MightyQuinn Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 This is long... Sorry... Thanks to anyone who can slog through it and offer a helpful response... OK, I've known New Guy for 11 months, we've been dating since March, though it hasn't been very serious until more recently. At first, we were making out like crazy but wanted to delay sex to get to know each other. We didn't want to ruin things by moving too fast. It was a mutual decision, but I really wanted to take it slow because honestly, I had just come out of a marriage a few months previous where sex had replaced intimacy, and I was in the process of finishing up the divorce. I didn't want to just jump into bed, I really wanted to get to know New Guy. He had said sex was very serious with him, he didn't just give it away like a lot of guys, and I thought that was awesome - I don't just give it away, either. We fooled around a lot, though. About 3 months in, we finally had sex. It was short, we didn't even finish. He was exhausted from working 12 hours shifts and could barely stay awake, so I didn't think anything of it. I was still excited for the possibility of more. Then sex basically came entirely off the table. We still made out and had fun, so I was OK with it, at first, because we connect so well, we have such great conversations. I thought maybe he had freaked out a little bit and felt embarrassed about not being able to finish. I also wondered if he was just falling into an old pattern because his ex was super-religious and premarital sex was a no-no. After a while of nothing, I asked him if we were ever going to have sex, and he said "Of course." Still nothing happened. Somewhere along the line, he mentioned that he had even stopped masturbating. Then it was discovered he has sleep apnea, which can cause low sex drive and ED. Then earlier this week I came to the conclusion that I think he is depressed - depression also causes low drive and can result in ED. (http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/dating/565400-not-sure-where-go-here) So last night we talked, about my suspicions of his depression, our lack of sex life, and the future of our relationship. He admits he is probably depressed and certainly has sleep apnea, which exacerbates it. I brought up how a doctor might be able to help him sleep better and feel better, and that might make him feel more amorous. Then he mentioned how it "might not" because of some thing congenital he was born with, which he thinks causes ED. But he wouldn't tell me what it was, he was too embarrassed (and I told him I wouldn't, but I've been doing internet searches trying to figure out what it is - no dice). We have talked numerous times about how our sex life hasn't moved forward, and not once did it ever come up that he might be physically unable to, or I would have approached this topic differently. The lack of sex seemed like a more emotional, keeping his walls up kind of thing. And mind you, I've seen him naked, been up close and personal with his wang - there didn't appear to be anything wrong with it, except maybe more of a curve than I'm used to. He also says his age could be a factor in his ED (he's 36, almost 37, so that seems young still). He jokingly dismissed seeing a doctor - for the depression, apnea or ED. Then I basically poured my heart out to him about the way that I have been feeling, how I felt about him, how it appeared that he felt about me. How intellectually and emotionally compatible we seem to be, the great chemistry we have. I ended my heart-pouring by saying "This doesn't feel like any other relationship I've had, this feels like it could be so much more. I think you feel the same. If this relationship feels as valuable and important to you as it does to me, going to the doctor to see if there's something that could be done seems like it would be worth at least trying." I also said that if he does not view this relationship the way I do, that he should tell me. I could see in his eyes I hit some sort of nerve, but I didn't push, I wanted him to let what I'd said really sink in. I hoped he would really think about it. Now it's almost 24 hours later and I've basically been thinking myself nuts all day. Trying to figure out what his congenital issue might be. Thinking back on the other conversations that we'd had about sex, and how physical impairment had never been mentioned. My mind is starting to fill in the blanks with its own answers. He has been really open with me in many ways, but very guarded in others. Some of the things he says tells me that he thinks he is in some way unworthy of me, or that he has the expectation that I'm going to leave, so he is having a hard time investing fully in he relationship. Here are the possibilities that have been rolling around in my head: 1) He was telling the truth and has been embarrassed about sex. Perhaps he felt too ashamed to be truthful in previous conversations. If this is the case, it's still OK because there are lots of ways to get physically intimate without penis-vagina sex. As long as he could trust me and be vulnerable with me, I'm sure there are ways we could have fun. 2) He was using a minor birth defect that seems to have resolved as an excuse for his present-day lack of sex drive. The excuse is another wall that he has put up in an attempt to protect himself and to repel me. This would not be not OK, because I can't make him tear his walls down - he has to do it himself. 3) He had a minor defect when he was born that was corrected and now he is fine, but due to the pressure of the conversation, was grasping at straws to blame his intimacy issues on anything but depression and apnea. Because he basically thought neither of those could be the issue, despite the fact that he has many other depression and apnea symptoms. This last one seems like the most likely, just from how the conversation went. It's really frustrating, because for probably the first time ever, I had been doing such a good job of NOT overthinking. Overthinking is a feedback loop that can bring you to conclusions that are simply not true. Here I am, putting scenarios into my head that are all conjecture. And I'm finding myself wanting to "play" stupid "games" that are unproductive. Like purposely taking a long time to answer his texts. Wanting to be vague or passive-aggressive. Short replies, no emoticons. I am resisting, and trying to just be my usual self, but the fact that I'm even considering using these tactics against him in some attempt to "punish" him instead of being honest about how I'm feeling is disturbing. I feel like it's the start of me putting my own walls back up Anyway, I don't get to see him again until Friday or Saturday. I'm going to be overthinking for days. I just needed to vent. I don't know what kind of answers or responses I expect. Of course I know every time I type one of these, I'm opening myself up to people taking shots at my choices. Someone is probably going to say this guy is a jerk who is playing me - I have considered this and the rest of my experience with him doesn't point to that at all. Plus, usually jerks play you to get sex, not cuddle and hold you all night while you sleep, so that doesn't quite add up.
