Redhead14 Posted May 14, 2015 Posted May 14, 2015 The funny thing is, if I were to say that I would never marry a woman who wanted to be a SAHM for this very reason, you'd still lambaste me for it. We're damned if we do and damned if we don't. I'd rather be damned for not doing. EDIT: You heard it here first, guys: never marry a woman who makes less than you, and if you do, still expect to pay even if she cheats. This thread is about an extreme case. It appears that the woman in this situation was a narcissist/psychopath. They are "crafty" and manipulative to a spectacular degree. So much so, that the person they are involved with begins to feel as if they are the ones with some kind of mental health issue. It's very intense for the "victim". Unless they somehow realize or someone they really trust brings it to light for them, they will be drawn into a spiral that is extremely difficult to stop. I cannot emphasize enough the damage a psychopath leaves in their wake. The OP was/is collateral damage and suffering from it and will be for a long time. I do not blame the father in this situation. If it were any other healthy man who was taken to the cleaners by a woman who was anything else but a psychopath, I'd say the man shared the blame because he ignored signs from a woman. Psychopaths are almost undetectable until the damage comes to a crescendo.
toolforgrowth Posted May 14, 2015 Posted May 14, 2015 This thread is about an extreme case. It appears that the woman in this situation was a narcissist/psychopath. They are "crafty" and manipulative to a spectacular degree. So much so, that the person they are involved with begins to feel as if they are the ones with some kind of mental health issue. It's very intense for the "victim". Unless they somehow realize or someone they really trust brings it to light for them, they will be drawn into a spiral that is extremely difficult to stop. I cannot emphasize enough the damage a psychopath leaves in their wake. The OP was/is collateral damage and suffering from it and will be for a long time. I do not blame the father in this situation. If it were any other healthy man who was taken to the cleaners by a woman who was anything else but a psychopath, I'd say the man shared the blame because he ignored signs from a woman. Psychopaths are almost undetectable until the damage comes to a crescendo. That still doesn't negate my final observation. A man should never marry a woman who makes less than him so he doesn't get taken to the cleaners if things go south.
Timshel Posted May 14, 2015 Posted May 14, 2015 It does seem that people are freaked out about relationships more so than when I was in my twenties and early thirties. With a bad marriage that ended in divorce and a second husband that up and died, you'd think I'd be as freaked out as a cat on a hot tin roof. I'm not though because what these difficulties have taught me is there are no guarantees with anything, ever. It is better to love and (risk) losing than to never love at all. Krieger, if you have the courage to navigate the world every day and invest yourself in your daily life, then you have the courage to fall in love and become a father. You should have some therapy to work on your fears if they overwhelm you. There isn't any point in living in the future and being afraid of what might, maybe happen because, frankly, you don't know if you will live to see it. The past can not be undone. What you have is this moment. It is such a relief and life is more pleasurable when, as much as you can, just be in the moment you are in. Everything besides the basics of maintaining quality of life is pure speculation. 2
katiegrl Posted May 14, 2015 Posted May 14, 2015 Well, from this thread, his fear and anxiety is a normal response. When you father commits suicide apparently because of his mother's narcissism or psychopathy, it becomes trauma. Fear and anxiety are normal responses to trauma. The previous threads were really related to this thread. It is likely that his mother was not a good mother either. He has a reason to be distrustful, resentful and not have much appreciation for women. The situation described in this thread is the root of all his anxieties and fears and fuel for all his threads. You should note, too, that he wants children, will provide for them but doesn't see the need for a "mother" beyond being the physical vessel for that. His mother was "not there for him" so he doesn't see a need for one. He should have had counseling and it's not too late. He's very young still. He doesn't have irrational fears or fears borne out of "minor" incidences. This was huge. Red, the OP's father did not commit suicide and his mother is not a narcissist. His parents have been married for years and in fact are still together....his mother was very much there for him growing up...and is still there. The scenario discussed above are just people he knows. The OP did not grow up in such a dysfunctional environment. Just keep reading... That said, it appears he is very sensitive to his surroundings and the experiences of others .... and these negative experiences affect him profoundly. That is where his fears and anxieties stem from.....not from anything that HE experienced personally.
