I never thought I'd be here

[sandylee1]

Actually her apology to her sister supports the fact that she could be having an affair. It's like she can now sympathise and see the need to leave a marriage when you meet a new man. I guess you interpret it differently.

 

Maybe she's genuinely been discontent with the marriage and feels she could do better and have a more exciting life being single.

[thwack]

I think she went through the same feelings as her sister but just handled it differently... knowing that she wanted to be free of commitment and obligation, and that might lead to activities that might lead to an affair, she's asking for the divorce first.

 

She has gone on 3 dates with a new friend now. But that definitely wasn't going on before because she met him at a MeetUp she went to for the first time after asking for divorce. She admits it's faster than she expected and she's not sure it will go anywhere, especially since he has a daughter.

 

This weekend she's visiting a longtime friend several states away, who happens to be the guy she dumped when she started dating me. Yeah, I know. I didn't pry as to the reason. I can't believe she would get back with him, but maybe she just needs to get away from our situation. She did say he plans to show her some touristy things to do around there.

[thwack]

How does one figure out what one enjoys?

 

I feel like the only things I can come up with to do are tasks, not leisure. I just identified and labeled which circuit our wired smoke alarms are on in preparation for when a buyer's inspector tells us we have to replace them. And now I've run out of tasks so I'm doing nothing... just posting here.

[Angelica21]

Hello, thwack:

 

I have a lot of insight into the question you're asking about "how to know what one enjoys".

 

Sometimes a person enjoys activities that other people define as "fun" activities or "leisure" activities: riding a bike, going swimming indoors or outdoors, going to movies or theater, eating out at restaurants, playing sports or watching sports, etc. etc. etc.

 

But sometimes a person enjoys activities that other people define as "drudgery" or "work": cleaning out a closet, remodeling a house, attending classes, tracking financial investments, etc.

 

Tell me more about anything that you know you enjoyed in the past, WITHOUT JUDGING whether you'd want to do that again. For example, you might tell me "Well, I used to love going to the bars with my buddies and drinking too much" or "Well, I played baseball in high school".

 

After you tell me a list of everything you can think of that you liked to do in the past, then maybe we can find a way to do similar activities in your current life.

Edited June 18, 2016 by Angelica21

[thwack]

Of course my struggle is that for the past 10 years I've enjoyed doing everything with my wife. None of those things seem like fun alone.

 

So I'll look back before I met my wife. Well... I hated who I was back then, but I know you asked me not to judge. So, some of the things I enjoyed then... my memory sucks, so just perused some of my journal entries from that time. It looks like I didn't do things out on my own. I was always tagging along with my friends from college. Seeing movies, eating at the food court in the mall, driving across the state to see Da Vinci's Notebook perform. Going to the state fair to see my friend play fiddle on stage next to Charlie Daniels. Going to Sam's Club and randomly buying a microwave. Those are a few of the things I wrote about. While I was at home alone I apparently found joy in things like building or upgrading my PC. And playing piano, which I still do.

[Angelica21]

Great answers, with lots of potential for your present-day life.

 

Obviously, I see lots of music-related things, you love music. Summer is the perfect time to attend music festivals. Do you know of any near you? Are you close enough to Buffalo to tap into music events there, or close enough to Chautauqua to go to performances at the Institute?

 

Which friends or family members would attend with you if you made some arrangements ahead of time, or waited until day-of to see if you're in the mood?

 

My son buys music tickets from Group-On, or he also buys cheap last-minute tix online from people who can't use them, I don't know if he uses Craiglist or Stub Hub, I could ask him if you are interested.

 

Da Vinci's Notebook is a comedy group, n'est-ce pas? Are there any comedy clubs nearby? Even if you're feeling quite sour, a decent comedian could give you a brief laugh. Again, friends or family who would go with you?

 

I've attended music events, movies and restaurants alone, it's not as bad as it sounds, in fact in some ways it was nice to sit exactly where I want, eat and drink exactly what I want, etc. stay as little or as long as I want.

