Newbie: husband cannot choose between me and OW

[Desol]

Out of my whole post...THAT is what you latched on to?

 

Please go back and re-read my post. Also I am still correct because cousin love is different from "in love" which he is not in love he is in lust. Love does not happen in that phase.

 

And GROSS on the cousin thing. I don't understand how that can be seen as ok in any culture.

 

No, aileD. That was a question I could answer. I

[elaine567]

So he is leaving soon on a trip home again and your "fate" will depend on whether his cousin wants to have a relationship with him or not?????

 

Is that right?

 

That doesn't exactly sound like a remorseful WS.

[Desol]

Desol - I'm a little confused, is he trying to choose between you or has he already chosen? You said he hasn't asked you to stay or anything like that...

 

If you say it like that, somanymistakes, even I can see he already chose. Not me. I stopped having any relationship with him. I am working longer hours, even weekends, not doing anything at home, not eating, not talking, anything. I immediately moved to another room. He stopped having me, but he keep chatting with Cousin. At the beginning I read some chats they had, and they did not talk about love at all. It is consistent with him saying that they do not have a Relationship.

 

At some point, he told me that he loved me and he asked me if I still could see a future for us. He told me that he does love me but he cannot stop thinking about Cousin.

[Desol]

So he is leaving soon on a trip home again and your "fate" will depend on whether his cousin wants to have a relationship with him or not?????

 

Is that right?

 

That doesn't exactly sound like a remorseful WS.

 

I do not know that, Elaine. That's why I am here, to see the situation with clear eyes. I understood it as he doesn't know which one he loves, and he has me here all the time, so he needs to go to her and try her. Perhaps that's my culture and my elders talking, but I thought that I am the only second woman he has met, so I could grant him "permission" to get more experience and decide what he wants. Actually, my parents have ever said that to me, that he is just experimenting, and he will be back. That I should stay at home, because you "hunt more flies with honey" (I do not know the equivalent in English). But I started wondering "do I want a fly?".

 

Later I realized what you said.

[BTDT2012]

I do not know that, Elaine. That's why I am here, to see the situation with clear eyes. I understood it as he doesn't know which one he loves, and he has me here all the time, so he needs to go to her and try her. Perhaps that's my culture and my elders talking, but I thought that I am the only second woman he has met, so I could grant him "permission" to get more experience and decide what he wants. Actually, my parents have ever said that to me, that he is just experimenting, and he will be back. That I should stay at home, because you "hunt more flies with honey" (I do not know the equivalent in English). But I started wondering "do I want a fly?".

 

Later I realized what you said.

 

"You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar" is the saying.

 

He took vows with you, either he will honor them or he won't. If he is unwilling to go 100% no contact with his AP, you have nothing to work with.

However, truth was that his OW is in our country, she is the cousin with whom he stayed the last time, and he planned the trip to be with her and "understand". He is leaving in 3 weeks and he promised me to have an answer when he is back.

How about you tell him don't bother coming back, just stay there. Don't allow him to have his cake and eat it too. Don't do the pick me dance.

[Mr. Lucky]

It is consistent with him saying that they do not have a Relationship.

 

Desol, are you interpreting this as him saying he hasn't slept with her?

 

Last January he traveled to our home country 2 weeks for holidays.

 

Experience has shown that's a long time to be just holding hands ...

 

Mr. Lucky

[Desol]

Desol, are you interpreting this as him saying he hasn't slept with her?

 

Experience has shown that's a long time to be just holding hands ...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Oh, no, Mr. Lucky. Even before he told me they had sex, I assumed they had. It is just that it seems, from his words, the he was just a guy OW slept with, instead of OW's boyfriend. Doesn't make any difference for me, but I can sense his frustration and disappointment over the fact that he is not in a "stable" romantic relationship with OW, and that OW has not said she is willing to burn everything to be with him. Perhaps I taught him wrong, hahahahaha, and now he thinks every woman should do what I did.

