Crack Abuse

[blind_otter]

I think its the addictive personality still talking, when you say that you should not leave someone when they are an addict, POCONOBOB.

 

It's not fair to ask that of someone else. It simply isn't. It's egotistical, it's arrogant -- to ask another to sacrifice their life, their well being, their emotional and psychological stability, in order to facilitate their loved one's process toward sobriety.

 

And great, let's drag his parents in, who already know he's using, and force them to go through the pain of catching him in the act of using, the shame, the humiliation -- they aren't using, here. He is. They have to suffer, though? They know what he's doing, they know he relapsed.

 

(How anyone can think you can relapse "a little" with hard is beyond me, if you have an addiction problem once, and you relapse, you never relapse just a little).

 

I totally alienated my entire family using. And honestly the shame doesn't make you stop. It makes you use more because you want to keep running from your feelings. IME anyways.

[blind_otter]

Ahem. Reason I'm so familiar with NA is that I went for two years. I did the 30 meetings in 30 days and then went weekly. Finally one day my sponsor told me I was basically wasting my time because she didn't think I was an addict. She'd spent two years trying to get me to "break my act" until she realized it wasn't an act at all. Shocking, eh? (I was court-ordered to go because of a possession charge, that's how I ended up there.)

 

I know how many lives NA had saved. But I think their system has a fundamental flaw that prevents addicts from reaching a higher level of recovery.

 

The rest of your post was enlightened and I'm gonna chew on it for a while.

 

I'm sorry I assumed.

 

However, I still feel like the addict will always fundamentally be an addict, with the biochemical predispositions, and all that. And if they can transfer their addictive personality to religion, hey -- that's cool.

 

The thing is, in my very AA group there is a dude who was clean on his own, mind you, for 5 years before he went to a meeting. He never understood why his life was still so miserable after he quit cold turkey, that it never got better. Once he was in AA he realized that it wasn't about the substance, but his relationship with the substance, and his own inability to cope with reality as it is.

 

thus the whole thing about "dry drunks" -- I've gotten loads of advice from people who quit on their own, but those people I know who really were addicts are still as miserable as they ever were, even without their DOC.

[noclobber]

Forget Jesus Christ. Love yourself first. Jesus isn't the one whose life is going down the drain.

 

When addicts turn to religion in the recovery process, as they invariably do, they're just substituting one crutch for another. Which prevents them from eradicating the root problem, the need for a crutch to begin with. Then when their reasoning starts getting the better of them, the religion crutch suddenly collapses, and back to drugs they go. Because they never focused on the real issue at hand.

 

There, I'm done with the religion rant. On to the next thing.

 

I have to side with Blahblahqueen. It's an excellent point!

 

God and Religion cannot really save you. Ever heard of the proverb "God helps those who help themselves"?. We got to take responsibility for our actions and behavior! If we do this we are empowering ourselves! Trusting and hoping that an external agency like God to help and save us is abdication of personal responsibility. Even if you get saved, like BBQ said you will get rid of one addiction and begin another. And this time its Religion and God and if you want to get rid of this who will you turn to?

[sassybragg]

