Non virgin gf want to wait until marriage what should I do?

[David Graham]

4 minutes ago, stillafool said:

What is your idea of "make myself clear" to her?

to tell her honestly, that becase I love her so much I want to express sex only with her in the most intimate way but I do also need to respect her wishes and that's hard for me.

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, David Graham said:

ex forced her mentally to have sex and she had sex with him altough she didn't want to.

Ok, don't do the same thing to her by giving her ultimatums. You are too young to marry and do not know each other that long or that well.

You are telling her you need to have intercourse by such-and-such a time.

You've only been dating 12 weeks and already she's giving you oral sex and now you want more because she (unfortunately)  confided in you that she had intercourse before.

You either respect her clear expression that she wants to be married before intercourse or you tell her if you don't have intercourse, you'll breakup.

That may be the best option because you are clearly incompatible about goals and values.

[David Graham]

3 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Make yourself clear, then. 

But understand it might mean you need to find a different girlfriend. 

That's understandable but I always want to choose honesty than living in a lie

[David Graham]

2 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Ok, don't do the same thing to her by giving her ultimatums. You are too young to marry and do not know each other that long or that well.

You are telling her you need to have intercourse by such-and-such a time.

You've only been dating 12 weeks and already she's giving you oral sex and now you want more because she (unfortunately)  confided in you that she had intercourse before.

You either respect her clear expression that she wants to be married before intercourse or you tell her if you don't have intercourse, you'll breakup.

That may be the best option because you are clearly incompatible about goals and values.

Do you think talking to her about goals and values again will be must? what would you do instead of me?

[salparadise]

David, how long will be before you're ready to get married, assuming the relationship continues to be great? You said that you'd be willing to wait a year, but you don't want to wait longer, until marriage. Logically one would assume then that you see marriage being several years away. That's a long time to wait, and if she continues to want to wait your frustration will get worse and worse, and may [probably] turn into resentment. You should recognize that what you want is important too. Her decision is a unilateral one that does not take your wants and needs into consideration.

Secondly, oral sex is sex. So she's not actually waiting to have sex, only intercourse. I also wonder if she's actually THAT religious. I seriously doubt that her religion makes an exception for oral, and if that's the case it invalidates that argument. Of course it doesn't invalidate her choice, she has the right to choose even if it's illogical with respect to the reason given. But notions of virtue are different from religion, and it would seem that she is trying to preserve or regain virtue by withholding intercourse while engaging in oral sex.

I understand that the fact that she had sex with a previous boyfriend is problematic for you. I wouldn't want to be seriously dating any woman who refused to have sex with me (waiting awhile notwithstanding), and knowing that she had been sexual with a previous BF would intensify that feeling. I'm not sure I buy the justification either as she had just as much agency then as she does now. Still, she has the right to refuse, regardless. I commend you for strongly being agains any type of coercion. 

It seems that you are at a stalemate here, and you have only two options, a) accept the fact that you won't have intercourse until you marry, if and whenever that may be, or b) invoke your own agency and say no thank you... I do not intend to remain celibate for the next who knows how long, therefore we are incompatible and as much as I will miss you, I must end the relationship. I know you have strong feelings for her, but at three months I seriously doubt that it's what you think. It's probably more infatuation than true love. You'd be better off to end it now than to hang on for a year or more and then decide that you just can't any longer.

[ExpatInItaly]

Just now, David Graham said:

That's understandable but I always want to choose honesty than living in a lie

You're missing my point. 

It's good to be honest, yes. My point is that if you present this as a deal-breaker, then be prepared to walk away. It will likely mean the relationship is over as you two are evidently incompatible on a very significant level. 

If you're going to present this to her in hopes that she changes her mind and has sex with you, well, you might be in a for a big disappointment. 

[poppyfields]

10 minutes ago, David Graham said:

The thoughts about her ex having sex with her coming also with the thoughts of him abusing her and not just because he enjoyed having sex with her and me not.

^^Where else do these thoughts come from then?  

I don't mean to sound insensitive but she explained why she had sex with him, he forced her and abused her so you are considering breaking up with her?

I'm sorry this is not what a man truly in love with a woman would do. 

What if she got sick or in an accident and unable to have 'sexual intercourse' for a long time, would you break up with her?

This is NOT love, it's just not. 

It's sexual frustration, it's ego, it's jealousy, it's a whole bunch of things, but not love.

Edited February 5, 2022 by poppyfields

[ExpatInItaly]

4 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

It's sexual frustration, it's ego, it's jealousy, it's a whole bunch of things, but not love.

That's my take on it, too. 

