How do I move on from my ex fiancee?

[Downtown]

What I'm saying is that identifying "BPD traits" or any specific traits of a psych disorder is useless.

Field, the professionals disagree with you. The psychiatric community believes this information is very beneficial to the lay public, not dangerous or "useless." For the same reason that hospitals and medical centers publicize the symptoms for stroke and breast cancer, hundreds of mental health centers publicize the symptoms for BPD and other mental illnesses. They know that, when lay people are able to identify symptoms, they are far more likely to protect themselves and their loved ones by seeking professional help. Here are just a few examples:

 

• NIMH (National Institute of Mental Health) describes the nine BPD defining traits to the lay public at NIMH--BPD.
  
• Mayo Clinic educates the public about BPD traits at BPD Symptoms--MayoClinic.com.
  
• National Mental Health Association explains BPD traits to the public on its website at Mental Health America: BPD.
  
• U.S. House of Representatives -- yes, the House that can't seem to agree on anything -- unanimously passed House Resolution 1005 (in April 2008) to establish May as "BPD Awareness Month." It is meant "as a means of educating our nation about this disorder, the needs of those suffering from it, and its consequences." See BPD Awareness Month.
  

Doing so is a type of blame mentality where you don't look within yourself.

No, Wisely repeatedly indicates that he is seeking an understanding of what went wrong in his relationship. Early in his thread, he states, "I can't even understand what and why she must hate me that deep... I can't really understand her anymore." Wisely later states, "I am thankful that you have explained very well to me about this. Now I can understand that she is feeling like that to me."

 

Because Wisely indicates that he is seeking an understanding and is thankful for acquiring it, I believe him. I therefore disagree with your view that BPD information should be withheld from him because you fear he cannot be trusted with it -- i.e., that he might misuse that information to point fingers and place blame. Moreover, as I noted earlier, there are hundreds of mental health centers that provide that information to lay people because they believe it will produce far more benefit than harm.

[wiselyzzz]

I agree, Wisely. As I noted earlier, only professionals can determine whether BPD traits are so severe and persistent as to constitute full-blown BPD. It nonetheless is easy to spot strong occurrences of BPD behaviors.

 

By the time you were 17 or 18, you already could identify the selfish and very grandiose classmates -- without knowing how to diagnose Narcissistic PD. You could identify the class drama queen -- without being able to diagnose Histrionic PD. You could spot the kids having no respect for laws or other peoples' property or feelings -- without diagnosing Antisocial PD. And you could recognize the very shy and over-sensitive classmates -- without diagnosing Avoidant PD.

 

===> Yeah, I see that lots of the time.

 

Similarly, you will be able to spot strong BPD traits when they occur. Indeed, you would have to be deaf, dumb, and blind to be unable to spot temper tantrums, verbal abuse, and irrational jealousy.

 

===> I see what you mean there.

 

I think this is all you can do, wisely. Your story is heart breaking and I'm so sorry it happened to you. There were problems between you that couldn't be resolved but you tried and i think that is what you do when you truly love someone. One thing that stood out was that there seemed to be a communication barrier, that she would make assumptions and be upset that you did not know (why didn't she ask you to join her for tea, or she could have gone with you to eat). Or she would not explain her feelings. Although you wanted it to work, it sounds like your needs werent being met as she would close off and have no contact. Her comments about your grandfather were very strong and hurtful. Also, the fact you were intimate and the happy moments will torture you. The pain will gradually lessen and you might not even realise when it is improving but it will.

 

===>It's okay. Thank you for the caring. Yeah, I truly loved her. I tried to resolve it but she just doesn't want to end peacefully. Like you have mentioned about the intimate and happy moments, the making out is the worst one that tortures me the most. It is the most difficult for me to forget.

 

After my breakups i analysed everything that was said and done throughout relationships and breakups and tried hard to figure out the answers and resolve things. Often, there are no answers and a break up is not something that can be resolved. I think it is a natural part of grieving the loss of a relationship but make sure you allow plenty of time to be with family and friends and think about all the amazing things that lie ahead for you! It is ok to feel sad and pain for now. Remember, things will get a lot better and easier.

 

===>Yeah that is what I am doing right now. Be with friends, it can cure temporary to permanent. However, sometimes it comes back and torture my mind again making me back to square one. Thanks to her stubborn will not to end this peacefully, it feels I am at fault.

 

Field, nobody on this thread has attempted to diagnose anything. On the contrary, I stated above (post 8) that "At issue is whether she exhibits those traits at a strong and persistent level (i.e., is on the upper third of the BPD spectrum). Not having met her, I cannot answer that question." And I stated, "...only a professional can determine whether [symptoms] are so severe as to constitute full-blown BPD." You are confusing spotting warning signs (i.e., symptoms) with making a diagnosis. As I explain below, there is a world of difference between the two.

 

===> Do not worry about that downtown, you have done well and whether or not people said you diagnosed or not does not really matter to me. All I want is a good ear to be lent for advice .

 

Again, nobody on this thread is trying to diagnose anything. Wisely doesn't have to be a psychologist or doctor to spot strong BPD or NPD traits. We all know what these behavioral traits look like because we all exhibit them to some degree. It therefore is not difficult to spot strong occurrences when you learn which behavioral traits are on the list.

 

===> Yeah, I do not actually have to be psychologist to spot those. Perhaps it might be similar but I know what I saw when I see her actions.

 

 

That part is easy. Indeed, it is so easy that hundreds of mental institutions post a list of the nine BPD symptoms on their public internet sites to tell the lay public what symptoms to look for. They know that BPD symptoms, like those for heart attack and breast cancer, are easy to spot.

 

What is hard is being able to diagnose the existence and cause of the full-blown disorder. No doctor on the planet can do a real diagnosis of BPD or any other PD. That would require professionals to identify its underlying cause, which is yet unproven. All discussions of BPD traits, then, are simply descriptions of behavioral symptoms. Those symptoms do not describe the traits or characteristics of the underlying disorder causing the symptoms. Hence, discussing BPD behavioral symptoms is not an attempt to diagnose the underlying disorder -- i.e., not in the way the term "diagnosis" is used in every medical field.

 

Importantly, you don't go to a medical doctor to be told what symptoms you have. Instead, YOU tell the doctor all about your symptoms. Similarly, when you go to an auto repair shop, you don't go to be told about your car's symptoms. Rather, YOU tell the repairman what problems the car is exhibiting and he diagnoses the situation to tell you what is causing those symptoms to occur.

 

Hence, whereas diagnosing a cause is the province of professionals, identifying symptoms is the province of laymen (i.e., the client seeking help). This is why, when a patient is unable to identify disease symptoms, that disease is said to be "asymptomatic," i.e., "without symptoms." By definition, then, symptoms are traits that laymen are able to spot -- without trying to diagnose anything.

