HereNorThere Posted June 13, 2014 Posted June 13, 2014 I haz cheeseburgerz I actually think that CM's post on FB is completely understandable, as is his anger. And having an A is NEVER okay. It was just the whole sweeping in and declaring CD hopeless that bothered me. Cheezburgrz? Your offering pleases kitty! Thanks for being a good sport. And yeah, the Facebook thing was absolutely not an issue. However, CM has a really, really valid point about some of the possible consequences of poking at the OM. She sent him nude/sexual photographs and or videos of herself and he's a computer nerd. As bad as things are now, the OM could certainly make them much worse if he wanted to. Unfortunately, that was one the powers she mistakenly gave him. Maybe I'm different, but I couldn't handle someone trading naked pictures of my wife like baseball cards. Cat pictures are a completely different story though!
Owl Posted June 13, 2014 Posted June 13, 2014 As I posted on the other thread...how CM feels about OM at this point is pretty normal for most BS's. I certainly had thoughts of revenge still happening at the timeframe CM/CD are post d-day. Right now, he probably feels that things have greatly improved between the two of them, and he's happy with that. But at the same time, he probably still feels like he still 'owes' OM (his ex-friend) a little something still as well. OM in my situation was something of a friend to a degree too...so I get that. What CM should have done is to do a bit of 'cost/benefit analysis' on his actions before posting the article to FB. What does it do for me...and what does it 'cost' to do? Is it worth it? I'd agree that he SHOULD have considered how CD would feel seeing that posted, and that should have played some part in his decision making process. And perhaps he did that...and felt that whatever she felt was worth whatever it made OM feel. I don't know...can't read his mind. At the end of the day...he did what he did, he'll do what he's gonna do, and it's up to him and CD to figure out what their future will be. I think CD should have told him directly how it made her feel (she was personally embarassed/humiliated somewhat by it). I think she did that to a degree. And they should have discussed leaving it up or not. She should have been very, very careful to ensure to CM that she was not defending OM...but it made her personally feel bad to see it there, and was a reminder of things that she personally no longer wanted to see/feel. But again...is what it is. It's up to them to work out how they handle this issue...and how they handle future ones as well. 2
drifter777 Posted June 13, 2014 Posted June 13, 2014 (edited) ... It seems to me that the fact of the matter is that if we want to reconcile, we do need to 'get over it' even if our WS can never use such words. Again to be fair to CM, perhaps it's just too early. He hasn't yet had the luxury of 2-5 years. I suppose he's approaching a year and a half. To me, that seems a good time to ask when the free pass on lashing out expires. When does that stop? How long does a BS get to say that what they do pales in comparison to what the WS did? You hit on another exceptionally important subject: how long "should" it take a BH to stop the lashing out and passive/aggressive behavior? We can all agree that it will be different from BH to BH, but its a good subject to examine. You all know that I'm not in favor of a BH trying to reconcile because it's such a crap-shoot as to whether he will ever be able to truly forgive. The risk that he will stay married out of his desire to stabilize his world and his family life and then live with a great deal of regret is too great. BUT - we also know that most men are going to give reconciliation a try. For those BH's I always advise that they take their own temperature from time-to-time to determine if they honestly believe they will ever be able to accept what their wife did. Not just be able to swallow it and go through the motions of a marriage, but actually recover the relationship. One sign that true reconciliation is never going to happen could be something like this facebook post by CM. Not saying it IS - just that its kind of a red flag that he needs to examine. CM is curious why people are ao interested in their R. For me, I suppose it's that I like a success story. That's what I'd like to see here. As for your question about why CM would want to reconcile, I think Trimmer was right that you summed it up well. Maybe this is why others are interested in their story but not me. I don't think anyone can judge this to be a success story. Not yet. What I find facinating is that both CM and CD are willing to post the facts as they see them. I get insight into what motivated this particular WW to betray her husband in this worst possible way and her feelings now that she wants to try to save their relationship. I get a glimpse into the heart of another BH struggling to come to terms with all of this while knowing his story from both his and the WW's perspective. It really is quite interesting. Edited June 13, 2014 by drifter777 3