 

What if you planned a weekend getaway to see some music group that you want to see. Stay in a hotel, eat at a great restaurant.

 

Do you like the TV show "Diners, Drive-Ins and Dives"? You could take a driving trip to one of the restaurants featured on that show.

 

Do you play piano well enough to go to open mic somewhere? Are you good enough to teach someone how to play piano, even if you only had one student per week?

 

As far as ways to spend your time at home, what if you set a goal to watch a certain group of music DVDs that you get from the library, such as documentaries about rock bands or individual singers that you like? Or DVDs of comedians that you like. Recently I watched a documentary about Tom Petty, it was so interesting to learn all the back-story. Also watched one about The Eagles.

[thwack]

The few times I've gone to any kind of music festival, I just followed my friends around. I wouldn't have known what to do on my own except look around and try not to collide with other people. Nothing caught my interest. So maybe I don't really love music the way people normally do.

 

DVN no longer exists, but two of the original four members, Paul and Storm, are still active. I would see them if they came anywhere local. I only know of one friend from college who would also want to see them.

 

In general, these activities are expensive though, especially when travel is involved. Money will be tight while we sell the house (no equity) and move into our own places.

 

Funny that you mention open mic nights... I recently learned that some of my college friends attend an open mic night every Tuesday, so I have gone with them twice now and plan to continue. The piano they have there is in rough shape and the stuff I play wouldn't fit its character, so I haven't signed up to play yet, but maybe someday. That's one thing I can do for fun now, but it's only one night a week.

 

Documentaries tend to put me to sleep, which I assume means I'm not truly interested in the subject. I'm not a good history student.

 

One other casual hobby though is photography. As I write this I'm running between the computer and my camera on the deck out back where I'm trying to capture a long-shutter photo of all the fireflies on the hill behind our house. I only noticed them because I looked out the window at some nearby fireworks I heard. So this was an activity that found me... not something I came up with. That's why I feel like I'm not able to come up with things on my own, and all the fun I've had in my life was with someone else taking the lead. So what did I really find fun in itself and what did I only enjoy because of the people who led me there?

[angel.eyes]

I'm so sorry that you're going through this! Please don't be so hard on yourself. You just had your world turned upside down. Life may feel terrible now, but it will definitely get better. You're definitely not a loser just because you couldn't approach a group of strangers. You're still in shock from having life as you know it abruptly overturned. In time, you'll rediscover yourself, your joy, your passion, and a new life. Have you looked into joining a divorce support group? You need people who can support you and be in your corner. It doesn't sound as if you have that right now.

 

As for her suddenly meeting someone and it progressing so quickly in a couple of weeks? Down the road you'll discover that it started much much earlier. I would guess it's her running partner or someone in her running group. But that's irrelevant right now.

 

Focus on getting past the breakup and disentangle your lives as quickly as possible. It's not healthy for you to be living in a house with someone who is bragging about her new social life after pulling the rug from under you.

[thwack]

Have you looked into joining a divorce support group? You need people who can support you and be in your corner. It doesn't sound as if you have that right now.

 

I did attend the orientation for a local group last Thursday. I didn't really click with anyone there except the facilitator, and only because he noticed me standing alone when everyone else was socializing in small groups during break. I know the social aspect is what I need so much but I'm so bad at it... sort of a catch-22.

 

I also joined a brand new group that hasn't scheduled any meetups yet.

 

As for her suddenly meeting someone and it progressing so quickly in a couple of weeks? Down the road you'll discover that it started much much earlier.

 

If so, she hasn't told me about that person. The one she has told me about is someone she just met on her first meetup that she went to only after dropping the bomb on me. But he has a daughter and doesn't like Star Wars so she says it's doomed. Still, she spends time with him just to get out of the house I think.

