do men always have to approach?

[ZA Dater]

I suppose this is an obtuse question but do they really?

Reason I ask is that to try and feel better I sometimes go on long walks near the beach and of course I see the usual groups of friends, lots of couples but I do sometimes see ladies walking on their or mostly running on their own (I am not interested in taking up running) and part of me did wonder simplistically if I were to ever get approached? I can say in the 38 years I have been on this planet I have been approached twice so it would seem the odds are not in my favor.

Any guys here ever adopted this strategy and if you did, how did it work or not work?

I suppose the other problem even if I did get approached I'd have no idea what to do and the usual clumsy awkward moment would ensue.

[stillafool]

47 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

I suppose this is an obtuse question but do they really?

Reason I ask is that to try and feel better I sometimes go on long walks near the beach and of course I see the usual groups of friends, lots of couples but I do sometimes see ladies walking on their or mostly running on their own (I am not interested in taking up running) and part of me did wonder simplistically if I were to ever get approached? I can say in the 38 years I have been on this planet I have been approached twice so it would seem the odds are not in my favor.

Any guys here ever adopted this strategy and if you did, how did it work or not work?

I suppose the other problem even if I did get approached I'd have no idea what to do and the usual clumsy awkward moment would ensue.

No.  If you read around this forum you will see women are being very assertive in going after what the want and not waiting to be approached.

[basil67]

Back when I was single......sure, I've struck up conversations in a social setting to see if anything romantic could come from it.

But I'd never walk up to a stranger who's minding their own business, because I hated that being done to me. 

[Weezy1973]

Passive life strategies are a pretty bad idea. Essentially it’s like having as your financial plan for retirement winning the lottery. It’s a bad plan. Actively going after what you want in life is a good strategy.
 

This is the only life you got. Waiting around for it to start is a bad idea.

[glows]

I’m normally busy minding my own business and am approached. I would of course approach someone if I felt interested. There’s nothing wrong with that and am aware women do it too. Men don’t always have to be the ones to initiate conversation or express some interest. 

[ZA Dater]

6 hours ago, Weezy1973 said:

Passive life strategies are a pretty bad idea. Essentially it’s like having as your financial plan for retirement winning the lottery. It’s a bad plan. Actively going after what you want in life is a good strategy.
 

This is the only life you got. Waiting around for it to start is a bad idea.

Thanks for the feedback. I suppose one needs to have a plan and some skills to implement that plan. Or there needs to be a reason for her to initiate conversation.

It's difficult to.sort of know what to.say, when to say it and how to.say it. I have walked past all.sorts of what I would deem attractive people but how do you mitigate looking like an idiot when she isn't single which in my city is the most likely outcome.

Or do you weigh up the odds, being very attractive unlikely to be single or go ok she isn't attractive so likely to be single, that defeats the purpose of looking I reckon?

Maybe it actually this approach thing which makes OLD useful because if she matches chances are she would be receptive to a cold approach in person. Maybe then the strategy is to find an average of what one attracts on OLD and apply that to in person cold approaches. It doesn't help if nobody you find attractive on OLD finds you attractive and then you approach the same type of people.

 

 

 

[basil67]

18 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

but how do you mitigate looking like an idiot when she isn't single which in my city is the most likely outcome.

That's the thing.  If you're going to care about being shut down or have her show you the hand and walk away, cold approaches aren't for you.   A guy who cold approaches must be prepared for a very high rejection rate and to be able to not let it bother him.

[NuevoYorko]

Yes, some women approach men.  

I think that there are many men, however, who have never been approached by a woman.  Or at least not unless it happens in a bar or party where a lot of chemical lubrication has been involved.

Any man who would like to actively date would be pretty silly to wait until he's approached.  But it might happen.

[Alpacalia]

Quite a bit of your work will deal with you.

Particularly if you live in a society that believes many fallacies about dating.

Even today, some women and men advise you not to approach women. That there is only one kind of relationship.

Women are also perceived as something to be chased like trophies, hence the "playing hard to get" fallacy. When a woman uses this tactic, she does not realize that she is falling into the trap of being viewed as something to be won, like a trophy. The problem with this is that attraction isn't about chasing. It never was. It is about being attracted to someone or someone is attracted to someone - so one must show interest or decline.

Pursuing is interest in the other. They know this is a YES from both of them, but they flirt, tease to make the dating process less awkward and more fun for both.

You're desire is not that you NEED a woman but that you WANT a woman. Need only makes you think in terms of loss. In which case, you will sacrifice a lot and be fearful and overthink when it comes to dating.

[Wiseman2]

19 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

 part of me did wonder simplistically if I were to ever get approached?

