A question for the BS's, if your WS had offered an open marriage instead of cheating

[TrustedthenBusted]

I would have started singing this song

and then probably filed for divorce because at the time, we didn't have children.

[oldshirt]

Well first I would ask, "Why would OldShirt pose such a question?".

 

Would love a PM if you don't want to tell everyone.

 

No need for PMs or anything, I can talk about it openly.

 

I was actually more interested in probing the perspectives of APs and wondered if the APs had been approached about entering into an open marriage/swing/poly arrangement with a couple if they would have considered that. I posed that question to the APs a week or two and got some interesting responses.

 

That got me curious about the BS's and wondered what their responses would have been if they had been given the option of OM/swing/poly vs getting cheated on.

 

I will probably pose the same question in one way or another to the WS's too at some point in the near future.

[oldshirt]

Thank you to everyone for sharing your thoughts and insights.

 

I do want to touch on some things that have been brought up.

 

First of all this was probably kind of an unfair question in the first place. Infidelity and OM/swing/poly are completely unrelated and neither has any bearing on the other. I've said many times on these boards that swinging does not prevent cheating any more than monogamy causes it.

 

There for it is probably an unfair question to begin with but I guess I wanted to gauge people's feelings if they were presented with a variety of options for which they may not find any of them palatable.

[BluesPower]

That is interesting and it is an interesting question.

 

I am guessing that by some of the responses that sex is just something that some people can do with out.

 

While I do not understand that in any way, I guess different strokes for different folks.

 

For me, at this stage of life, or any stage really, I just cannot live that way.

 

I am not naturally a one woman man, I have come to realize that. However, if wifey keeps me happy, I think I can do it.

 

I am just confused how so many people can tolerate no or bad sex and still function.

[oldshirt]

That is interesting and it is an interesting question.

 

I am guessing that by some of the responses that sex is just something that some people can do with out.

 

While I do not understand that in any way, I guess different strokes for different folks.

 

For me, at this stage of life, or any stage really, I just cannot live that way.

 

I am not naturally a one woman man, I have come to realize that. However, if wifey keeps me happy, I think I can do it.

 

I am just confused how so many people can tolerate no or bad sex and still function.

 

I'm with ya Blues'. I don't get it either.

 

celibacy is not in my nomenclature. If my wife came to me and said she no longer wanted to have a marital sexlife, I would be civil and accommodating and thank her for her candidness and then I would sit down with her and start discussing the terms of our divorce and coparenting plan.

 

If she said she wanted to remain married and live as a family and that I could take a mistress(s), I would consider it, but that would depend on the quality of woman I could get as a 52 year old bald guy that is married and has a wife and kids in the house. If I could continue to get the quality for which I am accustomed (my wife is beautiful), they'd I'd probably be ok with it. But if I couldn't get a decent woman/women under those conditions, then we would be back to the divorce and coparenting drawing board.

 

 

 

If she came to me and said she wanted some variety and wanted to start swinging regularly again, I'd get back on some swinger sites and look up what clubs were in our area now.

 

If she said she wanted to take a lover(s) but didn't want me to see anyone else - I would laugh and shake my head in amusement and then start planning the rest of my life without her.

 

 

If I found out she was cheating behind my back, it would be a trip to the lawyers office the next day and then pulling up apartment-finder websites.

 

Living a cuckold, living a life of abstinence, spending countless dollars and burning valuable time on MC and doing any kind of "Pick Me! Dance" is just not in the cards for me.

 

I could not live a life without passion and intimacy.

 

I don't know if that is a strength, or if it is a terrible weakness.

 

I guess a part of my reasons for posing these threads is to get other people's perspectives from their point of view.

[MidnightBlue1980]

 

I am just confused how so many people can tolerate no or bad sex and still function.

 

I agree. For a long time I did not understand how xmm could say he was happy enough and want to be with someone he was not attracted to (and her to him). I felt he MUST be lying to himself, in denial, yada yada, yada, because how on earth could he go years without sex (and I know this to be a fact since our spouses spoke).

 

But I have come to realize that we are not all the same, we do not all want the same things in life. I believe now that he is happy enough. And I guess so is she.

 

I've even asked my girlfriends about this and a good number of them only have sex to make their husbands happy, about once a month, and they said if they could stop, they would easily do so. They prefer cuddling on the couch. I told them how sugar kills the libido, and they said they prefer pasta and cake over sex.

