We broke up over an ultimatum - I'm trying to talk to her but she won't talk right now - Looking for guidance

[DarkestbeforeDawn00]

Thank you in advance for reading my current situation and helping me.  I will try to keep this as short as possible. 

We dated for 4 1/2 years.  I'm 34 she's 25.  We moved in together 2 years ago because we both got jobs near each other, and it worked out well for our commutes.  Covid hit so we moved back home for sometime, then moved back into the apartment 6 months later.  Throughout our relationship we barely fought, meshed really well, and always enjoyed each other's company.  Moving forward to what happened:  One night while we were at the apartment hanging out watching T.V. and she brought up getting engaged within 2 years and my initial reaction was like hey whoa easy what's going on? Long story short, it got to the point where she gave an ultimatum and said either yes or no will we be engaged within two years, if it's a no then we are done.  I told her I envision a future with her and i want to marry her i just can't guarantee that within two years.  This led to about 3 weeks of us going back and forth discussing this situation.  I would repeat that I wanted to marry her but I couldn't guarantee within 2 years timeframe so it was then taken as a no.  Eventually it got to the point where I went back home and she stayed in the apartment for a couple weeks.  I wanted to work on us so I went back to the apartment after these 2 weeks, surprised her with flowers and told her that we can work on this and that she's the one and we are building our lives together, chapter by chapter, and that we need to focus on things and work it out together.  After hanging out again for a few days and trying to work on us, the conversation came up again about the engagement/marriage years to make sure we were on the same page.  I told her very specifically now that I want to marry her, she's the one I want to spend the rest of my life with and that an engagement ring might be in 2 years or 3, at most 4 but highly doubtful that long and she said I'm sorry but I can't accept that.  After that, it was basically like ok then that's it, we are done? And it basically came down to that decision of us breaking up.  I ended up moving out of the apartment.  We didn't talk to each other since we broke up because  (I guess the initial break up didn't really hit me) but about 6 weeks later after we broke up, I dropped off a love letter at the apartment telling her how much she means to me and asked her if she could give me the opportunity for me to tell her i love her in person.  She texted me back saying she got the letter and that she appreciated my honestly and expressing my emotions that our relationship was just as important to me, However, she said that she wishes I would've expressed that while she was being honest with me and many things have changed these past weeks and she's been taking steps to move forward and that she is sorry she doesn't have a clearer response for me right now but appreciates that I opened up.  A few days later I tried calling her but she said she has a lot going on right now and she's not really ready to talk right now.  About a week later after that, she was prepping to move out of the apartment and into a new one, and i told her i could swing by after work and help her move some boxes but she replied again that she's not really ready to see me and talk right now.  We have had a couple other texts back and forth but as of right now we really haven't texted each other in a month.  So, with this being said, I'm not sure how I should pursue this situation.  She clearly knows how I feel, and i understand she doesn't want to talk right now, but how much time do i give it before I reach out again? I want to respect her and her needing space, just not sure where I go from here. 

Thanks to you all for your time and helping me out.

[Sun Seeker]

You don't reach out, you let her go. She did the right thing by ending the relationship.

If after 4 years dating, 2 years living together, you still don't feel the want to marry her, then she is not the one for you.

Don't waste any more of her time, or yours.

 

[DarkestbeforeDawn00]

10 minutes ago, Punterxx said:

You don't reach out, you let her go. She did the right thing by ending the relationship.

If after 4 years dating, 2 years living together, you still don't feel the want to marry her, then she is not the one for you.

Don't waste any more of her time, or yours.

 

Thank you for the reply. Not sure if I was unclear in my post, I did tell her I wanted to marry her and that I wanted to spend the rest of my life with her. I said to her it could be 2 or 3 years we would get engaged at most 4 but highly doubtful that long but she said i’m sorry I can’t accept that. 

[Cersei]

You had the opportunity to do what she wanted. You chose not to get engaged. She basically said "s*** or get off the pot." You got off the pot and she has moved on. You need to do the same. 

[DarkestbeforeDawn00]

33 minutes ago, Cersei said:

You had the opportunity to do what she wanted. You chose not to get engaged. She basically said "s*** or get off the pot." You got off the pot and she has moved on. You need to do the same. 

