Was my comment that insensitive? Best way to reach out for damage control?

[Versacehottie]

Well I think of course your best friend was right. This girl has the upper hand and seems like she always will. If you want different behavior from her long-term and her to respect you more to where she will stop stringing you along and consider really dating you, you shouldn't have given in IMO.

 

That said, glad the weight is off your shoulders and things are going well with this other girl. I wouldn't get into the hot/cold war with first girl--she's a pro, and is likely to outdo your hot/cold!

[Els]

Actually I've been the one who wanted "more" but she has been hesitant, mostly saying she wants to start as friends to build trust before investing emotionally. Claims she's been alone so long it's hard to let someone in. She's been back and forth about "giving things a chance" over the months. The more I push talks about "us" the more it pushes her toward just friends. Relax the talks and just show her a good time, the more she opens up to the idea.

 

 

While your comment was pretty darn bizarre (especially in that context), I think it's largely irrelevant. IMO it's pretty clear from this paragraph that she isn't that interested in you - even if she does finally "capitulate" and agree to date you, won't you wonder if she's just putting you on the back burner? I mean, I'm a huge supporter of starting out as friends, but 6 months is MORE THAN ENOUGH time for someone to know if they want to date you. Honestly. It's not like you're asking her to marry you, gosh.

[smackie9]

Let her go! Such a waste of your time, when you are getting very little to nothing from her. Focus on this new girl.

[Gaeta]

Feels much better knowing things are "fine" between us.

This is insane and highly dysfunctional of you. Things are not *fine* she's has been playing you for attention for 6 months how is that *fine* ? Do you enjoy this?

 

Lastly, had a second date Wednesday with a new girl and received a very encouraging text from her last night. Definitely seems interested. She even threw in for most of the tab and refused to let me pay even when I offered. Felt good

Don't screw it because of Miss Virgin!

[JuneL]

Let me get this right: You’re relieved that you called because she reiterated her SSDD with you?

 

Called her today.

 

My best friend has been following the situation since day 1 and has predicted her behavior and personality quite well, said she'll never reach out and by disappearing will push her away. My gut feeling agreed but I also wanted to take action on the situation instead of just sitting around left to wonder.

 

She called back in a few minutes and was eager to talk. Didn't sound upset or distant. No mention of the situation last time with the bill. I mentioned it'd be fun seeing her this weekend but she was busy with work. She mentioned something about finding a partner someday and explained friends first again, it might have been a hint, but I'm done analyzing her. I ended the call after 20 minutes. Went like every other call we've had.

 

Feels much better knowing things are "fine" between us. Taking a step back over the past 10 days with no contact has also been a very needed breath of fresh air, feels like a ton of weight has been lifted off my shoulders and given me perspective. Reading all these replies helped equally so. So I'll sit on it for now. I'll try to distance myself but feels like I'm in a much better position to engage her while keeping my emotions in check, if I decide to do so. Hell maybe I can even spit back a little hot/cold game myself.

 

Lastly, had a second date Wednesday with a new girl and received a very encouraging text from her last night. Definitely seems interested. She even threw in for most of the tab and refused to let me pay even when I offered. Felt good

[cereal_dater]

This is insane and highly dysfunctional of you. Things are not *fine* she's has been playing you for attention for 6 months how is that *fine* ? Do you enjoy this?

!

 

No you're right, what was driving me crazy was not knowing if we were still on speaking terms, whether she'd reply or answer my call, etc. Regardless I'm putting her on the back burner and focusing on other girls.

 

Well I think of course your best friend was right. This girl has the upper hand and seems like she always will. If you want different behavior from her long-term and her to respect you more to where she will stop stringing you along and consider really dating you, you shouldn't have given in IMO.

 

That said, glad the weight is off your shoulders and things are going well with this other girl. I wouldn't get into the hot/cold war with first girl--she's a pro, and is likely to outdo your hot/cold!

 

I really like your advice and agree 100%. At this rate things are going nowhere. If I really want a chance with this girl it feels like we need hard reset. A few weeks or longer of no to little contact. She needs time to miss me. If she does initiate contact, wait hours or even until the next day to respond and respond with as little as possible. If all things were normal that would be a no-brainer, but she's far from normal.

 

The issue I foresee going that route is, whenever she has "warmed up" and come on strong has been during those periods when we've been texting frequently, building rapport and comfort, hanging out 1-3x per week. She'll initiate when we've had a string of recent texts. She'll almost never reach out once there's been 3-5 days of silence between us. Told me on day 1 she wants "the man to take the lead". I remember early on, after our first or second date, I went an entire weekend without texting her, and when I finally did her response was "thought I had lost you there for a minute". It's been such a weird situation that conventional advice just doesn't always apply and can be counterproductive.

 

With that said, it was only one phone call, so I'd like to think I can still apply your advice from post #48 with space and distance. But before I do, what are your thoughts now considering the paragraph above?