 

Because of this site, it seems like everyone is highly sexed and sleeping around but the reality is that a good percentage of people are just not sexual after a certain point in life, whether that is 40, 60, whatever.

[oldshirt]

Living a cuckold, living a life of abstinence, spending countless dollars and burning valuable time on MC and doing any kind of "Pick Me! Dance" is just not in the cards for me.

 

.

 

I do want to clarify something about MC.

 

I don't want to come off as knocking MC or thinking that it can not be helpful in some cases.

 

My wife and I did have some MC a few years back and it was beneficial for us.

 

In our case we had some trouble understanding where the other was at and we were having trouble understanding each other. We were both clear that we both wanted to remain together and wanted things to get worked out and get back to a happy, healthy place again.

 

MC helped us at that time and under those circumstances.

 

However if she were to come to me today and essentially say that she was "done" or if she were involved with someone else, or if she simply just wanted to live a new life without me in it, I would of course ask if there was something I could do to make things better, but if she said no and that she was done, I would take her at her word and see it as her prerogative and I would not expend the time, energy and money on MC again.

 

IMHO MC is great for people who both love each other and both ultimately want to be together, but are having problems working together and need a 3rd party to help each express their needs and find a way to work together towards a common goal.

 

MC does not correct bad character. It does not restore lost love. It does not eliminate the feelings for an AP. It does not erase or even ease the hurt caused by abuse or severe neglect or abandonment.

[NuevoYorko]

First of all this was probably kind of an unfair question in the first place. Infidelity and OM/swing/poly are completely unrelated and neither has any bearing on the other.

Further, couples who engage in open sexual arrangements probably have a bigger than average level of trust and confidence in their relationship in order to go there. Being pushed into it as the only alternative to being cheated on wouldn't work out well for one partner at all.

[oldshirt]

Further, couples who engage in open sexual arrangements probably have a bigger than average level of trust and confidence in their relationship in order to go there. Being pushed into it as the only alternative to being cheated on wouldn't work out well for one partner at all.

 

You are absolutely correct and I agree 100% with you. That is why it is kind of an unfair question.

 

Even as a former swinger, if my wife were to approach me today with it as an ultimatum to swing "or else," I too would likely opt out.

[wmacbride]

I would say no because I am a monogamous person by nature,and have no interest in sharing someone.

 

I've never been into open relationships, but if that's what someone else wants to do in their relationship, so long as it's done openly and honestly, that's up to the two ( or more) people in a relationship.

 

All I can say is that if my husband came home tomorrow and said to me ' there is a woman I am interested in having sex with outside of our marriage...how do you feel about it?", I would say no. i would also wonder if he had already been cheating.

[wmacbride]

That is interesting and it is an interesting question.

 

I am guessing that by some of the responses that sex is just something that some people can do with out.

 

While I do not understand that in any way, I guess different strokes for different folks.

 

For me, at this stage of life, or any stage really, I just cannot live that way.

 

I am not naturally a one woman man, I have come to realize that. However, if wifey keeps me happy, I think I can do it.

 

I am just confused how so many people can tolerate no or bad sex and still function.

 

I'd like to know why you assume affairs only happen in marriages with bad sex.

You say yourself you are not monogamous by nature,and even though you have said time and again that you love your wife,and she is doing so much better now, it sounds like you are finding other women , though maybe not on purpose, to have sex with outside your marriage.

 

If someone isn't monogamous, fair enough.Not everyone is, and many are not. I just wish that people would stop blaming someone else for their choices.

[JustJoe]

You are absolutely correct and I agree 100% with you. That is why it is kind of an unfair question.

 

Even as a former swinger, if my wife were to approach me today with it as an ultimatum to swing "or else," I too would likely opt out.

The problem I have with your question is this. A couple is married, and out of the blue, one or the other spouses asks to change the marriage to an open/poly/swinging relationship. Isn't this evidence of deception? If a partner asks to do this, it would mean that they have not been completely honest and have at least been thinking about sex with other people , while maintaining a facade of marriage. I think most people would be suspicious of the motives of the person asking, and also would probably have ideas that the person asking has already acted upon it.

Frankly, I cannot see any way this scenerio could be presented that would not be disrespectful, deceitful, demeaning or disloyal.

[JustJoe]

I know of no game, where it is acceptable to change the rules , in the middle of the game. Where I come from, people play a lot of poker. If somebody were to try this during a game, they would at the very least be asked to leave and probably not be asked back.