 

Because psychologists are unable to actually diagnose the underlying cause of these personality disorders, they are forced to rely on a severe occurrence of the behavioral symptoms to infer the existence of some underlying (but unproven) disorder. Only a professional, then, can determine whether the strong BPD or NPD behaviors you see are sufficiently severe and persistent as to be called full-blown BPD or NPD.

 

Of course, Wisely lacks the professional training necessary to declare such behaviors "full blown." This does not imply, however, that he is unable to spot moderate to strong occurrences of these behaviors. On the contrary, he was able to spot behaviors such as temper tantrums, verbal abuse, and irrational jealousy before he graduated from high school (or from its equivalent in Indonesia).

 

===> I learnt it from experience. That's why all those traits are clear in my eyes. Though not full, I was able to know these behaviors are what you guys have mentioned.

 

Field, please refrain from attacking me as being "irresponsible" and claiming that I am motivated by "a lot of resentment." The Community Guidelines prohibit personal attacks. Like you, I am simply trying to help Wisely heal from the abusive relationship he was in.

 

===>I thank you so much for helping me. I do not think you are doing wrong at all. One thing I want to tell you is that I never do any kind of verbal physical abusive to her. (Slapping, hitting, etc). I always want to build harmony relationship. I become a man to what women expected. But yeah despite those things, I still got dumped and hurt. I covered my weakness for her.

 

The feeling i get is that there was insecurity and resentment, probably from both wisely and his ex fiance. And she fell out of love and shut down. I don't know about BPD or abuse. They just had hurdles that they couldn't get past and were headed in different directions. Sorry if I am way off, but that was the gist of it for me.

 

===> I feel insecurity because of fear of her cheating or having another person in her heart while in relationship which turns out to be true. Resentment? She resents me for every actions despite unintentional mistakes. I don't know perhaps I am imagining things. I forgive her easily when she's wrong. But when I am wrong, it is very hard for her to forgive me. Also when she's wrong, she is VERY Proud of herself not to admit her mistake and apologize to me. Even when I confront her and remind of her mistake, its still hard for her to admit it. Takes a very numerous logic and reasons to make her admit and solve this peacefully.

 

Smiley, to me it sounds like Wisely's Ex was emotionally abusive based on his following statements (when considered as a whole):

 

• "I broke her up cause she always caused trouble making small simple problem into big which I think its ridiculous."
  
• "I am always like the bad guy in her eyes despite no mistake I did or unintentional mistake."
  
• "She is indeed spoiled, ungrateful and drama queen."
  
• "I managed to spot lots of... lies of her."
  
• "Hated me ever since she said to her mom that white candle is used for praying in Chinese to God. She said that I wanted her to die."
  
• "Trust is really an issue back then. However, I keep trusting myself to trust her and look what I got until break up. A betrayal."
  
• "I can't even understand what and why she must hate me that deep."
  

 

===> Just to remind that none of us have ever done verbal abusive such as slapping, hitting, etc. Maybe emotion or mental abusive.

 

Field, the professionals disagree with you. The psychiatric community believes this information is very beneficial to the lay public, not dangerous or "useless." For the same reason that hospitals and medical centers publicize the symptoms for stroke and breast cancer, hundreds of mental health centers publicize the symptoms for BPD and other mental illnesses. They know that, when lay people are able to identify symptoms, they are far more likely to protect themselves and their loved ones by seeking professional help. Here are just a few examples:

 

• NIMH (National Institute of Mental Health) describes the nine BPD defining traits to the lay public at NIMH--BPD.
  
• Mayo Clinic educates the public about BPD traits at BPD Symptoms--MayoClinic.com.
  
• National Mental Health Association explains BPD traits to the public on its website at Mental Health America: BPD.
  
• U.S. House of Representatives -- yes, the House that can't seem to agree on anything -- unanimously passed House Resolution 1005 (in April 2008) to establish May as "BPD Awareness Month." It is meant "as a means of educating our nation about this disorder, the needs of those suffering from it, and its consequences." See BPD Awareness Month.
  

No, Wisely repeatedly indicates that he is seeking an understanding of what went wrong in his relationship. Early in his thread, he states, "I can't even understand what and why she must hate me that deep... I can't really understand her anymore." Wisely later states, "I am thankful that you have explained very well to me about this. Now I can understand that she is feeling like that to me."

 

Because Wisely indicates that he is seeking an understanding and is thankful for acquiring it, I believe him. I therefore disagree with your view that BPD information should be withheld from him because you fear he cannot be trusted with it -- i.e., that he might misuse that information to point fingers and place blame. Moreover, as I noted earlier, there are hundreds of mental health centers that provide that information to lay people because they believe it will produce far more benefit than harm.

 

===> Once again, I am thankful of your advice, scientific explanation and logic reasoning. After combining so much support from all of you guys, including field, downtown and other people in this forum, I feel like I was able to understand what I didn't understand before of why she acted weird to me despite being long time, why she couldn't be there and chat me when she's not busy, why she's so insecure of letting people see our chat and wallpaper, why she's able to have another person in her heart, why she's annoyed with me everytime I ask her softly about picture and ring and so on. Those kinds of things were like mystery answers to me that even I at that time can't even seem to find out her heart. I was even thinking that she really didn't love me anymore during our second to third year of relationship. I was thinking she was still with me because she has no excuse of leaving me or maybe mercy on me???

 

P.S: To people in this forum, I would love to hear your advice to solve this if you ever have the same case as me. Anything is appreciated To me, this is the worst case that has ever happened to me. Thanks to that break up, I couldn't get good night sleep and make my eyes black. Cause the memory tortures me all the time.

[fieldoflavender]

And where is the ex's perspective on all of this? She could very well say tons of things he did too that could have set her off too. Not that she should behave in those ways, but it could be in reaction too.

 

Without the full picture, I can't comment or label people.

 

I think you're working in the right direction wisely, but maybe actually talk to a professional.

Edited July 2, 2017 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Edited for Civility & Respect ~ V

[wiselyzzz]

And where is the ex's perspective on all of this? She could very well say tons of things he did too that could have set her off too. Not that she should behave in those ways, but it could be in reaction too.

 

===> Let me answer that for you. There was once case I overheard from her talking with her mom. This case was there was her friend's boyfriend. He literally took advantage of her friend. She helped lots to her by doing something that cause public image bad. It was like insulting or gossiping in social media. When her mom confronted her and said that It is not good to say bad things to people like that. She said, "So what?Let it be. Make him embarrassed so he won't take any advantage to other girls.

 

So how is this related to my ex's perspective? It is assumed that she might say something bad about me to someone else with some truths changed (Due to most of the problems raised by her) to make me be the bad guy here. Like I have mentioned, if she is going to hate that person, she is going to hate forever. She is not the type to listen people's advice calmly and will not do it even though she said she promised. Evidence? I am the evidence cause many times she promised but she often forgot. I too may sometime forgot the promise but I always ask her to remind me and should that happen, I apologize to her if I forgot to promise and will still do my best to fulfill that. The promise is never gone if I ever promise to anybody. I detest breaking promise. That's my principle of life.

