Marks Posted March 25, 2014 Posted March 25, 2014 So I don't know how I managed this, but I now have two coffee dates setup with two girls that I would normally consider out of my league. I met them online through OKCupid...one of them messaged me first and the other I messaged first. I went back and forth with both for a little over a week before I suggested we meet up for coffee. Anyway, the problem I'm having is the fact that I consider both of them to be out of my league, and I'm not sure how to prep myself mentally for the meetups. I don't want to come off as a blundering fool, since generally speaking, I get pretty nervous around girls who I consider to be really cute/hot, and I start exhibiting a lot of the physical/behavioral signs of nervousness. Now, I don't know for a fact that they're out of my league...after all, they did agree to meet, so at the very least they must think I look good in my pictures, and my profile piqued their interest. But generally speaking, I'm not really aware of what my attractiveness level is, because I've never really gone out with girls like these--except for one time many, many years ago where I met up with a "hot" girl for frozen yogurt, and the whole thing ended horribly. Since then I've usually considered myself as less than attractive, and it has been a huge damper on my confidence with girls. So in my own mind I feel like I don't measure up...and I don't think I'd ever have the courage to ask out these girls in real life. But yet here they are...willing to meet with me. And I don't want to mess things up
Mo_Do Posted March 25, 2014 Posted March 25, 2014 So I don't know how I managed this, but I now have two coffee dates setup with two girls that I would normally consider out of my league. I met them online through OKCupid...one of them messaged me first and the other I messaged first. I went back and forth with both for a little over a week before I suggested we meet up for coffee. Anyway, the problem I'm having is the fact that I consider both of them to be out of my league, and I'm not sure how to prep myself mentally for the meetups. I don't want to come off as a blundering fool, since generally speaking, I get pretty nervous around girls who I consider to be really cute/hot, and I start exhibiting a lot of the physical/behavioral signs of nervousness. Now, I don't know for a fact that they're out of my league...after all, they did agree to meet, so at the very least they must think I look good in my pictures, and my profile piqued their interest. But generally speaking, I'm not really aware of what my attractiveness level is, because I've never really gone out with girls like these--except for one time many, many years ago where I met up with a "hot" girl for frozen yogurt, and the whole thing ended horribly. Since then I've usually considered myself as less than attractive, and it has been a huge damper on my confidence with girls. So in my own mind I feel like I don't measure up...and I don't think I'd ever have the courage to ask out these girls in real life. But yet here they are...willing to meet with me. And I don't want to mess things up Meh... You're being fooled by over the top dating profiles and pictures. #1 neither is going to look like her pics or be the woman you're currently envisioning. They're not, trust me, from someone that has and does date these chicks all the time. Knock 30% off their "profile looks" and you'll be close to what you're about to confront on these dates - I've met some that were 60% off their profiles. Don't get worked up or nervous, meet them as an equal and just see how it goes (and come back to let us know how they went). 1
Hello_is_it_me Posted March 25, 2014 Posted March 25, 2014 Wrong outlook, OP. Go in thinking about what you can offer them. Why they would be better off with you than some random guy. If you don't go in with a little confidence it might not turn out well. Also remember that in the long run, say one date doesnt go so well... Who cares?? It doesn't matter in the big picture. So go in with no expectations, some self worth, and HAVE FUN! 1
Author Marks Posted March 28, 2014 Author Posted March 28, 2014 Well, I suppose I shouldn't be surprised...but basically one of the girls I mentioned above (the one I messaged first) just pretty much stood me up yesterday. We were supposed to meet for coffee at 8 in the evening. About two hours beforehand I get a text from her saying that it looks like she might be staying at work until 7. She said that she'll keep me posted, to which I say "Ok, just let me know." For the next hour I don't hear anything from her so I assume that the meet is still on, so I start to get ready. At half an hour before I still don't hear from her, so I figure that she was able to make it out at 7 and so I go ahead and drive to the coffee shop where we agreed to meet. I get to the coffee shop a few minutes early so I just wait around for her out front. I make sure to look inside the shop to see if she's maybe already inside, but the shop is relatively empty and I don't see anyone there that looks like her. So I wait... As 8 o'clock comes I expect her to be walking down the street any minute... Well, at about 8:05 I get a text from her saying "I'm really sorry, I'm still at work " That's followed by a text asking if she can get a raincheck for next week. At this point I'm kind of flabbergasted because I've never had anyone cancel on me right when we're supposed to meet, so I don't know how to respond. It takes me a couple of minutes to think of a reply...and all I can come up with is "It's alright. Sure, we can meetup next week." ....and that was that. Since I drove all that way already I went ahead and got a coffee at the shop and hung around for about half an hour contemplating what just happened. Then I went home. Anyway, you're right...I really should have no expectations when it comes to this, especially with respect to girls from OLD. I'm not really sure what happened--I suppose I should give her the benefit of the doubt that she had a long day at work (although she said that the latest she gets out is 6:30), but I'm leaning more towards believing that she just decided to not meet with me for whatever reason. Maybe she chickened out, maybe she was on the fence about me and decided it wasn't worth her time... who knows. The main thing that irks me is that she didn't give me more advanced notice. I mean, if she knew the she wasn't going to make 8 o'clock, regardless of why, she could have at least given me the courtesy of letting me know, even if was just half an hour beforehand--it would've spared me the drive and the time wasted on waiting for her. Regardless, I'm not expecting for her to follow through with meeting up next week, so at this point this leaves me with this other girl I was chatting with through OKC (the one who messaged me first). She's currently out of town, but she promised that she'll get in touch with me to set something up...we'll see whether that materializes. I figure that if she contacted me first that she'll be more likely to follow through, especially since she seemed pretty enthusiastic about it.