You can do both. Be friendly, outgoing and approachable as well as approach people.

Start by discontinuing the "approach in the wild" theories promoted by pickup artist philosophy.

Simply view talking to all sorts of people as social opportunities and small talk. Take the pressure off viewing encounters as dating challenges. Just be open, interesting, friendly and relax.

It's important to find appropriate situations for small talk rather than walking up to women on the beach or hoping they walk up to you with an agenda to get numbers and get a date.

 

Edited February 11, 2023 by Wiseman2

[Trail Blazer]

Does anyone have to approach?  No.  Are men more likely to approach.  Yes. 

I am not sure what you mean by men adopting this strategy?  Cold approaching?

Back in my younger days, when out on the town, a few drinks under my belt?  Sure, I'd strike up a conversation. 

The same thing happened to me, where, a night on the town, yeah, I'd have had girls come up to me, too.

The last time I can truly say that it happened to me was outside the Rose Garden (Moda Center) after a basketball game in 2008 when I was waiting to get on a bus home. 

The girl came up and was very chatty and flirty.  I was in a relationship, so I was polite but subtly conveyed my lack of interest.

As an adult in his thirties?  No, never.  I'd let people go about their business.

I can't say I could imagine a situation where a woman would cold approach me, either.  But hey, who knows.  In any case, it will be the same outcome as after that basketball game.

 

[Weezy1973]

12 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

how do you mitigate looking like an idiot when she isn't single…

As other have said, don’t view have a conversation as trying to get a date. Just chat with someone if it’s opportune moment to do so. Like you previous thread where you chatted with the woman at the booth. Just a friendly chat. Keep doing that, and not just with women you find attractive. Do it with everybody if there’s a situation that warrants it. That way you’ll get more comfortable with it. 

[Lotsgoingon]

Really, wipe from your mind the idea of approaching a woman you don't know who you're not in conversation with. That's far over-rated and simply doesn't work for most people. 

Instead, just greet the person.  Just start saying "hi" .... or "hello" to person.  If you have a real smile to show, show it. Over time, you can get comfortable with a longer greeting (though you may always feel nervous) and you start to reveal more.

"Hi, how are you?"

She responds "good." 

You can then add, "I'm just loving this sun and this sand on my feet. Loving it!" S

She might then add her own observation as well. You will feel some people are on your wavelength, others not. 

There is a jolt of joy in just exchanging some words with a stranger. That jolt will feel stronger than you might imagine. And doesn't matter if they're married, single, a nun or whatnot. Remember, women have their guard up for predator guys and they can get as nervous and be as shy (or more) as you are. 

Just start there. Once you can greet people and share a feeling or observation with them, then down the line you can share the observation and slow down or stop walking once she engages. But I don't think you need to go there yet. Start with "hi" ... seriously ... start there, and you may end there and that's OK! 

 

[ZA Dater]

Based on this it would seem cold approaches are not really ideal at all and probably best avoided. Was just something I was wondering about while walking the other day, the opinions here are very interesting and sure I think maybe the right time to make conversation is important too. @Lotsgoingonvery interesting post because flip I really do not have that level of charm but everything you put there I have actually seen in person.

Simplistically I suppose cold approaching is where people have there guard up the most so the results are probably overall pretty poor.

 Seems to me I best just enjoy the walk and scenery and ignore the people around me because lets face it everyone is going about their business be it on their own or in this small groups of friends. 

A friend of mine is very good with cold approaches in social settings for example restaurants and bars, he has all the charm in the world which I guess helps and a good sense of humour. My take it if you have an outgoing happy go lucky personality then maybe cold approaches can work but serious and quiet are perhaps not the optimal personality traits for cold approaching.

When I used to go to bars it was interesting seeing how it worked there and the level of rejection was very noticeable. Maybe it is wrong but I tend to find people are just not very receptive of people they do not know in a walk type situation. My mind then wonders and the inevitable couples and "wonder where they met" and often words of advice from this forum chime loudly @Weezy1973in particular. 

Would it be fair to say cold approaches somewhere there is likely to be a mutual interest would work better?  Its probably important to live in the real world to, going to sit on a bench overlooking the sea on valentines day watching the sunset, it wont get me a date and its not likely to get my a cold approach of interest either. 

[ZA Dater]

9 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

You can do both. Be friendly, outgoing and approachable as well as approach people.

Start by discontinuing the "approach in the wild" theories promoted by pickup artist philosophy.

Simply view talking to all sorts of people as social opportunities and small talk. Take the pressure off viewing encounters as dating challenges. Just be open, interesting, friendly and relax.

