, I'm getting the feeling that he's re-playing scenes in his life, with me. And he said things to me a few weeks ago indicating that he is (somewhat) aware of patterns in his life.

 

Interesting, what you have to say here, because he told me point-blank a few weeks ago that I’m ‘a strong-willed woman’, and it seems that this is what he needs (his words). And perhaps he meant it, and perhaps he knows it, but knowing something and actually incorporating it into one’s life are two VERY different things. Sometimes we ‘know’ something but it can take a very long time to actually embed itself into our psyche.

 

If he gets a ‘reality check’ out of this – meaning from my reaction/non-reaction, great. I’m past the point in my life of trying to intentionally teach people lessons or, God forbid, try to ‘fix’ them. I guess if he gets a reality check, then perhaps his next attempt at a relationship with someone else might go a little better. But, really, what are the chances that he’s going to learn anything at all about himself here? I mean, he said to me a few times over the last few weeks that one reason he wanted to work things out and one reason that he loves me is ‘because I cause him to look at and want to deal with his issues’. Clearly, he hasn’t but perhaps this experience will nudge him a little farther in that direction. Perhaps not. Really, not my concern if we’re done with this.

 

I was thinking back over the two tumultuous conversations that we had over the last two weeks. I did say something to him about his commitment issues – which I think is what is part of what’s going on with him. (Was that a loud ‘Duh!’ I just heard? ) I didn’t say much, but I believe that I told him that I wasn’t going to deal with his commitment issues and that I wanted to be with someone that was sure that he wanted to be with me.

 

Am I willing to deal with his commitment issues if, like you said about you and your husband, he’s ready to drop ‘em? Ready to actually show some concrete evidence that he’s ready to drop ‘em? Yes. I’m willing to work on just about anything WITH someone, INSIDE of a committed relationship. Ah, but therein lies the conundrum. How does one know it’s a committed relationship if the person has commitment issues?! I guess the resolution there is for the person to show concrete evidence before getting in (or getting back in) too deep.

 

However, have no fear. While these things are flitting around on the edges of my psyche right now, my focus is on the here and now. And being acutely aware that I am at a complete loss as to having even one single word to say to him if he were to call right now.

 

I can't believe that I'm seriously willing to walk away from him.

 

It's a very interesting revelation about my strength and my growth.

[Island Girl]

It is an interesting revelation. However -- GREAT for you. I love these moments of positive self-realization!

 

The big wake up call for my husband was that I was not going to chase after him to try to prove I was somehow "worthy".

He was used to that. He had no respect for the girls that did.

 

Not like I was intentionally trying to be different -- I just do not do that for anyone at all. I am worth way too much for that.

 

I am happy you have the same mindset! You don't know how many times I try to tell women who have it wrong and lower themselves to grovel for some guy's attention or affection which NEVER works out to equal happiness.

 

Let me know what happens okay?

 

And stay strong no matter what comes out of the next few weeks or days -- whatever.

[Grrlish]

Yeah, I'm willing to bet that my bf is used to women running after him when he pulls this cr*p.

 

Like you, it's just not my nature to run after someone who's running away. If they want to go, then they can go.

 

I do think that his commitment issues are going to win out.

 

No word from him since he left for his mom's on Friday.

 

I'll let ya know what happens, if anything, or nothing.

 

Thanks for the support.

[Island Girl]

I don't know how long it has been between communication before but he could still decide since you are running after him he's got to dangle the bait again so to speak.

 

If his commitment issues are that strong, just be glad that you are finding out now. Can you imagine?!!

 

It will happen however it happens. But you seem fine about it now - not conflicted anymore.

 

No thanks necessary for the support that is what LS is here for - that is what is soooooooo great about it!