MrNate 2.0 Posted May 15, 2015 Posted May 15, 2015 I am scared to getting into long term relationships and have to be picky about the woman I date. I know to many men that been through hell with woman. My fear is meeting a good woman and we get married and have kids and get divorced. I do not want to be a part time dad and want to see my kids all the time. There are way too stories of woman puting good men through hell because they can. Woman get everything the kids , the house, help from the government , talk crap about the child father , the courts will bend over backwards for woman. She can make up lies and there is noting a guy can do about it. For me taking my kids away and not letting me see them and all that will hurt me so much. I would cry myself to sleep every night feeling like OI failed. People will say pick a good woman but you never know what is in someones head. That why I am going back to school and will never date a woman that makes 2 to 3 times more money than me so if things do not work out and we have kids I will not get F over by her and the courts. Woman can F up a guys life even when he did noting wrong. I also fear seeing that I am going in to nursing she can lie and say I abuse my kids and I could dam well lose my job . I am almost going to give up on dating and just adopt a kid or pay a female to have my kids . I rather be a single dad and just date woman. It too risky . I do not mind paying money for my kid but not seeing them and have to hear her lie to my kid about me I will not stand for. Man, a simple lesson in life is that nothing you do is without risk. You can live single, and risk never finding someone. You can get married, have kids, and risk losing all that in a divorce. Nothing in this world has a guarantee, and you have a right to feel the way you do. Just know that not every woman out there is out to make your life miserable. 1
Woggle Posted May 15, 2015 Posted May 15, 2015 I love how some of the same people who claim to stick up for women also blame men and call us stupid for trusting one enough to marry her. That is a bigger insult to women than men speaking honestly about our experiences.
sweetjasmine Posted May 15, 2015 Posted May 15, 2015 I love how some of the same people who claim to stick up for women also blame men and call us stupid for trusting one enough to marry her. That is a bigger insult to women than men speaking honestly about our experiences. That's not what she's even saying. What she's saying is this: if you don't want to be responsible for someone who's dependent on you, then don't marry someone who is dependent on you. It's not stupid to trust someone but it is stupid to marry someone who depends on you if your goal is to avoid having someone depend on you. If someone gets married without looking into what it means, legally, and what the potential ramifications could be of legally joining their lives to the other person's, then I don't really have that much sympathy. Same as any other legal contract people enter into willingly. Whose fault is it if you don't understand what you're doing? Everyone else's, of course, right? 2
Woggle Posted May 15, 2015 Posted May 15, 2015 One thing I want to ask is why do some women take it so personally when men honestly express these fears? Nobody is saying there aren't good loyal women but this scenario happens often enough that men have good reason to be concerned. Guys just want to avoid becoming another statistic and weekend dad who is only good for his wallet. Is there anything wrong with that?
lollipopspot Posted May 15, 2015 Posted May 15, 2015 Guys just want to avoid becoming another statistic and weekend dad who is only good for his wallet. The antidote to that is in almost all of my posts in this thread. There is a clear way to not have that happen, despite the victim stance. Is there anything wrong with that? People can complain all they want, but if they want to act like a victim of a very predictable scenario that they themselves set up, and they don't want feedback, then they oughtn't to complain about it on interactive internet forums.
BlueIris Posted May 15, 2015 Posted May 15, 2015 (edited) One thing I want to ask is why do some women take it so personally when men honestly express these fears? Nobody is saying there aren't good loyal women but this scenario happens often enough that men have good reason to be concerned. Guys just want to avoid becoming another statistic and weekend dad who is only good for his wallet. Is there anything wrong with that? I don’t know why. I don’t. It isn’t about me so I can’t take it personally. It’s about him. Our fears are always about us. It’s fine to express your fears. Some men fear these things and decide not to participate in marriage and having children. That’s fine. OP, on the other hand, does want to participate in marriage and being a father. So, I think many of us are trying to show him that women aren’t all like the women he fears, and most importantly, that he has a great deal of control over how he chooses a mate, who he chooses, and how he acts in the selection process and in the marriage. It’s an empowering message. I mean, it’s ok if he decides it’s too daunting and he’s afraid so he won’t do it. But there are ways to do it- date and mate- that do not end up in disaster. I’ve seen it played out successfully over and over and over. Here's another tip I'd give him since he talked about avoiding red flags (which is good). Go to the website The High Conflict Institute and read about High Conflict People/Personalities. They are the most common "type" in divorce court. They fill the dockets. Avoid them like the plague. Edited May 16, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Robert Posted May 16, 2015 Posted May 16, 2015 31 mostly off topic posts/threadjack deleted No infractions given out and if you don't want one then please post to the thread starters concerns rather than your own, thanks
Recommended Posts