xxoo Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 So they ARE unhappy? Which is it? Self report of happiness is subjective. If someone interprets it to mean that I feel satisfied in all areas, there are more areas for women now than in the 50s. This more you examine, the more likely to find weak areas and maybe focus on those when responding. They could objectively be happier than previous generations, and in fact that is what the suicide rates indicate (an objective measure).
123321 Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 People with money can be surgically rebuilt to look like whatever they want. Speaking of which, am I the only person who thinks the two women who had surgery to look like Barbie are disgusting? I'm not a fan of cosmetic surgery as it stands now, although 3D printing of body parts (not joking, it's being done) could be a whole other thing.
123321 Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 Self report of happiness is subjective. If someone interprets it to mean that I feel satisfied in all areas, there are more areas for women now than in the 50s. This more you examine, the more likely to find weak areas and maybe focus on those when responding. They could objectively be happier than previous generations, and in fact that is what the suicide rates indicate (an objective measure). So they are happy but they don't know it?
toolforgrowth Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 Self report of happiness is subjective. If someone interprets it to mean that I feel satisfied in all areas, there are more areas for women now than in the 50s. This more you examine, the more likely to find weak areas and maybe focus on those when responding. They could objectively be happier than previous generations, and in fact that is what the suicide rates indicate (an objective measure). But we can't ask each individual respondent what their subjectivity is. All we can say is that the majority of women polled reported they are unhappy, and that the number has increased over time.
xxoo Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 So they are happy but they don't know it? I didn't suggest this. The authors of the research did. And yes, pretty much. It's a limitation of self-reporting research.
123321 Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 I didn't suggest this. The authors of the research did. I'm not sure that paints the respondents as less whacky than simply saying the more they can get the more they want.
lollipopspot Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 I'm driving a 2012 car built by Germans, riding a late model sport bike, and everything is paid for, and I'm rebuilding my investments. I'm thinking to treat myself to a decent $6000 Swiss made timepiece this week, but maybe I will save that money. In general Women are more materialistic than men. Really? I see guys all over the place talking about the things they want to acquire. All of this "women are...blah, blah, blah"...especially when it gets into theories of what women are by nature (that just happens to be subservient to the person who's talking about it) is tiring. 3
xxoo Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 I'm not sure that paints the respondents as less whacky than simply saying the more they can get the more they want. Don't forget probably men have been that way all along, and women have just caught up.
toolforgrowth Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 Really? I see guys all over the place talking about the things they want to acquire. All of this "women are...blah, blah, blah"...especially when it gets into theories of what women are by nature (that just happens to be subservient to the person who's talking about it) is tiring. I don't think that 123321's happiness is dependent upon his acquiring those things. Although I could be wrong... 123321, what say you? I would never suggest that any one theory would fit every single man or woman. There will always be outliers. But do you have any evidence to discredit the research or the assertions made thereon? If you have an alternative suggestion, I'd be open to hearing it. This isn't a challenge, I'm just genuinely curious about the topic at hand. But as side note, it also gets tiring for men to be called..."whining wimpy men", I think it was you said? I humbly suggest that one shouldn't hop into the fray if they can't take a few jabs themselves. It comes with the territory.
toolforgrowth Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 Don't forget probably men have been that way all along, and women have just caught up. Evidence? /10 chars
jay1983 Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 Science says this is a fact. Women will almost without exception wave their hands and say it's not how THEY are, but it has to be someone ... Well........it seems like someone's toes have been stepped on. 1
lollipopspot Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 But as side note, it also gets tiring for men to be called..."whining wimpy men", I think it was you said? Huh? Nope, I don't believe I've said that. I think at most I quoted Wiki that referred to whining MGTOWers - that they don't actually "go their own way" but instead they stand around complaining about women. That's a bit different than making a statement about the nature of men or what all men are.
123321 Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 I don't think that 123321's happiness is dependent upon his acquiring those things. Although I could be wrong... 123321, what say you? Not at all. I'm happy I've been able to repair my life, but I was happy when it was in shambles too. I'm a happy guy. The above quote was in a line of commentary about my ex-wife ripping my fiscal well being apart, and was differentiating the way she was doing (pissed away over $400K) compared to how I was doing (out from under $300K of debt and climbing rapidly) more than "this is how I'm happy" or whatever.
toolforgrowth Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 Huh? Nope, I don't believe I've said that. I think at most I quoted Wiki that referred to whining MGTOWers - that they don't actually "go their own way" but instead they stand around complaining about women. That's a bit different than making a statement about the nature of men or what all men are. Oops...you're right. I apologize. I misunderstood the context of that post. My bad.
lollipopspot Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 Help an idiot out here....WTH is MGTOW? TFY You're in for a treat
123321 Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 Really? I see guys all over the place talking about the things they want to acquire. All of this "women are...blah, blah, blah"...especially when it gets into theories of what women are by nature (that just happens to be subservient to the person who's talking about it) is tiring. Are you talking about the survey, the conclusions by the survey takers, or what?
