It's all fun and games until someone gets eviscerated

[Sunnycalb808]

Just bc something is not sugar coated and exactly what the OP wants to hear, does not mean its not supportive.

 

Ultimately the support she really needs to hear is: dont be an OW. I think almost everyone can agree its a painful path. So saying find a single guy to screw is yes blunt but also good advice.

 

I believe she is projecting all kinds of things on MM in her over romanticizing of this NSA affair. Ultimately he called it quits when it suited him to do so...maybe he had a new OW, maybe he was just tired if it, maybe he was falling in love....she will never know. Such is the nature of affairs -- you are often in the dark and left not knowing what is real or lies. If it makes her feel better to assume the latter scenario than so be it. But ultimately she has hopefully learned NsA is hard enough and even moreso when you choose a MM as the partner. Sometimes thimgs really are that simple.

Edited May 18, 2016 by Sunnycalb808

[sandylee1]

You shouldnt even be getting close enough to a MM to find out you "click" if you have decent boundaries.

 

 

This is so well said.^^^^^ I just love it.

 

 

 

Would you start 'clicking' like this with your sister's husband? Would you like your nieces and nephews to suffer as a result?

 

I hope not. Just because his wife is not your sister and the kids involved are not your niece or nephews doesn't justify hurting them.

 

Otherwise your logic is I can hurt her because she's a stranger to me.

 

Then when the BW finds out and seeks revenge you get the line of 'face your husband.. OW is not your problem'

 

Well I'll be damned if I don't think the woman sleeping with my husband is not a problem.

 

If you view every MM in the same light as your brother in law..

[sandylee1]

Double post

Edited May 18, 2016 by sandylee1
double post

[Girlfromcali]

This is so well said.^^^^^ I just love it.

 

 

 

Would you start 'clicking' like this with your sister's husband? Would you like your nieces and nephews to suffer as a result?

 

I hope not. Just because his wife is not your sister and the kids involved are not your niece or nephews doesn't justify hurting them.

 

Otherwise your logic is I can hurt her because she's a stranger to me.

 

Then when the BW finds out and seeks revenge you get the line of 'face your husband.. OW is not your problem'

 

Well I'll be damned if I don't think the woman sleeping with my husband is not a problem.

 

If you view every MM in the same light as your brother in law..

 

This is actually pretty interesting point of view, because obviously I would never have developed feelings for my best friend's boyfriends, husband, or any spouses of family members..my mothers's boyfriend?

 

I mean maybe there are people like that and they belong to a Jerry Springer show, but I couldn't even fathom the idea of developing feelings for a family member's or friend's SO (my mother's boyfriend just happens to be my soulmate <- see how absurd it sounds!), so why is it acceptable to go after some woman's H, who you have no feelings for?

[ShamanLover]

Well, I just spent an hour writing a global response to a lot of the issues raised and somehow managed to delete it just prior to posting. I can't face trying to resurrect it at this point so let me just say thank you all for taking the time to consider my situation and weigh in. I am reading with interest and gratitude...

[jenkins95]

You write really nicely Shaman - don't you just hate it when the computer just loses a post that you have spent so long getting just right and can't wait to post!! Happens to us all! I'm glad we didn't have computers in Shakespeare's time. Can you imagine....

 

Editor: Is your latest book, McBeth, ready yet, Will? The press is ready to go.

Shakespeare: Yes! Just finished. Just hitting send now.....

Editor: I didn't get anything?

Shakespeare: Check your spam.

Editor: No, nothing.

Shakespeare: Well I did hit send! Let me check..... Ahhhhhh - Oh s***. That was the delete key!

(Computer is heard crashing out of the window!)

 

Sorry for the above - just a mad moment!

 

Keep them coming Shaman - you have a lot of great stuff to say.

 

J

 

Well, I just spent an hour writing a global response to a lot of the issues raised and somehow managed to delete it just prior to posting. I can't face trying to resurrect it at this point so let me just say thank you all for taking the time to consider my situation and weigh in. I am reading with interest and gratitude...