Edited November 21, 2016 by JustJoe

[elaine567]

Frankly, I cannot see any way this scenerio could be presented that would not be disrespectful, deceitful, demeaning or disloyal.

 

I kind of agree.

Seems to me that when two people BOTH decide to open up their marriage, they do so when the marriage is solid and they both feel the need to explore their sexuality in other ways. Fine. Both are happy being polygamous and usually most know pretty early on, that that is how they want their marriage to work.

 

The problem with the potential WS suggesting an open marriage is that the potential BS usually staunchly believes in monogamy. They did not enter marriage to share their spouse with others.

The request for an open marriage is thus usually one sided.

The thought that the WS is someone who doesn't believe in monogamy, and may never have believed in monogamy is shocking to most and will rock the very foundations of the marriage in the same way cheating would have done.

Add to that the usual "If you do not agree to the open marriage I will leave all together", it does not tend to lead to a very healthy dynamic.

It is a "forced" open marriage, with one person all excited and determined to do it regardless, leaving the other person heartbroken.

[minimariah]

Seems to me that when two people BOTH decide to open up their marriage...

 

even then though... one of them needs to speak up FIRST; one of them needs to suggest it first, one of them needs to OKAY it out loud FIRST... in a couple, there is always someone who wants it a little bit more than their partner.

 

Both are happy being polygamous and usually most know pretty early on, that that is how they want their marriage to work.

 

not really; most couples explore their sexuality together & they start reaching out of their comfort zone YEARS into their relationship. usually when the kids are out of the house, when they're financially stable... it's weird if a spouse approaches you & suggests an open marriage out of the blue, when it was NEVER discussed. but if it was discussed, if it was an idea or fantasy you toyed with...? it's not weird at all.

 

OP - it would be a no from me... simple reason: i'm just not into it. no, i wouldn't divorce my partner on the sight - i'd try to communicate the matter further and... we would see what happens from there.

[Lion Heart]

Maybe a better way for me to have worded this is if your WS had come to you prior to stepping out and said that they could no longer uphold an exclusive, monogamous marriage and presented you the options of open marriage/swing/poly, "don't ask, don't tell" or divorce right then and there, which would you have chosen.

 

Divorce.

 

Lion Heart

[Lion Heart]

The problem I have with your question is this. A couple is married, and out of the blue, one or the other spouses asks to change the marriage to an open/poly/swinging relationship. Isn't this evidence of deception? If a partner asks to do this, it would mean that they have not been completely honest and have at least been thinking about sex with other people , while maintaining a facade of marriage. I think most people would be suspicious of the motives of the person asking, and also would probably have ideas that the person asking has already acted upon it.

Frankly, I cannot see any way this scenerio could be presented that would not be disrespectful, deceitful, demeaning or disloyal.

 

Agreed.

AND just to cover all bases, my current bf and I have discussed these relationship dynamics at length (I was at a "surprise" swingers party recently and omg...went home lol). I am NOT interested in sharing myself.

 

I wanted to know my bfs perspectives. His response was a straight out No Way. He doesn't share.

 

It's really healthy to discuss these things before M.

 

Lion Heart

[beatcuff]

my W and i were watching a movie in which the spouses gave each other a 'hall pass' (i do not remember the name but it was not: hall pass). i said it would not work. because if it was great i would want to do it again (slippery slope) or if it was ok/bad i would wonder if it was me, her, timing, nerves... and want to do it again --- to make sure.

 

OP to your question... i can't see how it would work 'fairly' as in my mind a W would just have to walk into any bar and say 'anyone?' i, no doubt, would spend my entire evening attempting to convince my 'target' that my W was fine with it before giving up in frustration.

[dichotomy]

The problem I have with your question is this. A couple is married, and out of the blue, one or the other spouses asks to change the marriage to an open/poly/swinging relationship. Isn't this evidence of deception? If a partner asks to do this, it would mean that they have not been completely honest and have at least been thinking about sex with other people , while maintaining a facade of marriage. I think most people would be suspicious of the motives of the person asking, and also would probably have ideas that the person asking has already acted upon it.

Frankly, I cannot see any way this scenerio could be presented that would not be disrespectful, deceitful, demeaning or disloyal.

