His wife texted me asking to meet- what do I do? [Updated 2016-12-2]

June 10, 2016

I have been following this story for quite sometime and i have to say I'm absolutely shocked the BS isn't suing for defamation of character. To use her mental/medical history against her in a court of law when neither you nor your lawyer has access to her medical records seems super shady. It doesn't seem ethical or moral to use her history as a sword against her especially since that history is being spread by hearsay.

Edited June 10, 2016 by desert_punk
cant spell

June 10, 2016

I am just confused how the lawyers were able to talk so openly about the wife's confidential medical information. Can someone please explain how that is even allowed?

The 2 lawyers talked. My lawyer talked to me after their lawyer walked out of the room. He relayed everything their lawyer said. Their lawyer was prepared for everything my lawyer threw at her. Including the videos xMM had provided me that he took after his wife destroyed their house.

June 10, 2016

I've said this before..I suspect it's because OP is still hoping MM will leave his wife and be with her. I get the feeling that she's making this as difficult as humanly possible because she wants him to get fed up and divorce his wife for her just to escape all the hassle.

I want him to walk. He's going to, eventually. I'd rather him do it before baby knows him then when she's 3 years old and bonded to him and he just walks out and leaves her with memories. He will fall in love with the novelty of her and then turn his back on her. I'd rather him disappear now while she's blissfully unaware of his existence.

There's no more nostalgia on my end. The sad love faded into anger weeks and weeks ago. I'm just in a constant state of being pissed off.. Not lovelorn.

June 10, 2016

The 2 lawyers talked. My lawyer talked to me after their lawyer walked out of the room. He relayed everything their lawyer said. Their lawyer was prepared for everything my lawyer threw at her. Including the videos xMM had provided me that he took after his wife destroyed their house.

So what was their lawyer's response to said videos?

June 10, 2016

I want him to walk. He's going to, eventually. I'd rather him do it before baby knows him then when she's 3 years old and bonded to him and he just walks out and leaves her with memories. He will fall in love with the novelty of her and then turn his back on her. I'd rather him disappear now while she's blissfully unaware of his existence.

.

Why now do you want him to walk away when I thought it was a relationship with your babys father that you wanted for her? Why now do you want him to walk away? You don't know that he will eventually walk away from her. What are you pissed off about, you got the CS.

June 10, 2016

I've said this before..I suspect it's because OP is still hoping MM will leave his wife and be with her. I get the feeling that she's making this as difficult as humanly possible because she wants him to get fed up and divorce his wife for her just to escape all the hassle.

So what was their lawyer's response to said videos?

She knew he gave them to me. She knew all of the 'ammo' my lawyer was ready to use to prevent the wife from having contact. She knew about even more social media stalking that I did not, she apparently gained access to a family only access account, because the lawyer was asking why I was in town on a certain date. I went and deactivated/deleted EVERYTHING afterward.

As far as the apartment, I paid my own rent. I move out completely in 2 weeks. My lawyer didn't tell them that but I moved there at xMM insistence. XMM didn't confess to his own lawyer how long I lived there because I'm sure he didn't want his wife to know how long the affair was and that's fine. When I moved there I gave him the choice of 2 places of where I could live and he chose the apartment I was living in as it was closest to his office. I still need to move all my furniture into storage as I don't need it here at moms but I'll be gone from that area soon enough.

June 10, 2016

Why now do you want him to walk away when I thought it was a relationship with your babys father that you wanted for her? Why now do you want him to walk away? You don't know that he will eventually walk away from her. What are you pissed off about, you got the CS.

Because she's now 5 months old and my postpartum hormones have leveled off. I'm mentally in a much better frame. I've been the sole caretaker of baby and have realized, I do not need his help. The connection my daughter and I share is unreal and the fact we now have my parents, is an added bonus to our family constellation. I'd rather him back out before baby gets to know him. XMM gets excited about things but then loses interest. I don't want my daughter suffering that. i don't want my daughter having to go through this circus because right now I will not change my mind about the wife. I don't trust her. She views me as a threat to the point where he and I cannot coparent at all except through a third party facilitator, and that's fine; but I don't want any potential anger she may harbor for me or for him about the affair to filter through my daughter. The fact she was still stalking my personal family Facebook up until the day we went to court tells me she will not let thoughts of me going and she may relive those feelings of angst when she looks at my child.