I was reaching out to her to try and talk to he rand reconcile the relationship and see if she is willing to do the same.  She has said she isn't ready to talk right now, so I have been respecting her space.   I just don't know how long I should wait until reaching out to her again to see if she's ready to talk, we haven't texted in a month.

[Cookiesandough]

You need to consider why if it’s true you really want to be with her forever why you need 2 more years. Something holding you back. You didn’t let an ultimatum force you into making a decision you weren’t ready for and that’s a good thing. Break ups are hard. It will be really hard and you will probably have some doubts or whatifs forever but I think ultimately you have to make the decision you feel is best. Nc and good luck

Edited July 7, 2021 by Cookiesandough

[DarkestbeforeDawn00]

12 minutes ago, Cookiesandough said:

You need to consider why if it’s true you really want to be with her forever why you need 2 more years. Something holding you back. You didn’t let an ultimatum force you into making a decision you weren’t ready for and that’s a good thing. Break ups are hard. It will be really hard and you will probably have some doubts or whatifs forever but I think ultimately you have to make the decision you feel is best. Nc and good luck

Thank you very much for your reply.  The ultimatum I got blindsided by, we never really talked about this topic before, so for it to come out of nowhere put me in a different state of mind.  I expressed to her that we were building our lives together, and that for me I felt 2 or 3 years would suffice because we just started new careers and lived together for a little over a year and we would be in a great position then to get engaged and start that chapter of our lives.  

She is the love of my life and I do want to spend the rest of my life with her.  Do I reach back out to her and try and reconcile this and let her know how I feel and if she isn't on the same page then just move on? I've been doing No Contact but I also don't want to have any regrets.  I think she may be looking for me to put all my feelings out there and keep trying (although I did give her that love letter and stuff), IDK - I don't want to have false hope either but I look at it as, If i try and get denied at least I wouldn't have any regrets.  This is someone who we were discussing marriage about, not a 6 month fling.

[LynneVicious]

Question Op,

What do you hope to accomplish by reaching out and reconciling with her?

She wants to get married within 2 years. You don’t. By trying to get back with her, you’re asking her to move her boundary and go back on her ultimatum. 

Unless you are willing to marry her in the next 2 years, do not reach back out to her and expect her to move her timeline for you. Respect that. 

[poppyfields]

I agree you should begin the healing and moving on process but not for the reasons others have stated.

I don't believe in ultimatums, they're manipulative and have very little, if anything, to do with LOVE.

It sounds to me like "being married" was more important to her than the shared connection, intimacy and what you have actually established and built together over the past four years.

She is only 25, so it can't be because she's in this big rush to have a family, she has at least ten more years for that.

But yet she was willing to throw it all away because of some arbitrary timeline stating after four years, you "should" be married and if you're not ready to do what I want, you're OUT!

That is NOT love.  Not by a long shot.

I could understand if you had told her you weren't sure you would ever be ready, but my goodness, you have done more than enough to indicate that she's the love of your life, that you DO want to spend your life with her, but feel you need to get some things in order before that happens.

Now granted, my opinion may stem from the fact I think marriage has become somewhat of a joke in our society, with all the lying, cheating, etc. but I do understand it's important to many people.

But at the end of the day, what is most important IMO is the connection and the love, caring, affection and understanding a couple feels for each other.

Clearly, she does NOT feel that with you, sadly.  And THAT is why I believe you should walk away and begin the healing and moving on process.

I'm sorry.

All the best moving forward.

 

 

Edited July 7, 2021 by poppyfields

[DarkestbeforeDawn00]

20 minutes ago, LynneVicious said:

Question Op,

What do you hope to accomplish by reaching out and reconciling with her?

She wants to get married within 2 years. You don’t. By trying to get back with her, you’re asking her to move her boundary and go back on her ultimatum. 

Unless you are willing to marry her in the next 2 years, do not reach back out to her and expect her to move her timeline for you. Respect that. 

Thank you for the reply.  I would like to reconcile our relationship and talk about what broke us up which was this timeline disagreement and see if there's something we could do about it.  I don't want to lose her, and I didn't give in initially to the ultimatum of " either 2 years or we're done" but at the same time, now that this has all transpired, I'd love to  try and talk to her and work things out and see if we can come to an understanding/agreement together

[DarkestbeforeDawn00]

5 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

I agree you should begin the healing and moving on process but not for the reasons others have stated.

