Mrs. John Adams Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 I like that and I respect your decision. Some women consider working a critical part of taking caring of their family. The biblical Virtuous Woman passage (Proverbs 31:10 - 31) contains several lines that suggest a woman earning money to provide for her family's welfare is beneficial. Not necessarily a job, but doing whatever it takes to secure the welfare of her family. I don't think there is a right or wrong answer as long as the family is taken care of. You notice I said work outside the home... Lol I keep my house perfect... I take care of much of the yardwork ...I do the shopping... I am very familiar with proverbs 31... And I have always run my household with pride. I had a hard time in the early 80s when we were bombarded with the idea that we were "just house wives"... I began to doubt my importance. That's when I went back to school and when I had my affair. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
DreamP Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 My "issue" is with women who get married, have kids - yet wanna diss the family and kids to continue with their "careers", "dreams" etc. - which IMO, is the equivalent of a man who gets married, works all day/night and just expects to come home and boink his wife as if she was a call-girl and then go to bed. And why is it you don't have this same issue with men? Why are women supposed to sacrifice their ambitions? If a man puts his career first and family second (which happens ALL the time, both due to necessity as well as because we as a society encourage this behavior), why aren't people so outraged compared to if a woman did this. This whole tread is about whether a mother should work. We should be having discussions about having as single working parent or dual working parents. The fact this conversation is so heavily geared towards working mothers makes me angry. This is the 21st century and we still have to fight these types of gender discrimination. 5 Link to post Share on other sites
xxoo Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 The question really should be: Should both parents work? Not, should a wife work? When there are two parents, there are two adults capable of earning money, keeping a home, and raising children. In my marriage, we both do all of those things. The proportions have shifted according to our family's needs. It's a difficult balance, for sure, but isn't a gender-dependent balance. 7 Link to post Share on other sites
No_Go Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 What do you think about SAHDs? It seems to be becoming as common as SAHMs was in the 50s. At least 3 friends of mine got full-time house-husbands (what were working before marrying them). In my family, I'm sure it will be looked down, but if I stay with my current BF, I can foresee it as our only option in the future (he's just not ambitious at all and I have much higher earning potential). Deep inside, I think I'll built resentment if the SAHD situation happens though. I suspect the husbands of SAHMs may feel the same way? Link to post Share on other sites
Gloria25 Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 You notice I said work outside the home... Lol I keep my house perfect... I take care of much of the yardwork ...I do the shopping... I am very familiar with proverbs 31... And I have always run my household with pride. I had a hard time in the early 80s when we were bombarded with the idea that we were "just house wives"... I began to doubt my importance. That's when I went back to school and when I had my affair. And that's a big point for me... People don't get it that there's a bigger plan behind all these "groups" advocating "rights". Pulling women out of the home and telling them they oughta do this/that destroys families - but what do I know since I'm not married and/or had kids. Or society, in order to keep the "pyramid" in tact (few on top supported by many on the bottom), requires control of those people and manipulation of those people to meet certain goals. Destroy the concept of "family" and you'll have a break down in society. Our society is based on the family. If you have no one "parenting" you have kids that we have now - self-centered brats with alleged "mental illnesses" (which IMO, is a detachment disorder from not having a mother around and/or dual parents working and neglecting them). So, break down the family unit, break down society - and when chaos ensues, "someone/something" must come in to restore "order" and that's where government comes in and takes control over a people who cannot police themselves. The o'l concept of "divide and conquer". Divide our society into "groups" by race, gender, sexuality - who are constantly battling and it's easier to take them over. Link to post Share on other sites
Gloria25 Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 And why is it you don't have this same issue with men? Why are women supposed to sacrifice their ambitions? If a man puts his career first and family second (which happens ALL the time, both due to necessity as well as because we as a society encourage this behavior), why aren't people so outraged compared to if a woman did this. This whole tread is about whether a mother should work. We should be having discussions about having as single working parent or dual working parents. The fact this conversation is so heavily geared towards working mothers makes me angry. This is the 21st century and we still have to fight these types of gender discrimination. It's that like it or not, the woman has a more influential role in the "home" than a father has. Look at us physiologically. We carry children in