And why am I pissed off? You live the last year and a half of my life. Much of pain has been self-chosen, sure, but some of the things others have done in this time to my daughter and to me are unforgivable. Maybe in time but id rather be angry than lovelorn.

June 10, 2016

The 2 lawyers talked. My lawyer talked to me after their lawyer walked out of the room. He relayed everything their lawyer said. Their lawyer was prepared for everything my lawyer threw at her. Including the videos xMM had provided me that he took after his wife destroyed their house.

Waaaaaaaaait. Their lawyer supposedly told your lawyer all this stuff about his clients?

Either [] your lawyer made it up, or it did happen and both of your lawyers are total losers taking you both for a ride.

Your lawyers obligation on getting that information isn't to tell you, it's to report the other lawyer because it makes the whole case you have 100% tenuous. It's a breech of ethics and if that lawyer is found out and found to have told your lawyer, they're both in serious trouble and it voids any agreement made by or mediated by said lawyer.

Where is the mediator in all of this information sharing?

I find it difficult-to-impossible to believe a lawyer incriminated his own client to the opposing counsel, opposing counsel took the information and rode with it, and the mediator said "cool story bro" and did nothing.

Edited June 10, 2016 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

June 10, 2016

Mayday

If she honestly had any ill feeling towards your daughter, why do you think she's the one who initially contacted you and said they want a relationship with your DD?

Because honestly an awful lot of BWs would be pushing for total no contact with your DD and just have their WH pay CS. Infact many state that's the only way they will not divorce, because they realise that a relationship with the child usually means contact with the EX OW.

I can't think of a logical reason why and I'm deep down you know that she's the one pushing him for visitation.

Can you answer why his lawyer would discuss confidential info like him wanting a divorce with you/your lawyer? If I were you I'd be wondering what your lawyer tells his lawyer .... like that Maydays Ex isn't paying CS for her other 2 kids so she really needs this money.

June 10, 2016

Because she's now 5 months old and my postpartum hormones have leveled off. I'm mentally in a much better frame. I've been the sole caretaker of baby and have realized, I do not need his help. The connection my daughter and I share is unreal and the fact we now have my parents, is an added bonus to our family constellation. I'd rather him back out before baby gets to know him. XMM gets excited about things but then loses interest. I don't want my daughter suffering that. i don't want my daughter having to go through this circus because right now I will not change my mind about the wife. I don't trust her. She views me as a threat to the point where he and I cannot coparent at all except through a third party facilitator, and that's fine; but I don't want any potential anger she may harbor for me or for him about the affair to filter through my daughter. The fact she was still stalking my personal family Facebook up until the day we went to court tells me she will not let thoughts of me going and she may relive those feelings of angst when she looks at my child.

And why am I pissed off? You live the last year and a half of my life. Much of pain has been self-chosen, sure, but some of the things others have done in this time to my daughter and to me are unforgivable. Maybe in time but id rather be angry than lovelorn.

But you don't get to choose to cut him out because you don't want to deal with him or think he will abandon her, or because your life is complete as is. It's his baby, he has equal rights to the child, shared with you. And because of that, in turn you share rights with his wife, who you even say wants to be involved.

Since he hasn't abandoned his other child, there's no reason to think he will abandon this child. Especially given at this point it would be easier for him to vanish and he has chosen not to.

You also don't get to cut him out and collect child support.

If the endgame is to force him out, why the song and dance about custody and child support and getting him to be accountable? Ask him to sign his rights away, collect only the arrears (though if he signs it away he may not have to pay that) and terminate child support, and go on about your life.

If you're unwilling to do so, or he's not allowing you to do so, then you have to play ball and accept that he has a legal right to the child, as does his wife.

June 10, 2016

B

If the endgame is to force him out, why the song and dance about custody and child support and getting him to be accountable?

.

I believe MD envisaged her EX MM coming over to her apartment to spend time with the baby and them playing happy families while he was with her.

She never anticipated his wife being involved for one minute from many of her earlier comments.

