Jacob Blake Video

[rjc149]

24 minutes ago, lana-banana said:

What are these "difficult truths" you're talking about? Statistics indicate Black men are more than twice as likely to be pulled over, arrested, and convicted for the same crimes as white counterparts (this is particularly obvious with marijuana arrests). 

"Why didn't he just comply?" --- is this a joke? There is no shortage of Black men who have been filmed complying with police and been brutalized anyway. Look at Charles Kinsey.

Why is it considered acceptable to kill Black people simply for not complying with police? What, precisely, are you trying to say about "difficult truths"? 

Let’s just look at this specific incident. Just humor me. This specific incident. Not all the other shootings. Not socioeconomic racial bias. Not American race relations. Let’s look at the shooting of Jacob Blake and only this shooting. 

He had a squad of cops following him, screaming at him again and again, to comply with their commands. The video shows it clearly. 

So I’ll ask you one question. Please don’t retort with more questions. Don’t answer “well why does that men he deserved to get shot? Why did George Floyd die? Why did Eric Garner die? Why did all the other black men get shot? Why this? Why that?” 

Answer this question and this question alone. I’m only interested in hearing your answer to this specific question regarding this specific incident. Not other questions about other incidents.

Did Jacob Blake’s open refusal to comply with repeated police demands have anything to do with him getting shot?

I’m not asking if it was right. I’m not asking if he deserved it. I’m not asking why, or if, the cops in this incident mishandled this confrontation.

I’m asking one question. Do you believe that Mr. Brooks’ open refusal to comply with police demands had anything to do with him getting shot?

Again I’m not interested in having any sort of debate about this unless you can answer this question directly and succinctly. If you can, I’ll respectfully  spend the time presenting, and debating, the statistics regarding crime rates and racial demographics in this country.

Edited August 26, 2020 by rjc149

[Piddy]

My wife and her co-workers were talking about the Jacob Blake shooting this morning.

One of the women looked down and rubbed her arm and said, I wish I were white.

My wife's heart broke for her.  Being white we can hear them, but we'll never know.

What is the reply people? 

 

 

 

Edited August 26, 2020 by Piddy

[lana-banana]

8 minutes ago, rjc149 said:

Let’s just look at this specific incident. Just humor me. This specific incident. Not all the other shootings. Not socioeconomic racial bias. Not American race relations. Let’s look at the shooting of Jacob Blake and only this shooting. 

He had a squad of cops following him, screaming at him again and again, to comply with their commands. The video shows it clearly. 

So I’ll ask you one question. Please don’t retort with more questions. Don’t answer “well why does that men he deserved to get shot? Why did George Floyd die? Why did Eric Garner die? Why did all the other black men get shot? Why this? Why that?” 

Answer this question and this question alone. I’m only interested in hearing your answer to this specific question regarding this specific incident. Not other questions about other incidents.

Did Jacob Blake’s open refusal to comply with repeated police demands have anything to do with him getting shot?

I’m not asking if it was right. I’m not asking if he deserved it. I’m not asking why, or if, the cops in this incident mishandled this confrontation.

I’m asking one question. Do you believe that Mr. Brooks’ open refusal to comply with police demands had anything to do with him getting shot?

Again I’m not interested in having any sort of debate about this unless you can answer this question directly and succinctly. If you can, I’ll respectfully  spend the time presenting, and debating, the statistics regarding crime rates and racial demographics in this country.

No, it doesn't. Not complying is not a justification for, nor a factor leading up to, the decision to shoot someone. If you believe an unarmed man in the presence of his children not immediately complying with a cop's orders is justification for being shot in the back seven times then, uh, that's on you.

Edited August 26, 2020 by lana-banana

[rjc149]

1 minute ago, lana-banana said:

No, it doesn't. Not complying is not a justification for, nor a factor leading up to, the decision to shoot someone. If you believe an unarmed man in the presence of his children not immediately complying with a cop's orders is justification for being shot seven times then, uh, that's on you.

Okay — just so I’m clear on the conclusion you are drawing, and please correct me if I’m wrong — the fact that Blake openly refused to comply with police commands, then reached into his car, had absolutely nothing to do with him getting shot by the cops. The only reason he was shot is because he is black. Had he complied with repeated police commands, he would have been shot anyways, because he is black.

Is that a correct summation of your argument?

[lana-banana]

I never said he was shot only because he was Black. I simply said that his not complying is not a valid justification or reason for shooting an unarmed man in the back. The police had plenty of other means available to subdue him if they wanted to. 

However, we have an abundance of evidence from around the country that complying fully with police demands won't prevent you from being shot, so.