katielee Posted June 13, 2014 Posted June 13, 2014 about 2 months ago my hubby told me that if he were alone with my AP and he had a gun, it would be 50/50 on whether or not he'd kill him. I said, "do what you need to do and i'll bail you out of jail." (we're 4 years out) Point is - this crap runs deep, very deep. I'm with drifter in that I don't think many men can recover from this. Sorry, I hate generalizations but there it is. I think this is par for the course and CM is moving in the right direction. Baby steps. Who cares what anyone thinks on Facebook. And sorry CD but you made this a bigger drama than it needed to be, IMO... 4
jnel921 Posted June 13, 2014 Posted June 13, 2014 Most of us BH's end up stuck in the middle between walking away from our WW's and trying to get our old lives back. We want the world to return to the way it was before she betrayed us. We want that so badly that we are willing to pretend that we forgive and pray to God that time will eventually heal us. But just under the surface the pain rages. The urge to get even with her simmers. For lots and lots of BH's there is no such thing as reconciliation - just settling for a cheater because it's safer than trying to start . I can't say I agree with this. I didn't settle the first time and I did move on.... To another man who cheated as well....but I decided to stay. It's not an easy process. Trust me I put my H through the ringer and back. He slept with his good friends GF and my h and his friend used to work together, so he got it at work. What the heck did he expect? But you know what? He was okay with that. Because he owned his actions. He hurt those he cared for and did whatever he could to try and maintain at least a good working relationship when they still worked together. CM has to deal with and work his way through the pain. CD needs to be humble and accept her part in this. Never give him a reason to feel that she is there for him and only him. No one should settle. 1
HereNorThere Posted June 14, 2014 Posted June 14, 2014 If your ideal partner is a person who would never hurt or shame your family and you end up with a partner who has or would, you do have to decide if you are willing to settle for that partner. We all settle in some way, shape or form so it's not necessarily the world's worst thing. We all have different core values and beliefs. OP is obviously stronger than the average person, so he may simply have a higher capacity to handle the dissonance associated with this type of relationship. Whatever it may be, he certainly has my respect. He seems like such a good, chill dude. Whoever ends up with this amazing guy is going to be a VERY lucky person. A young musician with a six pack and the freedom to do whatever the F he wants. The world is this man's oyster and he doesn't even realize it. 1
Hope Shimmers Posted June 14, 2014 Posted June 14, 2014 A young musician with a six pack and the freedom to do whatever the F he wants. The world is this man's oyster and he doesn't even realize it. That's how you and I see it, from the distance that lets us have objectivity and no emotional investment. But love is a very powerful thing.
Spark1111 Posted June 14, 2014 Posted June 14, 2014 if both parties are serious about reconciling, the mind movies have to be put to rest, eventually. PERIOD. The size of his d#ck, how many O's experienced, how many ILYs, and all the breathless secrets shared just have to be put into perspective. If you will not understand that ALL affairs follow the same patterns of releasing adolescent like hormones, addictive in nature and limerance, stupid, judgement affecting risk-taking: If, given the chance to be together 24/7, most will blow apart within 2 years because these chemicals WILL fade: If you want to take it personally for years, decades later......then do not reconcile. It will not work. Your ego will not let it....EVER. But if your very healthy ego needs to flex and gets angry or takes a cheap shot, burns a couch, smashes a car, punches a nose, exposes on their email list and you are still standing--as opposed to jumping off a bridge--PAT YOURSELF on the back! You are halfway to home, indifference and some real inner peace. 3
HereNorThere Posted June 14, 2014 Posted June 14, 2014 (edited) if both parties are serious about reconciling, the mind movies have to be put to rest, eventually. PERIOD. The size of his d#ck, how many O's experienced, how many ILYs, and all the breathless secrets shared just have to be put into perspective. If you will not understand that ALL affairs follow the same patterns of releasing adolescent like hormones, addictive in nature and limerance, stupid, judgement affecting risk-taking: If, given the chance to be together 24/7, most will blow apart within 2 years because these chemicals WILL fade: If you want to take it personally for years, decades later......then do not reconcile. It will not work. Your ego will not let it....EVER. But if your very healthy ego needs to flex and gets angry or takes a cheap shot, burns a couch, smashes a car, punches a nose, exposes on their email list and you are still standing--as opposed to jumping off a bridge--PAT YOURSELF on the