our bodies for "months", our children depend on us for milk the first few years of their lives. We're not disposable. A baby sitter cannot replace us. There's an intangible thing that takes place when a woman is present for her children and family. Men, their bodies are meant for hard labor. Emotionally they can't even relate to others and/or kids like we women were built to do. So, if anyone is confused about the impact males and females have on the family, then look at biology/physiology. Even with working moms, they physiologically have to stop working when it gets close to due date of baby. They just don't pop out a baby like a basket ball and go back to work. Their bodies need healing. If women were meant to be self-suficient, then why can't a woman give birth at 4PM and clock back into work the next day? Why does a child need to get her breast milk? Men were built to "provide/protect". Yes, there are some weak men, but they're the exception and not the rule (well in this society they're becoming the rule). It's not gender discrimination. On a football team not everyone can be the quarterback. Each player on the team has their "role" and they come together and make it happen. None is less than the other even though they have skills and/or talents and/or physical abilities that differ from each other. They need each other. The differences should be "respected". But, when you try to raise and/or discuss these "differences" between the sexes, you're discriminating. Meh, me? Yea, I wouldn't want to stop working and depend on a guy. I guess it came from the insecurities I developed from having a dead beat dad. But, with my FWB, it felt freakin' nice to let down my guard and just let him "do" things for me (i.e. driving, fixing stuff, etc.). The "dance" between male and female is beautiful if you ask me. No, I don't wanna be a slug who depends on a guy, but now, if a guy offers to pay for my dinner and/or do stuff for me, I'm not gonna be as rude and ignorant like I was in the past with my "I can do it for myself" attitude. And no one is telling women to sacrifice their "ambitions". If you want to have a career, go have one. If you want to have a family, then don't diss them to pursue your "ambitions". You can't call yourself a "mother" just cuz a few hours a day you change diapers. And if a mother thinks that a baby-sitter is as good as she is, then she needs to change her title from "mother" and call herself a "surrogate" and/or "baby-sitter" too. Link to post Share on other sites
serial muse Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 People don't get it that there's a bigger plan behind all these "groups" advocating "rights". Pulling women out of the home and telling them they oughta do this/that destroys families - but what do I know since I'm not married and/or had kids. Or society, in order to keep the "pyramid" in tact (few on top supported by many on the bottom), requires control of those people and manipulation of those people to meet certain goals. Destroy the concept of "family" and you'll have a break down in society. Our society is based on the family. If you have no one "parenting" you have kids that we have now - self-centered brats with alleged "mental illnesses" (which IMO, is a detachment disorder from not having a mother around and/or dual parents working and neglecting them). So, break down the family unit, break down society - and when chaos ensues, "someone/something" must come in to restore "order" and that's where government comes in and takes control over a people who cannot police themselves. The o'l concept of "divide and conquer". Divide our society into "groups" by race, gender, sexuality - who are constantly battling and it's easier to take them over. Oooh. Who's that then? Do you mean our current government or is there another shadowy force waiting in the wings? 4 Link to post Share on other sites
basil67 Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 I had every intention of returning to work after the birth of my first. Then as his disabilities became apparent, we realised that I would remain a carer. The most I've managed is some part time work while his school hours were regular enough for me to be able to commit. I can't see that there is a *should* in this argument at all. 5 Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 Well, in a law-abiding and generally peaceful society, who benefits from chaos and conflict and social strife and discord? Follow the money Hint: It's not, generally, the rank and file working wives and mothers. I remember, back when I was a young adult, plenty of women my age (20's) who were working with kids basically had nothing left after paying the government extortion and that new thing, child care, a product carefully crafted for the working mom. Some said screw it and went back to SAHM'dom. Others toughed it out to gain work experience and add something to the family coffers. That was a marked departure from when I was a kid, when practically no mother had a 'job' outside the home, except those women who worked in the family business, like doing bookkeeping for the farm or running the counter at the store and the like. Then again, the kids were working too. Everyone worked. Then came more 'laws'. Follow that money. Link to post Share on other sites
xxoo Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 A father can nurture and raise children just as well as a mother. Gestating and nursing aside, there is nothing that a mother can do that a father can not do. The pregnancy and infant stage really is an exception. Biologically, the mother will naturally carry a greater burden during this stage. But it's a short stage, and should not be the basis of long term decisions regarding family structure and parenting roles. Parenting responsibilities go on for a good 17 years past the average weaning stage. 6 Link to post Share on other sites