[David Graham]

8 minutes ago, salparadise said:

David, how long will be before you're ready to get married, assuming the relationship continues to be great? You said that you'd be willing to wait a year, but you don't want to wait longer, until marriage. Logically one would assume then that you see marriage being several years away. That's a long time to wait, and if she continues to want to wait your frustration will get worse and worse, and may [probably] turn into resentment. You should recognize that what you want is important too. Her decision is a unilateral one that does not take your wants and needs into consideration.

Secondly, oral sex is sex. So she's not actually waiting to have sex, only intercourse. I also wonder if she's actually THAT religious. I seriously doubt that her religion makes an exception for oral, and if that's the case it invalidates that argument. Of course it doesn't invalidate her choice, she has the right to choose even if it's illogical with respect to the reason given. But notions of virtue are different from religion, and it would seem that she is trying to preserve or regain virtue by withholding intercourse while engaging in oral sex.

I understand that the fact that she had sex with a previous boyfriend is problematic for you. I wouldn't want to be seriously dating any woman who refused to have sex with me (waiting awhile notwithstanding), and knowing that she had been sexual with a previous BF would intensify that feeling. I'm not sure I buy the justification either as she had just as much agency then as she does now. Still, she has the right to refuse, regardless. I commend you for strongly being agains any type of coercion. 

It seems that you are at a stalemate here, and you have only two options, a) accept the fact that you won't have intercourse until you marry, if and whenever that may be, or b) invoke your own agency and say no thank you... I do not intend to remain celibate for the next who knows how long, therefore we are incompatible and as much as I will miss you, I must end the relationship. I know you have strong feelings for her, but at three months I seriously doubt that it's what you think. It's probably more infatuation than true love. You'd be better off to end it now than to hang on for a year or more and then decide that you just can't any longer.

I think marriage will be (if) within 3-4 years of dating.

I can possibly wait for more than a year,but I do want her to be ready and not place a dead-line of certain time.

I will totally rescpect her decisions but I must be honest with her and work things out

[David Graham]

10 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

You're missing my point. 

It's good to be honest, yes. My point is that if you present this as a deal-breaker, then be prepared to walk away. It will likely mean the relationship is over as you two are evidently incompatible on a very significant level. 

If you're going to present this to her in hopes that she changes her mind and has sex with you, well, you might be in a for a big disappointment. 

I agree that I should be ready for a break up if things don't get along.

[David Graham]

7 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

^^Where else do these thoughts come from then?  

I don't mean to sound insensitive but she explained why she had sex with him, he forced her and abused her so you are considering breaking up with her?

I'm sorry this is not what a man truly in love with a woman would do. 

What if she got sick or in an accident and unable to have 'sexual intercourse' for a long time, would you break up with her?

This is NOT love, it's just not. 

It's sexual frustration, it's ego, it's jealousy, it's a whole bunch of things, but not love.

I truly love her, otherwise I wouldn't be in a true loving relationship with her.

yes,the fact we don't have regular sex is frustrating but I don't want to lose her just because of this,even though it's important for me.

I already told her I would truly die for her and do anything I can do to make her feel protected.

She and her family always telling me how loved and protected and good she feels around me and I can also see that on her and on her behavior.

Sex is not the most important thing to me, the most important thing to me is being best friends of each other and being there when needed always, and we both do!

[glows]

41 minutes ago, David Graham said:

to tell her honestly, that becase I love her so much I want to express sex only with her in the most intimate way but I do also need to respect her wishes and that's hard for me.

Do you not think you are flogging a dead horse? Or sounding repetitive? She already knows this. 

You can mention it again however. Be prepared that you’ll be back where you started or run the risk of pressuring her when she’s already told you her stance on the sex before marriage.

I’d leave out the nonsense about protecting and dying for her. Try not to be dramatic. You’ve only known her less than a year. Go easy and slow down.

[Ami1uwant]

13 hours ago, David Graham said:

Hey everybody.

I’m 22 and I have a girlfriend for 3 months now, she is my first girlfriend and I really love her, we were best friends for 6 months before we were a couple.

When I asked her out she told me she wants to wait until marriage for religious beliefs and I told her it probably won't be easy for me but I want her so much (also as a friend) that I'm willing to take it as an “experiment” because she told me she has no problem with oral sex.

I knew she had 2 exes when I asked her out and that the first one was abusive and toxic and they lasted for a year until she broke up with him ans the second one broke up with her after 6 months.

After one month of me dating her she told me she is not a virgin and she had sex with her first ex because he mentally abused her and didn't stop talking with her about it.

Now I'm feeling very frustrated, we agreed that if she changes her mind about sex she would tell me so I don't have to remind her sometimes that it's hard for me.

For me sex is more emotionally important than physically and I had many opportunities to lose my verginity but declined because I want to have sex only with the girl I love.

This girl is really the love of my life and I found myself a gf which is also my best friend.

