? Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 lots of people here mention that young girls (early 20s) like those un-available jerk-type guys... being one a girl at that age, i'd like to object it's true that those super-nice guys dont stand a chance. why? mostly b/c they want too much of my time. it's not cuz they're so nice... that part is cool. but it's that 1 - im not ready to give a relationship 24/7 or even 23/7 2 - if they spend all their time with me, they stop learning stuff and will soonish become boring so it's not about nice or not nice. it's all about whether they're interesting and fun. i think the reason older women do like those nice guys is because they no longer strive for independence, and value the person being interesting less than their character, stability, etc. that's my view...! -?. Link to post Share on other sites
Tony T Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 Your objection is noted and it is stipulated that this is your view. For the greatest number of ladies, their dislike of nice guys is because of their predictability, the lack of challenge, the sickening generosity, the absense of backbone, etc. It has little to do with them wanting a lot of time because most young ladies don't give them the time of day...yet the nice guys keep coming back to kiss butt. Link to post Share on other sites
Miss Mojo Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 i think the whole "nice guys" scenario is very stereotypical and way too much of a generalisation. i know guys who are genuine nice guys, yet they won't stand for crap or let anyone take advantage of their kind and generous nature. they are fun and interesting. i also have a male friend who is a fantastic nice guy, but seems to be oblivious to the fact that many girls he has dated do not appreciate him and walk over him. he is far from boring or predictable. just generous with his time, affection and money. i also know a lot of nice guys who are not ready to settle down, but are happy to have a steady girlfriend and remain faithful to them. from the many posts i have read on this board, i feel that i am one of the few females who cannot stand a "bad boy". i have zero attraction to guys who are players or who don't treat their girl (or girls) with respect. i've met many a jerk and have always given them the cold shoulder. i have an excellent radar for the "smooth" guys (probably because i *always* seem to attract them...why oh why???) i just don't want a jerk because i know they will not respect me. jerks are generally emotionally distant, abusive and dishonest. there's no way in hell i will waste my time with a guy like that, regardless of what kind of relationship he wants (although i think it's fair to say they do not want a commitment if they will treat a girl like that). it is true that a lot of girls are attracted to the "bad boys" because these guys are not ready to commit to a girl. these girls feel that a "nice guy" is probably after the house with the picket fence and marriage. again, this relates back to the stereotype of a "nice guy". i think a nice guy is great. of course, there is always too nice, which can be offputting. and if this nice guy wants something different to what i want, then i just won't pursue it. i do not want to get married yet, but i can still, and have had, a fulfilling and exciting relationship with a nice guy. my last boyfriend was a nice guy and i had so much more fun with him than i have with any guy before. we respected each other, we understood each other, we had the same interests, and because there was very little tension at all in our relationship, we were comfortable together and had a ball together. he was a lot of fun. as a final thought, i think it's fair to say that a girl is less likely to lose self-esteem and self-respect if she is dating a "nice guy". so don't write-off the "nice guys" as boring, uninteresting or desperate for commitment until you get to know them and what they want. Link to post Share on other sites
loser Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 I just want to add my two cents. The socially dominant usually appear as mean. Social dominance has been a criteria used by women for choosing mates for thousands of years. Those who mated with more dominant (ie strong)males had more successful offspring than those who did not. Therefore, as a whole, modern ladies have inherited this mechanism for choosing guys. Might is right. Many would object they make no such evaluations based on social dominance. However, they would not be speaking the truth. They evaluate men subconsciously, instinctively rendering a feeling of attraction or indifference. We hear so much of the phrases likening love to 'a spark' or chemistry, and this is because our animal brains size up potential mates, run everything through the supercomputer of our unconscious minds, and gives us all a simple answer of yes-good partner or no-not if you were the last mate on earth.(though it must be said this program runs a little more leniantly in men!) We have no need to be aware of these computations going on in our minds, it serves no evolutionary purpose. But rest assured, it is there, ensuring the propagation of the strongest and most fit of our species. How long would humans have lasted if ladies always picked the weakest men? I admit that my premise that all strong men must also be 'jerks' may not be true. I don't believe that's true. However, though we live in an advanced world, we have primitive brains. Our mate choosing mechanisms are trapped in time and still select for traits which were perceived as 'strong' when the world was a very different place. So basically that's why women like the confident but perhaps 'jerk type' over the nice guy. nice guys are weak guys. or at least their strength is not readily visible to their eyes...... Link to post Share on other sites