 

In reading my old journal entries to write my response to Angelica21, I think I realized a large part of my problem in coping with this... two of my closest friends who might have supported me through this have died. I never grew closer to any other friends because by then my wife was my best friend. If anything, I grew further away from all my other friends because I spent every minute with my wife... by choice. That's where I was happiest. So all my eggs ended up in one basket.

[winterpast]

Do whatever you need to do to find something positive about yourself everyday, even one small thing. You don't need to be beating yourself up over not being social or knowing what you enjoy yet, those things can take time for some people. Even if you take baby steps each day towards those goals, eventually you will make progress that you can see.

 

I feel as if you are stressing yourself to do all of these things that your wife is doing and to do them at the same speed as her. She is probably going to burn herself out going as fast as she is. You need to develop and heal at your own pace.

 

As far as finding out what hobbies or activities you enjoy: just try new things. Don't try to think about what you would enjoy. Just try things out and stick with the ones you do like. Keep going to social gatherings if you want, even if you don't approach people. Eventually you might feel comfortable and be able to interact.

 

I just think the biggest thing to focus on is going at your own pace and don't be comparing yourself to her and what she's doing.

[thwack]

Well it's getting more real now.

 

She wants to make an offer on a condo nearby, and to do that her mortgage broker will need to see a signed and notarized separation agreement outlining how our debts will be divided. By next Tuesday.

 

I've been trying various social things but none of them feel like fun. I'm not sure if it's because I truly didn't enjoy the activity or because I'm just in this funk where nothing can be enjoyable. I'll talk to my therapist about that tonight.

 

Yesterday was tough. I walked around a local music festival after work but nothing caught my interest so after about 20 mins I went home. After my wife went out to her social thing I wept while folding laundry. I think I never learned to be an adult. My crying is entirely childish. It's because I can't have what I want. But unlike a child I'm not forgetting about it 20 seconds later.

[tinkerbell16]

Well it's getting more real now.

 

She wants to make an offer on a condo nearby, and to do that her mortgage broker will need to see a signed and notarized separation agreement outlining how our debts will be divided. By next Tuesday.

 

I've been trying various social things but none of them feel like fun. I'm not sure if it's because I truly didn't enjoy the activity or because I'm just in this funk where nothing can be enjoyable. I'll talk to my therapist about that tonight.

 

Yesterday was tough. I walked around a local music festival after work but nothing caught my interest so after about 20 mins I went home. After my wife went out to her social thing I wept while folding laundry. I think I never learned to be an adult. My crying is entirely childish. It's because I can't have what I want. But unlike a child I'm not forgetting about it 20 seconds later.

 

I used to cry in the shower. That was the only place my kids would not see me. Fast forward 1.5 years later... I am happier than ever. I LOVE my new "life". You will too, in time.

[WhirlwindGuy]

I was so proud of our marriage. We had it so easy. None of the drama or fighting that we hear about in other relationships. Just happy to spend our lives together.

 

Then out of the blue on May 14th, she drops a bombshell on me. Fighting back tears, she tells me she has come to the conclusion—and assures me that's what it is, a final conclusion—that we should get divorced.

 

We just bought a house 6 months ago. We just had an amazing vacation with her parents. I couldn't believe what I was hearing. I was beside myself, watching me ask her "why?"

 

I struggled to make sense of her attempts to explain how she reached this conclusion. She had had thoughts for about a year, but never said anything, trying to "protect" me. On her own, she made a list of issues and possible solutions. I'm not immediately supportive/understanding of her decisions. I'm stuck in a mediocre job with no ambition to improve myself. We've grown stagnant and stuck in our daily routines. She's tired of being the adult and making all the decisions while I'm just along for the ride. She wants to be single. She doesn't want anyone to factor into her decisions but herself. She doesn't want obligation or commitment (anymore; 4 years ago we took vows!).

 

I'm powerless to do anything. This is her plan. She is incredibly smart and knows how to set a goal, break it into steps and never deviate from her plan until the goal is reached. This is how she lost over 100 lbs and got weight loss surgery to keep it off and recently completed her first half marathon and is already training for a full marathon. Meanwhile she says that as she has improved herself and I haven't, she feels like we've grown apart. (I'm already ideal weight and have run a 5K... she must be talking about improvement in other areas.)