GorillaTheater Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 I'm glad that my wife was able to be a SAHM, since it's what she wanted to do and we were in a position to do so. But boy, am I f*cked if we ever get a divorce ... 1 Link to post Share on other sites
thefooloftheyear Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 I'm glad that my wife was able to be a SAHM, since it's what she wanted to do and we were in a position to do so. But boy, am I f*cked if we ever get a divorce ... Just about what I was gonna say..... If you are a young guy and are thinking this out, you better consider this.....And think of it very hard.... I know a guy that's still paying alimony,......He was divorced in, I think... 1981...?? TFY 3 Link to post Share on other sites
loveweary11 Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 Far more challenging is to get both careers to work *together*. I personally prefer an unemployed girlfriend so she can travel and work with me, enjoying freedom and not needing to answer to anyone. Link to post Share on other sites
purplesorrow Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 And that's a big point for me... People don't get it that there's a bigger plan behind all these "groups" advocating "rights". Pulling women out of the home and telling them they oughta do this/that destroys families - but what do I know since I'm not married and/or had kids. Or society, in order to keep the "pyramid" in tact (few on top supported by many on the bottom), requires control of those people and manipulation of those people to meet certain goals. Destroy the concept of "family" and you'll have a break down in society. Our society is based on the family. If you have no one "parenting" you have kids that we have now - self-centered brats with alleged "mental illnesses" (which IMO, is a detachment disorder from not having a mother around and/or dual parents working and neglecting them). So, break down the family unit, break down society - and when chaos ensues, "someone/something" must come in to restore "order" and that's where government comes in and takes control over a people who cannot police themselves. The o'l concept of "divide and conquer". Divide our society into "groups" by race, gender, sexuality - who are constantly battling and it's easier to take them over. Just curious about this mindset. You post often about being an ow. Do you not feel that role also helps to destroy families? 2 Link to post Share on other sites
len51 Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 It depends on your financial situation. When we first got married my wife supported us while I was in College. Then she got disabled for two years I had to leave college and get a full time job. I was trying to go to school and hold down 3 part time jobs and it was not enough. I had bill collectors after me for medical expenses and I just told them that I have nothing to give them and they were welcome to come and take what they wanted. Once I started making good money I told my wife that if she wanted to stay home, she could. We had no children so she was free to work if she wanted to. She basically worked for a year or two and then stopped for a few years. She stopped working altogether 10 years ago. Link to post Share on other sites
MuddyFootprints Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 I think my youngest was 5 when I transitioned into a full time SAHM. I worked my tail off. I was always at the school, sat on the boards for athletics, volunteering in the community while the career moms followed an employment path. I was the mom you could call for anything. Weighing it out, now, I still wonder if we chose the right path. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
xxoo Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 I think my youngest was 5 when I transitioned into a full time SAHM. I worked my tail off. I was always at the school, sat on the boards for athletics, volunteering in the community while the career moms followed an employment path. I was the mom you could call for anything. Weighing it out, now, I still wonder if we chose the right path. I know those moms! Thank you for your service!!! It means a lot to us working moms 4 Link to post Share on other sites
DreamP Posted April 1, 2016 Share Posted April 1, 2016 Men, their bodies are meant for hard labor. Emotionally they can't even relate to others and/or kids like we women were built to do. That is a very sexist view that limits both men and women. We are no longer in the era that hard labor is the required strength that supports a family. Not only do we not have too many physical labor jobs as before, we also allow women to do whatever men can do. Men can connect to their children and others just as much as women. It is only social perceptions that limit men and women behave. I'm sorry you haven't experienced that in life, but you cannot judge half the world's population on your limited experience. Also why do you continually insist a woman having a job equates to them dissing their children? 5 Link to post Share on other sites
