Embracing the OW role....

[MissBee]

I wouldn't say I embrace it, but I'm happy with the status quo.

 

 

But I'm a MOW, so I don't want another husband.

 

 

I dot want to share a home or family with MM or any of those things.

 

 

 

 

We both already have those.

 

I think being a MOW is definitely a whole other kettle of fish that is more conducive to being happy with it than if you're single.

[goodyblue]

I definitely did not embrace being OW. I would not have remained in the situation without an end game.

 

But I do know a couple of women that only want the part time. They want the fun of a relationship without the responsibility of taking care of a man. They don't want to clean up the vomit when he is sick. They don't want to scrub his toilet, make his meals, clean up the hair in the shower.

 

They want sex, a companion at certain times and not others, they want nice vacations, gifts, expensive or not. And honestly, most OW are very close emotionally with their MM. They are best friends. A confidant. Not always of course, but a lot. OW usually get mostly good and very little bad.

 

The problem comes when OW decide they want more. The MM can't deliver and things go south. But if the OW is content, it can go on for decades.

[Sassy Girl]

I think being a MOW is definitely a whole other kettle of fish that is more conducive to being happy with it than if you're single.

 

I agree. I don't think I'd ever be a single other woman. Why?

[cocorico]

And I believe MissBee is saying that one need not be in an affair in order to get space and time in a relationship.

 

In theory, sure. In reality, most men (of the age group I'm interested in) weren't up for that, whatever they may have claimed. Don't forget, OW have not only ever been OW -'especially those of us who've been around the block a few times have had many different are, of many different kinds, and so have had the richness of experience to teach us what works best for ourselves at any given time, given our circumstances.

 

People change over time, and so do our needs and preferences. At the time, an A (like the one I had - not like the caricature type where you're some "dirty secret" and you just hang about the phone waiting for him to call) suited me perfectly. I needed to have my time and space, certainly, but I also needed to have all that control. My time and emotional energy were scarce - more demand than supply - and I needed to be the one controlling the flow. And, as a single parent, I was very mindful of what we teach our kids about relationships, and I wanted my kids to see a strong, independent woman with a rich social life, who didn't need romantic relationships in order to feel "complete", and was prepared to abstain from them until she found what suited her. My kids dd not meet any of my romantic partners, until the one that got serious (now my H).

[cocorico]

I was quite happy in my OW role. It suited me at the time. 5 years later, it doesn't suit me any more. But I can say I was happy the majority of the time.

 

Exactly. People's needs change over time.

 

I was very happy as an OW. The A changed over time to reflect our changing needs, and eventually became a full time marriage. Which suits us both, now.

 

Would I become an OW again, in the future? It would depend on my circumstances, what I needed and wanted. It's not where I'm at now, but I can't predict the future.

[Got it]

And I believe MissBee is saying that one need not be in an affair in order to get space and time in a relationship.

 

And no one is saying that. But one CAN get that in an affair to where it does work for them.

[William]

Here's the topic, and I cleaned up the original post to more clearly identify it:

 

"Has anyone [embraced] or is it possible to embrace and own the OW role?

 

I know being the OW means your needs won't always be met and your AP is more than likely using you or being selfish; I get that. But if you and your AP have a sexually AND emotional connection, you're able to separate reality from fantasy, still be open to dating and meeting someone "real", could being the OW work?

 

I've been asking myself that question a lot lately and wondered if anyone ever wondered the same and is content and has in fact embraced their role. TIA!"

 

Meta-discussions regarding the function of this forum or the backgrounds of its members is not fodder for the public forums but certainly can be discussed using our private message system. If referring to any specifics regarding the thread starter's past posts which are relevant to the topic, please include direct quotes and links to those quotes. Thanks in advance for your cooperation with this moderation directive.

[mokamint7]

I agree. I don't think I'd ever be a single other woman. Why?

 

I love my freedom. I don't really want to share a household with a guy or get married. And it keeps the passion alive in our R. I could list a thousand other reasons. For me it works. Me being single has nothing to do with why I ended up in an A. It wasn't something I chose, but it happened and I enjoy it more so than not. Don't get me wrong, I have moments where I rethink what I'm doing or I'm not happy, but I get through those moments, I talk to my AP and we both fix things to make both of us happy. It takes work, but not as much as being married or living with someone.

