TylerDurdenn Posted June 23, 2014 Posted June 23, 2014 repent means to say sorry,know what you have doen is bad mean it sincerely and never do it again......i do it often...i often make mistakes no one is going to repent however for the bees or the species that are dying out.....no one.....everyone blames everyone else and continues to hair spray their coif before work as the eat their honey on toast and hop into their non fuel efficient cars they complain about the price of petrol, instead of maybe walkin it.......... what woudl the world be like without bees.......whole slews of vegetation would not get pollinated.......the food chain will collapse.......scientists are concerned that this is happening.....scientists ai am talking about not religious zealots...... what also cncerns scientists are the mutating of diseases that are jumping from animals to people......plagues of insects are forming because species are dying out that once controlled them the species that have died out include pollinators.....bats, birds, and finally.....bees......bats through a fungus that was once harmless now isnt harmless......birds through loss of sight at night ....one new years eve thousands of blind birds flew into the air from shock.....when they were opened up in the morgue they had one common denominator they looked like they had all been hit by blunt force trauma.....fish that were hardy and prolific floated belly up in several places due to damns adn an increse of gas in the water..... so lets recap....diseases jumping from animal to human....extinction of whole species...plagues of insects with no alpha to control them and the destruction of our own food chain due to lack of pollination by birds bats and bees.........scientific proof of this happening but also........given to us through prophesy to be prepared.....prophesied in the bible hundreds of years ago.......scary huh... so i say sorry and i repent when i do something wrong....for the bees.....for the bats.....for the birds...for the fish for the humans dying out from mutating disease as we encroach on animal dominions more everyday....deforestation....erosion....lack of a simple tree here and there...and i am praying hard every night before i go to sleep and i believe that the scientists are too....that's what i was getting at..you want proof ....ask a scientist.....i am not one, i just listen to them.....deb Wow. Just wow.
umirano Posted June 24, 2014 Posted June 24, 2014 It's becoming clearer and clearer to me that the reason so many members of the religious right tend to be gung-ho in favour of expanded military incursions and opposed to efforts to repair humanity's damage to the natural environment is that they see their positions as helping to hasten the arrival of the so-called "End Times". In the meantime they condemn millions to die, but what do they care? They believe they'll be "lifted out" anyway, so what's it to them? That's exactly the problem. Never in history have dumb ideas, bad morality and outright crazy claims had so easy access to devastating technology and military power. Years from now, our descendants will shake their heads in disbelief at the fact that we willingly ceded so much power and influence to people who believed in talking snakes, miracles, a man living in a "big fish", etc. "If there's one thing I hate more than prophecy, it's self-fulfilling prophecy." Given the seriousness of the situation, I sure hope there will be descendants in the first place. And maybe they'll just be able to utter this criticism while sitting around a camp fire in a post-nuclear apocalypse. And for sure there will be this one guy saying the lord just spoke to him, and that there's nothing to worry or some such nonsense.
Author pureinheart Posted June 24, 2014 Author Posted June 24, 2014 Wow. Just wow. I get this sense that you feel quite superior. Not just in this comment, but in others.