 

Without the full picture, I can't comment or label people. Downtown, you just seem obsessed on every forum trying to put your own story (and it's even unclear if you ex wife even had it - was she formally diagnosed by a third party professional and not yourself - considering you are far from third party) onto everyone else and THAT does more harm than good.

 

===> If you are talking about full picture about listening to both sides, I also want you to listen to both sides too. However, that would be impossible for now because she's not here. Plus like I have mentioned, she is always avoiding me. Downtown's mentioning his ex wife is not a problem to me, at least I can feel painful of other people. I am open minded person who can feel the emotion of others even though we do not meet face to face. However, I would also see the story and comprehend carefully.

 

So why doesn't wisely actually talk to someone professional about it rather than getting misguided help from you.

 

I think you're working in the right direction wisely, but maybe actually talk to a professional rather than listening to people on the Internet who hold tons of resentment and hate.

 

===> Thank you and that's okay. I can see if people actually hold resentment or not. I am just needing advice badly cause I am pretty sure I am wound up hurt for several months thanks to this break up.

 

===> There is another thing I need to mention to you guys, I know I am not supposed to judge but I may have the ability to predict future although It won't be accurate. When I was in relationship with my ex, the prediction future almost always comes up bad based on her personality to me. I can see an abusive household and so on due to many arguments over simple matter. I don't know if this is actually good or not but do you think my ex's future can be good if she keep her behavior like this?

[Downtown]

I know I am not supposed to judge but I may have the ability to predict future although it won't be accurate.

On the contrary, Wisely, it is good that you're using your best judgment when considering a woman as a potential mate. Moreover, your judgement will be increased ten fold by considering her overall pattern of behaviors instead of looking only at individual behaviors in isolation. This is true for potential mental issues as well as for medical problems.

 

For example, when you experience a sudden pounding of your heart, shortness of breath, lack of energy, and dizziness, your good judgment tells you that this pattern of symptoms is a strong warning sign (i.e., a "predictor" as you say) for Atrial Fibrillation. You don't have to be a medical doctor to know that. Rather, you only have to be able to read -- because hundreds of medical centers post this list of warning signs on their public websites.

 

Spotting strong warning signs, however, does not give you a diagnosis. Instead, it only tells you that the problem is sufficiently serious to warrant seeking a diagnosis. A professional can determine whether those symptoms are sufficiently severe and persistent as to constitute a full-blown disorder.

 

Hence, you need not be fearful of using your own judgment in assessing the warning signs for mental or medical issues. Whereas diagnosis is the province of professionals, spotting warning signs (i.e., symptoms) is the province of lay people. By definition, a "symptom" is something that a layman is able to spot. When a layman is unable to spot the dysfunctional effects, the disorder is said to be "asymptomatic," i.e., "without symptoms."

Edited July 2, 2017 by Downtown

[wiselyzzz]

On the contrary, Wisely, it is good that you're using your best judgment when considering a woman as a potential mate. Moreover, your judgement will be increased ten fold by considering her overall pattern of behaviors instead of looking only at individual behaviors in isolation. This is true for potential mental issues as well as for medical problems.

 

===> I see. Then I will put it as a good use. So far, when I see any of my ex's emotion. Mostly they are contempt, disgust, hate and annoying. This is a reference from Lie to me TV Series. I have been studying it and so I know the microexpression of my ex. I guess right most of the time and when I hit Jackpot to her hiding something, she would change subject. Learning this also cause my drawback which is uncomfortable whenever she is hiding something which causes me think about third person interfering in our relationship.

 

 

For example, when you experience a sudden pounding of your heart, shortness of breath, lack of energy, and dizziness, your good judgment tells you that this pattern of symptoms is a strong warning sign (i.e., a "predictor" as you say) for Atrial Fibrillation. You don't have to be a medical doctor to know that. Rather, you only have to be able to read -- because hundreds of medical centers post this list of warning signs on their public websites.

 

===> Yeah, that's a good example.

 

Spotting strong warning signs, however, does not give you a diagnosis. Instead, it only tells you that the problem is sufficiently serious to warrant seeking a diagnosis. A professional can determine whether those symptoms are sufficiently severe and persistent as to constitute a full-blown disorder.

 

===> I understand what you mean.

 

Hence, you need not be fearful of using your own judgment in assessing the warning signs for mental or medical issues. Whereas diagnosis is the province of professionals, spotting warning signs (i.e., symptoms) is the province of lay people. By definition, a "symptom" is something that a layman is able to spot. When a layman is unable to spot the dysfunctional effects, the disorder is said to be "asymptomatic," i.e., "without symptoms."

 

===> Downtown and other people in this forum, there are somethings that you should know about me. First is I am a man who wants to keep his promise all the times. Several promises that I made with my ex, some of them are fulfilled, some are broken due to not realized it or accident mistake. There is one promise that I haven't fulfilled to her. She once told me she loved this animation Bolt movie. So I told her I would give it to her, however, by the time breaking up happened, I realized I haven't given her this movie. So despite having broken up, I tried my best to meet her but you guys have known she wants to avoid me until now. Like I said, I really don't like If i still have debt unfulfilled or promises left behind. That is one of the reason why I really want to meet her last time so I can give her the movie she wanted. But, yeah despite reading my letter of apologize. What i got was BLOCKED.

 

Second of all, when I am in relationship, what I can only think is I will do my best to make my lover happy always. I cover up some of my common personality to make better life. Example: I don't like to sing but I sing a song for her despite bad voice. I make funny animal voices, etc. I make lots of things that even I myself was not believed it until I did it. Like, I managed to lift her like the after-wedding and so on. Despite the cover up, I was happy even though I am not really myself. I smiled lots of times. Once, I also told myself and to her, I don't care what happen to me as long as you are safe. I don't want to see or make you sad or cry ever again. Though, I also said if that happens you can break me up. Now that you mention it, when the break up happens she used one of this as an excuse despite she cried or when we argue not because of me whole reason (The reason of breaking up was already in previous posts). She said,"You told me to break you up if you make me cry, and I did. So why am I always at fault?" As usual, Is it me the one who make such a stupid promise? Or Is it her that is abusing this promise? This way I learn my lesson not to say something like that anymore. I thought when a man trying to make his woman happy by covering up some of his personality, he can achieve his eternal happiness. I was wrong or maybe it was not there in the first place.