Edited June 23, 2018 by cereal_dater

[todreaminblue]

Unfortunately I realize it too well. This probably sounds crazy, but for the last 3 months it feels like my happiness has become contingent on how things are going with her. I'm probably the least "clingy" guy on earth, but when you've got someone you really like, have chemistry where hours feels like minutes, instant comfort and connection, lots of attraction, common interests you never you'd find in a potential partner, they reciprocate interest and assure hope.

 

Then POOF the rug gets swept out leaving you in a tailspin, unsure where you stand, trying to psychoanalyze mix messages, she's indecisive and distant, feels like eggsells, anxiety just to text in fear of if/how they'll respond, etc.

 

Then a week or two later things start going really well again. She's initiating warm texts often. Dropping obvious hints and making bold statements of interest. You get that sense of relief that everything is fine again. Rise and repeat the cycle about x3. You become consumed with the situation and it occupies your thoughts much of the day when in those doubtful periods. Meeting other women does nothing but makes you appreciate chemistry with her even more. She's been mostly upfront about wanting to move slow and a relationship would be difficult, so it's hard to fault her personally.

 

I'm a seasoned dater and usually have no trouble walking away -- so I don't think I'm crazy?

 

 

 

I'm a seasoned dater and usually have no trouble walking away -- so I don't think I'm crazy?

 

 

why are you questioning that statement by a question mark at the end..is it rhetorical?..or is it because you feel a little crazy...

 

i dont feel what you said was any big deal after you apologised and explained....and i am a woman who pays for herself....it should have been over...and i feel it was over...

 

her non answer to you well who knows why she hasnt answered...she could have lost her phone even......but in my opinion ...she sounds conflicted and unsure and set in her single life....i date from friends first but....in saying that the guy i eventually date knows its me dating in view to something more committed because i dotn date for fun...and after six months....i would already expect a close and committed relationship to have formed......i would expect it to be that way......guys know where they stand with me fairly early on.... ... its easy to let people know where they stand and to me she has given you nothing to stand on....after months is it?

 

you have more like a stick to limbo under for the time being....keep this in mind if someone truly desires a person and wants to be with them...theres no games or ambiguity necessary

 

forget the gaff you made...it should be over...dont apologise or explain yourself again

 

if you do contact her.... do so with a suggested date and time and place if she doesnt answer....move on....send a clear message with no ambiguity to her in hope of receiving the same back at least...best wishes.......deb

[Veronica73]

Good lord, she sounds like a lot of work. I’d give you advice if I had any, but like you said, she’s a piece of work and conventional advice may not apply.

[Veronica73]

Okay, I know I said I wasn’t going to give any advice, but I can’t seem to help myself...!

 

Six months, or however long it has been... is more than long enough for her to know whether she wants to date you or not. I think she needs to make a CLEAR choice and if she isn’t ready to be in a real, exclusive boyfriend-girlfriend relationship with you, you should move on. Otherwise you are just wasting your time. (I think she is stringing you along.) I’m not into ultimatums at all, but this may be a situation ripe for one.

[Versacehottie]

No you're right, what was driving me crazy was not knowing if we were still on speaking terms, whether she'd reply or answer my call, etc. Regardless I'm putting her on the back burner and focusing on other girls.

 

 

 

I really like your advice and agree 100%. At this rate things are going nowhere. If I really want a chance with this girl it feels like we need hard reset. A few weeks or longer of no to little contact. She needs time to miss me. If she does initiate contact, wait hours or even until the next day to respond and respond with as little as possible. If all things were normal that would be a no-brainer, but she's far from normal.

 

The issue I foresee going that route is, whenever she has "warmed up" and come on strong has been during those periods when we've been texting frequently, building rapport and comfort, hanging out 1-3x per week. She'll initiate when we've had a string of recent texts. She'll almost never reach out once there's been 3-5 days of silence between us. Told me on day 1 she wants "the man to take the lead". I remember early on, after our first or second date, I went an entire weekend without texting her, and when I finally did her response was "thought I had lost you there for a minute". It's been such a weird situation that conventional advice just doesn't always apply and can be counterproductive.

 

With that said, it was only one phone call, so I'd like to think I can still apply your advice from post #48 with space and distance. But before I do, what are your thoughts now considering the paragraph above?

 

Yes I agree with a "hard reset". To really do that though YOU can't keep doing the same things. (Also separately you set up an unhealthy pattern for you guys if you do the hot/cold/stonewalling each other more than a time or two because it loses it's impact). In my opinion, she really needs to believe you are moving on! Listen, she is really jerking you around with saying the man must take the lead when you don't have a dating relationship--you are FRIENDS!!! She is making you jump through a bunch of hoops to prove that you would be a good boyfriend (and its having you on eggshells). She has enough information to know if you would be a good boyfriend--for whatever reason she is not compelled to take it the next step. Kinda at this point if you keep letting her string you along, you are doing it to yourself!!! Hoping against hope really, as all evidence has shown that she always makes you feel like you haven't done enough, aren't enough and need to do more/prove yourself more. Not healthy, ultimately won't make you happy--even if you win your "prize" (which I could debate for hours that she is NOT that!).