umirano Posted June 24, 2014 Posted June 24, 2014 I get this sense that you feel quite superior. Not just in this comment, but in others. Well, for a start, he doesn't walk around making unfounded claims about the nearing end of the world. Also, while I find todreaminblue a very likable poster, her posts can be pretty convoluted at times. As per the post in question: Species die out all the time, and new species come into existence. Of course we're now witnessing a large (anthropologically caused) extinction event. But if we really manage to poison the pollinators away (with pesticides being the most likely cause), leading to food shortage, it's our own damn stupidity and not a divinely inspired holocaust. I just read this, probably on this very forum: "If you can make someone believe absurdities, you can make them commit atrocities." Voltaire is supposedly the author of this, and I find it to be embarrassingly true, looking at the religiously fueled hate and violence all around the globe. Seriously, nothing of what todreaminblue describes is unheard of, it keeps happening throughout history of nature. Diseases of all sorts keep evolving, adapting, changing, becoming less or more agressive, and yes, some even disappear or become a mere medical nuisance. Now, dear believers, do all of you really think, if you were to start a new cult, you'd really forgo the beautiful opportunity to draw attention to your writings, by not making some generic vague reference to future catastrophes of one sort or another? The answer to the issues todreaminblue rightly mentions as threats to our civilization is not to resort to stone age texts and scare people into an emotional cave of prayer and end time stories. The answer is to think, and act. We can change what's happening. We can save the bees and take care of our environment. Wasting energy on praying to a sky daddy who doesn't give a damn (assuming he exists) is not helping any problem, at all. Same goes for endless discussions on how to correctly interpret the desert scribbling. It's taking so much thinking power away from real actual problems, that we'd actually stand a chance solving, if we just focused on the real, and not the bizarre and unreal. 3
todreaminblue Posted June 24, 2014 Posted June 24, 2014 I get this sense that you feel quite superior. Not just in this comment, but in others. maybe he is just stunned at my retarded childish logic...for i often thin retardly when to me it makes perfect sense............each to his own pureinheart ...i wish him well...hugs.deb 1
todreaminblue Posted June 24, 2014 Posted June 24, 2014 (edited) Well, for a start, he doesn't walk around making unfounded claims about the nearing end of the world. Also, while I find todreaminblue a very likable poster, her posts can be pretty convoluted at times. As per the post in question: Species die out all the time, and new species come into existence. Of course we're now witnessing a large (anthropologically caused) extinction event. But if we really manage to poison the pollinators away (with pesticides being the most likely cause), leading to food shortage, it's our own damn stupidity and not a divinely inspired holocaust. I just read this, probably on this very forum: "If you can make someone believe absurdities, you can make them commit atrocities." Voltaire is supposedly the author of this, and I find it to be embarrassingly true, looking at the religiously fueled hate and violence all around the globe. Seriously, nothing of what todreaminblue describes is unheard of, it keeps happening throughout history of nature. Diseases of all sorts keep evolving, adapting, changing, becoming less or more agressive, and yes, some even disappear or become a mere medical nuisance. Now, dear believers, do all of you really think, if you were to start a new cult, you'd really forgo the beautiful opportunity to draw attention to your writings, by not making some generic vague reference to future catastrophes of one sort or another? The answer to the issues todreaminblue rightly mentions as threats to our civilization is not to resort to stone age texts and scare people into an emotional cave of prayer and end time stories. The answer is to think, and act. We can change what's happening. We can save the bees and take care of our environment. Wasting energy on praying to a sky daddy who doesn't give a damn (assuming he exists) is not helping any problem, at all. Same goes for endless discussions on how to correctly interpret the desert scribbling. It's taking so much thinking power away from real actual problems, that we'd actually stand a chance solving, if we just focused on the real, and not the bizarre and unreal. Seriously, nothing of what todreaminblue describes is unheard of, it keeps happening throughout history of nature. Diseases of all sorts keep evolving, adapting, changing, becoming less or more agressive, and yes, some even disappear or become a mere medical nuisance. how do you know that it isnt a gradual design in gods plan for this to occur for the end of days we have no time frame...when it happens it happens.....and could be it doesnt mean its a big bang boom crash ending .....but maybe a whimper the world goes out on due to necessity to fulfill gods promises..............can you cite proof for me please why it couldnt be a sign from our sky daddy....my only real daddy i trust by the way.......i am not being facetious i actually want to know......what proof you have it isnt a sign of biblical prophecy.......it happens all the time isnt proof ....other than to say the frequency and increase that scientists are actually concerned with doesnt bother you that you would shrug and say it happens all the time..pesiticides you say when scientists are baffled .....and it is their life long passion to study and define why...they cant give reasons why but you can....i believe this is my proof...that god has hands on earth to help him....so in hindsight i would say so does satan....in pesticide manufactures for one and the ignorance of mankind another........deb Edited June 24, 2014 by todreaminblue
Glinda.Good Posted June 24, 2014 Posted June 24, 2014 My neighbors recently had quite a number of red calves, some of them are heifers. It's not unusual in the breed (Red Angus). Is this of monumental significance?