 

Third, when I was in relationship with her during first year, she was so innocent. Until second year to third year, she became grown up and not so innocent anymore. I taught her lots about knowledge I knew. Technology, development life and so on. However, it makes me think that she just used me for advantage. Why? Because after she got a job in April which involves as a Sales Promotor VIVO which also must have lots of knowledge about Android and stuff, she becomes like a person who knows better than me. I was like thinking, " Hey, I was the one who taught you that. Why would you boast around that to me? I even taught you something that no common people know that." Example: Network Hertz and ADB, Bootloader and so on, also custom Rom. I was thinking that I regret ever teaching her that, otherwise, she wouldn't have succeeded in test for the job. Of course, It is bad to wish her like that but still I am regret. Not only that, during almost

to second year, she wanted me to pick her up from work every day to college. When I was busy at that time, she would show her not happy face to me. Just one day from Monday to Saturday, if I didn't pick her up, she would get angry to me. Making me thinking that she accepted me and dated me just because I can be used as an Object.

 

Finally, even while playing game LINE get rich. She was quite stubborn and blamed me if we lose in team. Occasionally, I played with her often team battle. When we lose, she blamed me for picking the bad choice in my turn or using wrong pendant or card. When we win, she just happy and hooray to me. I thought, "Has it never occurred to you that you also cause the lost? Why would you blame me? Furthermore, this is just a game. OMG" Sometimes, she asked me to set her character and pendant up and tell her if there's something wrong. After it's done, we played. We lost and she blamed me. Also, she has like 4000+ diamonds, when I set cube which uses clover (Only 2 left from 5), she blamed me again. I was like," You can always buy clover for XX diamonds and besides, it's cheap." So, yeah to conclude all of this, my ex is not a really good cooperative gamer and she acted the above of everything even I was the one who introduced the game to her first and I knew more than her since I played first before her.

 

So downtown and others, I don't know why, Love is so so complicated. Despite that, why did I FALL IN LOVE with her? TBH, she was not beautiful but I loved her at the first sight and her heart was pure and beautiful. But now, she is beautiful but quite rotten in her heart. No longer pure. I guess what people say is true, Inner beauty reflects everything. If you are kind and beautiful in heart, your outer sight will also beautiful and vice versa. Tell me, How could I fall in love with her? I didn't know that this love caused me so much pain that I always want to forget her but i couldn't due to the memory of 3 years and making out.

[Downtown]

But now, she is beautiful but quite rotten in her heart. No longer pure.

Wisely, the only place on this earth you will encounter a woman who is either "rotten in her heart" or "pure" is in fairy tales. Children's stories are filled with people who are "all bad" or "all good" because young children are too emotionally immature to perceive of a person's bad and good qualities at the same time. This is why young children (and adult BPDers) cannot handle being consciously aware of ambiguities, strong conflicting feelings (e.g., love and hate), uncertainties, and the other gray areas of close interpersonal relationships.

 

Because you are a mature adult with well developed emotional skills, you no longer have to think in that childish black-white manner. You already knew three years ago that your ex-fiancee is a complex human being who has both good and bad aspects to her personality, just like the rest of us. And you still know that now.

 

If your ex-fiancee really does have strong BPD traits as you believe, she likely is a good woman who often exhibits selfish and abusive behavior because -- like a young child -- she is too immature to control her own emotions. The result is that her feelings often are so intense that they distort her perceptions of your intentions and motivations. As I noted earlier, a BPDer's problem is not being bad -- or being "rotten in her heart." Rather, her problem is being unstable (due to her emotional immaturity).

 

Tell me, how could I fall in love with her?

Because I've never met her, I cannot know for sure. Yet, if she really is a pretty BPDer as you believe, I can tell you that falling in love likely would have been easy. BPDers typically exhibit a warmth, purity of expression, charm, passion, and spontaneity that otherwise is only found in young children. It makes them so very easy to love. It therefore is not surprising that two of the world's most beloved women -- Marilyn Monroe and Princess Diana -- both had full-blown BPD if their biographers are correct.

 

Moreover, walking away from a long-term BPDer relationship usually is very painful. The primary reason is that it feels like you are walking away from a sick young child who, despite her periodic tantrums, dearly loves you. As noted earlier, a BPDer is able to love very intensely, albeit in the immature way a young child is able to love.

 

A second reason is that a BPDer usually believes the outrageous allegations coming out of her mouth. Because her feelings are so intense, she is absolutely convinced they MUST be correct. Moreover, that sincerity and conviction usually will be obvious to you (and to the police if she ever calls them to arrest you). Hence, because you know she loves you and truly believes most of her allegations, you mistakenly assume that -- if you can only figure out what YOU are doing wrong -- you can restore the relationship to that wonderful bliss and passion you saw at the beginning.

 

A third reason -- especially for excessive caregivers like you and me -- is that a BPDer relationship gives us an opportunity to experience the intoxicating feeling of being the nearly perfect man who has ridden in on a white horse to save the maiden from her distress. As excessive caregivers, our desire to be needed (for what we can do) far exceeds our desire to be loved (for the men we already are). We therefore are strongly attracted to a child-like woman who can project her vulnerability across a crowded room. Indeed, Marilyn Monroe could project it across the room from a flat movie screen.

 

A fourth reason is that, because a BPDer so completely mirrors the best aspects of your personality and your preferences, you both mistakenly believe that you have found your "soulmate." Hence, even when you later start to question that intense feeling intellectually, you still have to fight against the intense feeling that she is somehow perfect for you -- and destined to be your mate.

[wiselyzzz]

Wisely, the only place on this earth you will encounter a woman who is either "rotten in her heart" or "pure" is in fairy tales. Children's stories are filled with people who are "all bad" or "all good" because young children are too emotionally immature to perceive of a person's bad and good qualities at the same time. This is why young children (and adult BPDers) cannot handle being consciously aware of ambiguities, strong conflicting feelings (e.g., love and hate), uncertainties, and the other gray areas of close interpersonal relationships.

 

===> I see. It may be the fairy tale because I was hoping like that. However, I won't stop believing that cause I believe there will be a person who will match to my expectation despite few weaknesses (cause no one is perfect). To be honest, I wish that I would get my Hinata (character from Naruto) one day, the only reason why I am so motivated in pursuing my true love. Otherwise, I wouldn't bother. I wonder if there is any person there who has similarity of her. Even if it is very low chance, I will keep believing.

 

Because you are a mature adult with well developed emotional skills, you no longer have to think in that childish black-white manner. You already knew three years ago that your ex-fiancee is a complex human being who has both good and bad aspects to her personality, just like the rest of us. And you still know that now.

 

===> Yeah, until now, I know that. To be honest, I don't like feeling cold hearted. That's harsh. However, feeling strong emotion is also not cool just like my current state now. Though, I really appreciate it cause i feel love.

 

If your ex-fiancee really does have strong BPD traits as you believe, she likely is a good woman who often exhibits selfish and abusive behavior because -- like a young child -- she is too immature to control her own emotions. The result is that her feelings often are so intense that they distort her perceptions of your intentions and motivations. As I noted earlier, a BPDer's problem is not being bad -- or being "rotten in her heart." Rather, her problem is being unstable (due to her emotional immaturity).