[stilltrying16]

Well, I just spent an hour writing a global response to a lot of the issues raised and somehow managed to delete it just prior to posting. I can't face trying to resurrect it at this point so let me just say thank you all for taking the time to consider my situation and weigh in. I am reading with interest and gratitude...

 

Oh, that happens to me so many times on this site! I'm sorry. I've heard that hitting CTRL and then the + sign and then Z can bring it back. But not always. It happen apparently if I accidentally highlight my entire text and then hit some key- my laptop takes that as permission to delete.

 

And once or twice I've typed out my post on my word program and tried to paste it in, but it then gets all sorts of extra formatting I don't want. It's a mystery.

 

--

 

Back on topic: OP, I commend you for coming here and posting. It takes courage to want to pull back. I am less appreciative of your MM here. He seems especially lacking in empathy IMO. I could be misreading what he seems to have said to you, but I wonder if you've ever questioned his general sense of ethics and empathy?

 

We are staying away from each other. No kids - he is "fixed" (coincidentally, part of the guilt on his part... his wife had to forego the experience of having children when she married him, and now she is beyond child-bearing years, so he feels responsible... just icky all around)

 

Icky is an interesting choice of word,OP. I suppose her feelings are messy and icky and will get in the way of the great glorious passion that is at stake. I doubt it's the word she would choose, though, if she ever had the privilege of offering an opinion on her primary relationship.

 

You said part of his attraction to you as an MM was that he was less available than a single guy would be. Thanks for your honesty there- it's pretty rare. This actually confirmed something I've always wondered about. He's unavailable because of the BW. If she weren't in the picture he would be available. So the BW contributes directly to the thrill of the affair. Her situation, and the potential misery and suffering that is being risked on her behalf, is not collateral damage (as WS and APs often claim). Her misery is a vital ingredient for the affair to soar.

 

Interesting also that among the other choices he took away from her was the one of motherhood, something she wanted. I'm curious why she "had to" give up that dream. Did they ever consider the possibility of her having a child with someone else? I also wonder how she'll feel if she learns that her dreams of motherhood were discussed so freely by her H with his AP. IMO guilt is ultimately a feel-good emotion. So what if he has to sacrifice her privacy in order to wallow in guilt over fu*king her over. He gets to bond with you, his AP, over his sadness at having messed up her life. Priceless.

 

at that meeting, he reiterated that despite all of those insights, he intended to stay married because he was “satisfied”, he felt “in control” in the relationship, and it "worked for him” (yikes, but fair enough). [...] he couldn’t handle the “disappointment” of perpetually contrasting what he had with me to what he has with his wife.

This poor, poor man. If he lets her go, he no longer has the aphrodisiac thrill of betraying her. And if he has her stay, then he is doomed to a lifetime disappointing comparisons between her and you. He's bearing up so manfully under this burden, however. What a prince. Edited May 18, 2016 by stilltrying16

[Cymbeline]

'You said part of his attraction to you as an MM was that he was less available than a single guy would be. Thanks for your honesty there- it's pretty rare. This actually confirmed something I've always wondered about. He's unavailable because of the BW. If she weren't in the picture he would be available. So the BW contributes directly to the thrill of the affair. Her situation, and the potential misery and suffering that is being risked on her behalf, is not collateral damage (as WS and APs often claim). '

 

I did not interpret Shamen's words this way. The BW is the ever present obstacle, but that is all she is, especially in the APs eyes. I interpreted this as meaning that the situation - the 'affair dynamic' causes the intensity. True it is the shadow of the wife that is the obstacle that causes the intensity, but she is a shadow only.

 

Laurel Richardson, a feminist professor of sociology

 

https://sociology.osu.edu/sites/sociology.osu.edu/files/CV2013_Richardson.pdf

 

has researched this Phenomenon specifically with regard to single OW with MM. It is the assumed temporary nature of the affair, together with limited time together and no feedback from outside opinion, among other circumstances, peculiar to an affair situation, which produce and reinforce the feelings of specialness and intensity. The lack of a past and lack of a definite future make the participants act more freely and with greater disclosure than would be the case between two single people and these factors all increase the sense of intimacy.