CarrieT Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 Learn the mantra: There is no league, there is no league, there is no league.... People are people. No one is better than anyone else. it is all a matter of compatibility and common interests. 5
TheGuard13 Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 If they're so far out of your league, why are they also on OkCupid? 1
Mo_Do Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 This girls interest is low - I hope you're not hounding her with texts and other BS. Also, why did you drive all the way there when she clearly stated she was still at work? That's on you pal...not her fault you assumed she was on her way without even telling you. I betcha' she wasn't at work at all - probably opted to meet someone else instead.
mammasita Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 She's probably 30lbs or more heavier than her pics and was too embarassed to meet you so she chickened out at the last minute. ....and coffee is sooooo boring not to mention it turns your teeth brown . Why not a stiff drink?
TB Rhine Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 Girls are flaky... at least one out of every two will stand you up at least once. Some say they're just inconsiderate; others say it's all a "test" of some sort, to see how you'll react. As far as the girl who messaged you first... that's an automatic indicator of more interest, so I'd give her another chance, even after blatantly standing you up. Certainly don't head out somewhere until you receive ironclad confirmation from a woman that she'll be there (or she's on her way there). You're just asking to have your time wasted. If you asked HER out, it's a toss-up. If you had a difficult time, AT ALL, getting her to go out with you (busy all the time, noncommittal, etc.), I'd say drop it... she's ambivalent, and either chickened out at the last second or never intended on meeting you in the first place. In either case, you'll find that - AMAZINGLY - another crazy series of circumstances will erupt EVERY TIME you manage to make plans with her. Her car will break down. Her long-lost aunt will come visit. She'll get held up at work. I had a girl tell me her aunt had cancer once. Women will say absolutely ANYTHING (and contrive any situation) to get out of something they don't wanna do.
Gaeta Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 Also, why did you drive all the way there when she clearly stated she was still at work? That's on you pal...not her fault you assumed she was on her way without even telling you. I second that, if someone says I am being delayed and will keep you updated, you stay home. Don't jump to conclusion she was not interested. It does happen that people get stranded at work. 2
Sweetnothing Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 Perhaps these girls are dating below their league because they know they'll have the upper hand. Instead of being blown off by gorgeous men, they can date someone who's ok looking and will sit around at a coffee shop like a dumb*ss for 2 hours. 2
oldshirt Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 Learn the mantra: There is no league, there is no league, there is no league.... People are people. No one is better than anyone else. it is all a matter of compatibility and common interests. Oh they're absolutely ARE leagues and its very hard to date out of your own league. The catch is its very difficult to pin down exactly what league you are in vs what league someone else is in. You only know by trying and giving it your best shot. A guy may think some gal is out of his league because she is pretty but what he doesn't know is what her particular values are or what she thinks is important. And she may have self-image issues where she vastly underestimates her attractiveness or market value. So in a way it is much about compatibility and common so it is always worth your best shot. 1
Author Marks Posted March 28, 2014 Author Posted March 28, 2014 (edited) Ok, I admit that it was a bit foolish to drive out to the coffee shop without her confirming that she's indeed going to be there, but in my defense this was the first time I've had something like this happen to me, so I wasn't expecting her to flake so last minute. Learn the mantra: There is no league, there is no league, there is no league.... People are people. No one is better than anyone else. it is all a matter of compatibility and common interests. I know what you guys are saying, and logically it makes sense. We are all just people after all... Heck, I've seen not so great looking guys with some beautiful women before, so I know that anything is possible. But I'd argue that as a rule of thumb people tend to stick with people of about the same attractiveness level. That's what I mean by "league". I feel that compatibility also includes physical attraction, so is it far fetched to think that people include that in their calculus? This girls interest is low - I hope you're not hounding her with texts and other BS. No, not at all...I haven't contacted her since that last text I sent her. She's probably 30lbs or more heavier than her pics and was too embarassed to meet you so she chickened out at the last minute. ....and coffee