[whichwayisup]

I understood it as he doesn't know which one he loves, and he has me here all the time, so he needs to go to her and try her.

 

Marriages don't work like that! You don't go have an affair and then tell your spouse "I'm going to go live with the OW and try life with her, if it's good, sorry I'm filing for divorce and if it's not good or what I thought it would be, I'll dump her and come back home and stay married to you..." WTF.

 

TELL him to pack his bags and GO to the OW. File for divorce, get a lawyer too. Even if you don't actually follow through with a divorce down the road right now he needs to know that YOU aren't willing to put up with this shi.tty behavior of his.

 

He is not the husband you married, he's a selfish man right now and wanting what he wants without caring that it's hurting you and ruining your marriage/life.

[Try]

Even before he told me they had sex, I assumed they had. It is just that it seems, from his words, the he was just a guy OW slept with, instead of OW's boyfriend. Doesn't make any difference for me, but I can sense his frustration and disappointment over the fact that he is not in a "stable" romantic relationship with OW

When your cheating spouse said that "he was just a guy OW slept with, instead of OW's boyfriend", and that he was "frustration and disappointment over the fact that he is not in a "stable" romantic relationship with OW", he is telling you to your face, in no uncertain terms, that you are officially his backup plan in case the other woman (OW) just wants him as a FWB instead of as her boyfriend. Thus you would not be waiting for him to decide. You would be waiting for her to decide.

 

The fact that he has the nerve to talk to her constantly when he is staying with you, but ignored you the last few days of his trip when he was staying with her, tells you who really matters to him, and it is not you. He is not just physically breaking his marriage vows, but he also breaking the most basic marriage commitment to put you as his spouse before all others. Sorry but even if he is unable to win her over, and he ends up temporarily coming back to you, you will be married in name only, as the marriage will be based on a lack of any real commitment by him to you. Now that he has told you that you are not his priority, you need to find someone else that does consider you as his priority to be your husband. When you do find such a husband, you will wonder why you even thought to stay in this marriage.

Edited April 22, 2017 by Try

[BaileyB]

I understood it as he doesn't know which one he loves, and he has me here all the time, so he needs to go to her and try her. Perhaps that's my culture and my elders talking, but I thought that I am the only second woman he has met, so I could grant him "permission" to get more experience and decide what he wants. Actually, my parents have ever said that to me, that he is just experimenting, and he will be back.

 

I can't imagine my parents ever saying that to me. Why would they encourage you to wait around for your cheating husband to return home after he's had his fun and hurt you so deeply?

 

Marriages definitely don't work like this! He committed his life, to you. That means, he doesn't have the right to go out and "try on" other woman, just for fun.

 

His indecision, is a decision. But still, why are you waiting around and allowing him to chose? You have every right to make your own decision.

 

It is not wrong to say that you want a man who loves you, devotes himself to you alone, and comes home every night because he wants to be with you. You shouldn't accept anything less from your life partner.

Edited April 22, 2017 by BaileyB

[Desol]

When your cheating spouse said that "he was just a guy OW slept with, instead of OW's boyfriend", and that he was "frustration and disappointment over the fact that he is not in a "stable" romantic relationship with OW", he is telling you to your face, in no uncertain terms, that you are officially his backup plan in case the other woman (OW) just wants him as a FWB instead of as her boyfriend. Thus you would not be waiting for him to decide. You would be waiting for her to decide.

 

The fact that he has the nerve to talk to her constantly when he is staying with you, but ignored you the last few days of his trip when he was staying with her, tells you who really matters to him, and it is not you. He is not just physically breaking his marriage vows, but he also breaking the most basic marriage commitment to put you as his spouse before all others. Sorry but even if he is unable to win her over, and he ends up temporarily coming back to you, you will be married in name only, as the marriage will be based on a lack of any real commitment by him to you. Now that he has told you that you are not his priority, you need to find someone else that does consider you as his priority to be your husband. When you do find such a husband, you will wonder why you even thought to stay in this marriage.