Edited August 26, 2020 by lana-banana

[Piddy]

34 minutes ago, Piddy said:

My wife and her co-workers were talking about the Jacob Blake shooting this morning.

One of the women looked down and rubbed her arm and said, I wish I were white.

My wife's heart broke for her.  Being white we can hear them, but we'll never know.

What is the reply people? 

I answer my own question.  Stop the state sponsored violence against black people.  That's a start.................

[DarrenB]

It is horrific.

Damn right reckless and inhumane. People can argue that they need 'better training', however it is more than noticeable that the intent to cause grievous harm and even death is there, evidently. No form of 1:1 training will change that diabolical mindset some people have.

[Weezy1973]

2 hours ago, rjc149 said:

Did Jacob Blake’s open refusal to comply with repeated police demands have anything to do with him getting shot?

I think so. If he had complied, I suspect he would not have been shot. The police in that instance are terrified. If he puts his hands up, goes on the ground etc. I suspect chances are he’s not shot.

[lana-banana]

12 minutes ago, Weezy1973 said:

I think so. If he had complied, I suspect he would not have been shot. The police in that instance are terrified. If he puts his hands up, goes on the ground etc. I suspect chances are he’s not shot.

Why are so many armed police "terrified" of an unarmed man who is probably wondering if his children are going to witness his murder? If cops are so scared their only recourse/instinct is to murder people, they should probably get another job. 

[schlumpy]

It was reported in the news about 30 minutes ago that Mr. Blake was reaching for a knife.

This sound like suicide by cop to me.

 

[Bantosm]

On 8/24/2020 at 4:08 PM, CautiouslyOptimistic said:

I agree with everything you said.  And I'm glad you did not mention his prior record or current warrants since they have nothing to do with him being shot in the back without a weapon.

Why are you ignoring Blake's prior record?

He made the decisions that resulted in warrants being issuesd for his arrest and he also made the decision not to comply.

3 hours ago, lana-banana said:

"Why didn't he just comply?" --- is this a joke? There is no shortage of Black men who have been filmed complying with police and been brutalized anyway. Look at Charles Kinsey.

The problem is there have been millions of police interactions with black men with no problems because they complied.

[basil67]

5 minutes ago, schlumpy said:

It was reported in the news about 30 minutes ago that Mr. Blake was reaching for a knife.

This sound like suicide by cop to me.

 

Who released this information?   Why did they release it?  And what evidence do they have?

News reporting isn't always accurate, and some sources are less accurate than others.   Speculation does nobody any good.

 

[Weezy1973]

2 hours ago, lana-banana said:

Why are so many armed police "terrified" of an unarmed man who is probably wondering if his children are going to witness his murder? If cops are so scared their only recourse/instinct is to murder people, they should probably get another job. 

They need to be trained better. And paid better so the police can recruit to a higher standard. The police are afraid for their safety / lives as well. It’s a human reaction.

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

2 hours ago, Bantosm said:

Why are you ignoring Blake's prior record?

 

Because it had nothing to do with what happened.  How do we even know the officers who shot him in the back had any clue at all about his prior record??

[Bantosm]

1 hour ago, CautiouslyOptimistic said:

Because it had nothing to do with what happened.  How do we even know the officers who shot him in the back had any clue at all about his prior record??

It had everything to do with what happened. The encounter occured because officers had active warrants for Blake's arrest. 

[basil67]

@Bantosm where did you get the information that the encounter occurred because officers had active warrants for Blake's arrest?   I was of the understanding that the encounter occurred because police were called to a domestic incident.   The truth of what was happening at the incident remains to be be discovered.

[Prudence V]

11 hours ago, Weezy1973 said:

If he had complied, I suspect he would not have been shot.

Didn’t work for all the other (black) guys who complied. 

13 hours ago, lana-banana said:

However, we have an abundance of evidence from around the country that complying fully with police demands won't prevent you from being shot, so.

 

[Prudence V]

Even if he had a knife, even if a taser hadn’t worked.... a single shot to the leg to incapacitate him would have sufficed. Him lying next to his car clutching a knife wounded in the leg would still be a “neutralised threat”. There was no need to shoot him repeatedly in the back. That is overkill. 

[Weezy1973]

1 hour ago, Prudence V said:

Didn’t work for all the other (black) guys who complied. 

 

I suspect that for people that do comply, regardless of race, the incidence of them being shot / killed is far lower than incidences where people don’t comply. It just doesn’t make the news. 

[d0nnivain]

14 hours ago, basil67 said:

Who released this information?   Why did they release it?  And what evidence do they have?