ThisisIt606 Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 Seems as though it's a combination of medical factors. I knew someone who ran into a similar situation with her boyfriend who was 36, depressed, and she was unsatisfied in her sex life with him. If he choses to address the issue by seeing a doctor as you suggested that would be a good move. But whether is his embarrassed, that's something he will just have to get over if having a satisfying sex life is important to him. He needs to want to solve his issue. It's not up to you to solve/not about you. I remember my friend would often cry while dating her bf because the sex was just so "come and go", hard for him to maintain and erection, etc. He'd often have to stop because he felt dizzy or was shaking. He never actually addressed his problem and their sex life, as far as I know didn't improve. You have been very supportive, but as with anything-- the person facing the situation must want to change/take the direction to solve the problem, in this case ED.
DivorcedDad123 Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 It could be a number of things, from depression to low testosterone, to high blood pressure, diabetes, and the list goes on....The one thing he needs to do is see a doctor, because ED is an indicator that something is wrong physically. And, honestly, there are such a wide array of fixes for ED these days that there's really no need to deal with it. From pills to implants, something can be done. Main thing is he needs a complete physical to check for underlying serious issues that could be causing it.
HereNorThere Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 I really doubt it's a health issue related to ED simply because that's so easy to treat. Don't confuse ED with a low sex drive because they are two totally different different things. People with ED want to have sex, but can't get an erection. They have no problem getting a quick script for a nitric oxide inhibitor like Sildenafil. Low sex drive due to depression or some other issue would probably be easy to spot as well because it would manifest itself in other areas of emotion. It sounds more like you've stumbled across someone who has Aspergers or some other sensory and/or social issues. I would be looking more in that medical area than I would something physical. It sounds like his issue is much more related to the actual intimacy than the mechanics of the act. Let me guess, he's an engineer? (j/k)
mrldii Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 Boy, OP...from all your posts/threads about This ONE Guy, he sure does have a lot of *good*/legitimate or *bad*/completely made-up reasons for why he just can't seem to be completely present in this *relationship* with you, huh? He's depressed...but doesn't want to see a doctor. He's got a medical issue (that he can't/won't talk about)...but, he doesn't want to see a doctor. He's got a lot of unresolved and carry-over issues from his last relationship...but, he doesn't want to see a doctor. Are you a nurse? Are you going to be The One to *fix* him? By *fixing* him, is he going to be eternally grateful and never leave you? Or, is he The Last Man on the Planet and that's why you're trying so hard to make this *relationship* work...when he's not willing to take a single, simple step in the direction to attempt to get better?!? 4
MidwestUSA Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 (edited) Did you come across Peyronie's disease in your reading? It would definitely cause a 'curve'. Did he flinch or appear to be in pain when you guys did have sex? Worth a read. Or just flat out ask him if this is it. Peyronie's Disease: Symptoms, Causes, Treatments Um, OP, he's been doing nothing for more than two months now about his apnea? How overweight is he? You know, it sounds like you have a partner who really doesn't care about being healthy, either for himself, or for you. Edited January 14, 2016 by MidwestUSA
Author MightyQuinn Posted January 14, 2016 Author Posted January 14, 2016 Boy, OP...from all your posts/threads about This ONE Guy, he sure does have a lot of *good*/legitimate or *bad*/completely made-up reasons for why he just can't seem to be completely present in this *relationship* with you, huh? He's depressed...but doesn't want to see a doctor. He's got a medical issue (that he can't/won't talk about)...but, he doesn't want to see a doctor. He's got a lot of unresolved and carry-over issues from his last relationship...but, he doesn't want to see a doctor. Wow, what did I do to deserve such attitude in your response? I appreciate the fake concern, but your delivery totally sucks. Seriously, how condescending and rude. First, we've only talked