back! You are halfway to home, indifference and some real inner peace. "Mind movies" or as us scientionists call them, intrusive thoughts, are mostly an involuntary response. Rumination (obsessive thought) usually occurs comorbidly, but not always. In cognitive behavior therapy (and many other psychological disciplines/models) there are various thought stopping techniques or coping mechanisms used to provide relief to the sufferer. Different personality types need different treatment. Personality wise, I think I'm probably more like CD than I am CM when it comes to this particular issue. I simply can't control what pops into my mind at any given time. I think what I have learned and could pass onto her is this - Regardless of whether or not I can control my thoughts/obsessions, I do not have to give them significance. I can allow thoughts, inner dialog, mind movies to freely flow through my mind while picking and choosing the ones that are healthy to explore. Also (and I keep messing this one up) don't confuse your obsessions with love. New relationship energy or infatuation is easily confused for love because the same monoamine neurotransmitters (serotonin, dopamine, norepinephrine, etc) are involved. Studies show these systems stay ramped up for a year or so before they start declining. Most healthy people move onto attachment love after that, but some just want that next hit of dopamine. For myself, infatuated/new love is too much of a roller coaster of doubt, obsession and longing. Attachment love on the other hand is like being my 5 year old self wrapped in a warm blanket, watching cartoons while my mom makes me chicken soup. Ahh, the love you never have to doubt. Edited June 14, 2014 by HereNorThere 2
Spark1111 Posted June 14, 2014 Posted June 14, 2014 "Mind movies" or as us scientionists call them, intrusive thoughts, are mostly an involuntary response. Rumination (obsessive thought) usually occurs comorbidly, but not always. In cognitive behavior therapy (and many other psychological disciplines/models) there are various thought stopping techniques or coping mechanisms used to provide relief to the sufferer. Different personality types need different treatment. Personality wise, I think I'm probably more like CD than I am CM when it comes to this particular issue. I simply can't control what pops into my mind at any given time. I think what I have learned and could pass onto her is this - Regardless of whether or not I can control my thoughts/obsessions, I do not have to give them significance. I can allow thoughts, inner dialog, mind movies to freely flow through my mind while picking and choosing the ones that are healthy to explore. Also (and I keep messing this one up) don't confuse your obsessions with love. New relationship energy or infatuation is easily confused for love because the same monoamine neurotransmitters (serotonin, dopamine, norepinephrine, etc) are involved. Studies show these systems stay ramped up for a year or so before they start declining. Most healthy people move onto attachment love after that, but some just want that next hit of dopamine. For myself, infatuated/new love is too much of a roller coaster of doubt, obsession and longing. Attachment love on the other hand is like being my 5 year old self wrapped in a warm blanket, watching cartoons while my mom makes me chicken soup. Ahh, the love you never have to doubt. On this, we agree! Unrequited love is always perfect. It has never been tested by reality. true love has not only been tested by reality, but has come out unscathed on the othe side and.....endures. Firework roller coaster versus blanketed chicken soup. Great analogy. One lasts. One does not. Psychological annals are filled with limerance versus mature love. Limerance is driven by short-lived brain chemicals that are Similiar to cocaine addiction. psychs and scientists are now trying to study mature love: Couples monogamous for 50, 60 years who are STILL holding hands and wanting to have a roll in the hay....gloriously, passionately partnered. 2
drifter777 Posted June 14, 2014 Posted June 14, 2014 I can't say I agree with this. I didn't settle the first time and I did move on.... To another man who cheated as well....but I decided to stay. It's not an easy process. Trust me I put my H through the ringer and back. He slept with his good friends GF and my h and his friend used to work together, so he got it at work. What the heck did he expect? But you know what? He was okay with that. Because he owned his actions. He hurt those he cared for and did whatever he could to try and maintain at least a good working relationship when they still worked together. CM has to deal with and work his way through the pain. CD needs to be humble and accept her part in this. Never give him a reason to feel that she is there for him and only him. No one should settle. I never apply any of my opinions or advice to a BW. Any generalizations such as "most BH's" or "lots of BH's" come from my own personal experience as well as everything I've read and observed for the past few decades. 1
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