I disagree about God being able to save you. God can save you from anything,any deed,crime,etc..addiction! You must want to stop and ask God with belief in your heart that he can help you. I was married to a crack addict/alcoholic for almost 13yrs. and he used crack for about 11 of those years. An addict doesn't get better, they have to stop..period! I don't believe anyone who does drugs really wants to be addicted,but since they are, they must have a desire to stop by getting away from the drugs and realizing why they started using in the first place. Rehab is a good place to start in that it gets you away from the drugs and you have time to detox from it, but living back in your natural environment is the test. It's like having a candy addict live next door to the candy store....it won't work if you don't realize it can severely harm you if not kill you. This drug along with alcohol ruined my family life and ended our marriage. There is absolutely nothing you can do to stop him,but you can love him and yourself and refuse to tolerate his use by leaving his life or at least ending the romance and being his friend from a distance only if he is clean. Divorcing my ex actually saved his life at the time. He had to work to take care of himself because I was no longer there to do it for him. This also made him realize how "out of control" his life was. I rarely have contact with him now and it has been 5yrs. since we divorced,but he has had many times of long abstainance from use since then. When we were married,the longest he was clean was about 2weeks,then he was back out there blowing his paychecks,pawning anything of value from our home,staying out all night,ignoring his personal hygiene and ignoring his wife and child. I felt like a single parent because he stayed away from anything pleasant like family outings,etc...He almost missed my college graduation due to being out getting high the night before. This addiction affects everyone involved with the addict and covering up and/or bailing them out of jams is only enabling them to continue. If they know you will be there after each binge,they have no reason to think they can't survive after they have blown their/your money,lost jobs,embarassed you,disappointed others. It's an awful thing to watch your loved one live like this. I pray that your loved one wants to stop and gets help through rehab,therapy,God or all of the above while he still has life in him. This addiction.as you said, can cause breathing problems,heart problems,etc... Sometimes an intervention from his support system(you and his family) might help. Telling him you will no longer support or bail him out might be a wake up call. It might not,but at least you can try. Whatever you do, never blame yourself or let him blame you or others for his addiction.

I read the post in response to the herion addiction in which a description is given of someone else's loved one. I am in shock as it also fits, to a "T" the behavior of my loved one except the drug is crack.

 

He has been on a bender for most of the month of January. I can not even talk to him because he's either high, asleep, or coming down... only to start the cycle all over. The only time he's calm is when he's smoking. He goes into his back room, shuts the door, turns on his techno and that's it. I'll walk in to check on him and he's usually just sitting there, staring off into space.

 

He has changed product consistency as well...instead of getting rocks, he is now buying powder and cooking it up in a test tube. He is so proud of his chef skills that if this was a respectable occupation, he'd be a millionaire. The catch22 here is that not only is he unable to afford his habit but he's got asthma and I notice in the past week, he's been hitting the inhaler more than ever.

 

I've been with this man for over six years. I used to smoke with him but he just smoked me out. I don't like to get high; unfortunately, he LOVES to get high. I sat with him last night; he asked me if I wanted a hit and I said no thank you. I just don't have that "need" whatever it is that is the driving force behind this drug.

 

We went over to his parents on Monday night. He had been up since the previous Friday. He told them that he's had a couple of relapses (yeah, kind of like when the officer pulls you for a DUI and asks how much have you had to drink and the answer is "only a couple") but he's "Okay." He told me not to say a word...and I know they were deeply hurt to know he's been using. I believe it was a good step to let them know but he turned it into a scam as well. From his weekend bender, he owed his dealer who fronted him. He told his parents he was looking into buying a used jeep and he needed $400 as he was selling his car to make up the difference. And you know how well an addict can lie to get what they want. He got the money, went straight to Amscott (7p.m.at night), then to his dealer to pay off his fronts. In less than an hour, $400 was gone and he even managed to come home with powder in his pocket...

 

This cycle (minus cash) repeated itself last night. He's cooking, smoking and running missions back & forth. The crack/base is obviously not satisfying his cravings and I know it's such a mental addiction drug. Obviously, he's building up tolerance. I know from experience, if the dope isn't good, you're going to ape which makes the dealer rich and the smoker crazy.

 

I have a full blown addict on my hands. I have just about reached my wits end with the way he's spiraling...I feel he's truly out of control and I do not know what to expect when I come home from work.

 

This is not an idiot, he is so damn smart that if this energy was channeled properly, the possibilities would be endless.

 

I'm truly wondering if this behaviour is suicidal and/or a cry for help. I don't want to come home and find him dead of a heart attack at 38 years old. I don't know what the h*ll he's trying to escape from, except himself.

 

If addicts can't get clean by themselves (guess I wasn't an addict), he and I are in a no win situation at this point. He can not just have a few rocks on Friday night & wake up Saturday and enjoy the weekend; smoking has overpowered his rational thinking skills. Other than taking care of me, at this point, does it sound like I need to baker act his *ass? He said he'd never do rehab...but is this 24/7 behavior maybe a secret call for help? I'm out of ideas.