lollipopspot Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 It's a rather entertaining offshoot of the men's right's movement, with men going "on strike" against women, but they can't really manage to cut off half of the population (who can?) so they just stand around complaining about them... Men Going Their Own Way - RationalWiki I wholeheartedly support people doing what they want with their lives! But there's a lot of drama queen-ness in this "movement." 1
lollipopspot Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 Are you talking about the survey, the conclusions by the survey takers, or what? No, I didn't read that study. I'm talking about this thread and others. I actually don't believe that there are such major differences between the genders. Some, sure. Exactly what they are, no one knows, because we've all been raised under the thumb of cultures which shape us. I think we can talk about social influences, but the broad statements about what men or women ARE is not helpful in my mind, and is often rather offensive.
jay1983 Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 (edited) No, I didn't read that study. I'm talking about this thread and others. I actually don't believe that there are such major differences between the genders. Some, sure. Exactly what they are, no one knows, because we've all been raised under the thumb of cultures which shape us. I think we can talk about social influences, but the broad statements about what men or women ARE is not helpful in my mind, and is often rather offensive. That's because you don't get out much. You're so paranoid of being attacked that you freak out when you walk to your car and you don't even feel safe in your own home by yourself. Your words, not mine. I can dig and find exactly where you said that, if you're short of memory. You use links for studies to tell you everything, including some of the most simple things. We on the other hand actually go out and see for ourselves. We go to bars, malls, coffee shops and observe what kind of women can be found where. Who attractive women are married to, which areas have high concentrations of them, what kind of cars they drive and so on. Edited May 28, 2015 by jay1983
Author Robert Z Posted May 28, 2015 Author Posted May 28, 2015 (edited) No, I didn't read that study. I'm talking about this thread and others. I actually don't believe that there are such major differences between the genders. Some, sure. Exactly what they are, no one knows, because we've all been raised under the thumb of cultures which shape us. I think we can talk about social influences, but the broad statements about what men or women ARE is not helpful in my mind, and is often rather offensive. Do you think the same is true of homosexuals. They are different than heterosexual men because of social conditioning? Do you think there are any difference between gay men and straight men besides sexual preference? And is this all due to social conditioning? Or is it a coincidence that about 90% of the male actors on Broadway are gay? I was engaged to a woman whose younger brother was gay. His mother said she knew by the time he was four years old. How? He liked to do girl things, like play with Barbie, instead of boy things, like playing with trucks. Yet you maintain that there is no significant difference between the genders? There is a HUGE difference. There are variations of every sort and always exceptions to the rule, but IMO, any woman who doesn't think we are significantly different [on the average] doesn't understand men even enough to realize that you don't understand us! And how do I know that? It is about as old of a truism as there can be that men spend most of their lives trying to figure out what in the hell women are doing and what you all want! You often don't make sense to us at all. If you all thought like us life would be far simpler. Edited May 28, 2015 by Robert Z
toolforgrowth Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 Do you think the same is true of homosexuals. They are different than heterosexual men because of social conditioning? Do you think there are any difference between gay men and straight men besides sexual preference? And is this all due to social conditioning? Or is it a coincidence that about 90% of the male actors on Broadway are gay? I was engaged to a woman whose younger brother was gay. His mother said she knew by the time he was four years old. How? He liked to do girl things, like play with Barbie, instead of boy things, like playing with trucks. Yet you maintain that there is no significant difference between the genders? There is a HUGE difference. There are variations of every sort and always exceptions to the rule, but IMO, any woman who doesn't think we are significantly different [on the average] doesn't understand men. And how do I know that? It is about as old of a truism as there can be that men spend most of their lives trying to figure out what in the hell women are doing and what you all want! You often don't make sense to us at all. One of my female friends from high school had a little brother who could sing and dance like moo other. It was uncanny. And I honestly thought to myself that he might grow up to be gay. And I was right. To this day, he's in the closet to his parents because he's afraid of the backlash. But he was vastly different from other boys; it was clear as day to anyone who was open minded to it. I've come to the conclusion that it's not our jobs to figure out what women want. It's their responsibility to figure it out and attain it on their own. I stopped trying to make sense of it all long time ago. 1
xxoo Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 Evidence? /10 chars Men in the 50s reported less happiness than women, yet they had more control, more opportunities, and fought hard to keep things as they were. If they were unhappy, why didn't they want change? In a separate questions, why are women viewed poorly for reporting less than full happiness when they have more control of their lives, and men are not?
toolforgrowth Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 Men in the 50s reported less happiness than women, yet they had more control, more opportunities, and fought hard to keep things as they were. If they were unhappy, why didn't they want change? In a separate questions, why are women viewed poorly for reporting less than full happiness when they have more control of their lives, and men are not? Do you have statistics that show men reported less happiness than women in the 50's? I can't answer this questions without the proper context.
thefooloftheyear Posted May 28, 2015 Posted May 28, 2015 Men in the 50s reported less happiness than women, yet they had more control, more opportunities, and fought hard to keep things as they were. If they were unhappy, why didn't they want change? In a separate questions, why are women viewed poorly for reporting less than full happiness when they have more control of their lives, and men are not? I think the only man in history that has had a truly "happy" life is Hugh Hefner...all the rest of us just lead lives of short bursts of complacency... TFY
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