It's important to find appropriate situations for small talk rather than walking up to women on the beach or hoping they walk up to you with an agenda to get numbers and get a date.

 

Very difficult things to accomplish simultaneously particularly the last one. 

[ZA Dater]

13 hours ago, NuevoYorko said:

Yes, some women approach men.  

I think that there are many men, however, who have never been approached by a woman.  Or at least not unless it happens in a bar or party where a lot of chemical lubrication has been involved.

Any man who would like to actively date would be pretty silly to wait until he's approached.  But it might happen.

Add me to the silly list. I have tried pretty much everything else so I hoped this one might have some degree of success! Yeah I think its much easier at a party with alcohol but I suppose there are pros and cons there too. I do wonder if there was ever a point in time in history where ladies did approach?

[NuevoYorko]

1 hour ago, ZA Dater said:

 I do wonder if there was ever a point in time in history where ladies did approach?

It's cultural.  Women historically have presented themselves or been presented by their parents / families as "eligible."  Women in upper social classes were groomed in "charm" and "feminine arts" in order to help them lure men.   Men were then competing for the most advantageous match.  That's still behind most of the traditions of courtship in western cultures.   It's all still in play.

 

[basil67]

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

Add me to the silly list. I have tried pretty much everything else so I hoped this one might have some degree of success! Yeah I think its much easier at a party with alcohol but I suppose there are pros and cons there too. I do wonder if there was ever a point in time in history where ladies did approach?

As I said earlier, I've certainly approached at parties and planted a seed to see where it goes.  But before doing that, I observe what kind of person they are and how they interact.  I wasn't necessarily attracted to the guy who's the most handsome and/or the life of the party.  Instead, it was the guy who was actively engaged and looking happy.  However, you said previously that at a party, you remove yourself to a quiet spot and observe.  ZA, nothing positive is ever going to happen while you choose to stand quietly on the peripheral.

I completely agree with you that people who are out for a walk are going about their own business and don't want to be interrupted.  And watching a sunset alone on Valentines isn't likely to lead to a positive outcome because a single woman is more likely to be out with friends doing some kind of "We're single and having fun with the girls" thing or just getting on with life.  Settings where you have something in common are much more likely to bear fruit if they are somewhat social.

[Weezy1973]

2 hours ago, basil67 said:

  Settings where you have something in common are much more likely to bear fruit if they are somewhat social.

Yes being part of a group, club or taking a class that you’re interested in where you see the same people over and over again is good, not only to meet a potential mate but just for socializing in general. The more you’re able to have small talk with people the better. It’ll help with the “relax” part of the equation. 

[mark clemson]

No you don't. Make yourself as attractive as possible, there's a good chance women will occasionally "approach" you. (By which I assume you mean strike up a probably unnecessary conversation and see if the person is at all interesting, and if there's potentially some romantic chemistry.)

At the risk of reiterating what others have said, if you do the approaching, don't do it with an eye to jumping ahead of things. Just strike up a conversation. IF the conversation goes well and/or lasts longer than it reasonably needs to, there might be some interest. So, suggest going on a date/out to dinner at the end and see what happens. Generally the worst she is likely to do is act a bit peeved and say no (but she'll probably just say no apologetically if the answer's no). OR she might say yes.

Looking good is by no means the be all/end all. HOWEVER, it can be quite helpful for "getting your foot in the door". So, IF you can go around looking good all the time (or as much as reasonably possible), that may help with "creating opportunities" in normal social situations where these unnecessary and mildly flirtatious conversations get started. I can't count the number of times I've read statements to the effect of "there has to be some chemistry or I'm just not interested" from women on this forum. Looking good and projecting confidence while making at least halfway decent conversation goes a LONG way towards creating that "chemistry" IMO.

An important thing noted by folks above: generally the friendly conversation has to happen BEFORE the asking on a date. Particularly with women. Trying to "cold approach" where you simply ask for a phone number and/or on a date without bothering to even strike up a conversation first is for PUA types and is typically putting the cart before the horse IMO.

Edited February 12, 2023 by mark clemson

[ZA Dater]

18 hours ago, Weezy1973 said:

Yes being part of a group, club or taking a class that you’re interested in where you see the same people over and over again is good, not only to meet a potential mate but just for socializing in general. The more you’re able to have small talk with people the better. It’ll help with the “relax” part of the equation. 

I think you are probably 95% right with this. Familiarity probably brings a degree of comfort which is rather different than seeing the same person day after day with no real interaction.

Perhaps the alternative to all this is to simply just enjoy the walk with a view of having no interaction at all.