[mokamint7]

Luckily not everyone shares a common view on what constitutes a "good guy".

 

I agree with this because even though my AP is being unfaithful to his GF, he's still a good BF to her. That sounds so oxymoronish, lol. He's sweet with me, laid back, and can take my many mood swings without being down right mean. So to me even given our situation I still see my AP as a "good guy."

[minimariah]

I agree with this because even though my AP is being unfaithful to his GF, he's still a good BF to her. That sounds so oxymoronish, lol. He's sweet with me, laid back, and can take my many mood swings without being down right mean. So to me even given our situation I still see my AP as a "good guy."

 

it sounds oxymoronish because it is an oxymoron.

good guy =\= good boyfriend.

 

cheating includes a lot of things... and it's extremely deviant in it's core. that being said, you cannot possibly be a good partner to someone & cheat on them - no matter how "good" you treat them in a day-to-day life.

[mokamint7]

You cannot possibly be a good partner to someone & cheat on them - no matter how "good" you treat them in a day-to-day life.

 

You are so right. That's not something I'd want as the GF.

[Quiet Storm]

I agree with this because even though my AP is being unfaithful to his GF, he's still a good BF to her. That sounds so oxymoronish, lol. He's sweet with me, laid back, and can take my many mood swings without being down right mean. So to me even given our situation I still see my AP as a "good guy."

 

This is a common way many OW lie to themselves- thinking MM is a good guy, and that he is only lying because of the circumstances. In most cases, he is a very selfish guy with character issues.

 

In all parts of our life, we use a person's actions to judge their character. That's just a smart thing to do. We aren't going to trust a coworker that talks behind another's back. We aren't going to trust a boss that does something unethical. We aren't going to trust an addicted sibling around our purse. We don't hire contractors with a bad work record. We would never trust a babysitter with a bad reputation around our kids.

 

An OW can see all that the MM is capable of doing- the lies, the sneaky behavior, the betrayal, the manipulation, the broken promises- and still think MM is a good guy because he's sweet to her.

[mokamint7]

This is a common way many OW lie to themselves- thinking MM is a good guy, and that he is only lying because of the circumstances. In most cases, he is a very selfish guy with character issues.

An OW can see all that the MM is capable of doing- the lies, the sneaky behavior, the betrayal, the manipulation, the broken promises- and still think MM is a good guy because he's sweet to her.

 

You're right. I do think he's a good guy because he's sweet to me. Which basically means I overlook the fact that he is lying and betraying his GF in order to be with me... sad on my part.

[Tauriel]

In all parts of our life, we use a person's actions to judge their character. That's just a smart thing to do. We aren't going to trust a coworker that talks behind another's back. We aren't going to trust a boss that does something unethical. We aren't going to trust an addicted sibling around our purse. We don't hire contractors with a bad work record. We would never trust a babysitter with a bad reputation around our kids.

 

An OW can see all that the MM is capable of doing- the lies, the sneaky behavior, the betrayal, the manipulation, the broken promises- and still think MM is a good guy because he's sweet to her.

 

I think that we are all a combination of both good and bad. Believe me, I don't think that MM is a 100 percent "good guy". In fact, anything but. I have known him most of my life, and I honestly would have never pegged him as a cheater. I would have thought that he was the type of man who would leave his marriage once it got to the point where he was attracted to other women to the point where he acted on it.

 

For me, I think that there was a window of time in which something had to happen -- when he should have left, to keep things as honest as possible. And yet 1.5 years down the line, and he's still carrying on, even after being busted once. Had it been me, I would have 'fessed up and either cut ties with the OW (me), or I would have 'fessed up and left. Those are the two choices you have when the truth finally comes out.

[AngeliqueC]

First of all, being a W does not mean all your needs are met any more than being an OW means all your needs are not met. Generally speaking, in a good relationship, you get out of it what you put into it. If you work at meeting each others needs, it's a good relationship, and everyone pretty much gets their needs met most of the time.