I thought about telling her that I'm not willing to wait until marriage, and that I love her so much and feel frustrated that I can't express my love to her in the most intimate was possible and it's hard for me.

I thought waiting a whole year of dating to say that so she will know I'm serious about our relationship and that I'm not using her for sex.

I won't lie I'm thinking way too much about the fact she had sex with her ex.

What should I do?

Sex compatibility is critical to a relationship. Say you aren’t waiting.

[salparadise]

@David Graham One more quick post and then I'm out.

You are a young man of 22 ready to experience and explore your sexuality.You've started dating a girl for 3 months, known her for 9, and she's telling you that you're going to have to put any notions of sex on hold for 3-4 years. That is huge. Hardly any man who has been around the block a time or two would call this acceptable. So let's say you decide to hang in there and accept this other-imposed state of celibacy... in your imagination you're almost certainly assuming that once you get to sex everything will be wonderful. But there is actually a good chance that it won't be so simple. You have no idea about sexual compatibility, or her proclivities in the sexual realm. She might think once every few weeks is plenty when you're wanting it every day, for example. Or she might decide that her religion feels that it's only acceptable for the purpose of procreation (as with one major sect of Christianity). There are an unlimited number of unknowns that may become barriers to a wonderful married sex life, assuming the marriage eventually happens, which is not a given.

All I'm saying is, this is a loooooong time to put life on hold because of some rule that you don't even believe in. Think about that. 

Edited February 5, 2022 by salparadise

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, David Graham said:

I agree that I should be ready for a break up if things don't get along.

Yes. She is clear about wanting marriage before intercourse. It's unfortunate her last BF manipulated her. So break up and sow your wild oats elsewhere. Don't be that guy who tells her (again) "I need sex before marriage, so I am not waiting". That's fine, have sex with other girls. But do not pressure her.

[dramafreezone]

13 hours ago, David Graham said:

When I asked her out she told me she wants to wait until marriage for religious beliefs

So not a virgin but wants to wait until marriage for relgious beliefs?

I don't want to bash someone's religion so I'll just say you can't go along with her plan if you're not 100% cool with it.  Stand up for what you believe in, you might lose her in the process if she's steadfast in this belief but IMO this would just be the tip of the iceberg.  She's imposing a rule that works for her and not you.  That's not what we do for people we care deeply about.

You can be sensitive to her traumatic past without making yourself unhappy in the process.  That's not what a relationship is built on, it's built on compromise.  You agreeing to her rule is not a compromise, it's you submitting 100%.

Edited February 5, 2022 by dramafreezone

[David Graham]

1 hour ago, glows said:

Do you not think you are flogging a dead horse? Or sounding repetitive? She already knows this. 

You can mention it again however. Be prepared that you’ll be back where you started or run the risk of pressuring her when she’s already told you her stance on the sex before marriage.

I’d leave out the nonsense about protecting and dying for her. Try not to be dramatic. You’ve only known her less than a year. Go easy and slow down.

thanks for the advice!

[David Graham]

46 minutes ago, Ami1uwant said:

Sex compatibility is critical to a relationship. Say you aren’t waiting.

I do want to say, but not with pressure or against her will, but I do also need to meet my needs

[David Graham]

45 minutes ago, salparadise said:

@David Graham One more quick post and then I'm out.

You are a young man of 22 ready to experience and explore your sexuality.You've started dating a girl for 3 months, known her for 9, and she's telling you that you're going to have to put any notions of sex on hold for 3-4 years. That is huge. Hardly any man who has been around the block a time or two would call this acceptable. So let's say you decide to hang in there and accept this other-imposed state of celibacy... in your imagination you're almost certainly assuming that once you get to sex everything will be wonderful. But there is actually a good chance that it won't be so simple. You have no idea about sexual compatibility, or her proclivities in the sexual realm. She might think once every few weeks is plenty when you're wanting it every day, for example. Or she might decide that her religion feels that it's only acceptable for the purpose of procreation (as with one major sect of Christianity). There are an unlimited number of unknowns that may become barriers to a wonderful married sex life, assuming the marriage eventually happens, which is not a given.

All I'm saying is, this is a loooooong time to put life on hold because of some rule that you don't even believe in. Think about that. 

you are true! I didn't think about it honestly

when I'll talk to her about it I will mention the points you mentioned because they are very important

Thank you!

How do you think I should start the conversation with her about this?

[Alpacalia]

14 hours ago, David Graham said:

When I asked her out she told me she wants to wait until marriage for religious beliefs and I told her it probably won't be easy for me but I want her so much (also as a friend) that I'm willing to take it as an “experiment” because she told me she has no problem with oral sex.

Compromise is an important concern in a relationship. It's admirable that you're willing to make the sacrifice for her, but what about you?