pie2 Posted June 24, 2014 Posted June 24, 2014 The End Times Are Screaming at Us! It's not exacty what I wanted, but this has turned out to be harder than I told you prior. I can't find an article that puts all of the prophetic Scriptures together in order of timeframe and also connecting them with current events. I had a pretty good one, but can't find it now... That's sort of what I saw too: 13 End-Time Events Which says that end times will be marked with: Worldwide breakdown of characterIncrease in false ChristianityWars grow much worseWars and commotionFamineTroublesDiseaseAnimal attacksEarthquakes and volcanic activity increaseTrue gospel is preachedThe world is warnedHoly Roman Empire is resurrectedThe False Prophet appears After all that, the Second Coming will take place, then the Rapture. Or the Rapture first, and then the Second Coming? And that's where the pre-tribulation, mid-tribulation and post-tribulation arguments begin? It's all very confusing, honestly. And it's hard to tell what we're really seeing with the signs around us. For example, sometimes it feels like we live in a more peaceful time than ever before, compared to some of the atrocious wars and famines in the past. On the other hand, something that doesn't seem to compare are the earthquakes (another 8.0 today!). But sometimes I think we just have better tools to read those earthquakes we previously wouldn't have been able to measure. Regardless, we should always be ready for anything! God will come like a thief in the night. 1
M30USA Posted June 24, 2014 Posted June 24, 2014 Nice list, Pie. The rapture precedes the second coming. A good way to remember this (and support the view) is that, since Christ's second coming will be WITH saints, he must have previously taken them away. There are many gray areas in Scripture but this sequence of rapture preceding second coming is crystal clear and unarguable. 2
Author pureinheart Posted June 24, 2014 Author Posted June 24, 2014 My neighbors recently had quite a number of red calves, some of them are heifers. It's not unusual in the breed (Red Angus). Is this of monumental significance? They have to be perfect. Did you watch the clip- it explains that and more.
pie2 Posted June 24, 2014 Posted June 24, 2014 Nice list, Pie. The rapture precedes the second coming. A good way to remember this (and support the view) is that, since Christ's second coming will be WITH saints, he must have previously taken them away. There are many gray areas in Scripture but this sequence of rapture preceding second coming is crystal clear and unarguable. So this site has listed the following order of events: RaptureWar of Gog and Magog (aka Russia/Iran/Libya/etc. vs. Israel)Antichrist's 7-Year Covenant with IsraelThe TribulationGlobal GovernmentSatan Thrown to EarthThe Abomination of Desolation - the first place I read about the temple (I was skimming though). It said the Antichrist will enter the temple and proclaim himself as God. So I guess the temple will have to be rebuilt sometime before that .Jews flee IsraelThe Mark of the BeastGreat TribulationAppearance of Two WitnessesBabylon Destroyed in One HourDeath of Two WitnessesGathering at ArmageddonGlorious Appearing of Christ (is this the "Second Coming"?)The Birth of the Millennial Kingdom That's a lot that has to happen! What do you guys think about this order of events? 1
Author pureinheart Posted June 24, 2014 Author Posted June 24, 2014 That's sort of what I saw too: 13 End-Time Events Which says that end times will be marked with: Worldwide breakdown of characterIncrease in false ChristianityWars grow much worseWars and commotionFamineTroublesDiseaseAnimal attacksEarthquakes and volcanic activity increaseTrue gospel is preachedThe world is warnedHoly Roman Empire is resurrectedThe False Prophet appears After all that, the Second Coming will take place, then the Rapture. Or the Rapture first, and then the Second Coming? And that's where the pre-tribulation, mid-tribulation and post-tribulation arguments begin? It's all very confusing, honestly. And it's hard to tell what we're really seeing with the signs around us. For example, sometimes it feels like we live in a more peaceful time than ever before, compared to some of the atrocious wars and famines in the past. On the other hand, something that doesn't seem to compare are the earthquakes (another 8.0 today!). But sometimes I think we just have better tools to read those earthquakes we previously wouldn't have been able to measure. Regardless, we should always be ready for anything! God will come like a thief in the night. The Rapture comes before the Second Coming. I think people use the term "Second Coming" when they actually mean the Rapture or that is what they mean and are off IMO. Oh yes, there is a debate on that; pre-trib and mid-trib. Nothing but pre-trib makes sense due a couple of things. First, the Holy Spirit is removed (the Church is indwelled with the Spirit) and during the trib it goes back to the Spirit indwelling specific people, like in the O/T. Second God didn't mean His people for His wrath and that is what the 7 yr trib is. Yes I saw that link ...read so many. Pre-Trib Research Center - Pie, I had some really good links a couple of years ago and lost them on my other laptop. They dealt with and gave excellent translations of Psalms 83 and Ezekiel 38/39. I'll find them again:) I find that most who believe that one can lose their salvation also believe in mid-trib rapture. There may be a connection here as IMO the concept of the Spirit is lost in these two things. I say, read the Word and do an exhaustive study and find the conclusions from that. Sadly I did this study 27 years ago and my notes aren't in my Jesus file (yes I really do have a Jesus file...lol)