 

 

I have a theory about my wife - feels right in my gut - is that my wife loves me and wanted to marry me and have a family - but found she thrived sexually in an open/multiple partner/poly lifestyle she was involved in between marriages. I think its the reason our sex life went mostly away after we got married. I think even today she can't reconcile to the two parts of her wants - stable caring good man,husband, and father type - and feelings/experiencing other men. Again just my theory after years of issues with her. I tried to tell our sex therapist this at the end of our sessions.

 

I think some people love the idea of marriage - or being with a good partner and home and family nice home - but find that sexual monogamy for them is a challenge.

 

Perhaps you could say they were being dishonest to their spouse, but perhaps they were also dishonest with themselves and their nature. Perhaps they dont understand this till later.

 

Either way its painful to discover your spouse might want a different lifestyle or relationship that you want or are wired for.

Edited November 21, 2016 by dichotomy

[BetrayedH]

Tough question to answer as there are so many variables (poly vs open vs swinging, etc.) and potential boundaries. Much like in your own summary, it would depend on the request.

 

Of one thing I am fairly certain, though. I would have had a lot more respect for my wife had she had the discussion. Just about any approach would have been preferable to how things unfolded. And some of the scenarios may have been palatable. We'd hypothetically discussed threesomes but never taken any action. I was happy enough without (other than the tremendous decline in frequency over the years).

 

But ultimately I suspect I would have respectfully declined my wife's request if it had involved her having other men. If divorce was the other option, then divorce would have been the case.

[oldshirt]

I know of no game, where it is acceptable to change the rules , in the middle of the game. Where I come from, people play a lot of poker. If somebody were to try this during a game, they would at the very least be asked to leave and probably not be asked back.

 

How many times over the last 40 years has the NFL, NBA, NHL etc etc updated their rule books?

 

How many times over the last 40 years has every corporation updated their policies and practices?

 

How many times in the last 40 years has the legeslature repealed laws and added new ones?

 

How many times over the years has The Holy Bible itself been updated and amended.

 

The fact is EVERYTHING changed over time and all policies and practices get updates and changes over time.

 

It is simply unrealistic to think that a 40, 50 or even 60 year marriage will not experience changes over time.

[seren]

If H had said any of this, then I would have said thanks, but no thanks. I am a one man woman by nature, if I love, then I love with all of me, I could not imagine any circumstances where I would knowingly share intimacy with another or, have my H share that with another either. If he still wanted to have other partners for sex, then he could, but I wouldn't be around to see it.

 

If H wanted celibacy, then I would reluctantly agree. Due to health issues H has had long periods of abstinence, but that doesn't mean a lack of intimacy, there is more than one way to float your boat, as they say. I have nothing against or views on open marriages for other people, if both agree that is what they are happy to do, then it is their business, but it isn't for me. So, if an ultimatum of open or an affair, then I would divorce.

[wmacbride]

How many times over the last 40 years has the NFL, NBA, NHL etc etc updated their rule books?

 

How many times over the last 40 years has every corporation updated their policies and practices?

 

How many times in the last 40 years has the legeslature repealed laws and added new ones?

 

How many times over the years has The Holy Bible itself been updated and amended.

 

The fact is EVERYTHING changed over time and all policies and practices get updates and changes over time.

 

It is simply unrealistic to think that a 40, 50 or even 60 year marriage will not experience changes over time.

 

Fair enough, but for many people who are monogamous, the idea of being with someone else or having their spouse do so is not for them. It's not that they have an issue with other people doing so, it's just not for them. For some, that can change over time, but for others, it's a fundamental part of who they are.

 

Just my opinion, but if someone wants to have sex outside of their marriage, and their spouse says "no", they need to really ask themselves if that are okay with that being the end of their foray into extramarital sex or if they are going to spend the rest of their married life holding a grudge against their husband or wife because they weren't interested. Will they be bale to let it go, or will they always be looking for a chance to have sex behind their husband or wife's back.

[MadJackBird]

It's an interesting question. My answer would be no, and I would have been shocked to here her even suggest it, or quite frankly her to be open and honest about it in the first place.

 

Most of HER LIFE (Let alone the cheating) was so based on lies and deception that I don't think it would have ever even occurred to her to come clean and tell me the truth about anything. The type of people that are serial cheaters have so much other things messed up under the surface, that to even be open and honest enough to suggest such a thing is just unfathomable. Usually people that cheat start out as people that are deceptive and dishonest.

[BTDT2012]

I would have chosen divorce.