News reporting isn't always accurate, and some sources are less accurate than others.   Speculation does nobody any good.

 

It was released during yesterday's press conference by the Wisconsin Attorney General.   

I thought the tone of the conference was transparency & community cooperation.  African American community leaders including the local president of the NAACP also spoke & called for calm & compliance with curfews.  

[Tamfana]

15 hours ago, schlumpy said:

It was reported in the news about 30 minutes ago that Mr. Blake was reaching for a knife.

This sound like suicide by cop to me.

The knife was discovered in his car. He was unarmed when shot.

Given the bad rep from other police scandals planting evidence, that's not near enough to conclude this was suicide by cop.  That is a wild conclusion to draw.  

DO you think that *unarmed* people who own weapons deserve to be shot by police more than people who don't own weapons?   

 

Edited August 27, 2020 by Tamfana

[Tamfana]

16 hours ago, Weezy1973 said:

I think so. If he had complied, I suspect he would not have been shot. The police in that instance are terrified. If he puts his hands up, goes on the ground etc. I suspect chances are he’s not shot.

Many people doubt that compliance matters.  There are white supremacists in police departments and the military (remember the recent US but WS soldier who gave intel to WS groups in Europe).  

George Floyd was killed despite complying.  

Google "Charles Kinsey" too.  Police shot a black man who was caring for a mentally ill man.  Both were unarmed and the caregiver, Kinsey, was on the ground with arms up, begging not to be shot. And police shot him.  

Bad cops undermine policing and safety on the streets.  Get them out, hold them accountable and things will be much more peaceful in America. 

On another topic, the Trump administration is now attacking journalist David Fahrenholdt who won the Pulitzer prize for his research on the crimes of the Trump Organization.  All of his reporting was supported by real evidence.  

This is the method- attack, smear, do anything to make his base ignore evidence against him. And his family.  

Edited August 27, 2020 by Tamfana

[Weezy1973]

10 minutes ago, Tamfana said:

Many people doubt that compliance matters.  

I understand that, but doesn’t mean it’s true. We are seeing a very small sample of police interactions, and the ones going viral are newsworthy. Newsworthy means different from normal. 

 

13 minutes ago, Tamfana said:

George Floyd was killed despite complying.  

Yup he was. But was that the rare exception or the rule? I’m guessing it was the rare exception.

 

15 minutes ago, Tamfana said:

Bad cops undermine policing and safety on the streets.  Get them out, hold them accountable and things will be much more peaceful in America. 

Absolutely true. I think higher pay and better training, as well as getting rid of many of the laws that protect bad police officers are all proactive steps that should be taken.

This video struck me very very differently than the George Floyd video. I was absolutely horrified by the Floyd video. 

[Tamfana]

23 minutes ago, Weezy1973 said:

I understand that, but doesn’t mean it’s true. We are seeing a very small sample of police interactions, and the ones going viral are newsworthy. Newsworthy means different from normal. 

Yup he was. But was that the rare exception or the rule? I’m guessing it was the rare exception.

Absolutely true. I think higher pay and better training, as well as getting rid of many of the laws that protect bad police officers are all proactive steps that should be taken.

This video struck me very very differently than the George Floyd video. I was absolutely horrified by the Floyd video. 

The first time I was truly horrified was the Kinsey shooting.  (Cell phones might save the country.)  I wasn't seeing enough until cell video poured into YouTube.  

I had no idea how imbalanced police responses are when it comes to race.  I'd had a big WTH?! moment when a Harvard professor was stopped by cops trying to get into his own house but it really wasn't until Kinsey and other incidents of cops assuming black people didn't live in their houses that I joined BLM.

 Cops work for the people, all the people.  If they're  more afraid of any group and more likely to harm them, they need to be fired. 

ETA: But I don't believe they're "afraid."  I believe they're violent and intentionally kill. 

Edited August 27, 2020 by Tamfana

[Piddy]

5 hours ago, Prudence V said:

Didn’t work for all the other (black) guys who complied. 

Very true.  Philando Castile comes to mind.  He was stopped with his girlfriend and her 4 year old daughter in the car and was asked for his license and registration.  He told the the cop he had a firearm in the glove box and was told to not reach for it.  Castile said he would not and the cop opened fire and murdered him.

So yeah, you're black and comply you get shot.  You're black and scared and don't comply you get shot.  You're a 12 year old  black kid (Tamir Rice) playing by yourself in a park with a toy gun and the cops roll up and shoot you and kill you, etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc..........................................................

 

Edited August 27, 2020 by Piddy