Author pureinheart Posted June 24, 2014 Author Posted June 24, 2014 So this site has listed the following order of events: RaptureWar of Gog and Magog (aka Russia/Iran/Libya/etc. vs. Israel)Antichrist's 7-Year Covenant with IsraelThe TribulationGlobal GovernmentSatan Thrown to EarthThe Abomination of Desolation - the first place I read about the temple (I was skimming though). It said the Antichrist will enter the temple and proclaim himself as God. So I guess the temple will have to be rebuilt sometime before that .Jews flee IsraelThe Mark of the BeastGreat TribulationAppearance of Two WitnessesBabylon Destroyed in One HourDeath of Two WitnessesGathering at ArmageddonGlorious Appearing of Christ (is this the "Second Coming"?)The Birth of the Millennial Kingdom That's a lot that has to happen! What do you guys think about this order of events? This is excellent (thank you so much Pie!) ....oh this is so fascinating IMO...I got down to the two witnesses, which some believe it will Moses and Elijah, others think it will be Enoch and Moses. WOW, this occurs at the end of the first 3 and 1/2 years and could usher in the next 3 and 1/2 years (please, I stand corrected if need be, it's from memory). Anyway, can you imagine! Regardless of who it actually is, I believe they are O/T major prophets...WOW! You know the trippy thing that I just read about, and it makes a lot of sense. The Rapture could occur several years prior to the Trib due to the fact that it will take a bit of time to get re-established...think about it, the Church is gone- poof ...the Church holds many positions in society and these voids will have to be filled. Not to mention the disasters that will take place. I also firmly believe that those who have heard Christians talk about the Rapture and actually see it- well, I think a lot of people could be saved by that alone. I feel there will be a great revival, may it happens shortly after the Church has been taken up... I'd love to see how the world explains that one...lol. I know some will explain- see the negative force is gone, so it could be attributed to Satan. 1
Author pureinheart Posted June 24, 2014 Author Posted June 24, 2014 Well, for a start, he doesn't walk around making unfounded claims about the nearing end of the world. Also, while I find todreaminblue a very likable poster, her posts can be pretty convoluted at times. As per the post in question: Species die out all the time, and new species come into existence. Of course we're now witnessing a large (anthropologically caused) extinction event. But if we really manage to poison the pollinators away (with pesticides being the most likely cause), leading to food shortage, it's our own damn stupidity and not a divinely inspired holocaust. I just read this, probably on this very forum: "If you can make someone believe absurdities, you can make them commit atrocities." Voltaire is supposedly the author of this, and I find it to be embarrassingly true, looking at the religiously fueled hate and violence all around the globe. Seriously, nothing of what todreaminblue describes is unheard of, it keeps happening throughout history of nature. Diseases of all sorts keep evolving, adapting, changing, becoming less or more agressive, and yes, some even disappear or become a mere medical nuisance. Now, dear believers, do all of you really think, if you were to start a new cult, you'd really forgo the beautiful opportunity to draw attention to your writings, by not making some generic vague reference to future catastrophes of one sort or another? The answer to the issues todreaminblue rightly mentions as threats to our civilization is not to resort to stone age texts and scare people into an emotional cave of prayer and end time stories. The answer is to think, and act. We can change what's happening. We can save the bees and take care of our environment. Wasting energy on praying to a sky daddy who doesn't give a damn (assuming he exists) is not helping any problem, at all. Same goes for endless discussions on how to correctly interpret the desert scribbling. It's taking so much thinking power away from real actual problems, that we'd actually stand a chance solving, if we just focused on the real, and not the bizarre and unreal. What are your thoughts on Islam?