Tony T Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 I think relative to the original post, this person defines "nice guy" as one who is sickeningly nice, too accomodating, too generous, spineless, no challenge, etc....and especially at the beginning of a relationship. I know that's the definition of a nice guy who will lose every time because most healthy women are just turned off by that sense of desperation in a man. The definition of a nice guy advanced in your post is very good and that sort of nice guy will usually make it quite fine. Yes, women want that kind of nice guy as long as he sets boundaries and he is intermittent with the big gifts, surprises, etc. Even still, even for the good kind of nice guy, it is not good to be overly kind in the beginning of a relationship and I'll defend that proposition to my death. Time after time, I've seen women either get scared, sick or wonder about the motives about a guy who just comes across way too nice in the beginning. And, absolutely, young girls very often go for those unavailable "jerk type" guys, mostly because they have been abused or have low self esteem. It's very sad. But there are others no matter how young who won't tolerate crap from men. Link to post Share on other sites
Tony T Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 You have made some very excellent points here that may apply to a number of cases. I think you're defintely on to something in many ways. However, I know many ladies who are attracted to shy guys, others who love the coy, elusive type. It really depends on each lady's family background, level of maturity, intelligence, life experience, etc. I think in the scheme of things there's somebody for everybody and the difficult part is each person getting together with the right person. Link to post Share on other sites
Carrie Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 I look at "nice guy" as a guy who's totally available. He's sweet, comes on too strong and wants a serious relationship - as soon as possible. Woman at a young age do not want the available guy, because they find it smothering and a lack of a challenge (like Tony said). It's not something I came up with, it's the topic of most of the relationship movies out there. The nice guy (or available guy) never get the girl, until they learn to become less available and desperate. That doesn't mean that all girls want jerks when they're in their early 20's. There are plenty of nice guys that are still unavailable. A lot of guys SHOULD be unavailable at a young age, because they are exploring different women and getting the "dating thing" out of their system, so by the time they are older, they're ready for a committment and eventually marriage. It's normal and healthy. If you are still confused by what I'm talking about, once you hit your 30's, you'll know exactly what I mean if you are still single. You can maybe even watch an episode of Ally McBeal or Sex in the City. These shows will pretty much explain it to you. Link to post Share on other sites
Sally Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 When you say strong male types, do you also mean character and decision making strength? I tend to go for men with strong morals and character over the physical. I personally like naturally thin men and I'm not as attracted to the bulky, strong football player, muscular, athletic types. Link to post Share on other sites
Miss Mojo Posted November 29, 2001 Share Posted November 29, 2001 hi tony, i totally agree about the sickening, overzealous, smothering type of guy. i'd be wondering if they are bordering on obsession. i'd also be wondering about their general state of mind...why the need to be clingy?? why the need to "prove" something. thankfully, i've never attracted a guy like that and i hope i never do! Link to post Share on other sites
Tony T Posted November 29, 2001 Share Posted November 29, 2001 Will you marry me, PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE!!! I will give you anything your heart desires. If not, would you just go to the movies with me just once? Link to post Share on other sites
Miss Mojo Posted November 29, 2001 Share Posted November 29, 2001 ...anything my heart desires, eh? ok...send me a cheque in the sum of US$20,000. then i can do a runner to any part of the world i like sorry, i will have to skip the movies. i'm scared you might take it as an opportunity to ask me to move in with you Link to post Share on other sites
Tony T Posted November 29, 2001 Share Posted November 29, 2001 Forget it...I'll just stay home and watch cable. Link to post Share on other sites
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