about the need for him to see a doctor twice - Once in November, and last night. And he hasn't actually said "no" to the doctor this time, it was a joke when he said, and I brought him back to seriousness to say "no, this is important" and then I DIDN'T LET HIM ANSWER yes or no about the doctor because I hope he will THINK about it. It will mean nothing and do nothing if I try to force him to go. All I can do is hope the message sunk in. As many others have said, and as I've said myself, it's up to him to make that decision, not me. Second, I JUST discovered about the possible congenital medical issues last night. I'm a woman, and I can fully understand why a man might be embarrassed or scared to bring this issue up. Why does it seem like that surprises you so much that it might take some time for a man to admit he has problems with his manhood? Sheesh. Are you a nurse? Are you going to be The One to *fix* him? By *fixing* him, is he going to be eternally grateful and never leave you? Or, is he The Last Man on the Planet and that's why you're trying so hard to make this *relationship* work...when he's not willing to take a single, simple step in the direction to attempt to get better?!? Third, I'm not trying to "fix" him, he's not broken, he's just sick. If you've been reading my other posts, then you know that I'm wrestling with the dilemma of staying or going, too, but I also have been giving him the chance to let down his walls at his own pace, which he has been doing. If there hadn't been progress in the relationship this whole time, that would be different and I would have likely left. It's just a slower relationship than this instant gratification world is used to, and frankly I've LIKED and NEEDED the slowness. As for the ex issues, hell, I still have issues with my ex, because my life doesn't exist in a vacuum and time doesn't stop long enough to sit and feel sorry for ourselves. I'm not a prize, I have my own baggage. Everyone does. If I started looking for someone with NO problems, I'd never find one. Fourth, the whole reason why I'm still with him is exactly because it HASN'T been work. EVERYTHING ELSE about this relationship has come easy. BECAUSE everything else has come so easy, NOW is the first time we've really had to work towards anything, and so this is a test, mostly for him. We are JUST NOW starting to get more serious about each other, as we've been keeping it casual until just before the holidays. So at the first sign of something not going my way I'm supposed to run? No, I'm ready to meet the challenge if he's ready to go to the doctor, because in all seriousness, sleep apnea, depression and ED are not dealbreakers for me. I would love to see him get some help and see if we can't keep moving forward on this amazing adventure that we're on. If he actually refuses to see a doctor (which he hasn't even done yet, tho your message totally writes him off as if he said no) and nothing improves, then I will have to make a change. But ****, I'm going to at least give him a chance to do something instead of telling him to hit the road less than 24 hours after we had the talk that we did. "Hey, here's the issues, now I'm not even going to give you any chance to work on them, see yah bye." I would consider myself undateable if I ever became that much of a b!tch. 1
mrldii Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 OP, sorry that you felt that my honest response to the numerous threads and posts you've made about This One Guy who - by your own words - is a relatively new relationship and one in which you are going very, very slowly (by your own choice) is causing you so much angst, despair and - again, by you own words - causing you so much "overthinking". Sorry, but just reading about it is exhausting...I can only imagine what actually living through it - and having so many doubts, concerns, and second (and third and fourth) thoughts about every little thing must be for you. This should be the honeymoon phase of a relationship, where every little thing he does is wonderful to - and wonder-filling for - you. Sorry, too, that you believe that a grown woman who is as concerned about her own physical, mental, and emotional being while being in a relationship with another human being is "a bitch". I do seem to have struck a nerve, though...and it is obvious that it a nerve that is extremely sensitive and one that you do NOT want to explore as to why it's so sensitive. Not a problem; I won't be making any more replies to your threads where you ask for others' input as to what they make of the issues of your newly-budding relationship with This One Guy. Best of luck to you...I hope it all works out for the two of you, just as you hope it will!