I don't believe in ultimatums, they're manipulative and have very little to do with love.

It sounds to me like the marriage was more important to her than the shared connection, intimacy and what you have actually established and built together over the past four years.

She is only 25, so it can't be because she's in this big rush to have a family, she has at least ten more years for that.

But yet she was willing to throw it all away because of some arbitrary timeline stating after four years, you "should" be married and if you're not ready to do what I want, you're OUT!

That is NOT love.  Not by a long shot.

I could understand if you had told her you weren't sure you would ever be ready, but my goodness, you have done more than enough to indicate that she's the love of your life, that you DO want to spend your life with her, but feel you need to get some things in order before that happens.

Now granted, my opinion may stem from the fact I think marriage has become somewhat of a joke in our society, with all the lying, cheating, etc. but I do understand it's important to many people.

But at the end of the day, what is most important IMO is your connection and the love, caring, affection and understanding a couple feels for each other.

She doesn't feel that with you, sadly.  And THAT is why I believe you should walk away and begin the healing and  moving on process.

I'm sorry.

All the best moving forward.

 

 

Hi Poppyfields,

Thank you very much for the reply.  You've provided some great clarity that I need to consider for sure! I do agree with you on the ultimatum front and the whole it's either within "x" timeframe or we're done.  I have told my friends the same also if I said to her I didn't know if i ever wanted to get married, then yeah I would totally understand her reaction/viewpoint.  It's funny you mention about her not being in a big rush.  i forgot to add in that when she said she couldn't accept my answer, she went on to say because she didn't want to be getting married at 28/29 and kids around 30/31 - so I believe a timeline was in her head? 

[Lotsgoingon]

That's a reasonable deadline. Two years to engagement isn't like next week. 

Doesn't mean you're married at two years--engaged right?. I think most people can make a good decision on whether to be engaged after 2 years. And you've already been together four plus years!  So really she's asking for engagement by sixe years if I understand the timetable. Totally reasonable.

So what's the problem pro? Why can't you decide? If you don't want to go forward, then consider letting her go. 

Bottom line: I see her point of view. You have clearly sent signals of ambivalence and uncertainty to her, and she (given her goal of marriage) is very right to put you on the spot. I'm not taking her side--I'm simply saying she's set her own standard. And I'm prodding you to own up to your own hesitancy. 

Question: what don't you like about this woman? You are clearly ambivalent it seems. What's the blocker? Do you even want to get married? Is marriage a priority for you? And dude, it's OK if marriage is not an urgent priority for you. 

 

Edited July 7, 2021 by Lotsgoingon

[poppyfields]

2 minutes ago, DarkestbeforeDawn00 said:

i forgot to add in that when she said she couldn't accept my answer, she went on to say because she didn't want to be getting married at 28/29 and kids around 30/31 - so I believe a timeline was in her head? 

Well in two years when you anticipate having your ducks in a row, she will be 27 so that certainly fits within her timeline.

Frankly, I think her reasoning is a load of ****, she may be using it as an excuse because she just wants OUT.

In any event, even if that's not the case, her actions here do not reflect love and respect, so again I think it's best you accept her decision and begin taking steps to heal and move on.

This is DONE, I'm sorry.

 

 

[poppyfields]

By the way, my brother didn't marry his now-wife for ten years!   They had a beautiful relationship, and she knew that, she loved him and it didn't matter to her that they were not married, she loved him and what they shared together and that was all that mattered.

They are now married and VERY happy.

Also, I have a friend whose boyfriend couldn't take that leap of faith for FIVE years.  Everyone told her he would NEVER marry her and to move on; I was actually the only one to advise her to forget "marriage" for now and simply LOVE each other and cherish and enjoy what they had together.

She took my advice and stopped hounding him about it, and guess what?

A year later he literally got down on one knee and proposed! ❤️

They got married a year later and this was four years ago, they are still very happily married now and expecting their first child together.

I say, move on from this one, and look for a woman who actually LOVES you more than she loves the idea of marriage.