[blind_otter]

Even if you get saved, like BBQ said you will get rid of one addiction and begin another. And this time its Religion and God and if you want to get rid of this who will you turn to?

 

There is no way to completely eradicate the impulse to self-medicate. And the faith in God isn't what you turn to instead of alcohol or drugs. It simply helps to give you the strength to resist.

 

And WTF is wrong with turning to religion anyways? It's better than smoking crack. Jeez.

[noclobber]

And WTF is wrong with turning to religion anyways? It's better than smoking crack. Jeez.

 

I think I touched your nerves blind_otter

 

I just mean to say that God and Religion is another crutch that you lean onto. If you have to get out of the addiction and save yourself then you got to put all your hopes on you and not on something external to you. I am an addict myself and God apparently didn't help me come out of it. And I wont' blame HIM b'cos I am supposed to help myself.

 

Again this is just my perspective of things.

[sassybragg]

There is some confusion about my statement concerning God and religion. I was replying to an earlier post that said God couldn't help. I absolutely believe God can help a person who has made up their mind about being clean and sober.

For me God is the ultimate source of strength and the only being with the power to help with addiction. Rehab can help but even there they ask you to depend on "whatever" a persons higher power is. How else could we do anything? We don't wake ourselves up in the morning or with the alarm clock....God goes. He allows us to go through things if we choose wrong but he is always there waiting to help if we ask. Just my take on this subject.

[noclobber]

For me God is the ultimate source of strength and the only being with the power to help with addiction.

 

Great!

 

I am now trying by myself to kick my addiction and this sounds so discouraging! Are we humans so powerless??? I really don't understand why God has to put up with the burden of taking care of us. I really believe that we can take care of ourselves. My addiction is My behavior!! I choose the behavior and thus choose the consequences. We just cannot throw away personal responsibility!

[amaysngrace]

Quote from my dad: "God helps them who help themselves" don't know where it originated but i would agree with you noclobber, based on my upbringing...

[Ladywithafan]

Well, I've done a bit of searching on the internet and have decided that my boyfriend needs to see an addictions doctor. Someone who can maybe try out some of the latest meds that make those cravings go away as well as get him some sort of therapy to figure out the continued need to get high and escape...the depression that comes after the smoke out is just unbearable.......I don't think there's any dopamine left inside...he's just too mean & nasty. I do believe he has chemically altered his brain...

[amaysngrace]

 

oh no...can this be reversed, do you think?

[noclobber]

Well, I've done a bit of searching on the internet and have decided that my boyfriend needs to see an addictions doctor. Someone who can maybe try out some of the latest meds that make those cravings go away as well as get him some sort of therapy to figure out the continued need to get high and escape...the depression that comes after the smoke out is just unbearable.......I don't think there's any dopamine left inside...he's just too mean & nasty. I do believe he has chemically altered his brain...

 

Chemical imbalance is very likely in your boyfriend's case. The drugs may have dried out the chemicals in his brain. Please rush him to a doctor.

[noclobber]

oh no...can this be reversed, do you think?

 

Yes, if timely medical treatment is given!

[sassybragg]

Where do you get the inspiration to help yourself? Who or what gives it to you? I am sorry if I offended you. I wasnt raised to believe humans have any kind of power without the help of God, so thats where I am coming from. I didnt mean you couldnt have willpower and/or a strong determination to quit. Youre right, you chose it and no one else. I was just saying "I felt" that God could have you back especially is your addiction drove others you once could depend on away from you...........that is all.

 

Best of luck to you!

Great!

 

I am now trying by myself to kick my addiction and this sounds so discouraging! Are we humans so powerless??? I really don't understand why God has to put up with the burden of taking care of us. I really believe that we can take care of ourselves. My addiction is My behavior!! I choose the behavior and thus choose the consequences. We just cannot throw away personal responsibility!

[blind_otter]

Great!