 

===> Yeah, even I myself can't even manage to suppress her emotion. I tried so many things to calm her down by hugging her, warming her, cuddling her when she cried. All but to no success.

 

Because I've never met her, I cannot know for sure. Yet, if she really is a pretty BPDer as you believe, I can tell you that falling in love likely would have been easy. BPDers typically exhibit a warmth, purity of expression, charm, passion, and spontaneity that otherwise is only found in young children. It makes them so very easy to love. It therefore is not surprising that two of the world's most beloved women -- Marilyn Monroe and Princess Diana -- both had full-blown BPD if their biographers are correct.

 

===> You might haven't seen her but yeah If only I can provide you a picture of her, you would at least be able to perceive some of the situation. However, that's the privacy of hers. I can't do it of course unless you want to search it by your own. I see, maybe that sparkling love from first sight was due to that? Who knows....

 

Moreover, walking away from a long-term BPDer relationship usually is very painful. The primary reason is that it feels like you are walking away from a sick young child who, despite her periodic tantrums, dearly loves you. As noted earlier, a BPDer is able to love very intensely, albeit in the immature way a young child is able to love.

 

===> That's kinda cool comparison which quite match with my case. Yeah, come to think of it, why do I still love her until now even if I got hurt? That doesn't make any sense. Usually, if any person got abused, their love will decreased to the point it will be gone.

 

A second reason is that a BPDer usually believes the outrageous allegations coming out of her mouth. Because her feelings are so intense, she is absolutely convinced they MUST be correct. Moreover, that sincerity and conviction usually will be obvious to you (and to the police if she ever calls them to arrest you). Hence, because you know she loves you and truly believes most of her allegations, you mistakenly assume that -- if you can only figure out what YOU are doing wrong -- you can restore the relationship to that wonderful bliss and passion you saw at the beginning.

 

===> I see. So it makes it useless.

 

A third reason -- especially for excessive caregivers like you and me -- is that a BPDer relationship gives us an opportunity to experience the intoxicating feeling of being the nearly perfect man who has ridden in on a white horse to save the maiden from her distress. As excessive caregivers, our desire to be needed (for what we can do) far exceeds our desire to be loved (for the men we already are). We therefore are strongly attracted to a child-like woman who can project her vulnerability across a crowded room. Indeed, Marilyn Monroe could project it across the room from a flat movie screen.

 

===> That's it. That's what I am talking about. If i remember correctly, she once said that I was a prince who saved her from misery painful past of loneliness ever since her father passed away. But, it may seem that she changed her mind? Yet again, the desire keeps exceeding from what I expected.

 

A fourth reason is that, because a BPDer so completely mirrors the best aspects of your personality and your preferences, you both mistakenly believe that you have found your "soulmate." Hence, even when you later start to question that intense feeling intellectually, you still have to fight against the intense feeling that she is somehow perfect for you -- and destined to be your mate.

 

===> Yeah, I thought I believed she was my soulmate but still, yeah in the end, we weren't. I kept fighting for our love. Failed to realize that she was far to be considered as soulmate.

 

Looks like you really miss her. I think she got all the attention that you can give, enough to say that you really love her. You know, girls are always like that. Making small simple problems into big. That actually shows that she really cares or love you and also needs your attention. Yes, at some point it might have an impact to her by the time you broke up with her, but still, you did your best to make it right again and I know she felt that. But then again, what's done is done. It's always ok to be sad. It will always be ok to cry. For now you will cry about it but eventually you will laugh at it.

https://deepthoughts.ga/

 

===> Yeah, I do miss her until now but that feeling is decreasing slowly.

I do really love her until now but I want to make it forgotten soon. I hate if girls do that for attention, kinda different from my expectation of attention.

I cried 3 times after we broke up. I don't think she will shed tears for me.

She wouldn't care. Thank you buddy. I hope you won't end up the same as me.

 

 

===> Downtown, dhohen and others, I just realized some things or points forgot to be mentioned. Here are some points of her and me.

 

Number 1, there was one case of when I broke her up at the time span between first year to second year, we kinda argued more even when we broke up. Also, since we did making out lots. She did something that cause me embarrassed and did something that no children should want to do. She said, " We have seen each others from head to toe, I want you to take responsibility." After hearing that, I told her, "Why should I take responsibility? I never do any sex to you, just petting stimulation and so on. Besides, You are still virgin." She said,"Who knows, we never know. You have to take responsibility." After that, I was like on rage. I kinda like don't chat her anymore. What was in my mind of responsibility perhaps telling my parents to make it clear of responsibility. So I told my mom, luckily she understood and open minded. It happened to couples these days, as long as the girl is not pregnant. everything is well. When I told my mom, I was so embarrassed as a child cause I make my parents disappointed. Thanks to that incident, I didn't want to talk to her and blocked her. However, about 2 months later, I forgave her and unblocked her. So, we started chatting again and yeah the love which was gone before blooms again. That's when we went back together which her love wasn't the same as before. Also, she told me that that wasn't the responsibility she was talking about, although in the end she never told me what was the responsibility about.

In conclusion, I think I get the karma about this because of this incident. Only, I never blackmail her. I just have feeling of love to her until now.

 

Number 2, She loves everything about Korean and are fans to Kim Kibum. She overfans so much that every moment we go out and if there are books or accessories about Super Junior, she will buy it. I don't mind cause it is her right. I also am not jealous of her fans. But she fond him too much by the time goes by. After that, she couldn't really separate which one is real life love and which one is just for fan. I do have fans but I don't really care or fond that much. When I joked to her saying that she really loved him so much, etc, she's angry and said why I was always complain and jealous of him. It is natural to be jealous but not making it a big deal, but she makes it as a big deal. Ever since that, I began to hate everything about Korean despite they are not at fault.

 

Number 3, She is a cat lover. So yeah, every time I see a cat. I think of her. Which makes me hate cats. Again, despite I don't want to.

 

Number 4, I was her first love, but she wasn't my first love. Despite being her first love, in the end, it didn't work out.

 

Number 5, She can't take joke very well. Example: When I order food in restaurant like TEXAS chicken, I took the meal and brought to our table. Then, I acted like a polite waiter and gentlemen. I said,"Here is your meal, ma'am. Enjoy the food." with smile. However, she's angry of me cause I called her ma'am. I do not think calling that is wrong. However, yeah despite being a joke, she couldn't see it and understand it well.