 

 

I think that aspect what Shamen was referring to rather than getting one up on the BS.

[heartwhole]

It sounds as though at this stage, you are most angry that he ended a relationship that you wanted to continue because of the highs, the pizzazz, etc.

 

If you developed genuine feelings for him as you say, and you admit that you wouldn't want a real world relationship with him, then I can only view your current feelings and wishes as selfish. You want him to continue in a NSA relationship because you like what it gives you. You are not concerned about his struggles or about his sense of what he must do to protect his primary relationship. Surely this is not a surprise to anyone . . . affairs are inherently selfish.

 

My recommendation would be journaling and counseling to explore your feelings further so that you can put them to bed properly. From your relationship history, it sounds as though you are used to being the one who ends the relationship. It seems to be aggravating and perplexing you to be the one who was dumped, even after you suggested further safeguards. That's a hit to your ego.

 

Perhaps I am not reading your posts correctly, but you don't sound eviscerated to me. Your AP sounds like he is suffering more than you. His wife would suffer most of all if she discovered the truth. It sounds to me like your ego is wounded, and you don't like it. The logical part of you recognizes why you sought this type of "NSA" relationship at this stage of your life, why it was appealing in the way a traditional relationship couldn't be, and why it wouldn't work out in a real world monogamous way. And yet the emotional part of you is angry. That's normal, I suppose, but there's not much I can offer in terms of alleviating that anger. All I can suggest is that you are directing it at AP when he has done nothing but exercise his right to end a relationship that had grown beyond what was agreed upon. You should be directing it at yourself, for choosing a relationship that you should have anticipated would end here. I also encourage you to look into the empathy and compassion you referenced OWs feeling for MMs in another thread. I'm not seeing much of that here, to be honest.

 

Good luck.

[stilltrying16]

Cymbeline, thanks for the reference- I will definitely check it out.

 

I think I get what you're saying. But I'm not sure I agree (and this is unusual; I typically do agree with you on things).

 

 

1. I do get that the BS isn't even on the mind of the MM much- or any- of the time during the affair. She's a "shadow." But one can be a shadow in oneself, and still be vital to the affair dynamic. Like a character in a novel who is crucial for the action but who is sketched minimally and whom we are not supposed to think about when we read. A character who is nothing more than a plot device. Turning a living human being, one whom you actually loved at some point, into a shadow and a plot device is pretty darn sickening. Being a shadow is well and good, but the BS is still indispensable to the plot, and that's what I find so interesting.

 

To me the "shadow" reasoning is further indication of how rotten a sense of ethics the MM has. I think this argument turns on intentionality. I think I often hear a version of it when affairs are justified. EG I wasn't even thinking of my wife. I didn't mean to hurt her. Well, sorry, MMS don't get a pass because they unintentionally ruined someone's life.

 

2. There's also the collateral damage argument:

 

Oooops, the drone strike hit a hospital. Our bad. We didn't really mean it. SOWWWWWY! Can hardly stand the guilt.

 

Just an analogy- I'm not saying the impact of an affair on the BP is the same as that of a drone strike on a hospital. But just wanted to highlight the logic of collateral damage.

 

And I was trying to say that there's a difference and the collateral damage paradigm doesn't fit an affair. You don't need a hospital to be there for the strike to be successful. But you do need a BP to be there to serve the plot function of an obstacle for the affair to be intense and amazing.

 

So however much the presence of the BS is minimized and however unreal s/he becomes, without him/her the affair might lose all its thrill.

 

On the point that it's the temporariness of the affair that makes it so thrilling. Probably true, but that temporariness can't happen without the BS. So once again she's crucial as a plot device. I wonder what would happen if the same sense of temporariness could be worked into a relationship with a single partner. It's hard to imagine the circumstance- but let's say it was someone about to be deployed. Would that relationship have the same intensity as an affair with an MM? Or does the presence of the BP (betrayed partner) and the possibility of her finding out and her hurt bring an extra special magic to an affair?