umirano Posted June 24, 2014 Posted June 24, 2014 What are your thoughts on Islam? Same thing as any other religion. A useless attempt at understanding the world, and a heartless attempt at morality. 3
umirano Posted June 24, 2014 Posted June 24, 2014 how do you know that it isnt a gradual design in gods plan I don't see any reason to believe there's a god in the first place. So, conveniently, I don't have to worry about his psychotic, devilish plans to kill and destroy civilization. It's just fiction to me. I'm worried though about the number of people who think it's reality, as I would be if people started believing in the return of the orks or Saruman. for this to occur for the end of days we have no time frame...when it happens it happens.....and could be it doesnt mean its a big bang boom crash ending .....but maybe a whimper the world goes out How this prophecy conveniently fits all kinds of events. Boom or whimper, quick or long stretched. Could be anything. I can make predictions like this. In 100 years people will eat lunch. Am I a prophet now too? on due to necessity to fulfill gods promises..............can you cite proof for me please why it couldnt be a sign from our sky daddy You're asking me to prove a negative.Russell's teapot - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia If I asked you to prove to me that the big volcanic eruption a few years ago in Iceland is not a sign of the return of Thor, you would be facing the same problem. The thing is, with this thinking, you can justify anything. That's why it cannot be part of a serious argument. Proof to me that <generic event> is not a sign for <generic religious prophecy> will always "work", but obviously, a causal relation cannot be established by the person arguing for the connection of the event and the prophecy. ....my only real daddy i trust by the way.......i am not being facetious i actually want to know......what proof you have it isnt a sign of biblical prophecy.......it happens all the time isnt proof If you agree that it is ongoing, rather than a new phenomenon, why wasn't it a sign before? Of course it happens all the time, that's why there's even a word for that: Background extinction rate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ....other than to say the frequency and increase that scientists are actually concerned with doesnt bother you that you would shrug and say it happens all the time..pesiticides you say when scientists are baffled .....and it is their life long passion to study and define why...they cant give reasons why but you can.... Well, actually the scientists that are baffled as you claim, aren't really: Colony collapse disorder - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. We have a very good understanding of likely causes. TL;DR: too much use of dangerous pesticides, uniform agricultural plantations (lack of diversity in food sources), genetic degradation of bee swarms due to hybridization and reliance on a few selected breeder swarms. i believe this is my proof...that god has hands on earth to help him....so in hindsight i would say so does satan....in pesticide manufactures for one and the ignorance of mankind another........deb I cringe at expressions such as my proof. There's proof and there is things that aren't proof. And as I showed, you're actually misrepresenting the fact that scientists are baffled. They did not, like you and believers in general resort to the argument from ignorance (Argument from ignorance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia They sat down in the lab or went out into the field and took a look at the real world and narrowed down the likely causes of the CCD instead of inserting a hypothetical mystical being wanting to terminate the earth.
Glinda.Good Posted June 24, 2014 Posted June 24, 2014 They have to be perfect. Did you watch the clip- it explains that and more. Serious question: Surely you are aware that there are millions upon millions of cattle born constantly, all over the world. There could be plenty of pure red ones that are not even noticed; not all farmers are looking for "signs." What if the special animal has already been made into hamburgers somewhere and nobody even took note of it? 1
Haydn Posted June 24, 2014 Posted June 24, 2014 If you believe in end times. what are you doing with your time left. Still paying taxes, dropping the kiddies to school etc... 1
pie2 Posted June 24, 2014 Posted June 24, 2014 Serious question: Surely you are aware that there are millions upon millions of cattle born constantly, all over the world. There could be plenty of pure red ones that are not even noticed; not all farmers are looking for "signs." What if the special animal has already been made into hamburgers somewhere and nobody even took note of it? While I don't know if this calf is anything special, I do know that God doesn't make mistakes. The chosen calf (if such thing is needed) isn't ground beef. She'll be born in the right place at the right time. If you believe in end times. what are you doing with your time left. Still paying taxes, dropping the kiddies to school etc... Great question! Yes, what are we doing with the time we have left? And even if you don't believe in "end times", we all have an end time coming, so what is anyone doing with his or her time on earth? I think many Christians are called to love during their time on earth; loving God and loving our neighbors. So paying taxes and dropping kiddies off would probably fall into one of those categories. But falling into a lifestyle of gluttonous, drunken sin probably isn't something most believers are aiming for. However, if you don't believe in the afterlife, it's said that life should be lived to the absolute fullest: eat, drink and be merry! For tomorrow...well, you know. 2
Author pureinheart Posted June 24, 2014 Author Posted June 24, 2014 Serious question: Surely you are aware that there are millions upon millions of cattle born constantly, all over the world. There could be plenty of pure red ones that are not even noticed; not all farmers are looking for "signs." What if the special animal has already been made into hamburgers somewhere and nobody even took note of it? I think Pie gave a good explanation in an above quote. I think the part that interests me the most is that the red heifer was found or chosen from the US, and believe that to be significant. After reading more on this matter, it is a very painstaking process.