[ZA Dater]

21 hours ago, basil67 said:

As I said earlier, I've certainly approached at parties and planted a seed to see where it goes.  But before doing that, I observe what kind of person they are and how they interact.  I wasn't necessarily attracted to the guy who's the most handsome and/or the life of the party.  Instead, it was the guy who was actively engaged and looking happy.  However, you said previously that at a party, you remove yourself to a quiet spot and observe.  ZA, nothing positive is ever going to happen while you choose to stand quietly on the peripheral.

I completely agree with you that people who are out for a walk are going about their own business and don't want to be interrupted.  And watching a sunset alone on Valentines isn't likely to lead to a positive outcome because a single woman is more likely to be out with friends doing some kind of "We're single and having fun with the girls" thing or just getting on with life.  Settings where you have something in common are much more likely to bear fruit if they are somewhat social.

Again you are probably right, then again I have actually been approached once at a party but my guard goes right up and the awkwardness is off the scale so that setting is not going to work for me. Looking happy, that made me smile because I do not think I ever have that look!

Yeah sure the ladies will be going out with their friends and the same club bar pick up scene kicks in and he who dares who has a degree of good looks wins.  I think for cold approaches to have any sort of success the person doing the approaching needs to be super confident to the extent the other person finds that confidence attractive. Good looks probably help too!

Then again I have seen some truly cringe worthy approached before where I simply feel sorry for the guy but oddly this approach seems to also work to some degree. Common ground I think definitely helps but for some that is very difficult to find, the risk is also being creepy and that is I think a very fine line to walk on. Beach is another place I feel would not work for a cold approach, for me any place where I cannot with certainty if she is single is a "do not attempt" zone. 

[basil67]

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

I think you are probably 95% right with this. Familiarity probably brings a degree of comfort which is rather different than seeing the same person day after day with no real interaction.

Perhaps the alternative to all this is to simply just enjoy the walk with a view of having no interaction at all.

You can actually work with the bolded.  If you see the same person day after day, if you're walking towards each other, you can catch their eye and smile.  A genuine smile - not the "awkward white person smile" (Google it).  But keep walking.   Keep doing this each time you cross paths and it may end up that you have a chat.    Heck, just walking down my street, it's not uncommon for strangers to smile and say "good morning" to each other.  I do it frequently

 

1 hour ago, ZA Dater said:

Again you are probably right, then again I have actually been approached once at a party but my guard goes right up and the awkwardness is off the scale so that setting is not going to work for me. Looking happy, that made me smile because I do not think I ever have that look!

Yeah sure the ladies will be going out with their friends and the same club bar pick up scene......

Why do you keep going back to the same topic of club bar pick up scene?   Heaps of people don't like these places yet still meet others 

 

[ZA Dater]

14 hours ago, basil67 said:

You can actually work with the bolded.  If you see the same person day after day, if you're walking towards each other, you can catch their eye and smile.  A genuine smile - not the "awkward white person smile" (Google it).  But keep walking.   Keep doing this each time you cross paths and it may end up that you have a chat.    Heck, just walking down my street, it's not uncommon for strangers to smile and say "good morning" to each other.  I do it frequently

 

Why do you keep going back to the same topic of club bar pick up scene?   Heaps of people don't like these places yet still meet others 

 

I think to do a cold approach you sort of need to have the ability to make the person feel comfortable instantly to engage in conversation, my level of intensity does not really work well for this at all. Maybe I suppose the way to get this right is to be introduced by someone who is a mutual friend and thus there is some common connection so its not a totally random conversation, this probably works well for people with that degree of social life.

People do not like those places but many do go to them and do meet people there, I think that we can agree on. As meeting places I guess they can be effective . I pains me to say this but I do wonder what the current world would do without OLD...

Maybe the entire key to all of this is to be approachable yet provide levels of familiarity so people feel comfortable. I struggle with that, in interactions in general I am fairly businesslike because it gets the job done. When I have had a sort of random conversation its been to the point rather than flowery so for me its difficult to picture myself being able to approach any lacy with the view of dating, business yes and that I am fairly good at but then I will never win when I am against the guy with charm and charisma, neither of which I have. 

Of course the world would be a lot easier if as I guy I did not need to show any sort of interest and interest would arrive..

[Wiseman2]

31 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

 The world would be a lot easier if as I guy I did not need to show any sort of interest and interest would arrive..

Surely you've pursued things like education, a job, the car you want, etc. It's not much different. Anything worth having doesn't just fall in your lap.  So yes, work on being friendly, personable and approachable. They're good life skills to have. Don't worry about "cold approach", just be relaxed without an agenda.

Edited February 13, 2023 by Wiseman2