Edited May 18, 2016 by stilltrying16

[Cymbeline]

Cymbeline, thanks for the reference- I will definitely check it out.

 

I think I get what you're saying. But I'm not sure I agree (and this is unusual; I typically do agree with you on things).

 

 

1. I do get that the BS isn't even on the mind of the MM much- or any- of the time during the affair. She's a "shadow." But one can be a shadow in oneself, and still be vital to the affair dynamic. Like a character in a novel who is crucial for the action but who is sketched minimally and whom we are not supposed to think about when we read. A character who is nothing more than a plot device. Turning a living human being, one whom you actually loved at some point, into a shadow and a plot device is pretty darn sickening. Being a shadow is well and good, but the BS is still indispensable to the plot, and that's what I find so interesting.

 

To me the "shadow" reasoning is further indication of how rotten a sense of ethics the MM has. I think this argument turns on intentionality. I think I often hear a version of it when affairs are justified. EG I wasn't even thinking of my wife. I didn't mean to hurt her. Well, sorry, MMS don't get a pass because they unintentionally ruined someone's life.

 

2. There's also the collateral damage argument:

 

Oooops, the drone strike hit a hospital. Our bad. We didn't really mean it. SOWWWWWY! Can hardly stand the guilt.

 

Just an analogy- I'm not saying the impact of an affair on the BP is the same as that of a drone strike on a hospital. But just wanted to highlight the logic of collateral damage.

 

And I was trying to say that there's a difference and the collateral damage paradigm doesn't fit an affair. You don't need a hospital to be there for the strike to be successful. But you do need a BP to be there to serve the plot function of an obstacle for the affair to be intense and amazing.

 

So however much the presence of the BS is minimized and however unreal s/he becomes, without him/her the affair might lose all its thrill.

 

On the point that it's the temporariness of the affair that makes it so thrilling. Probably true, but that temporariness can't happen without the BS. So once again she's crucial as a plot device. I wonder what would happen if the same sense of temporariness could be worked into a relationship with a single partner. It's hard to imagine the circumstance- but let's say it was someone about to be deployed. Would that relationship have the same intensity as an affair with an MM? Or does the presence of the BP (betrayed partner) and the possibility of her finding out and her hurt bring an extra special magic to an affair?

 

All this is true. The BS is an essential plot device, but I suppose I think it is t personally vindictive. It doesn't feel that way to The BS - it feels bloody personal and I have yelled everything you say about collateral damage at my WH in some form or other.

 

I think Nepali g around behind mummy's back is thrilling for men, especially those at mid life or with slight Madonna/whore issues. And competition must be a factor for some OW. But most of these deeper issues are hidden deep in their psyches. They are nt aware of them, which is why they believe themselves when they claim they didn't mean to hurt us. So although the BS is essential to the dynamics, I believe she/he is usually an unconscious presence for the APs if that makes sense? Or at least, the frisson created by her shadow is felt but they don't realise she/he is the reason the frisson is so compulsive and strong.

[stilltrying16]

around behind mummy's back is thrilling for men, especially those at mid life or with slight Madonna/whore issues. And competition must be a factor for some OW. But most of these deeper issues are hidden deep in their psyches. They are nt aware of them, which is why they believe themselves when they claim they didn't mean to hurt us. So although the BS is essential to the dynamics, I believe she/he is usually an unconscious presence for the APs if that makes sense? Or at least, the frisson created by her shadow is felt but they don't realise she/he is the reason the frisson is so compulsive and strong.

 

Wonderfully put. I'd never thought of it that way- and it makes complete sense to me. Thank you.

 

I think all of it is interestingly applicable to the MM in this case.

[loveisanaction]

Or does the presence of the BP (betrayed partner) and the possibility of her finding out and her hurt bring an extra special magic to an affair?

 

I've never understood that analogy.

 

Creeping around, lying, sneaking brings excitement to an affair? Knowing that the betrayed spouse could find out at any point in time makes the affair magical? Illicit sex makes the sex all the more powerful?