Author pureinheart Posted June 24, 2014 Author Posted June 24, 2014 Great question! Yes, what are we doing with the time we have left? And even if you don't believe in "end times", we all have an end time coming, so what is anyone doing with his or her time on earth? This is a question I think all should ask themselves. IMO we all fall short, but if one is asking themselves this, they are definitely in the right direction... 1
Author pureinheart Posted June 24, 2014 Author Posted June 24, 2014 Same thing as any other religion. A useless attempt at understanding the world, and a heartless attempt at morality. ...although in your mind, your thinking is ok? Correct? The funny thing is, I don't and don't see many other Christian's hating on those who don't believe and find that quite ironic. IMO it's the intolerance of a supposed tolerance. The reason I asked you about your thoughts on Islam is more than not I see Christians blasted if they communicate one word about God- there is outrage and an outcry. How is a discussion concerning the last days a threat? If you know in your heart that it's all a bunch of BS and not real...well... IMO it's the intolerance of those who profess to be tolerant. 1
Trimmer Posted June 24, 2014 Posted June 24, 2014 I think Pie gave a good explanation in an above quote. I think the part that interests me the most is that the red heifer was found or chosen from the US, and believe that to be significant. Oh, so the United States is specified in the prophecy? 1
Author pureinheart Posted June 24, 2014 Author Posted June 24, 2014 Oh, so the United States is specified in the prophecy? Yes, the US is in Bible prophecy, although in this specifically I communicated in an earlier post why I felt it to be significant. It's a personal feeling, that's all:)
umirano Posted June 24, 2014 Posted June 24, 2014 ...although in your mind, your thinking is ok? Correct? Of course, but I'm happy to accept proof and change my mind, contrary to religious doctrine. The funny thing is, I don't and don't see many other Christian's hating on those who don't believe and find that quite ironic. Telling people they go to "hell" and they deserve it is quite enough hate for me, thank you. The reason I asked you about your thoughts on Islam is more than not I see Christians blasted if they communicate one word about God- there is outrage and an outcry. I see no outcry or rage here. I just hold a very strong POV, which is that no religion ever furthered humanity morally or otherwise in understanding and improving our circumstances. That's not rage, that's just my conclusion from looking at the good and the bad that comes from religious doctrine and from the people following any given religion. Christianity is currently less damaging than Islam, e.g. when we look at beheadings or religious fanaticism. BUT that doesn't make it true when it comes to christian claims about the state of the universe or our future. And from a philosophical POV both are equally terrible attempts at explaining our world, our purpose and our origin. How is a discussion concerning the last days a threat? If you know in your heart that it's all a bunch of BS and not real...well... IMO it's the intolerance of those who profess to be tolerant. The discussion isn't a threat to me personally. I'm just saying it doesn't have a testable foundation, it's absurd at best, and a waste of time and energy and it's scaremongering at worst. Some people start taking it seriously and suddenly their god commands them to unleash violence on "satan's followers" and they will feel justified as they're just fulfilling the bible's prophecies. I mean, explain to a devout muslim why he shouldn't make use of the atomic bomb to further the jihad. A similar case can be made for christianity. Would it not make you feel uncomfortable if I went to prepare my ork sword because I strongly believe Saruman is about to come and summon his troops? That I'll be part of his big plan to take back middle earth or whatever?
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