She has stated unequivocally that she does not want to have any sex until she marries. This has been her position from day one.

Of course, in order for both husband and wife to explore each other, sex necessitates practice.

You can't fix this by asking again in a different way or clinging to the carrot of hope, especially if she is now archaic and completely opposed to sex before marriage.

Please keep in mind that you are not wrong or immoral in any way. It will simply be your way of thinking, which is fine because it is your life and you have the right to make your own decisions.

14 hours ago, David Graham said:

I won't lie I'm thinking way too much about the fact she had sex with her ex.

Her denial of sex seems to be attributed to a lack of trust that isn't entirely anyone's fault (other than her past abusive partners). She said she was "mentally forced" into it but maybe she did it then because she thought it right at that moment, but now she thinks it wrong. Clearly, her past history plays into her thinking that she won't bargain with herself just for a moment. She does not just want a "boyfriend"; she wants a "lifetime partner", and she wants to see that quality in you.

 

Edited February 5, 2022 by Alpaca

[David Graham]

41 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Yes. She is clear about wanting marriage before intercourse. It's unfortunate her last BF manipulated her. So break up and sow your wild oats elsewhere. Don't be that guy who tells her (again) "I need sex before marriage, so I am not waiting". That's fine, have sex with other girls. But do not pressure her.

I won't be that guy, I treat her with respect and love.

How should I start the conversation with her about this?

[David Graham]

28 minutes ago, dramafreezone said:

So not a virgin but wants to wait until marriage for relgious beliefs?

I don't want to bash someone's religion so I'll just say you can't go along with her plan if you're not 100% cool with it.  Stand up for what you believe in, you might lose her in the process if she's steadfast in this belief but IMO this would just be the tip of the iceberg.  She's imposing a rule that works for her and not you.  That's not what we do for people we care deeply about.

You can be sensitive to her traumatic past without making yourself unhappy in the process.  That's not what a relationship is built on, it's built on compromise.  You agreeing to her rule is not a compromise, it's you submitting 100%.

How would you start this conversation with her?

[David Graham]

39 minutes ago, Alpaca said:

Compromise is an important concern in a relationship. It's admirable that you're willing to make the sacrifice for her, but what about you?

She has stated unequivocally that she does not want to have any sex until she marries. This has been her position from day one.

Of course, in order for both husband and wife to explore each other, sex necessitates practice.

You can't fix this by asking again in a different way or clinging to the carrot of hope, especially if she is now archaic and completely opposed to sex before marriage.

Please keep in mind that you are not wrong or immoral in any way. It will simply be your way of thinking, which is fine because it is your life and you have the right to make your own decisions.

Her denial of sex seems to be attributed to a lack of trust that isn't entirely anyone's fault (other than her past abusive partners). She said she was "mentally forced" into it but maybe she did it then because she thought it right at that moment, but now she thinks it wrong. Clearly, her past history plays into her thinking that she won't bargain with herself just for a moment. She does not just want a "boyfriend"; she wants a "lifetime partner", and she wants to see that quality in you.

 

What would you say to her and how?

[salparadise]

Begin with, "I'm sorry to have to inform you, but... "

[ericw899]

15 hours ago, David Graham said:

Hey everybody.

I’m 22 and I have a girlfriend for 3 months now, she is my first girlfriend and I really love her, we were best friends for 6 months before we were a couple.

When I asked her out she told me she wants to wait until marriage for religious beliefs and I told her it probably won't be easy for me but I want her so much (also as a friend) that I'm willing to take it as an “experiment” because she told me she has no problem with oral sex.

I knew she had 2 exes when I asked her out and that the first one was abusive and toxic and they lasted for a year until she broke up with him ans the second one broke up with her after 6 months.

After one month of me dating her she told me she is not a virgin and she had sex with her first ex because he mentally abused her and didn't stop talking with her about it.

Now I'm feeling very frustrated, we agreed that if she changes her mind about sex she would tell me so I don't have to remind her sometimes that it's hard for me.

For me sex is more emotionally important than physically and I had many opportunities to lose my verginity but declined because I want to have sex only with the girl I love.

This girl is really the love of my life and I found myself a gf which is also my best friend.

I thought about telling her that I'm not willing to wait until marriage, and that I love her so much and feel frustrated that I can't express my love to her in the most intimate was possible and it's hard for me.

I thought waiting a whole year of dating to say that so she will know I'm serious about our relationship and that I'm not using her for sex.

I won't lie I'm thinking way too much about the fact she had sex with her ex.

What should I do?

Sounds to me like incompatibility. It doesn’t matter if she had sex with an ex. If she has decided for herself and her life that she doesn’t want to have sex with a man until her wedding day, then that’s her prerogative. You either have to respect that or move on and find a woman who will have sex without marriage.