 

Edited July 7, 2021 by poppyfields

[DarkestbeforeDawn00]

12 minutes ago, Lotsgoingon said:

That's a reasonable deadline. Two years to engagement isn't like next week. 

Doesn't mean you're married at two years--engaged right?. I think most people can make a good decision on whether to be engaged after 2 years. And you've already been together two years.  So really she's asking for engagement by four years. Totally reasonable.

So what's the problem pro? Why can't you decide? If you don't want to go forward, then consider letting her go. 

Bottom line: I see her point of view. You have clearly sent signals of ambivalence and uncertainty to her, and she (given her goal of marriage) is very right to put you on the spot. I'm not taking her side--I'm simply saying she's set her own standard. And I'm prodding you to own up to your own hesitancy. 

Question: what don't you like about this woman? You are clearly ambivalent it seems. What's the blocker? Do you even want to get married? Is marriage a priority for you? And dude, it's OK if marriage is not an urgent priority for you. 

 

Thank you for the reply.  I'm not denying her timeline.  It's the initial ultimatum of we get engaged in two years or we're done.  I never told her I don't want to marry her or I am weary about marrying her.  I always told her I wanted to marry her and she is the one, I just didn't accept the ultimatum.  I told her I can't guarantee that within two years we would be engaged.  I told her we are building our lives together and moving forward together.  A few weeks after the ultimatum, I then told her again I want to spend the rest of my life with her, and it may be 2 years maybe 3 at most 4 years but 4 years is like last resort, but she said she can't accept that answer.  

I do want to get married of course and to her, which I've told her numerous times.  I may have been hesitant regarding the ultimatum at first because I got blindsided by it.  

Edited July 7, 2021 by DarkestbeforeDawn00

[DarkestbeforeDawn00]

11 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

Well in two years when you anticipate having your ducks in a row, she will be 27 so that certainly fits within her timeline.

Frankly, I think her reasoning is a load of ****, she may be using it as an excuse because she just wants OUT.

In any event, even if that's not the case, her actions here do not reflect love and respect, so again I think it's best you accept her decision and begin taking steps to heal and move on.

This is DONE, I'm sorry.

 

 

Yeah this could all be so true honestly, which hurts to think about.  Do you think I give it one last shot and tell her how I feel and would like to reconcile the relationship? Or best to just move on at this point? My gut tells me try one last time

[DarkestbeforeDawn00]

8 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

By the way, my brother didn't marry his now-wife for ten years!   They had a beautiful relationship, and she knew that, she loved him and it didn't matter to her that they were not married, she loved him and what they shared together and that was all that mattered.

They are now married and VERY happy.

Also, I have a friend whose boyfriend couldn't take that leap of faith for FIVE years.  Everyone told her he would NEVER marry her and to move on; I was actually the only one to advise her to forget "marriage" for now and simply LOVE each other and cherish and enjoy what they had together.

She took my advice and stopped hounding him about it, and guess what?

A year later he literally got down on one knee and proposed! ❤️

They got married a year later and this was four years ago, they are still very happily married now and expecting their first child together.

I say, move on from this one, and look for a woman who actually LOVES you more than she loves the idea of marriage.

 

Wow, that's amazing love stories! Yeah I agree, the whole forcing something especially marriage is really tough pill to swallow.  Amazing advice you gave there to your friend! So great to hear it worked out.  

Yeah, that's a great point.  I truly do appreciate your insight and honest words.

[ShyViolet]

I don't blame her at all.  You had been together for 4 1/2 years.  She said she wanted to get engaged within 2 more years.  That is a very generous amount of time, and you still weren't comfortable with that, you were trying to push it to "3 or 4" years.  Why so ridiculously long?  I am not surprised that she took that as you not being committed to the relationship.  She didn't like your indecisiveness and decided to just walk away.  That's her choice, just accept it.

[Lotsgoingon]

I think you're still dodging. I mean, I was not exactly a strong commitment person when I was younger.

But, when I met people I really liked, the idea of getting engaged in two years was a blast, like planning a trip to a vacation spot in two years. 

So I think you guys are NOT compatible. There is no reason to feel the ultimately as pushing you around. Your gf is clearly right: you are NOT interested in marriage soon. After 4.5 years and you don't want to get clarity on marriage. Yes, if marriage is her priority, she should dump you.