 

I am now trying by myself to kick my addiction and this sounds so discouraging! Are we humans so powerless??? I really don't understand why God has to put up with the burden of taking care of us. I really believe that we can take care of ourselves. My addiction is My behavior!! I choose the behavior and thus choose the consequences. We just cannot throw away personal responsibility!

 

Well where exactly is this personal responsibility now? You obviously aren't putting it in full effect in terms of your own addiction. If you are correct, then you should simply be able to decide that you want to be sober, and do it. Personal responsibility, right?

 

Having faith in God doesn't take away your personal responsibilty, but it gives you something to help you through the cravings and the obsession. Something good, higher, than the filth that I let corrupt my whole life with cocaine and alcohol.

[noclobber]

Where do you get the inspiration to help yourself? Who or what gives it to you? I am sorry if I offended you. I wasnt raised to believe humans have any kind of power without the help of God, so thats where I am coming from. I didnt mean you couldnt have willpower and/or a strong determination to quit. Youre right, you chose it and no one else. I was just saying "I felt" that God could have you back especially is your addiction drove others you once could depend on away from you...........that is all.

 

Best of luck to you!

 

I am sorry, I am not taking a hit at your beliefs. Please don't take this personally. People are different and have different opinions. I am actually from India, a supposedly religious country. I myself was very very religious but over the years I have seen that having faith in God and being religious didn't get me anywhere in life. Its not that I only depended on God to be successful. I am a Master's degree holder and have put in the efforts to be successful in life and having faith in a God didn't bring me any good luck or miracles or whatever. It doesn't make sense for me to pray and please a God so that HE will make life better for me. That makes prayer look like bribing!

 

I have just come to a conclusion that its better to completely trust and count on myself rather than expecting a higher power to make things better for me. But that's just me... and I like me the way I am!

[noclobber]

Well where exactly is this personal responsibility now? You obviously aren't putting it in full effect in terms of your own addiction. If you are correct, then you should simply be able to decide that you want to be sober, and do it. Personal responsibility, right?

 

That's right, I have taken up personal responsibility, decided to be sober and have been 'clean' for 2 weeks now. I keep telling to myself that I am responsible for my life and if I screw up I got to deal with the consequences.

 

I am not saying that praying will take away responsibility. But I think by praying you are developing that emotional crutch on which you tend to lean on. What if after all the praying you relapse? Will you be angry with God b'cos HE didn't see you through?

[sassybragg]

I posted "its my belief" as I know people believe differently and get through crisis in many different ways. I was just offering suggestions for anyone who "does" have faith in God, and not trying to impose my beliefs on you or anyone else. Being an American, most people in the U.S. have faith in God and most people who have overcome an addiction will tell you they did it with God's help and possibly support of family and friends.

I too have higher education but I know God helped me study and gave me the intelligence to pass the courses needed for my degree."I" don't believe people are born with wisdom, but when God gives it. He gave my instructors their wisdom and techniques to teach me and help me learn and succeed. Again, that is "my faith" and where I draw strength. We do what works for us, so I hope you get through this however is best for

you.

I orginally posted because I was married to a crack addict for years and he will tell you God helped him with being clean and sober when no one else could or would. Again, he had faith in God so that is why he saught God and not only himself. He felt worthless, helpless and hopeless and knew he couldn't do it alone. He also knew God would forgive him,and not judge him. Humans are very quick to judge especially when they don't understand or when someone is different from them. God is not like that.God does expect us to have self-determination and to strive for the strength needed to overcome, but he is also there to guide,give peace and comfort when we need it. Just because things don't go our way in life, it doesnt mean God wasn't there for us. It may be that what or who we wanted wasn't in his plans for us. I also didn't say God would "fix" our problems. I wanted to impress that God could get you through an addiction, but since you don't believe or have faith in God and think it's bribing, you wouldn't understand where I am coming from. I meant my statements as statements, not that anyone should follow, as I was not preaching, just offering other support if faith in God, or whoever the higher power was present. Sorry to have wasted your reading time. I was just sharing my side of addiction with you because it's rough to watch an addicted love one cope.

Good luck to you!