 

I think I should defend myself, for you think I am stupider than I really am if you think he is actually saying/doing exactly that and I am playing his loving wife. Yes, I told him two weeks ago I was willing to fight for our marriage if he wanted to be with me at the end. But the turn for the worse happened last week, when I remembered the thing about the pictures and I had the conversation with him when he said he did planned this (where he didn't actually said that). And since then, I have not been at home. My brother came to be with me, and we have been staying in a hotel. I haven't seen my husband in 9 days now. He only knows I will be back, he doesn't know when. And he still believes I will wait for him, while in fact I already secured an apartment to move out, contacted an lawyer to get a divorce, and started moving money to my private account.

 

He did not say he was just a guy who slept with OW. What he said, angrily, is that he did not have a relationship with OW. I laughed and said that he did. She even asked him not to say who she was to me (he didn't have to: I guessed it myself). He repeated he did not have a relationship with her and he did not know if she wanted to be with him. I think he is angry and disappointed because the way he said that to me. But if I believe that, I could very well believe when he said he loved me. It's the same guy, saying two different things. Why should I believe any of them?

 

And I do not know for sure he is actually chatting with her. I told him to stop using his phone when he is with me, and he complied. I do not have evidence he stopped talking to her. Therefore, he must be talking to her.

Edited April 22, 2017 by Desol

[stillafool]

 

She even asked him not to say who she was to me (he didn't have to: I guessed it myself).

 

What a coward!

[Desol]

What a coward!

 

That was so cruel. The only thing I could think after he told me that was that I knew her, and she was a friend of mine. I spent nights thinking about every woman I knew in my country, wondering if they were OW. And the ****ing thing is that I don't even know Cousin! I have never seen her before! So probably she was afraid I was going to expose her to their family, the piece of ****. That shows how dishonorable she is. I could never do that. However, she is insignificant and I don't know more things about her. Were not be her, it would be another.

[wmacbride]

I think I should defend myself, for you think I am stupider than I really am if you think he is actually saying/doing exactly that and I am playing his loving wife. Yes, I told him two weeks ago I was willing to fight for our marriage if he wanted to be with me at the end. But the turn for the worse happened last week, when I remembered the thing about the pictures and I had the conversation with him when he said he did planned this (where he didn't actually said that). And since then, I have not been at home. My brother came to be with me, and we have been staying in a hotel. I haven't seen my husband in 9 days now. He only knows I will be back, he doesn't know when. And he still believes I will wait for him, while in fact I already secured an apartment to move out, contacted an lawyer to get a divorce, and started moving money to my private account.

 

He did not say he was just a guy who slept with OW. What he said, angrily, is that he did not have a relationship with OW. I laughed and said that he did. She even asked him not to say who she was to me (he didn't have to: I guessed it myself). He repeated he did not have a relationship with her and he did not know if she wanted to be with him. I think he is angry and disappointed because the way he said that to me. But if I believe that, I could very well believe when he said he loved me. It's the same guy, saying two different things. Why should I believe any of them?

 

And I do not know for sure he is actually chatting with her. I told him to stop using his phone when he is with me, and he complied. I do not have evidence he stopped talking to her. Therefore, he must be talking to her.

 

You are not a stupid person. You are someone who opened herself up to loving someone, and he is being a jerk and throwing it back into your face.

 

You sound like someone who is very loving and loyal. Don't waste that on him.

[Mrs. John Adams]

If a wayward spouse is having trouble deciding who to choose....help them decide...and show them to the door.

 

If a wayward...does not humble themselves before you and ask you to allow them to stay....you have already lost them.

 

help them decide...seek a lawyer

[I4givehim]

I am sorry this is happening to you. I feel your pain. I have since divorced my cheating WH and I am LOVING LIFE. At the time of finding out of his A I was devastated.I could never trust him again. As time went on I realised it was the best thing he did to me. It was the only way I would have gotten out of that miserable marriage. I thank God every day. Stay strong. Go no contact with him. Good things, good life and better times are coming your way.