June 10, 2016

As far as the apartment, I paid my own rent. I move out completely in 2 weeks. My lawyer didn't tell them that but I moved there at xMM insistence. XMM didn't confess to his own lawyer how long I lived there because I'm sure he didn't want his wife to know how long the affair was and that's fine. When I moved there I gave him the choice of 2 places of where I could live and he chose the apartment I was living in as it was closest to his office. I still need to move all my furniture into storage as I don't need it here at moms but I'll be gone from that area soon enough.

Did MM give you the 1st and last month, plus security deposit to move in? Did he pay all of your moving expenses to be there?

June 10, 2016

I believe MD envisaged her EX MM coming over to her apartment to spend time with the baby and them playing happy families while he was with her.

She never anticipated his wife being involved for one minute from many of her earlier comments.

I'm getting that vibe too. Either he'd go be with her or they'd have the secret family that he was equally invested in as the "main" family.

June 11, 2016

I'm getting that vibe too. Either he'd go be with her or they'd have the secret family that he was equally invested in as the "main" family.

Actually yes your right, because I recall you (May) were having him served at his workplace to prevent his wife finding out. So you would have been satisfied with DD being a secret from his wife.

May, you keep saying you've been managing alone with DD since she was born. In reality many many single parents do this every day so bearing in mind the circumstances of the situation it's no suprise.

June 11, 2016

Did MM give you the 1st and last month, plus security deposit to move in? Did he pay all of your moving expenses to be there?

He never gave me any money for anything. He only ever gave me anything for the baby when the court told him to. he never paid my rent, he never bought groceries, or diapers, he bought us takeaway maybe 15 times in 15 months (so 1x a month) the only thing he'd ever spend money on was beer and HIS hotel rooms when he lived in them for 2 months. He'd bring me beer often to my apartment and once a cheap bottle of wine when I was in my second trimester. He drank his, would crack something open for me and it would sit undisturbed on my nightstand. (We won't go there..) but no. He told me to move next to his work but I had to pay for it all. Back then my xH was paying his alimony and CS religiously. XH didn't stop that until November/December. Then it all nosedived.

Edited June 11, 2016 by Mayday2016

June 11, 2016

May he has treated you horribly. TBH, he wasn't even treating you like his OW but less. Why would you bare the cost of moving close to him? Why didn't you make him pay for it otherwise, no go? Plus the fact that he bailed the moment he found out you were pregnant tells me there was no love for you on his part.

June 11, 2016

Because she's now 5 months old and my postpartum hormones have leveled off. I'm mentally in a much better frame. I've been the sole caretaker of baby and have realized, I do not need his help. The connection my daughter and I share is unreal and the fact we now have my parents, is an added bonus to our family constellation. I'd rather him back out before baby gets to know him. XMM gets excited about things but then loses interest. I don't want my daughter suffering that. i don't want my daughter having to go through this circus because right now I will not change my mind about the wife. I don't trust her. She views me as a threat to the point where he and I cannot coparent at all except through a third party facilitator, and that's fine; but I don't want any potential anger she may harbor for me or for him about the affair to filter through my daughter. The fact she was still stalking my personal family Facebook up until the day we went to court tells me she will not let thoughts of me going and she may relive those feelings of angst when she looks at my child.

And why am I pissed off? You live the last year and a half of my life. Much of pain has been self-chosen, sure, but some of the things others have done in this time to my daughter and to me are unforgivable. Maybe in time but id rather be angry than lovelorn.

May, I'm glad that you've handled yourself well as a single parent to your daughter and that you two have such a nice bond.

You know, I also surprised myself with how well I adapted to single motherhood and hoow much I actually ended up actually loving it. My daughter and I have a really special connection that comes from years of being only the two of us, she is an amazing little girl and our life together is very stable and happy.

So when xMM came into our life again, I was 1) worried that he'll end up abandoning her, 2) mess up the stability I worked so hard to create, 3) wondered whether we actually need him.

Then I realized I may not need him, but my daughter does. No amount of closeness with me is going to make up for not having a father in her life. That is just a fact, she would have a huge chunk of her missing and it may not show now, nor in a few years, but it would certainly impact her.