I am sorry, I am not taking a hit at your beliefs. Please don't take this personally. People are different and have different opinions. I am actually from India, a supposedly religious country. I myself was very very religious but over the years I have seen that having faith in God and being religious didn't get me anywhere in life. Its not that I only depended on God to be successful. I am a Master's degree holder and have put in the efforts to be successful in life and having faith in a God didn't bring me any good luck or miracles or whatever. It doesn't make sense for me to pray and please a God so that HE will make life better for me. That makes prayer look like bribing!

 

I have just come to a conclusion that its better to completely trust and count on myself rather than expecting a higher power to make things better for me. But that's just me... and I like me the way I am!

[blind_otter]

That's right, I have taken up personal responsibility, decided to be sober and have been 'clean' for 2 weeks now. I keep telling to myself that I am responsible for my life and if I screw up I got to deal with the consequences.

 

I am not saying that praying will take away responsibility. But I think by praying you are developing that emotional crutch on which you tend to lean on. What if after all the praying you relapse? Will you be angry with God b'cos HE didn't see you through?

 

No, it would be a failure on my part to stand strong against my weak nature.

[noclobber]

Sorry to have wasted your reading time. I was just sharing my side of addiction with you because it's rough to watch an addicted love one cope.

 

Sassy please don't say that. You don't have to be sorry to me or anybody else. This is an open forum and people are free to post their views.

 

Please understand that I am not opposing your views. Its just that we are two different people with two different perspectives. If your method works fine for the Original Poster's boyfriend great. The bottom line is, that person has to be saved.

 

I am just being curious. From your posts I am getting the impression that you view God as another human with whom you can interact. You say that HE won't judge us, will give us peace, will guide us etc. I really don't understand how its possible. Do you actually "feel" it? Do you feel that there is a voice inside of you that says do this, do that? Is there something inside you that calms and comforts you and provides you with strength?

 

It's great to know that your husband was saved with the help of God. And I believe that strengthened your faith even further. I just find it amusing when I hear people saying God gave them the strength. But my question is, how exactly?

[noclobber]

No, it would be a failure on my part to stand strong against my weak nature.

 

That's the personal responsibility I am talking about

 

Some people may end up resentful with God becuase they think HE didn't help them out. But if you own up to your actions then you can look to yourself, see what made you to relapse, correct your mistakes, get back on to the carousel of life and continue the ride again.

 

What exactly do you mean by "God will give you the strength to resist the cravings"? I asked the same question to Sassy... I just want to know. Please don't think I am challenging your beliefs or faith.

[sassybragg]

I wasn't apologizing for my faith, just for wasting time on this. I am sorry you find my faith amusing, or what I think God does for me amusing. As we have both said, we are different, like everyone is. I didn't respond to the orginial post to defend my religious beliefs, but about addiction and how it affects people and that's what the focus should be.I mentioned my "ex-husbands" experience as an example. I know people must be saved, etc... For that reason I will not get into how or why I believe in God, his power and what he can do as we don't have to prove anything. He wakes me up every morning,something I certainly don't have the power to do myself, and I don't know any human being who does. Do what works for you and I will do the same. Good luck to you and may God Bless You!

 

Sassy please don't say that. You don't have to be sorry to me or anybody else. This is an open forum and people are free to post their views.

 

Please understand that I am not opposing your views. Its just that we are two different people with two different perspectives. If your method works fine for the Original Poster's boyfriend great. The bottom line is, that person has to be saved.

 

I am just being curious. From your posts I am getting the impression that you view God as another human with whom you can interact. You say that HE won't judge us, will give us peace, will guide us etc. I really don't understand how its possible. Do you actually "feel" it? Do you feel that there is a voice inside of you that says do this, do that? Is there something inside you that calms and comforts you and provides you with strength?

 

It's great to know that your husband was saved with the help of God. And I believe that strengthened your faith even further. I just find it amusing when I hear people saying God gave them the strength. But my question is, how exactly?

[noclobber]

Good luck to you and may God Bless You!