[Desol]

I have an update now. Yesterday I returned home after 9 days out with my brother. I decided to tell WH I'm leaving, since I still have to organize our bank accounts and remove my name from utilities and the lease, and I cannot do that by myself.

 

We have been barely talking since DDay. He does not have anything to say, I do not ask. Yesterday I told him I am leaving and what I need. I did not want to talk about feelings: I don't think he can hear me. He asked then if I was really leaving (meaning not temporarily) when I told him about the furniture I was going to take with me.

 

I told him that I could not stand "this". He asked what was "this". I said "being your plan B". He said I was never his plan B, that he did not ask for anything because he loves me, but he doesn't know how he got into this, so it could happen again. Then he asked if he could send me a link to the TED talk Rethinking Infidelity by Esther Perel.

 

I watched the talk in youtube, and then told him that I was leaving because it was very cruel to get things like that, giving me hope of a future when we could be together, while at the same time he IS leaving to OW in 3 weeks. I told him I did not know if I was going to be able to forgive him after that and he said "I know". Then I started crying and I went back to my room. He knocked my door, sat on the floor next to me and I cried for more than one hour straight (my poor eyes!). He just held me close and said sorry many times.

 

He just left to give medication to my cat, and I went to bed. About half an hour later he knocked my door again and asked me if there was something he could do to make this easier. I said I did not think so, because I could not see him doing the only thing that could help me: not to go to her. He said "no, I don't think I can do that either", and he left.

 

I don't know what I am feeling today. I was told, in a very plain way, that I do not matter, while being told that I am loved. Now I desperately want to wish to end things now forever. But yesterday, in his arms, I only wanted to be there forever, principles and self respect to be dammed! Please, please, tell me that things get better with NC.

[Mr Blunt]

Your husband’s crying just shows that he is a weak man that cries because he got himself into a trap. He is not thinking of you to any degree or he would leave the OW. Actions always tell the truth more than emotions and words.

 

You will get a lot better in time with lots of pain and determination. Yes the NO CONTACT with him is a good start as your great need for his affection and his ability to weaken you is evident. You have to get to the point that you are thinking with your head and not your damaged emotions and need for affection. That advice sounds terrible but it is reality and what you need to do to get better.

 

Get all the help that you can, family, friends, faith, etc. You are way too valuable to be plan B. Either you are number one without any number twos or you can start building a new life without him. Millions have done it and so can you.

[EZNona]

I have an update now. Yesterday I returned home after 9 days out with my brother. I decided to tell WH I'm leaving, since I still have to organize our bank accounts and remove my name from utilities and the lease, and I cannot do that by myself.

 

We have been barely talking since DDay. He does not have anything to say, I do not ask. Yesterday I told him I am leaving and what I need. I did not want to talk about feelings: I don't think he can hear me. He asked then if I was really leaving (meaning not temporarily) when I told him about the furniture I was going to take with me.

 

I told him that I could not stand "this". He asked what was "this". I said "being your plan B". He said I was never his plan B, that he did not ask for anything because he loves me, but he doesn't know how he got into this, so it could happen again. Then he asked if he could send me a link to the TED talk Rethinking Infidelity by Esther Perel.

 

I watched the talk in youtube, and then told him that I was leaving because it was very cruel to get things like that, giving me hope of a future when we could be together, while at the same time he IS leaving to OW in 3 weeks. I told him I did not know if I was going to be able to forgive him after that and he said "I know". Then I started crying and I went back to my room. He knocked my door, sat on the floor next to me and I cried for more than one hour straight (my poor eyes!). He just held me close and said sorry many times.

 

He just left to give medication to my cat, and I went to bed. About half an hour later he knocked my door again and asked me if there was something he could do to make this easier. I said I did not think so, because I could not see him doing the only thing that could help me: not to go to her. He said "no, I don't think I can do that either", and he left.

 

I don't know what I am feeling today. I was told, in a very plain way, that I do not matter, while being told that I am loved. Now I desperately want to wish to end things now forever. But yesterday, in his arms, I only wanted to be there forever, principles and self respect to be dammed! Please, please, tell me that things get better with NC.