HereNorThere Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 You may not want hear this, but this is a fatal relationship issue. Sexual incompatibility isn't something that you simply move past this early in the game. It seems like what you may have perceived as moving slow is really just a lack of intimacy on his part. Now you want to move forward and that's not going to happen because he isn't capable of it. You're dangerously close to moving into a distancer-pursuer relationship. The more you press him for intimacy, the further away he is going to distance himself. It won't be long until he starts resenting you for pushing his boundaries. Some people can only handle so much intimacy before they start shutting down and you've come across one of those people. This isn't normal and will eventually drive you crazy. It's better to start accepting the true nature of this friendship because that's what it truly is. For whatever reason, this person doesn't do intimacy in the same way you do and in likelihood doesn't have the capability to. He seems very nice so I can see by that would be distressing, but it doesn't change the situation. I wish you the best but please be prepared for the worst. 1
Author MightyQuinn Posted January 14, 2016 Author Posted January 14, 2016 Did you come across Peyronie's disease in your reading? It would definitely cause a 'curve'. Did he flinch or appear to be in pain when you guys did have sex? Worth a read. Or just flat out ask him if this is it. Peyronie's Disease: Symptoms, Causes, Treatments Um, OP, he's been doing nothing for more than two months now about his apnea? How overweight is he? You know, it sounds like you have a partner who really doesn't care about being healthy, either for himself, or for you. That... could be it, but it doesn't sound congenital. It was dark, I couldn't really tell, but it could possibly have been painful. He has been getting back into an exercise routine and eating better, has slimmed down a little since then and his snoring and sleeping have improved some. I think he's probably only about 15 pounds overweight, but he wants to try to lose 30. His family has a history of apnea, and he doesn't want to have to get on a machine, so he has been gyming 4-5 days a week. I suspected the apnea might have caused the depression due to lack of sleep, and his mood has improved some, but I still think he's probably mildly depressed. He does care about being healthy, but has an aversion to doctors like pretty much every man I've ever known. I dunno where you guys live, but where I'm from, none of the men like to go to the doctor My dad wouldn't go until he had a heart issues that forced him to the hospital. My brother electrocuted himself and had numbness in his hand weeks later and refused to see a doctor until my mom made him. My ex refused to go to the doctor until after I left him. One of my friend's hubby refused to get stitches when he really probably needed them. Most of the guys around here are of the opinion you can just rub some dirt on it and get back to playing. New Guy seems smarter than that. But I guess time will tell :/
MidwestUSA Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 That... could be it, but it doesn't sound congenital. It was dark, I couldn't really tell, but it could possibly have been painful. I dunno where you guys live........ If genetics play a factor, and predisposes one to it, I consider it congenital. My husband has a brother and a nephew with it. I reckon I live close. But when it comes to serious issues, I pick up the phone and make the appointment for him.
ExpatInItaly Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 (edited) I skimmed your other thread about him, OP. I think it's more than a physiological problem. I can't reasonably guess what type of condition he says he was born with that he's too embarrassed to tell you. The ED issue is - I imagine - embarrassing enough for him so I'm not sure what could be more than that. I don't doubt there could be some underlying physical problem, but I sense this more psychological than anything else. I say that because in your last thread, you noted he shut right down after he learned you are open to having children and this somehow led to a big argument. In my mind, that's an important piece of the puzzle here. He has walls up. How did this miscommunication become "horrible", as you put it? If I understand correctly, you both want children in the future and thus you're on the same page. I don't quite get how that led to an argument? I understand you're concerned that he could be depressed. Depression can absolutely rob people of their libido. If that's the case, he needs the appropriate medical care, as you've already addressed with him. But I still have to wonder if he's got some issues surrounding intimacy issue, Something is definitely bothering him and I don't believe you're overthinking. This is a big challenge in the relationship. If he doesn't visit a doctor soon, I don't really see this changing. Edited January 14, 2016 by ExpatInItaly 1