 

I've been divorced for 23 years and an OW for 20 plus of those years (yes, with the same MM). It can be a roller coaster, but the older we get, the more settled we are with our relationship. I still get "OW crazy" sometimes, but these days, I chalk it up to being in the "change of life" (hormones can be hell!!). It's an emotional, sexual, and even 'routine' relationship (what's for dinner, what's on tv, etc).

 

I don't know what the future holds for us, but the present reality is that I'm the primary caregiver for my mother who is in her eighties, and he is in his mid-sixties and considering retirement. We've discussed finally making the step to living together once he retires, but who knows? One day at a time.

 

THAT said, I'm not interested in finding that 'fantasy' single guy who sweeps me off my feet and hauls me off to the altar (Unless it's Batman. Adam West Batman.). I'm as content as I am capable of being with my life, given everything that it is or could be. I have my mother to care for, MM and I have raised my two kids together (he and W don't have any) and we've seen them graduate HS, college, go into good careers, get married, even have a grandchild. I bought a "golden years" house once the nest was empty and we have worked together to renovate and furnish it to our liking (still needs some tweaking!). We just got back from an eight day vacation to see the grandkid, and have plans for a few more trips this summer. A lot of life gets lived in twenty plus years; you go through so many ups and downs, ins and outs, and it would be difficult to walk away, because we have truly been life partners, day in and day out, year after year.

 

I guess that's what really embracing being the OW has been for me, a life choice. I got the man I wanted, just not full time. And maybe, for those years, it was the best choice. Regardless, it is what it is, and was what it was.

[cocorico]

 

I guess that's what really embracing being the OW has been for me, a life choice. I got the man I wanted, just not full time. And maybe, for those years, it was the best choice. Regardless, it is what it is, and was what it was.

 

I agree that it's a life choice. Choices can be made from positions of strength as well as positions of weakness. Not every OW is choosing because they have no other options. For many of us, it was a choice from out of many options, and the choice that - each for our own reasons - best met our needs at the time.

 

On the bolded - I think this is a point that is often missed. It is assumed by many that _any old man_, as long as he is single, is a better deal than the man you love / want / are in an A with. Whether you want him or not, whether you like him or not, whether he has three heads and erminal body odour and toes for UKIP or not. The fact that he's single (whether or not the reason for that is obvious...) means you should dump your lover / true love / soulmate instantly and grab some single man action from the unattached (unwanted?) guy. Because isn't all any woman wants, to have her own man 100% of the time, even if he's the king of the reject pile? Isn't that the only marker of success as a woman?

 

Whether it was the best choice for you those 20 years past, only you can say. It must have been good enough, at least on some level, to keep you there.

[Poppy47]

First of all, being a W does not mean all your needs are met any more than being an OW means all your needs are not met. Generally speaking, in a good relationship, you get out of it what you put into it. If you work at meeting each others needs, it's a good relationship, and everyone pretty much gets their needs met most of the time.

 

I've been divorced for 23 years and an OW for 20 plus of those years (yes, with the same MM). It can be a roller coaster, but the older we get, the more settled we are with our relationship. I still get "OW crazy" sometimes, but these days, I chalk it up to being in the "change of life" (hormones can be hell!!). It's an emotional, sexual, and even 'routine' relationship (what's for dinner, what's on tv, etc).

 

I don't know what the future holds for us, but the present reality is that I'm the primary caregiver for my mother who is in her eighties, and he is in his mid-sixties and considering retirement. We've discussed finally making the step to living together once he retires, but who knows? One day at a time.

 

THAT said, I'm not interested in finding that 'fantasy' single guy who sweeps me off my feet and hauls me off to the altar (Unless it's Batman. Adam West Batman.). I'm as content as I am capable of being with my life, given everything that it is or could be. I have my mother to care for, MM and I have raised my two kids together (he and W don't have any) and we've seen them graduate HS, college, go into good careers, get married, even have a grandchild. I bought a "golden years" house once the nest was empty and we have worked together to renovate and furnish it to our liking (still needs some tweaking!). We just got back from an eight day vacation to see the grandkid, and have plans for a few more trips this summer. A lot of life gets lived in twenty plus years; you go through so many ups and downs, ins and outs, and it would be difficult to walk away, because we have truly been life partners, day in and day out, year after year.