 

I don't get it. Isn't that kinda...errrrr....dysfunctional?

 

Knowing that you are doing something very immoral, so immoral that you could crush a person's heart in two if the person finds out... turns a person on?

 

Uuhmmm..Okay....

[sandylee1]

Still Trying - Or does the presence of the BP (betrayed partner) and the possibility of her finding out and her hurt bring an extra special magic to an affair?

 

I don't believe it's the BW being hurt that brings the thrill so much as the forbidden fruit and being able to have sex with another woman's husband. I've heard a number of OW say that it makes it so intense .... not too many on LS to be honest ... but targeting MM is a preference for some. It gives them a sense of power.

[stilltrying16]

Sandy, interesting point. I absolutely agree it's about power (not romance or soulmate- shyte- JMO). But I see it as the power to do hurt.

 

(In fact as someone who question the whole soulmate logic, I think many relationships passing as grand romances are nothing more than plays of power. JMO)

 

I was talking more about the MM's attitude than the OW's. I would question those who present the damage to their BW in terms of collateral or unintentional damage.

 

Anyway...it is such a depressing, ugly dynamic IMO- an affair. And it is what it is. For the BW it is a shyte sandwich whichever way you cut it. I suppose I'm not saying anything new there!

[ShamanLover]

@Heartwhole Thank you for your candour. Truly.

 

Yes, my feelings are indeed all over the place. I think another word for that is being human.

 

I do actually spend quite a bit of time in that place of empathy and compassion - I consider it my "higher self". And very occasionally - and it only started relatively recently - I am able to get in touch with some anger (mostly around having been sucked back in - correction: allowing myself to get sucked back in - and undoing six months of hard-won healing). I wrote this post from that place. It's the only place I can find the life force to tell my story from, and it is a well-defended place that gives me access to all of the other defense mechanisms that are probably evident in my post - analysis, over-intellectualization, blame shifting, etc. When I write from my sadness, it swallows me whole and it feels bottomless - in that place there are no words.

 

What you would have no way of knowing is that I have not been able to even LOOK at LS for months since this happened, because it triggered me too badly. I could not sleep, eat, work, play for longer than I feel comfortable admitting. I was almost hospitalized because I had lost so much weight, had suicidal thoughts, etc. The truth is that the depth and tenacity of my grief response to this experience terrifies me. Because I don't understand it. Because it seems so wildly disproportionate to what happened. Because it embarrasses me and makes me feel weak. Because I chose it on some level.

 

Yes, I am journaling and doing deep, difficult personal work and reading and experimenting with every self help modality under the sun. The one thing I hadn't tried is talking to people who had been there - some kind of support group. So I thought LS might help. Turns out I was wrong. Not because of any of you lovely people. Because of me. It's just too soon. It's still too raw. Perhaps I'll try again in a few months time...

 

Played with fire. Got burned. I get it.

 

In the meantime, let me leave you with the beautiful, moving passage from Elizabeth Lesser's Broken Open (highly recommended!) that inspired my profile name. Wishing everyone "good medicine" on their personal healing journey ahead

 

"...there in another kind of shaman – the kind I call the Shaman Lover. The Shaman Lover is a man or a woman whose destiny is to heal the heartsick with the sweetness of love, and to give the gift of fire to those whose passion is frozen. Some call the Shaman Lover a temptress or a cad, a siren or a snake. Sometimes this is true; sometimes the Shaman Lover has bad medicine to offer. Sometimes the smartest response to the allure is to run away. But sometimes the Shaman Lover has been sent by fate the blast us open, to awaken the dead parts of our body, to deliver the kiss of life. And if we succumb, we are changed forever.... it is the Shaman Lover who changed my life. It is the Shaman Lover who initiated me into womanhood through the healing power of sex, love, and passion. The Shaman Lover brought me all the way down into the underworld and left me there to find my way home. The journey down was as important as the journey up. He guided me down, and in finding my way back, I found myself.