 

Number 6, When I was in debate competition one team with her. Her skill wasn't as great as I am. I wasn't expecting to win and lose though. I did my best to make our team passed. However, Since I am a competitive person and hates losing and want to win. I began like annoyed when she presented the point not clearly and screwed up. Although, I gained composure fast cause she was my lover and I understood her skills. I didn't blame her. I also hates blaming people in team except when they are not doing their best and trying to make people lose instead of winning (Like what happens in MOBA games DOTA2 mostly.) Although, I didn't blame her and said anything to her, I still showed unhappy and disappointment face but trying my best to keep it down. She spotted that and kinda like didn't happy too. So, whenever we argue, she would brought this issue which I think should be forgotten. Bringing this up would be the same as hey, I give you my book, now can i take it back. Don't you think?

 

Number 7, VERY RARELY we used sailor language to each other such as "Sh**, Fu**, Slu*, etc". I remember I never said anything to her. But, last Christmas before, when we argued, she said that words to me which I was surprised and shocked. How could she say that to me while I never say that to her? That was also the first time she said to me like that.

 

So, Downtown and others, What do you say about these issues and points? What can you get?

Edited July 3, 2017 by wiselyzzz
Missing BOLD part

[Downtown]

She once said that I was a prince who saved her from misery painful past of loneliness ever since her father passed away. But, it may seem that she changed her mind?

Yes, if she is a BPDer as you believe, it was inevitable that she would change her mind. That's what unstable people do. As soon as her infatuation started to evaporate, her two fears returned and you could not avoid triggering them. At that point, then, she would have started perceiving you as The Perpetrator (i.e., the cause of her unhappiness) instead of The Rescuer (i.e., the one saving her from unhappiness). This is the black-white thinking we've been discussing.

 

Whenever we argue, she would brought this issue which I think should be forgotten. Bringing this up would be the same as hey, I give you my book, now can i take it back. Don't you think?

I agree. Once someone has apologized for a minor mistake, a mature adult will forgive him and leave that incident in the past. But, if your Ex is a BPDer, NOTHING will be left in the past. Nothing is "forgotten," as you say. Instead, she will keep a long list in her mind of every mistake and offense you ever committed against her. And she will not hesitate to pull out the ENTIRE list during the most minor of arguments with you.

 

The reason BPDers do this is that their self image is so fragile that they need frequent validation of their false self identity of being The Victim, always The Victim. My exW, for example, would mention mistakes/offenses I had done 12 or 15 years earlier -- things having absolutely nothing to do with the current argument over some minor thing. When a BPDer feels she is losing the current argument, she will pull things out of the distant past (real or imagined) to support her false belief that she is the victim and you are the cause of her unhappiness.

[wiselyzzz]

Yes, if she is a BPDer as you believe, it was inevitable that she would change her mind. That's what unstable people do. As soon as her infatuation started to evaporate, her two fears returned and you could not avoid triggering them. At that point, then, she would have started perceiving you as The Perpetrator (i.e., the cause of her unhappiness) instead of The Rescuer (i.e., the one saving her from unhappiness). This is the black-white thinking we've been discussing.

 

===> Yeah, I believe something like that was going to happen.

 

I agree. Once someone has apologized for a minor mistake, a mature adult will forgive him and leave that incident in the past. But, if your Ex is a BPDer, NOTHING will be left in the past. Nothing is "forgotten," as you say. Instead, she will keep a long list in her mind of every mistake and offense you ever committed against her. And she will not hesitate to pull out the ENTIRE list during the most minor of arguments with you.

 

===> No kidding, that was the reason why I almost always be the bad guy when she pulled the list and mentioned almost everything that I did to her in the past.

 

The reason BPDers do this is that their self image is so fragile that they need frequent validation of their false self identity of being The Victim, always The Victim. My exW, for example, would mention mistakes/offenses I had done 12 or 15 years earlier -- things having absolutely nothing to do with the current argument over some minor thing. When a BPDer feels she is losing the current argument, she will pull things out of the distant past (real or imagined) to support her false belief that she is the victim and you are the cause of her unhappiness.

 

===> I am sorry about your case, I don't know how you made it. I believe you felt pain more than I do, however, it's relevant. Each people have different feeling of pain. So, what do you suggest if a person has BPD and when that person someday wants to go back to you like example your ex wife or my ex fiancee, will you forgive her and want her back? Tell me the reason.

[Downtown]

What do you suggest if a person has BPD and when that person someday wants to go back to you like example your ex wife or my ex fiancee, will you forgive her and want her back?

My view is that a person is not responsible for their feelings but, rather, for how they choose to act on those feelings. It therefore is important to hold a high functioning BPDer -- like my exW -- fully accountable for those bad actions. To do otherwise would be harmful to her because my enabling behavior would destroy her incentives to confront her issues and learn how to control them. She will have incentives to do that only as long as I don't keep protecting her from the logical consequences of her own bad choices.

 

This is not to say, however, that I want her back. Because she is emotionally stunted at the level of a young child, she is capable of handling only a parent/child relationship -- not a husband/wife relationship. Moreover, because she is incapable of trusting me (or anyone else), I can never trust her.

 

A person who cannot trust me can turn on me, with a vengence, at anytime -- as she has already done many times. Importantly, trust is the foundation on which all close long-term relationships must be built if they are to be lasting and successful. With a BPDer, that foundation is missing unless she has worked hard for many years in intensive therapy to acquire the missing emotional skills.

[wiselyzzz]

My view is that a person is not responsible for their feelings but, rather, for how they choose to act on those feelings. It therefore is important to hold a high functioning BPDer -- like my exW -- fully accountable for those bad actions. To do otherwise would be harmful to her because my enabling behavior would destroy her incentives to confront her issues and learn how to control them. She will have incentives to do that only as long as I don't keep protecting her from the logical consequences of her own bad choices.

 

===> I see. Then, I must have done the wrong choice with my ex-fiancee then.

 

This is not to say, however, that I want her back. Because she is emotionally stunted at the level of a young child, she is capable of handling only a parent/child relationship -- not a husband/wife relationship. Moreover, because she is incapable of trusting me (or anyone else), I can never trust her.

 

===> I figure as well, because It is hard for me to trust her ever again if we ever go back. Feeling of insecurity will always be there. Also, to be honest, she not only is not suitable to be in Husband/wife relationship, but also parent/child relationship. She once said to me that she hated kids, especially noisy kids. How do you think of that? People say once cheater, always a cheater. Is this true?

 

A person who cannot trust me can turn on me, with a vengence, at anytime -- as she has already done many times. Importantly, trust is the foundation on which all close long-term relationships must be built if they are to be lasting and successful. With a BPDer, that foundation is missing unless she has worked hard for many years in intensive therapy to acquire the missing emotional skills.

 

===> I agree with you. Trust is the most important thing in relationship. However, in my case, trust is always the issue here. I feel something weird happening and always uncomfortable. I don't want to feel that ever again if I were to have another relationship.

 

Revenge Your Ex

 

Each day hundreds of men and women seek revenge on their ex-mates for a

variety of reasons, usually because they got dumped or where cheated on.