 

I guess that's what really embracing being the OW has been for me, a life choice. I got the man I wanted, just not full time. And maybe, for those years, it was the best choice. Regardless, it is what it is, and was what it was.

YOu have never mentioned the W in all this. How do you manage to do everything like vacations and furnishing a house together?

Poppy.

 

Poppy.

[AngeliqueC]

What he tells her and what she chooses to believe is between them. I try not to pry into their relationship, or, in my opinion, what is left of their relationship, which he says is more like roomates or brother and sister. They live very separate lives, by all accounts, and she takes her vacations separate from him as well.

 

And we furnish a house together the way any other couple does - we go shopping, agree (or compromise!!) on style, color, finishes, etc and then buy what we want. Our biggest hurdle is that is loves the idea of all white, ultra modern, minimalist with pops of bright colors, and I enjoy earth tones and a more eclectic style. So, the meeting in the middle is mid-century modern with a few antiques (some from my family, and a few knick knacks from his parent's home).

[cocorico]

What he tells her and what she chooses to believe is between them. I try not to pry into their relationship, or, in my opinion, what is left of their relationship, which he says is more like roomates or brother and sister. They live very separate lives, by all accounts, and she takes her vacations separate from him as well.

 

And we furnish a house together the way any other couple does - we go shopping, agree (or compromise!!) on style, color, finishes, etc and then buy what we want. Our biggest hurdle is that is loves the idea of all white, ultra modern, minimalist with pops of bright colors, and I enjoy earth tones and a more eclectic style. So, the meeting in the middle is mid-century modern with a few antiques (some from my family, and a few knick knacks from his parent's home).

 

Some people struggle to accept the notion that As are proper Rs, (or at least can be if you want that), not just some "fog" or "fantasy", but this post illustrates pretty well what some of us have been saying forever.

[AngeliqueC]

It's really a question of what each person's needs are - at the time this relationship started, I needed a friend (we "dated" for a year before it became a romantic, physical relationship) and so did he. Looking back, I can see where he felt he had missed out on being a father, and he was able to fulfill that role EXCEPTIONALLY WELL with my kids - later, it came out that he had always wanted a particular kind of dog, and lo and behold, a mix of that breed appeared as a stray not long afterwards on my doorstep (and no, he didn't have anything to do with it) and 'adopted' us. What I needed was to feel safe and yet unconfined in a relationship (having been married to a very manipulative, controlling, abusive fellow with drug and alcohol self-medicating for bipolar). I needed someone who would support me emotionally and still give me the space I needed to heal (and it was a slow go), and understand that I didn't want to remarry until my kids were independent adults (which does not mean the minute they turn 18!).

 

I'm finally at the point where I feel pretty well healed from the trauma of the exH and the divorce (he hauled me into court every time I turned around, until about nine years ago when the younger one was about 20). I still have occasional nightmares about the ex, but I don't live in fear of him anymore. The kids are in good, stable careers and have solid marriages. I'm responsible for a lot of things where my mother is concerned, and since I'm an only child, there isn't anyone to share that with. She has welcomed MM as a part of our family, although she regularly lectures me on why I'm not "marriage material" and does everything she can to discourage me from the idea of a "normal" 24/7 live together arrangement. <shrug. she's a mother. that's just her way.

 

Anyway, what I'm trying to say is, every relationship has its own unique shape, whether it's a marriage or an affair or something else. If you find one that works for you, and it enhances your life, you're way ahead of most people. Not everyone is going to have a decades long love affair, married or otherwise. We're lucky - we've managed to love each other AND be "in love" with each other for a very long time. But I'm still on tenterhooks about what the future may bring - keeping my fingers crossed that our relationship will continue to evolve and become even better.