 

The most painful part is that she says it comes down to a matter of want. The marriage can't be saved because that requires both of us to want to work on it. She just doesn't want to.

 

How can she throw it all away? We've shared so much life together for so many years, before and after getting married.

 

I tried to ask her what she'll do as a single person that's so much better than what we have. She can't tell me anything specific. She just wants to be free and irresponsible and see what happens.

 

I've been trying to deal with the grief for over 2 weeks now. I started seeing a therapist (she went along the first time) and he said in some ways for me this is worse than grieving a death because the person is still here.

 

I miss holding her hand. I miss having a companion. I miss being part of her plans. Now we're just roommates sharing a house until it's sold. She was my reason for living. Now she's abandoning me with no clear cause and I don't know what to do.

 

My family and friends all say what she's doing doesn't make sense. But they assure me I have lots to live for and offer to someone else who will appreciate a supportive husband for the long term. Meanwhile, her family and friends all think she's doing the right thing. I can't imagine how this feels right to anybody.

 

That's my story. Looking for support wherever I can.

 

 

This is almost the exact way my marriage ended as well...I was completely blown out of the water. It was devastating.

 

 

I will say, it gets better. It is really tough, but you will overcome it eventually. I felt so destitute and defeated, but don't dwell on it too long.

 

 

I am really sorry this is happening. I wish I had a better explanation for it too, but people can be fickle. My wife also had weight loss surgery too, and I have heard that this can have a lot to do with it. Divorce rate after this surgery is extremely high.

[rainbowchaser]

Thwack, I am sorry for what you are going through. I am in the opposite situation. I just left my husband who I have been together with for the past 20 years. It's too long to get into but I was unhappy for a very long time. It sounds like your wife mulled this over for some time too before she announced her desire to separate.

 

It is a hugely difficult decision to end a long-term relationship. I question every day whether I did the right thing. I am sad and depressed and lonely. I can only imagine that my husband is feeling the same. It was very hard for me to read your posts.

 

I wonder though why you are discussing your wife's personal relationships with her. It's like pouring salt on a wound. It's cruel and not fair to you. I would tell her you don't want to discuss it if she tries to bring it up again.

[thwack]

Rainbowchaser, thanks for sharing your perspective. I do recognize how difficult it must have been for my wife to deal with these thoughts on her own for a year and ultimately come to the decision and build up the courage to tell me. That's part of why I wish she had communicated with me earlier on, so I could help and we could go through it together like we did with everything else. But I think she kept me out of the loop mainly because she knew I'm too emotionally attached to make a rational analysis of the issues she would bring up and she didn't want emotions to distract her from making the right rational decision for herself.

 

She does says he regrets not including me sooner, but mainly for how unfair it has been in terms of how far along she is in the process of moving on and how new this all is to me. While I'm still in the early stages of grief and trying to fix things, she's already moving on with her life like she was just waiting for the starting pistol. But when I suggest that she's just going through a phase and when she's done with this mid-life crisis I'll still be here, she says I couldn't be more wrong. She says she's more and more sure every day that she made the right decision. She keeps assuring me that I'll be happy again someday, but never again with her.

 

As for pouring salt on a would, I suppose you're right, except it's me asking her. She's not bringing it up on her own. I can't help wanting to know what she's doing. Not because I'm controlling, but because she has always been my leader in anything new. She's more outgoing than I am. On my own, without knowing what she's doing, I feel lost and I have no internal desire to do anything specific. Also, I had asked her about only how she met the people she's seeing to follow up on an earlier conversation we had... basically saying that if there is any hope of us remaining friends after all of this (she is proud of still being friends with most of her exes), there can be no doubt in my mind that she was being truthful when she told me she's not cheating on me. So as long as the people she's seeing now are people she initially met only after she broke up with me, then the friendship can be saved. Otherwise, it will be clear to me that she is no longer the awesome person I met 15 years ago, that she has now thrown all integrity out the window and is lying to get whatever she wants, and I can never see her as a friend again.