Lady2163 Posted April 1, 2016 Share Posted April 1, 2016 What's interesting to me is the focus of this has been primarily couples who have children. I'm past the age of having children. I'm around 50 and getting reading to retire in 60 days. I've worked hard to get to this point. I'm going to buy my dream house. I'm going to have a bit of disposable income. Enough that I can pretty much buy what I want. Well, not a Ferrari or an Escalde, but I don't really want those. I can probably afford a $5000 trip every year. Anyway, I'm going to be comfortable for the rest of my life. And I won't have to work. And I will probably hire someone to clean my house and do yard work. So, most of my "work" will just be daily routine of feeding myself, laundry and picking up after myself. Years ago I was dating a man and he lived two hours away. He'd been a bit irrespsonsible in previous years. He wanted to move to my area and we discussed living together and essentially fast tracking the relationship. At the time I was going to college and working part time at a job that paid a bit more than minimum wage. For him to move in a me to support him until he got a real job about six months later (he'd let a professional certification lapse and we needed to save for that fee); I would have to go back to work full time at a job with real stress. I'd have to go to school year round. This was to cover his debts. We were "assuming" he'd get a part time job of at least 20 hours at minimum wage. When we crunched all the numbers and came up with the only scenario for me to support him and I explained to him what my week would be like, he didn't see a problem with it. It was fine with him that I work 50 hours a week, spend 12 hours a week in a classroom and X number of hours writing papers and studying. All the while, he would be "pulling his weight" by working his part time job. What a prince. Anyway, what I'm getting at is: I've done my time. I've sacrificed and made do so I could retire this young. It is not okay for a man to think I need to work since I am bringing an income to the table. I'm not interested in bringing a double income so "we" (or his kids) can afford more toys. Or that I can pay to put his kids through college. I've got almost all the toys I want. Almost. I wouldn't mind a boat, but I've always felt since I didn't live on a lake and have a dock, I needed two people for that toy. Nor do I plan to support a man who is healthy. I've worked for my life of leisure, I'm not going to cut my quality of life so he can mooch from me. So, I expect a man to carry his share of our life together and to keep up with me. If he is spending more than he makes or has never planned for retirement, we aren't going to be compatible. Link to post Share on other sites
TX-SC Posted April 1, 2016 Share Posted April 1, 2016 My wife has a college degree and works hard every day. Aside from maternity leave (x2), she has always worked. My kids were in daycare during the day until they started school. Link to post Share on other sites
Els Posted April 1, 2016 Share Posted April 1, 2016 There should be no special expectations on wives simply because they are wives. Married partners are a team and should have a team approach to meeting family needs, utilizing the strengths of each partner. Women working is no reason or excuse for cheating. That's absurd. Quoting for so much truth. There is no 'should' or 'should not' - well, except for the fact that couples should figure out together a solution that works for them in their current circumstances. 5 Link to post Share on other sites
OpenBook Posted April 1, 2016 Share Posted April 1, 2016 I work with mostly men, about half of whom are married with kids. They regularly take time off from work (or work from home) to pick up the kids from school, take them to doctor visits, taxi them to sporting events, etc. A far cry from when I was younger. Some of their wives work, some of them don't. Doesn't seem to make a difference - they are most definitely involved fathers and do all the family-nurturing tasks that just 20 years ago was normally handled by the wife. They don't even brag or make a big deal out of it; it's all very matter-of-fact. They don't know it, but I am silently applauding them. It's very refreshing and heartening to witness. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Phoenician Posted April 1, 2016 Share Posted April 1, 2016 Definetly it is the choice and decision by the wife ; however it is important to analyze each case specifically ; and what she wants from life . the rules are simple , you want a great family , many kids and a happy husband ? then you shouldn't set your career as highest priority ; instead if it is just don't make wrong choices such as having 3-4 kids were you expect them to be raised alone . The role of wife at home is a sacred one , not just cook and babysit ; she is a school . in many societies and religions the wife gets a salary from from husband for the wonderful job ; even some future security if divorced. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
waterwoman Posted April 1, 2016 Share Posted April 1, 2016 You should tiddled off about that. Do you think you would have been happier if you as the high earner worked and he stayed at home to do the house work etc rather than you both work? I would have been, yes, but only if he had actually started to take care of the house. I always used to say I wanted a 'wife'. I work with men who sometimes moaned about having to work when their wives stayed home and I always told them how lucky they were - to get home to a warm reasonably clean home, a meal on the way and minimal chores to do. H would have hated it. Which is why it never happened. Link to post Share on other sites
xxoo Posted April 1, 2016 Share Posted April 1, 2016 No parent--woman or man--should have career as first priority. Its a balance, but quite obviously the survival of children is the first priority. The more men adopt this attitude, the more mothers and fathers share the load and each has room to grow a career. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
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