 

Wow...he has a lot of nerve.

 

First of all, I think you are a strong woman and you are handling this with a needed sternness and grace. You did the right thing and the fact that this so-called husband of yours said he would still leave to go see this OW after what was said and holding you while you cried for an hour shows how truly selfish he is in all this. No one deserves this and you most certainly do not deserve. You are right to leave him and never look back.

 

I can tell that you are a good, loving woman and there is no doubt you can find someone who will not treat you so carelessly and thoughtlessly. His behavior right now is deplorable and he is showing no remorse, so you have no choice but to move forward in a life without him anymore. I am so so sorry you are going through this. What torture he is putting you through while you anticipate his departure again in 3 weeks to see this OW. It is unbelievably cruel and what kind of black heart does he have to willingly put you through this?

[Desol]

Thank you, EZNona. It is so incredibly difficult to really see his actions, to evaluate them as a sensible person would do. Everything is so twisted now that I cannot see how cruel he is. I keep thinking that the love of my life (until now) is still here, and I am still trying to pretzel the reality for him. I know what I should do, I know there is nothing else to do but leave, but it is so hard, because the man I love was not like this! And I am not blind, he was not like this! Truth to be told, he had this other man inside. It is his father, his uncle, his brother, his grandfather. All of them are serial cheaters. Silly of me, thinking that mindset wasn't going to get me one day.

[BetrayedH]

It's pretty natural to have a breakdown. But you stuck to your guns. Well done.

 

Now it's time to 180 and detach. No more conversations unless they are necessary and have to do with logistics. You are building your second life and leaving him in the dust.

[Desol]

Another update. And the first thing I need to say is that I did not follow BetrayedH advice (which I did not see in time).

 

Yesterday we had a conversation. I discovered what was my failure in the relationship, and what was his. How we lied to ourselves thinking we were happy. We were, sure, but both of us settled and accepted stuff that now it's exploding. Good for that, even if it doesn't have anything to do with his affair.

 

Things became crazy when he told me that somehow he thought I would be ok with him having a relationship with Cousin everytime he traveled to our country. And how they planned what happened. I discovered how I do not matter anymore. I am fully invisible. He explains it as that I have been with him in everything he has wanted to do, so he convinced himself I would be with him now. That I am so close to his heart that his brain does not realize I am not. He says he loves me (we speak Spanish, so he uses "amo", romantic love, instead of "quiero", general love), but the more minutes pass, the more I feel I was just a friend with benefits.

 

He said he has been obsessed thinking I am leaving (I started packing last weekend) and very hurt anytime I've moved anything in the house (I am discarding anything that I don't like or hurts me). But at the same time, he is not ready to let go Cousin, and he admits perhaps he never will be able to cut contact forever with her.

 

Since this is too soon, I doubt myself every second of the day. However, I can feel already the seed of destruction inside of me, for I do not want to live with the shadow of that ****ing whore in my life forever. And there will be no way to remove her that since they are relatives. I read in other threads about reconciliation, which still is an option in my brain. Although I know how silly it is, since you can't read minds, I wonded if WS try to get back their BS, even if they say no. I guess I am trying to think about an universe where I tell my WS we are done forever, but I keep hoping, and it's still possible to get back together. I guess I've watched too many telenovelas

[aileD]

But at the same time, he is not ready to let go Cousin, and he admits perhaps he never will be able

 

There's your answer. There will never be reconciliation because of that.

 

It's time to move on, hon. I'm sorry

[Mr. Lucky]

I guess I am trying to think about an universe where I tell my WS we are done forever, but I keep hoping, and it's still possible to get back together. I guess I've watched too many telenovelas

 

When someone chooses - and it's not you - why would you want him back?

 

It might be hard for you to believe Desol, but you've been luckier than many in that you've at least been told the truth. Time to make plans based on that knowledge...

 

Mr. Lucky