Revenge comes in many ways. It typically starts by using social media to

vent, and then escalates from there. Now sites like "Get Revenge On Your Ex" for a fee will help you get pay back or revenge.

 

===>Revenge, huh? I never think about revenge actually cause I love her. Even if I want to embarrass her in social media, I will never do that. Waste of my time and energy plus I am not that kind of person. But, to be honest, deep down in my heart, I wish karma gets her although this isn't right. Am I wrong to have that kind of thought for seconds and that It's gone?

 

So what is the best way to get revenge besides slashing her tires, posting

nude photos of her and so on.

 

The best way according to the web site Right Choices 101 is to live your

life well. This is true no matter who you are seeking revenge on. Coworkers,

past bosses, bad friends or ex-lovers. Put your energy into succeeding and

enjoying your life, not wasting your time, energy and resources on revenge

that can end up costing you much more. Plus, when you seek revenge, you send

them a massage that you have not gotten over the relationship. It's much

better to show you are indifferent and don't care.

 

===> Hehehe, That was what I was thinking when I got dumped. You are absolutely correct, sir. Living my life well is the best revenge. However, it takes time. I am still emotionally attached to her. Need sometime to make it gone.

 

According to Kenneth Agee of A Foreign Affair, a service that specializes in

helping men find young beautiful foreign women, "The best revenge is to date

or marry a women 10 years younger than your ex. This will piss her off to no

end. No woman ever wants to be replaced with a younger, more attractive

woman. Just like a man never likes to get replaced by a guy who is wealthier

or more successful.

 

===> I don't know about this but I don't think she will care to what my future lovers gonna be. However, I am happy if I do find the perfect beautiful and young kind girl who will always love me. Maybe, that kind give her best piss off cause I will be finally in the right person .

 

I will never forget one of my first clients we took to Saint Petersburg,

Russia." says Agee, "The client told me that two days on our tour was better

than two years of therapy. Having hundreds of attractive women fighting over

you gets your ex out of your mind pretty quick.

 

==> This one is true to be honest. It happens to me when I see lots of beautiful women, my minds cleared up. However, I don't do this when I am in relationship. Seeing lots of beautiful women makes me think that there are lots of fish in the sea. She's not the only one.

 

I personally went through break up when my ex ran off with another man. But

a short time later, I met a new lady who was ten times better. I ran into

that man who stole my ex and I gave him a big thanks. In fact, I could not

thank him enough. He was stuck with an older nagging women, while I was now

with a young, beautiful, caring women. Plus, my ex had gained about 100

pounds. I don't look at that fellow as any kind of enemy but as the person

who saved me from my ex and years of suffering." This is the best a revenge

when you win without lowering yourself.

 

===> I feel you brother. If I ever find a guy who steals my lover and my lover was feeling him or go to him over than me (disloyal), maybe at first I will feel rage. But moments later, I will say nah, take my lover if you want. I thank you for giving me the chance to get my better soulmate. Definitely I will find better than you my ex love. You save me lol.

 

Other sites like "Get Over Her Now" give practical advice and tips for

getting over a past relationship.

 

Top Tips from Get Over Her Now:

 

Start making platonic relationships with as many women as possible, old,

young, skinny, fat, cute or ugly. This greatly helps you get back in the

game of socializing with the opposite sex. And it opens up lots

opportunities to meet their cute attractive friends in a more relaxed

environment. This also helps you build your game and confidence.

 

===> I will. Don't worry but in this local area where I reside, nothing interests me anymore especially women in here. They are always not comfortable with me. Well, at least eliminated those who can't accept me for who I am.

 

Improve yourself, start working out, get up early every day and exercise.

 

Buy new clothes. Dressing better makes you feel better and improves your

confidence.

 

Focus on work and getting a promotion or raise. Don't let a break up effect

your work negatively. Put that extra effort into work and it will pay off

with a better position and more money. This will also build your confidence

and help attract better quality women.

 

Any time you are depressed, improving yourself helps greatly. When you feel

depressed, don't sit and watch TV and then sleep-in late. Get out and do

something that will make you feel like you've accomplished something. Take a

class, go hiking, fix something you've been putting off.

 

===> Being doing that lots. Despite that, thank you buddy .

 

Don't start drinking. Drinking will always have a negative impact on your

life. Don't drink while depressed or when you are trying to get over some

one. After all, drinking is for celebrating. So if you are not celebrating

something, don't drink. A quality women is not going to be attracted to

someone who drinks a lot or has a drinking problem.

 

===> For your record, I never want to drink alcohol. Also, never tried it.

Don't sleep in; sleeping late increases depression. Get up as early as you

can and go for a walk, take a hike, or go to the Gym. Research shows getting

up early and exercising can eliminate depression. You will have no game be

depressed.

 

===> This already becomes my habit. But yeah I will try. Thank you.

Don't binge eat. If you start gaining weight, you will feel less self-worth

and lose your confidence. Confidence is a quality that women are extremely

attracted to.

 

===> This is the most I am having issue right now. Oh my god, I eat average but I can see I am getting fatter despite not eating like crazy.

 

Conclusion, the best revenge is when you improve your life so well that she

realizes she made a big mistake. And satisfaction comes when you meet

someone so much better, you are glad the ex is gone. After all, if you are

seeking revenge, how great could she really have been in the first place!

 

===> Of course dude. I want to make her see How successful I become. Building my own dream and can fulfill it while seeing her still struggling and regret her choices of ever dumping me behind over her selfishness. After all,

I get the chance of meeting someone better

[d0nnivain]

Downtown and other people in this forum, there are somethings that you should know about me. First is I am a man who wants to keep his promise all the times. Several promises that I made with my ex, some of them are fulfilled, some are broken due to not realized it or accident mistake. There is one promise that I haven't fulfilled to her. She once told me she loved this animation Bolt movie. So I told her I would give it to her, however, by the time breaking up happened, I realized I haven't given her this movie. So despite having broken up, I tried my best to meet her but you guys have known she wants to avoid me until now. Like I said, I really don't like If i still have debt unfulfilled or promises left behind. That is one of the reason why I really want to meet her last time so I can give her the movie she wanted. But, yeah despite reading my letter of apologize. What i got was BLOCKED.

 

It's lovely that you want to remain an honorable man with integrity who fulfills his promises, but once two people break up, you are released from any promises you made.

 

When you tried to meet & when you sent her the letter she didn't want you were behaving in an intrusive manner. You became a pest so she blocked you to protect herself.