Author MightyQuinn Posted January 14, 2016 Author Posted January 14, 2016 OP, sorry that you felt that my honest response to the numerous threads and posts you've made about This One Guy who - by your own words - is a relatively new relationship and one in which you are going very, very slowly (by your own choice) is causing you so much angst, despair and - again, by you own words - causing you so much "overthinking". Three whole threads. I don't think I ever used the word angst or despair. And sorry I was wrong about how long we've been dating because it started off as casual, tomorrow is the 10 month anniversary of our 1st date. So really not all that new. And overthinking is my bag, and that's MY issue, not his. I have general anxiety, overthinking happens whether I want to or not. And all of my friends live too far away, are married, have ****ty relationships, or are perpetually single, so none of them can offer any advice. So I'm here letting strangers who only know a small portion of the story critique my relationship, obviously some things are going to get lost in translation. Sorry, but just reading about it is exhausting...I can only imagine what actually living through it - and having so many doubts, concerns, and second (and third and fourth) thoughts about every little thing must be for you. This should be the honeymoon phase of a relationship, where every little thing he does is wonderful to - and wonder-filling for - you. After almost a year, (10 months) we're past the honeymoon stage and into the real stuff. I'd much rather be here than the honeymoon stage. And if it's so exhausting, you don't have to read or respond. Sorry, too, that you believe that a grown woman who is as concerned about her own physical, mental, and emotional being while being in a relationship with another human being is "a bitch". You seem to have misunderstood on several. I'm physically, mentally and emotionally fine, except for that my anxiety causes me to overthink and dwell on things, and coming here to talk about them makes me feel better. It gets the thoughts out of my head so I can go about my merry way and be productive. What I'm concerned about the health of my boyfriend. *I* will be fine either way, but obviously I hope for a certain outcome. The part that I was referring to that I thought was b!tchy? Was the specific scenario I spelled out, of telling someone "Hey, here are problems, but instead of giving you any time to work on them and make the situation better, I'm just going to dump you." That would be bitchy. If you care about someone and you at least want to TRY to make it work, you don't check out the very moment things get hard. 1
Author MightyQuinn Posted January 14, 2016 Author Posted January 14, 2016 I don't doubt there could be some underlying physical problem, but I sense this more psychological than anything else. I say that because in your last thread, you noted he shut right down after he learned you are open to having children and this somehow led to a big argument. In my mind, that's an important piece of the puzzle here. He has walls up. How did this miscommunication become "horrible", as you put it? If I understand correctly, you both want children in the future and thus you're on the same page. I don't quite get how that led to an argument? It's soooo stupid! For most of my life, I was militantly against the idea of having kids. Then as I got older and my friends started having kids, I started to question why I was so anti-kids. Over a few years, my attitude towards kids completely turned around - except I was with a partner with whom I'd never willingly reproduce. So that was one of the reasons I divorced my ex. Stupid me, instead of just being like "Hey, yeah, I want kids" I jabbered on and on about the time in my life when I didn't want kids, and it gave him the impression that I wasn't sincere. It came off like I didn't really want kids, like I was only saying it because he wanted kids. And honestly, I felt like such an idiot, because when I rethought all of what I said, it was a reasonable conclusion. I understand you're concerned that he could be depressed. Depression can absolutely rob people of their libido. If that's the case, he needs the appropriate medical care, as you've already addressed with him. But I still have to wonder if he's got some issues surrounding intimacy issue, Something is definitely bothering him and I don't believe you're overthinking. This is a big challenge in the relationship. If he doesn't visit a doctor soon, I don't really see this changing. He just texted a little bit ago and said he's thinking of going and that he probably should anyway because he hasn't in a while! *fingers crossed* I'm not expecting it to be an end all, fix all, but it's a step in the right direction.
Author MightyQuinn Posted January 14, 2016 Author Posted January 14, 2016 You may not want hear this, but this is a fatal relationship issue. Sexual incompatibility isn't something that you simply move past this early in the game. It seems like what you may have perceived as moving slow is really just a lack of intimacy on his part. Now you want to move forward and that's not going to happen because he isn't capable of it. You're dangerously close to moving into a distancer-pursuer relationship. The more you press him for intimacy, the further away he is going to distance himself. It won't be long until he starts resenting you for pushing his boundaries. Some people can only handle so much intimacy before they start shutting down and you've come across one of those people. This isn't normal and will eventually drive you crazy. It's better to start accepting the true nature of this friendship because that's what it truly is. For whatever reason, this person doesn't do intimacy in the same way you do and in likelihood doesn't have the capability to. He seems very nice so I can see by that would be distressing, but it doesn't change the situation. I wish you the best but please be prepared for the worst. It's definitely something I've thought about. Obviously something I've had to consider. Except for this particular issue, it feels like we've been moving slowly forward, but he is a little bit behind me, if that makes sense. I do "emotional checkins" with myself to try to evaluate where I'm at, where "we" are at, and if I feel like anything is "stuck" or otherwise doesn't feel right. I'd say the "threat level" has gone from green to yellow - I'm on high alert :/ As for the distancer-persuer, if it comes to that and he starts distancing... I'd probably have to just let him go.
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