 

You are fooling yourself if you think conventional advice doesn't apply. She is nothing special in this regard. My belief (and it would go with lots of examples) is the biggest dynamic in dating/choosing who to date is one of economics. I know this will make some people upset. But basically, if the attention and love is too abundant (saying this at beginning before one or both have committed), the value placed on that person is less. Such as, in your case, you keep running in, bridging the gap for her, and showing her you will "be there" and she does not value you. Sad isn't it? And conversely, you value her because her attention is scarce. So in economics, you need to reset and rebalance the market environment or product. For you, that would be to improve yourself as the product OR make yourself more scarce so she values your attention and love. Balance things out. Dating other girls, improving your looks or status in life and paying her less attention (i.e. just being real buddies/friends NOT friend hoping to date her) will do the trick. You don't even need to make sure she finds out about the other girls. It will usually show in your demeanor and how you spend you time because you have OPTIONS (rising market value).

 

Your OWN examples show that it is not counterproductive. You pull back, she pulls toward you--even if it is with a statement rather than initiating (she was "afraid she lost you", f*ck finally! she needs that feeling a lot more often). I am also wanting to warn you that while economics works if she has already determined that you are not what she wants, she is not ready for a relationship altogether, this will likely work but it will only short-term and then she will go back to her fickle, hot/cold thing. AND some people are just like this forever--they crave this dynamic. I feel like you want me to say she is different and therefore you can do what you want, which is always pushing in, trying to fix things--well that hasn't worked, has it?

 

I will say that IME guys that pander to me, never become bf's. If they show that I can jerk them around, i'm not interested (i'm a nice person so i don't literally do that but there are versions of where if a guy is overly fawning it just doesn't work). In her own statement, she says she likes guys who take the lead, not just literally, i.e. as in contact, I am sure it extends to figuratively, like a more dominant stance. Less dominant will stick around and be a doormat to her whims. More dominant will realize his efforts aren't paying off the way he wants to and moves on to where they will. I love this about guys. As a generalization guys have a good tendency to be slightly selfish--in a good way--they can be relatively linear and matter of a fact in that I like this girl but it's not reciprocal so i'm moving on. Most guys are overly protective of their hearts and their walls are up relative to ours (conditioning) so they shut down when they are being stomped on. Not always good in a relationship--but would ABSOLUTELY do you some good in this non-relationship. You can show you are "worth" it by asserting your value in the market place. Don't try to oversell yourself, keep reducing your value. A lot of the time the most attractive guys are the ones who just don't give a f*ck. They are like here I am, take me or leave me. This applies to shy guys, nerdy guys, macho guys, all types. People hate the use of alpha/beta but I would say that is the difference. Do NOT chase her. It's that simple. Good luck

[mortensorchid]

I am glad to read that you actually did CALL her to talk about the things that were bothering you rather than just send texts that may or may not go unanswered. But now that you have, it's clear she's not that interested in you and you have already moved on as you mentioned seeing someone else. So I am glad you got your answers.

 

I think people make things more complicated than they really are or are trying to read things into things that are or are not there. Many have come down on me for posting a series of rules and regulations for things, but it's been proven to me time and time again that they are right and everything else is not. If one person does not do/say A, B does not happen. FACTS. And this gal was not doing / saying things that were going to lead to something good for you or her.

[Babeindawoods]

Hello cereal dater,

 

Man, I wish I had someone to do free and cheap stuff with. Just a good guy friend would be great.

 

Question: how much sex did you get?

 

I feel like in this day and age, there is a direct correlation between money and sex.

[Highndry]

...She mentioned something about finding a partner someday and explained friends first again, it might have been a hint, but I'm done analyzing her. I ended the call after 20 minutes. Went like every other call we've had....

That was the perfect opportunity to put her on the spot, and you didn't do it. A simple "you've got my number when you're ready, but I have zero interest in a friendship with you" followed by "I've got another call coming in, I've got to run" was all that was needed. Instead, you likely came off as weak, like an orbiter. I would never, ever call this gal again.

[heavenonearth]

One of the best guys i ever dated... we went out for four months... he kept pressing for us to be more and i always postponed. I always told him “i need time” because i has just gotten out of a relationship.

Truth be told, i was having sex with someone else at the same time.

(He eventually found out about that but still wanted to date me)

We had a special connection but i just was not sexually attracted to him.

Still i am not. We hooked up 5 years after that in a second attempt at dating - because as i said, he checked all my other boxes.

Well, what happened? I consider him a good friend now.

i think what i did back when we first met was cruel. But i didn’t know better.

 

Long story short... i think she’s not sexually attracted to you. She may like you enough to wait but once she finds out, you will still just be - a friend.

She can’t be honest with you yet because she doesn’t want to hurt you - and because she doesn’t want it to be true either, especially cause she likes you.