 

Some will call my dance with the Shaman Lover just a clever name for an extramarital affair... "

 

That's the teaser You can read the rest of the excerpt here: []

Edited June 7, 2016 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
removed link ~6

[ShamanLover]

Oh, and in case it's not obvious, it's MM who is the Shaman Lover in this allegory, not me!

[lilajane]

I read the OP and it resonates with me. I'm a MW, not single, but what I feel for MM is more than I've ever felt for anyone in my life. I'm in the early stages of NC. He doesn't know yet, because he asked for a break. He said he was too busy, but I suspect he developed feelings too. I'm madly in love with him. I still think about him all the time. He was always honest with me and I agreed that this was about sex and fun, FWB. I had no idea what I was getting into. He def was my Shaman Lover. I was completely dead inside and thought real, passionate love was something in my past.

 

Thanks for the links to Laurel Richardson and Elizabeth Lesser's work. It will give me something else to focus on. I need a break from the pain of this heartbreak. I feel like I've had the best taste of love and passion, only to learn that it is all an illusion. I, too, pretended I wasn't feeling anything for him. I pretended I was going out all the time with friends, having fun, making him think I wasn't as into him as I was, that I had a whole other life. But I didn't. I was doing what I had to to keep him interested. I never bugged him. I brought him the best gifts. I told him everything he wanted to hear. I didn't always take his calls or answer his texts to entice the chase. I bought Jack's Blowjob Lesson book and introduced him to his own little porn star. He wound up being the best lover I ever had. Then he started avoiding me, telling me he was too busy to call. I suspect his excuse of being "busy" was about his feelings too because I ran into him and I could see the longing and pain in his eyes. He is a rough guy, with a thick shell that most people don't get past. I got way past it and the whole thing was very intense for both of us.

 

I know this is not real, but please explain that to my heart. Leaving him behind is one of the hardest things I've ever had to do. I had no idea what I was getting myself into. The highs were so high. But he woke me up. He returned something to me that I didn't even know I lost. I'm still going to say this was worth it. I think I'll always love him and be grateful. It's so hard, though.

 

OP, I don't mean to make this about me. I just wanted to share because I feel like we are going through similar feelings at the moment.

[Girlfromcali]

Those feelings you're describing are very typical. I certainly can relate when you're saying that the grief seems disproportionate to what actually happened. It's hard to understand but it's just the dynamic of affairs. I don't think anyone could really understand it if they haven't gone through it.

 

I think you might be right about the fact that it's too early for you to be here. It's too raw and too painful. I don't know if I could've been here a year ago. I was probably in such a denial that I wouldn't even have come here.

 

It's too painful. I get it. Don't torture yourself too much reading the stuff here too much. Do it little by little..take breaks, come back.

 

Take care of yourself..please. Reach out for friends, write down your feelings.. if not here, there are other places where you can dump your feelings on Internet.

[sandylee1]

Sandy, interesting point. I absolutely agree it's about power (not romance or soulmate- shyte- JMO). But I see it as the power to do hurt.

 

(In fact as someone who question the whole soulmate logic, I think many relationships passing as grand romances are nothing more than plays of power. JMO)

 

I was talking more about the MM's attitude than the OW's. I would question those who present the damage to their BW in terms of collateral or unintentional damage.

 

Anyway...it is such a depressing, ugly dynamic IMO- an affair. And it is what it is. For the BW it is a shyte sandwich whichever way you cut it. I suppose I'm not saying anything new there!

 

I don't even really think that MM want to hurt their wives with the affair. They usually don't want her to know about it and are happy to have wife and mistress.

 

The only exception would be an exit affair.

 

I just don't understand why if you're done... you don't up and leave rather than have an affair and be known as a cheater. In this case you do want your spouse to know or can't be bothered if they do.

 

You're right it's an ugly dynamic.

[Liam1]

like so many others, my MM made it clear from the beginning that he had no intention of leaving his wife, which suited me just fine as i was in it just for the sex and that made him “safe" (I won’t elaborate on my motives at this point

 

IMO, when a married man tells you this, most women in an affair need to believe it.