 

Maybe that's better for me in terms of helping me move on. But I'm still not convinced she made the right decision. Maybe she is still protecting me from the true reason behind her decision. It feels like all the reasons she has given me are just things she searched for to rationalize the decision she had already made. Any attempt to disprove them is met with arguments that I'm being emotional and she either dismisses that with flawless logic or just gives up on the conversation when she determines that I can't think rationally in that moment.

 

My current analysis is that she no longer wants to be loved for who she is on the inside. She just wants casual, shallow relationships and hook-ups from now on. Maybe after she has tried that for a while she'll find it to be not as fulfilling as she hoped. Or she'll continue her loss of integrity and end up marrying one of her new friends, going completely against what she told me she's looking for. At that point she might as well also have kids and start voting Republican.

[Jeff1690]

Maybe 1% chance she's having an affair. She has had no changes to her work schedule or strange unaccountable time away. And she's not even pushing for divorce papers until after the house sells and we've moved out.

 

I'm 38 and she's 37. She did not bring up any of these thoughts before May 14 because she thought she was doing the right thing by protecting me. Now she sees that was a mistake and she regrets it. She thinks if she had involved me in the process earlier, it may not have changed the outcome, but at least I would be in the same place mentally. (She's already resigned, while this is still brand new to me and I have to fight it.)

 

She describes it as she fought a long hard battle with herself for a year and lost. If it took her a year to concede to defeat, it will probably take me at least 3.

 

Same thing my wife did thwack. She has been thinking of divorce for a little over a year. She didn't say that but that is when the intimacy and sex stopped. I get no answer though when I ask her why didn't she tell me she was "falling out of love". It really hurts to think after over two decades and talking about everything and deciding on every major thing together she just leaves me out of the process and then wants a divorce. It was almost impossible to talk to her about the relationship. She would just say your not happy and I am not and when I would say the only reason I am not happy is because there isn't any intimacy or sex. All I want is her. Only answer I would get is a blank stare.

[Jeff1690]

She has a higher paying job than I do, so it's not a WTF moment for me... I totally get her perspective. In many ways the traditional gender roles in our marriage are reversed. But I had no problem with that. Maybe she did? She's tired of being the adult...

 

Same here. I was the bread winner for the first 11 years of the marriage she has been the last 12. Now suddenly she makes comments like "I pay for all this." as she waves her arms around at the house. Course It wasn't till later that I thought of a reply. "You are right you have. But, you forgot how you got here and who paid the bills and for your college the first half of the marriage when you had nothing." Next time she is home and says that I am going to bring that up very politely.

 

I feel like she has lost total respect for me as a man because she now thinks everything we have accomplished together was just her doing. Strange when I was working 80 hours a week so she could stay at home with the kids that doesn't count for crap. Doesn't seem to realize that the reason I don't make a lot is because I have been dumping so much money into my retirement fund so we could enjoy our retirement together.

[thwack]

Jeff, I'm so sorry. I'm too familiar with what you want through but having been together twice as long it must have been that much more difficult for you.

 

In my case even the intimacy wasn't a clue to anything being wrong. Because my wife was trying to save the marriage for that whole year (she says), and she was trying to protect me from any signs of trouble or what's on her mind, everything continued as normal. It wasn't until the final 2-3 weeks that I noticed any decline in intimacy, but I wasn't going to make an issue of it because it's not the only factor in our marriage. I was close to asking if something is wrong though.

[Jeff1690]

I have done a lot of soul searching and was at first blaming myself for her falling out of love when I saw the signs. It was if I just knew everything would work out in the long run. Everything always had because we did it together. But, you know what? I know I have been a loving supportive husband and always put her first with her desires. I am not perfect I have my faults by damn it I know I treated her freaking great. Other women friends of ours would always comment to her how they wished their husbands treated them like I treated her. The last few years she would just give a shoulder shrug.