 

Second of all, when I am in relationship, what I can only think is I will do my best to make my lover happy always. I cover up some of my common personality to make better life. Example: I don't like to sing but I sing a song for her despite bad voice. I make funny animal voices, etc. I make lots of things that even I myself was not believed it until I did it. Like, I managed to lift her like the after-wedding and so on. Despite the cover up, I was happy even though I am not really myself. I smiled lots of times. Once, I also told myself and to her, I don't care what happen to me as long as you are safe. I don't want to see or make you sad or cry ever again. Though, I also said if that happens you can break me up. Now that you mention it, when the break up happens she used one of this as an excuse despite she cried or when we argue not because of me whole reason (The reason of breaking up was already in previous posts). She said,"You told me to break you up if you make me cry, and I did. So why am I always at fault?" As usual, Is it me the one who make such a stupid promise? Or Is it her that is abusing this promise? This way I learn my lesson not to say something like that anymore. I thought when a man trying to make his woman happy by covering up some of his personality, he can achieve his eternal happiness. I was wrong or maybe it was not there in the first place.

 

Stop doing this. You can never be happy in a relationship if you try to change for the other person.

 

Yes compromise is important in a relationship. It was why went fishing with one EX & why my husband comes to the beach with me. We do things once in a while that we don't necessarily enjoy because it makes the other person happy.

 

You took it to an absurd extreme & your manipulative, selfish EX tried to hold you to it.

 

Third, when I was in relationship with her during first year, she was so innocent. Until second year to third year, she became grown up and not so innocent anymore. I taught her lots about knowledge I knew. Technology, development life and so on. However, it makes me think that she just used me for advantage. Why? Because after she got a job in April which involves as a Sales Promotor VIVO which also must have lots of knowledge about Android and stuff, she becomes like a person who knows better than me. I was like thinking, " Hey, I was the one who taught you that. Why would you boast around that to me? I even taught you something that no common people know that." Example: Network Hertz and ADB, Bootloader and so on, also custom Rom. I was thinking that I regret ever teaching her that, otherwise, she wouldn't have succeeded in test for the job. Of course, It is bad to wish her like that but still I am regret. Not only that, during almost

to second year, she wanted me to pick her up from work every day to college. When I was busy at that time, she would show her not happy face to me. Just one day from Monday to Saturday, if I didn't pick her up, she would get angry to me. Making me thinking that she accepted me and dated me just because I can be used as an Object.

 

This girl had you tied around her finger & you didn't even see it. She didn't love you. She was using you. Now she has honed her craft & wants to move on to men who can give her more because she's a taker.

 

Getting her out of your life is a blessing in the long run.

 

 

 

Finally, even while playing game LINE get rich. She was quite stubborn and blamed me if we lose in team. Occasionally, I played with her often team battle. When we lose, she blamed me for picking the bad choice in my turn or using wrong pendant or card. When we win, she just happy and hooray to me. I thought, "Has it never occurred to you that you also cause the lost? Why would you blame me? Furthermore, this is just a game. OMG" Sometimes, she asked me to set her character and pendant up and tell her if there's something wrong. After it's done, we played. We lost and she blamed me. Also, she has like 4000+ diamonds, when I set cube which uses clover (Only 2 left from 5), she blamed me again. I was like," You can always buy clover for XX diamonds and besides, it's cheap." So, yeah to conclude all of this, my ex is not a really good cooperative gamer and she acted the above of everything even I was the one who introduced the game to her first and I knew more than her since I played first before her.

 

Do you not see this as another example of what an entitled, spoiled princess she is?

 

Why would you want to be with someone so selfish?

 

 

So downtown and others, I don't know why, Love is so so complicated. Despite that, why did I FALL IN LOVE with her? TBH, she was not beautiful but I loved her at the first sight and her heart was pure and beautiful. But now, she is beautiful but quite rotten in her heart. No longer pure. I guess what people say is true, Inner beauty reflects everything. If you are kind and beautiful in heart, your outer sight will also beautiful and vice versa. Tell me, How could I fall in love with her? I didn't know that this love caused me so much pain that I always want to forget her but i couldn't due to the memory of 3 years and making out.[/b]

 

Since you now claim to realize she is rotten in her heart it should be easier for you to let go.

[wiselyzzz]

It's lovely that you want to remain an honorable man with integrity who fulfills his promises, but once two people break up, you are released from any promises you made.

 

When you tried to meet & when you sent her the letter she didn't want you were behaving in an intrusive manner. You became a pest so she blocked you to protect herself.

 

===> Do you think so? If you think promises are gone once break up happens that I will relinquish those promises. I might hate doing so but yeah I have no choice. Promise is useless without her. A pest, huh? Well I could be but nevertheless, I am done with her. Done trying to meet her so many times.

Stop doing this. You can never be happy in a relationship if you try to change for the other person.

 

Yes compromise is important in a relationship. It was why went fishing with one EX & why my husband comes to the beach with me. We do things once in a while that we don't necessarily enjoy because it makes the other person happy.

 

You took it to an absurd extreme & your manipulative, selfish EX tried to hold you to it.

 

===> Ikr. I want to be myself for my future lover so I know she will accept me no matter what. Changing yourself for someone is quite a lie. Truth even hurts when you are actually not that kind of person.

 

This girl had you tied around her finger & you didn't even see it. She didn't love you. She was using you. Now she has honed her craft & wants to move on to men who can give her more because she's a taker.

 

Getting her out of your life is a blessing in the long run.

 

===> I saw through it. But I was okay with it and fulfill what she wanted. But it was went way too over that I felt this is a problem like I am a servant to her. For a man who wants to take her, good luck with her personality and patient with her. If he can endure it, wish him and her a happy life.

 

Do you not see this as another example of what an entitled, spoiled princess she is?

 

Why would you want to be with someone so selfish?

 

===> I also see her way like that, spoiled princess. And to answer your question... I myself can't answer that. I don't even know why I could love her. I don't even know why my love could not be gone despite her personality. I guess love is stupid, daring.

 

Since you now claim to realize she is rotten in her heart it should be easier for you to let go.

 

===> It should be, however, it takes time. Takes time to make her gone in my mind. How about you yourself? What do you do to make your ex gone in your mind? What I know is since you have someone you love which is your husband, It is easy though.

[d0nnivain]

Time made my EXs go away.

 

I also kept myself busy & initially made lists. 1 list was all their bad qualities. 1 list was all the reasons were are better off apart (in the end that came down to 1 reason; we weren't right for each other) and 1 list of all the things I was going to do with all my free time. That last list helped me stay busy

[wiselyzzz]

Time made my EXs go away.

 

I also kept myself busy & initially made lists. 1 list was all their bad qualities. 1 list was all the reasons were are better off apart (in the end that came down to 1 reason; we weren't right for each other) and 1 list of all the things I was going to do with all my free time. That last list helped me stay busy

 

===> I see. Time really does cure all. Only how long did you manage to forget your ex? Also, eh lists, huh? I might as well do the same. That ought to works. If i may know, was your case the same as mine?

[wiselyzzz]

d0nnavain, do you think Karma exist? Cause I have been thinking what if this is my karma of what I did to her in the first break up. What if this is also happening to me? Does it really have to be thought of?