My point is, don't wish for him to walk away, your daughter does need him. Try and facilitate that relationship, don't write it off already when it hasn't even begun. Try and make some adjustments to make it easier on everyone, why not talk to his wife on the phone or e-mail? It would probably calm her down a little bit, you wouldn't seem so hostile and she may relent after a while when she sees that there are no hidden intentions on your part.

Come September, your new court date, you can suggest making different arrangements for the pick up/drop off and she might actually agree. After all, with time and some effort on your part, her anger may cool down a little bit and she may become more open.

Your daughter can only benefit from it.

June 11, 2016

May he has treated you horribly. TBH, he wasn't even treating you like his OW but less. Why would you bare the cost of moving close to him? Why didn't you make him pay for it otherwise, no go? Plus the fact that he bailed the moment he found out you were pregnant tells me there was no love for you on his part.

Oh, he said "I support you" when I initially told him right up until I was 17ish weeks, but then he did a 180 and told me to get an abortion which I didn't want. That's when the emotions started to slow. They stopped completely at the end of September but he kept screwing me until 10 days before delivery and I slipped up and we had sex when she was 6 weeks old and I had served him with the first set of papers.

I didn't see it as horrible at the time. I saw the 8 hour a night texting. Til 4/5 am. I saw the emails where he'd share the traumas of his past. I would flash the same text where he said 'of course I have feelings for you' in my head over and over. I fixated on the way he kissed me. On how he begged to see me so we could "love each other" -- I didn't see the horrible treatment until after he left me standing in the doorway of my bedroom with our daughter in the bassinet and he walked out of the apartment, he didn't even look behind him. It clicked and slowly over these last few months I saw through the veil. He said a lot about loving each other. He pushed the right buttons connecting with me through music (it's my sole passion in life) so it felt like we were kindred spirits. He was very good at bonding me to him and getting me to agree to ANYTHING. One flash of his blue eyes and I was liquid. A lot has changed in 4 months. Not even being able to look at him in court has helped me move forward so much. I hate the pain in the ass restrictions but I'm grateful for them too. He knew how to play me.

June 11, 2016

But again, he is in arrears so he is paying back child support. So while he didn't pay anything at the time (without a court order why would he? There's no way to set an amount, no way to prove he paid or how much), he is paying and repaying it now.

And if you moved at his request and paid out of pocket for it, that isn't his fault. He didn't force you to move... He shouldn't have asked you, but it's not his fault you agreed to go. That was your choice.

You've yet to clarify how he never met the child but was in the house with her to see you.

It just seems in this story, everything happens to you, it's all somebody else's fault. It's the insane BW, it's the court, it's the AP, it's now your ex husband... But never actually you.

He did treat you like crap, he did get away for too long not being in the baby's life, he did make unreasonable demands... But you put up with it. You agreed to it. You encouraged it. This isn't all him.

June 11, 2016

But again, he is in arrears so he is paying back child support. So while he didn't pay anything at the time (without a court order why would he? There's no way to set an amount, no way to prove he paid or how much), he is paying and repaying it now.

And if you moved at his request and paid out of pocket for it, that isn't his fault. He didn't force you to move... He shouldn't have asked you, but it's not his fault you agreed to go. That was your choice.

You've yet to clarify how he never met the child but was in the house with her to see you.

It just seems in this story, everything happens to you, it's all somebody else's fault. It's the insane BW, it's the court, it's the AP, it's now your ex husband... But never actually you.

He did treat you like crap, he did get away for too long not being in the baby's life, he did make unreasonable demands... But you put up with it. You agreed to it. You encouraged it. This isn't all him.

I nursed her, he kept his back to us. I laid her in the bassinet, he refused to look down at her. He did hold her when she was 6 days old. He begged me to meet him at a hotel because he was 'depressed' and needed me to "love him".. I figured it was my last chance since 2 weeks before that he had 'broken up' with me. I told him I needed to grab something from the car so I laid baby on one of the double beds and left the room. When I came back he was swaying with her in his arms patting her back awkwardly. He waited a minute or two before giving her back to me. That is the only t

June 11, 2016

Folks, we need to do some member cleanup so will close this briefly while taking care of that and then will reopen. Long thread so remember to keep it topical in the present and always respectful. It goes better for everyone that way.