[Sub]

What he tells her and what she chooses to believe is between them. I try not to pry into their relationship, or, in my opinion, what is left of their relationship, which he says is more like roomates or brother and sister. They live very separate lives, by all accounts, and she takes her vacations separate from him as well.

 

And we furnish a house together the way any other couple does - we go shopping, agree (or compromise!!) on style, color, finishes, etc and then buy what we want. Our biggest hurdle is that is loves the idea of all white, ultra modern, minimalist with pops of bright colors, and I enjoy earth tones and a more eclectic style. So, the meeting in the middle is mid-century modern with a few antiques (some from my family, and a few knick knacks from his parent's home).

 

I'm not trying to be snide, but based on your description of the R, it very much seems like you're the SO, and he's "cheating" on you with her in a way. They live separate lives....you don't want to know about their R......he's a father figure to your kids....it's very much like a BW who goes the "just don't throw it in my face and we'll be fine." Given all of this, I have to ask: why doesn't he just leave her? You gave a very typical R with this man. You do everything most people in "regular" M's do together. I would almost argue that you're not an OW at all.

[jellybean89]

Yeah ... I have big issues with that. Had MM left soon after we got involved, that would have been one thing. But to continue an A for more than a year and lie to his W? We've already had a DD (very early in), and no one ran packing. I'm sure that things are really messed up in that household -- he's alluded to this -- but yet he's continued to stay. What a mess for the two of them! Whenever I feel sorry for myself, I remind me that it could be worse: I could be his wife.

 

 

and you continue to be the mistress. What's your point? You are the hidden one, the wife is the one that he shows the world he wants, not you, because he chooses to continue a marriage. Hopefully, the wife has a boy toy on the side and gets her needs met while being able to maintain her lifestyle since her husband isn't planning to leave.

[mokamint7]

How do you manage to do everything like vacations and furnishing a house together?

 

Not every woman wants to furnish a house with a guy; me being one of them. A vacation would be nice, but if it doesn't happen I have my children, friends, and family to vacation with.

[AngeliqueC]

 

It's easy to settle for what you can get, and let's face it: a lot of women are very pragmatic creatures capable of making Faustian bargains without flinching. MM's W knows about us, and yet she stays. Maybe it's because she loves him, but I'd be willing to be that the fact that his salary, pension, and that big house he's paying for factor in heavily.

 

 

Yep, I figure that's what she is in it for - and as I said, I had no desire to remarry until I knew my "kids" were fully independent. Then, as life would have it, that's when my mother became "dependent" and I had to consider her needs and my responsibilities to her. She can be an extremely difficult person to deal with day in and day out, and though MM is great about working with that, I'm the one who is reluctant to drag him further into dysfunction - although, he keeps saying that when he retires, that's it for the marriage. But that's just him talking for now.

 

Oh, and I'm not exactly "hidden". We have socialized with the same people they have, I've been introduced to her coworkers, his coworkers (his coworkers are quite clear on the state of affairs, pun intended), and he's been a part of my immediate and extended family interactions for aeons, friends with our neighbors, etc etc etc. It's about as 'normal' as normal gets without the 'm word' being thrown in.

Edited April 25, 2015 by AngeliqueC

[Tauriel]

... he keeps saying that when he retires, that's it for the marriage. But that's just him talking for now.

 

I come from a legal/policy background. This is perhaps the very worst time to divorce, unless you're extremely wealthy. And I'm talking, Top 5 percent of income earners. The longer a marriage goes on, the more the main breadwinner has to lose, and that's a simple fact.

 

I'm happy that you are happy, Angelique, but because I do have this background -- and because of personal experience -- I worry about you because of this phrase: "by operation of law." Marriage is not just a piece of paper; it is a quasi-enforceable legal contract that adheres to state statutes governing rights and liabilities of spouses. I use the term "quasi-enforceable" because it goes against public policy to make someone stay married to a person they don't wish to be married to. Therefore, it's possible to break the contract.

 

If something happened to your MM -- if he became sick, terminally ill, or unable to take care of himself -- his W makes all of his decisions, by law. She could easily block your access to him, permanently, and she is within her legal rights to do so. There is absolutely nothing you could do to change things.