 

I guess she started thinking my devotion to her was no big deal. She always had it, I was always there. Guess that is where the losing respect was. She makes the money now and I always did what she wanted because of her background I wanted her to have everything she never had growing up. I wonder If I had treated her like **** if she would have still been chasing me.

 

But I do know this, I am going to get through this. I am going to live my life and travel the world like I always wanted. I make good money (not as much as her) and I have one hell of a retirement waiting on me in four years. If everything goes right I will be debt free at the end of this marriage. I will then start saving up money to start taking trips on my off time here in the States. Love riding my Harley and me and that iron horse are going to do some road trips and road side camping like I did when I was single. I am going to live my life to the fullest.

 

If she is screwing someone else I hope it burns her life down just like the majority of relationships that start out in affairs.

[thwack]

Love riding my Harley and me and that iron horse are going to do some road trips and road side camping like I did when I was single. I am going to live my life to the fullest.

 

Good for you. I know that's what I need to do. Unfortunately I have no personal goals. Sometimes I think I'm selfish in the way I treat others on the little things, but when it comes to big life goals I really only want to help someone else reach theirs. I don't know what will bring me happiness, but if someone else seems to have it figured out, that sounds like a good enough purpose for me.

[Jeff1690]

Tell you what. Start doing this. Have you ever noticed as you drive around the area you live in within several counties you see historical markers and little museums antique shops, cafes etc. ? What I started doing is stopping at every historical marker, driving the back roads finding little mom and pop antique shops cafe's and museums. Just within 75 miles of my home I have found dozens of amazing places to visit. Get with a buddy so you are not alone in the car thinking about the wife. Just check things out, heck even stop at garage and yard sales. You find amazing things.

 

I have always been kind of a loner but I have started just chatting people up at these places and have met some really neat people. I even love riding the hog up into Amish country and have met and created relationships (well first name basis kind of things where they know me and we shake hands and talk) also they show me how they make things. Fascinating. Never thought that this kind of stuff would interest me. But Just around the area I live I have met and discovered great things.

[thwack]

Yeah, first I need a buddy. My wife was my buddy. All my other friends I only see in groups; I'm not close enough with any of them to do anything one-on-one.

 

Today I had to get out of the house for an hour so a realtor could show it, so I tried to go to a new deli I like but they were closed. I couldn't figure out anywhere else to go on my own. I ended up driving across town to a family restaurant where my wife and I went a lot, and where we went together during a showing of our last house. I'm a terrible explorer. I really tried to look at that situation as an opportunity to discover something new. I took a slower back road and looked along both sides of the street, but it was mostly places of business closed on Sunday, no places to get food or anything else that looked interesting.

[Jeff1690]

On harley davidson website they have place called plan my ride. Pick a route you want to take and it will show you every local state and federal park and historical place also events and festivals that are going on. Great way to start exploring.

Oh and like you I used to do everything with my wife and am also having to learn how to socialize with folks without her. It is tough but I keep making my self do it. went to a couple of cook outs and a road trip on harley with a neighbor and his wife. at the cookouts everyone had a wife and girlfriend and I too felt like the fifth wheel. But, I am learning to be me again, or a new me and though a bit awkward and bringing up feelings for the wife for her not being there itis getting better. Don't stop.

Edited July 25, 2016 by Jeff1690

[Cephalopod]

I have very little respect for women like your wife who value marriage so little and treat men like they are disposable. What goes around comes around.

[Mr. Lucky]

I'm not close enough with any of them to do anything one-on-one.

 

thwack, you're going to realize at some point all this negativity - "I'm not...I can't...I never...I don't..." - is the biggest part of what's holding you back. Failing at things is proof you're trying. Stumbling is proof you're moving forward. Only fear holds you back.

 

You do things one-on-one with people by asking them. If they decline you ask someone else. One step at a time...

 

Mr. Lucky