OK, review since update complete, one member banned and another moderated. I hope this can proceed in an orderly and civil fashion or I'll do a more in-depth review and clean things up further. Let's leave the interrogations for the courtroom, shall we? This is a relationship discussion forum. Thanks!

Edited June 11, 2016 by William
Reopened thread

June 11, 2016

I want him to walk. He's going to, eventually. I'd rather him do it before baby knows him then when she's 3 years old and bonded to him and he just walks out and leaves her with memories. He will fall in love with the novelty of her and then turn his back on her. I'd rather him disappear now while she's blissfully unaware of his existence.

There's no more nostalgia on my end. The sad love faded into anger weeks and weeks ago. I'm just in a constant state of being pissed off.. Not lovelorn.

Then why go through all this? His actions have shown you who he is, and not only that but his past behavior with his other kids. He's always been a detached and absent father and sadly he'll continue to be that.

Leave it alone, you're getting child support so just back off of the visitation. He isn't interested.

Live happily with your baby and other children, look forward to the summer and have fun.

June 11, 2016

Waaaaaaaaait. Their lawyer supposedly told your lawyer all this stuff about his clients?

Either [] your lawyer made it up, or it did happen and both of your lawyers are total losers taking you both for a ride.

Your lawyers obligation on getting that information isn't to tell you, it's to report the other lawyer because it makes the whole case you have 100% tenuous. It's a breech of ethics and if that lawyer is found out and found to have told your lawyer, they're both in serious trouble and it voids any agreement made by or mediated by said lawyer.

Where is the mediator in all of this information sharing?

I find it difficult-to-impossible to believe a lawyer incriminated his own client to the opposing counsel, opposing counsel took the information and rode with it, and the mediator said "cool story bro" and did nothing.

I can't speak to the law in any other country but here, the laws in a courtroom are different than those that apply to mediation, and a lawyer is not obligated to disclose any information at all, especially confidential information. This is what makes this sound so strange. Why would the op;s ex-mm lawyer reveal of of this information, if he doesn't have to?

Also, and "video" of a wrecked house would likely be thrown out as evidence of anything, as there is no real way of authenticating it. Anyone can mess up a room and say someone else did it.

June 11, 2016

I can't speak to the law in any other country but here, the laws in a courtroom are different than those that apply to mediation, and a lawyer is not obligated to disclose any information at all, especially confidential information. This is what makes this sound so strange. Why would the op;s ex-mm lawyer reveal of of this information, if he doesn't have to?

Also, and "video" of a wrecked house would likely be thrown out as evidence of anything, as there is no real way of authenticating it. Anyone can mess up a room and say someone else did it.

Anything that is done in mediation can be used in litigation should mediation fail. So the lawyers are still bound to maintain a certain level of decorum and confidentiality and report any and all breeches to a presiding judge. It can be used against them later, so their own lawyer violating confidentiality and medical at a mediation... That's not ok.

And I agree about the wrecked house. Ask Amber Heard.

June 11, 2016

Anything that is done in mediation can be used in litigation should mediation fail. So the lawyers are still bound to maintain a certain level of decorum and confidentiality and report any and all breeches to a presiding judge. It can be used against them later, so their own lawyer violating confidentiality and medical at a mediation... That's not ok.

And I agree about the wrecked house. Ask Amber Heard.

Yeah, I just can't see any lawyer conducting themselves in a manner that would get them disbarred over representing clients. (No offence here, but especially clients that are not generating annual millions towards their firm). They have no vested interest in the overall "justice" of anything beyond their own client, actually they want to have a reputation of being an excellent lawyer defending their client and minimizing any payouts/culpability, to bring in future clients.

If the OP has skewed perceptions of how the mediation went, it naturally follows how skewed their perception is on all that has transpired. Are they listening to what others are saying or is their a closed-caption script already assigned to all the players...running on auto-pilot?

I do not recall if the OP is in IC or not...being a caregiver to so many, it is vital for the wellbeing of all them for there to be additional support in place.

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His wife texted me asking to meet- what do I do? [Updated 2016-12-2]

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