And you should want her to dump you, because you don't feel comfortable planning for marriage. By planning I mean setting a rough time ... again 2 years to engagement is NOT pressure. And you're not signing some contract you can't back out of. This isn't the Middle Ages. 

So what don't you like about her?

[Cersei]

I just don't see why you are delaying. You love her, you want to marry her. Why wait even longer? You have been together a long time already. Is there more to this story you are not sharing?

[DarkestbeforeDawn00]

7 minutes ago, ShyViolet said:

I don't blame her at all.  You had been together for 4 1/2 years.  She said she wanted to get engaged within 2 more years.  That is a very generous amount of time, and you still weren't comfortable with that, you were trying to push it to "3 or 4" years.  Why so ridiculously long?  I am not surprised that she took that as you not being committed to the relationship.  She didn't like your indecisiveness and decided to just walk away.  That's her choice, just accept it.

Thank you for the reply.  I wasn't comfortable with the ultimatum of either we are engaged within two years or we are done.  I told her I want to marry her.  Yeah it may not have been within her exact time frame, however, what's one more year for someone you'd spend the rest of your life with? We were just starting new careers and focusing on building our lives up together.  I felt a 2-3 year timeframe was perfect for us

[Lotsgoingon]

Dude, you can call her again, but she seems serious: you're toast unless you commit to engagement in two years.

Why are you evading the issue? She doesn't want to talk until you say "yes" and "two years" and "engagement." 

She's not an idiot. There is nothing to talk about. She's smart: there is no negotiation here. She's smoking out your ambivalence and hesitation. Really smart. She doesn't want to waste any more time with you given you can't commit. 

She needs to start letting you go so she can move on to find someone who is interested in marriage. Dude, I was your position and dumped and trust me: you aren't ready to get married to this woman given how frightened and hesitant you are. Something in the relationship isn't working for you. So yes, she should dump you and you'll be fine moving on and you'll understand more about yourself. 

Edited July 7, 2021 by Lotsgoingon

[poppyfields]

22 minutes ago, DarkestbeforeDawn00 said:

Yeah this could all be so true honestly, which hurts to think about.  Do you think I give it one last shot and tell her how I feel and would like to reconcile the relationship? Or best to just move on at this point? My gut tells me try one last time

If you feel you need to give it one last shot, then that is what you should do.  

Personally, I don't think it will do much good but you could try...

All the best whatever direction this goes.

[DarkestbeforeDawn00]

10 minutes ago, Lotsgoingon said:

I think you're still dodging. I mean, I was not exactly a strong commitment person when I was younger.

But, when I met people I really liked, the idea of getting engaged in two years was a blast, like planning a trip to a vacation spot in two years. 

So I think you guys are NOT compatible. There is no reason to feel the ultimately as pushing you around. Your gf is clearly right: you are NOT interested in marriage soon. After 4.5 years and you don't want to get clarity on marriage. Yes, if marriage is her priority, she should dump you.

And you should want her to dump you, because you don't feel comfortable planning for marriage. By planning I mean setting a rough time ... again 2 years to engagement is NOT pressure. And you're not signing some contract you can't back out of. This isn't the Middle Ages. 

So what don't you like about her?

I never dodged the situation.  When this ultimatum came up and all this started, I always told her it was her i wanted to marry and her I want to spend the rest of my life with.  I guess I'm just more on the reserved side and wanting to build our lives together (we were only living together 1 year because of COVID).  I didn't want to rush into anything, I guess that could be a flaw of mine? But I never gave her any doubt that it wasn't her.  

Haha - I like pretty much everything about her! My planning I guess was a little longer then what she was looking for.

[poppyfields]

Yeah, my friend's now husband told me one of the main reasons he was hesitant was because he truly felt being married was more important to her than HE was.  That she loved the idea of marriage MORE than she loved HIM.

It was only when she stopped pressuring him about it when he was able to feel that she actually loved him, the man, and THAT is when he got down on one knee and proposed.

I am not a man obviously, but I completely understood his POV which is why I advised her to stop hounding him about it, it was sending him the wrong message.

Edited July 7, 2021 by poppyfields