 

It's definitely a roll of the dice whether or not a MM will fall in love with his AP and an even bigger roll of the dice whether or not he will fall far enough in love with his AP to leave his wife.

 

Some men fall in love with their OWs . Some men fall in love with the affair...., almost like an addiction.

 

Still, the two other things I hear more often from MM is that the MM has a fondness for the OW but still loves his wife more and has no plans to leave her.

 

Or, the MM actually starts to dislike the OW when she backtracks on their original agreement and becomes too demanding of his time.

[ShamanLover]

IMO, when a married man tells you this, most women in an affair need to believe it.

 

It's definitely a roll of the dice whether or not a MM will fall in love with his AP and an even bigger roll of the dice whether or not he will fall far enough in love with his AP to leave his wife.

 

Some men fall in love with their OWs . Some men fall in love with the affair...., almost like an addiction.

 

Still, the two other things I hear more often from MM is that the MM has a fondness for the OW but still loves his wife more and has no plans to leave her.

 

Or, the MM actually starts to dislike the OW when she backtracks on their original agreement and becomes too demanding of his time.

Thanks for weighing in, @Liam1. It's always good to have the perspective of a MM.

 

Perhaps you missed the part about me not wanting him to leave his wife for me. I meant it, even after we fell for each other. I may be protecting myself somewhat by claiming not to have wanted him even if he had been available - in some parallel universe, it would have been nice to see where things might have led under different circumstances - but I wasn't certain enough about our long-term compatibility to have the dissolution of his marriage on my conscience. A relationship would have to be pretty rock solid (and the marriage he is leaving pretty ****ty) to withstand that kind of stress. And how do you evaluate the strength of a prospective relationship if you can't subject it to "real life" challenges? I am mourning the loss of the affair, exactly as it was, not some white picket fence happily ever after delusion.

 

You also seem to have overlooked the fact that HE backtracked on the original agreement, not me. Well, technically we both did, but HIS feelings, and the detrimental impact they were having on his marriage, were the reason he couldn't continue.

 

I object to the notion that MM don't leave their wives simply because they don't fall "deeply enough" in love with the AP. I can't generalize because I (thankfully) don't have a large enough data pool to draw upon, but I can tell you from first-hand experience that some pull the plug preemptively when they see things going in that direction because they don't WANT to leave their marriage.

[ShamanLover]

Just to elaborate on the theme of not seeing your AP as LTR material, because I think it's an interesting one... some of MY reasons included: the fact that he had been married twice and cheated on both wives, and that made me dubious about his communication skills. I (perhaps confusingly) value open, honest, vulnerable communication above all else in my interpersonal relationships, even when - no, especially when - the topic gets uncomfortable. For whatever reason, he uses affairs to avoid confronting the core challenges in his relationships. "My" guy would face his issues unflinchingly, and either fix them, or, if all efforts to do so fail, exit the relationship before pursuing something else. I have never cheated on a partner, and I'm not sure under what circumstances I would forgive it (although I am open to "open" arrangements, being clear-eyed about the fact that monogamy may be unrealistic over a lifetime with one person).

Edited May 19, 2016 by ShamanLover

[Sunnycalb808]

I dunno but this is starting to sound alot to me kike OW constructing narratives of the MM just being too overtaken by OW fabulousness to handle his emotions and thus ending the A.....as opposed to MM simply dumping OW for whatever reason.

 

I just have a hard time believing a MM would run from the supposed greatest sex and love of his life....all bc he feared it might effect home life.

 

I do think many MM love and adore their OW....but thats only in their role as OW. They usually end things bc of it getting stale, or becoming too much drama/trouble. Not bc they are falling in love. Remember, these are by definition selfish self-serving men.

[WasOtherWoman]

 

I do think many MM love and adore their OW....but thats only in their role as OW.

 

LOL, my MM told me I most disagreeable and difficult as an OW.

 

Maybe being an awful OW is the recipe for a lasting relationship?

Edited May 19, 2016 by WasOtherWoman
added last paragraph