 

You are very funny

[Poconobob]

I think its the addictive personality still talking, when you say that you should not leave someone when they are an addict, POCONOBOB.

 

It's not fair to ask that of someone else. It simply isn't. It's egotistical, it's arrogant -- to ask another to sacrifice their life, their well being, their emotional and psychological stability, in order to facilitate their loved one's process toward sobriety.

 

And great, let's drag his parents in, who already know he's using, and force them to go through the pain of catching him in the act of using, the shame, the humiliation -- they aren't using, here. He is. They have to suffer, though? They know what he's doing, they know he relapsed.

 

(How anyone can think you can relapse "a little" with hard is beyond me, if you have an addiction problem once, and you relapse, you never relapse just a little).

 

I totally alienated my entire family using. And honestly the shame doesn't make you stop. It makes you use more because you want to keep running from your feelings. IME anyways.

 

 

 

OKAY SO IF SHE LEAVES THEN HE KILLS HIMSELF, THEN SHE'LL NOT ONLY HAVE THE HELPLESS FEELING FOR LEAVING BUT ALSO GUILT. Please face it that no matter what decision, it is hard. I cannot stand on a pedistal and preeeech as I made a mistake. Please don't label me, I don't use anymore, as a matter of fact I was not addicted but I wanted to die, yes die. I was too chicken to kill myself and I was extremely depressed and I would use and use and abuse hoping to die. I actively thought that!!! HAD I been left alone which I already lost my wife to divorce, had just lost my fiance' to death, I had little in my life to live for. Soooooooooooooooo my solice was hoping to help others AFTER I cleaned myself up. I thought if I could impact just one life, just motivate one person to stop, it all wouldn't be ...... ahhh who am I kidding, I cannot get your respect, I am an addict to you and the personality so to speak dictates that.

 

I "could" have never shared my experience, as I am my own worst critic, not you.. Furthermore, and this is the stupid part, I am a smart, smart person who was stupid but yoiu know what?? I've grown from this, I am even volunteering at the local battered women's shelter here and I can honestly say I NEVER had any reason to be depressed. I HURT only myself and inflicted pain on my family indirectly. I've got enough guilt blind_otter without you pointing a finger saying addictive personality caused my opinion... NO it is a former user who cares ... it is a person who has hit bottom, and now gives back, who will forever repent and be thankful I was strong enough... and to also know I was a very very very very good liar to illude to others I was fine. But I wasn't, I see the pictures of my days and I literally look at some digital pics I was in and I looked raggggggged, haggard, and damn it I'm going to help others with all I can help with.

 

At first, I was insulted by the post but then I realized I did it all myself and I must deserve to be labeled that even though I never needed detox, I just packed up my U-Haul, loaded my Mazda 6S on the car carrier and "high" tailed it to florida and have not looked back since except for reasons like the aformentioned when I am devout on helping others.

 

NOTE TO ALL...

 

Could we PLEASE leave the topic where it belongs, the opinions where they belong and keep on topic, PLEASE. It isn't if god entered your quest to stop or not, it is STOPPING that is important here. I thank you all for respecting the fact there is a person here who EXPECTS, DESERVES, AND NEEDS our help! She quit on her own, she is living in hell with him and look, she answered my post and asked my opinion and NOBODY could give her the decency of a reply EXCEPT to argue about something so stupid, so trivial and it frankly pisses me off... or should I say it did piss me off.

 

bob

[Poconobob]

I wasn't apologizing for my faith, just for wasting time on this. I am sorry you find my faith amusing, or what I think God does for me amusing. As we have both said, we are different, like everyone is. I didn't respond to the orginial post to defend my religious beliefs, but about addiction and how it affects people and that's what the focus should be.I mentioned my "ex-husbands" experience as an example. I know people must be saved, etc... For that reason I will not get into how or why I believe in God, his power and what he can do as we don't have to prove anything. He wakes me up every morning,something I certainly don't have the power to do myself, and I don't know any human being who does. Do what works for you and I will do the same. Good luck to you and may God Bless You!

 

My post btw was not directed at you...