is sooooo boring not to mention it turns your teeth brown . Why not a stiff drink? Actually, I did do some research on her beforehand to make sure I knew who I was dealing with, and other pictures I've come across of her confirmed that she's a good looking gal. And what's wrong with coffee? If I asked her to drinks she probably would've declined meeting, thinking that I wanted to get her drunk and have sex with her. Perhaps these girls are dating below their league because they know they'll have the upper hand. Instead of being blown off by gorgeous men, they can date someone who's ok looking and will sit around at a coffee shop like a dumb*ss for 2 hours. Like I said, I admit I made mistake driving out to the shop, but I don't think I really appreciate being called a dumbass for it. Plus I was only there for half an hour. Edited March 28, 2014 by Marks
Author Marks Posted March 28, 2014 Author Posted March 28, 2014 Oh they're absolutely ARE leagues and its very hard to date out of your own league. The catch is its very difficult to pin down exactly what league you are in vs what league someone else is in. You only know by trying and giving it your best shot. A guy may think some gal is out of his league because she is pretty but what he doesn't know is what her particular values are or what she thinks is important. And she may have self-image issues where she vastly underestimates her attractiveness or market value. So in a way it is much about compatibility and common so it is always worth your best shot. I agree with this. The question though is...is it more common for people to be aware of what league they're in? And do they put any stock in it? I'd say that there are definitely examples where people self select based on certain personal characteristics...things like cultural background, attitudes, and physical appearance. A really good example of this are college fraternities and sororities.
CarrieT Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 Oh they're absolutely ARE leagues and its very hard to date out of your own league. The catch is its very difficult to pin down exactly what league you are in vs what league someone else is in. You only know by trying and giving it your best shot. Totally, totally, totally disagree... A "league" is a mindset that someone has and forces them (his or her) into self-imposed limitations, keeping them from approaching others because of this concept they are not good enough of another. Too many miss out on life's opportunities because of these societal-imposed "leagues." 4
Sweetnothing Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 I didn't mean you actually ARE a dumbass you seem nice and you didn't deserve to be blown off, but my point remains. You can date girls if you find them "too attractive" for you but play it cool. Maybe next time you get blown off don't be so eager to reschedule. Just say "no big deal" and leave it at that.
Versacehottie Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 Totally, totally, totally disagree... A "league" is a mindset that someone has and forces them (his or her) into self-imposed limitations, keeping them from approaching others because of this concept they are not good enough of another. Too many miss out on life's opportunities because of these societal-imposed "leagues." both you and oldhshirt are right. He is right that there definitely ARE leagues. They DO overlap like concentric circles and some of them can be bridged. In the extreme if there is too much variation there is NO way that would happen. As someone mentioned leagues aren't just based on looks but a number of factors although initially looks play a big part of the "perception" of what league someone is in and what attribute they possess. Like for our OP he believes these girls perhaps have a lot more than they do and is nervous about meeting them based pretty much on looks. I agree with Carrie in that you shouldn't let life opportunities pass you by because of what leagues you believe these two to be in. After all, there is at least some overlap otherwise the girls wouldn't be contacting you & agreeing to go out. Give yourself some credit. I would say you and your dates are on common ground now, in neutral if you will, until personalities & goals etc start to be revealed. Who knows you may even surpass them in these areas? Put it like this, I think when going on a date or a job interview, you have to assume this: the person on the other end has positive thoughts. They want you to be the "right" person. They don't want you to fail. Therefore if you come to the table with a good attitude, a healthy dose of confidence and your best foot forward it's a chance to see what could be. Most importantly, work on your confidence, it will put event the ugliest, lamest guys at an unfair advantage over someone who doesn't have any. You obviously have something attractive to offer otherwise you would not have gotten this far with them. Good luck! ps don't take 1st girls flakiness or need to keep working as the be all, end all. Don't read too much into it. As a generalization, people in OLD are flakey, weighing options and not that invested. In real life, people have to work late all the time. There could be a ton of reasons why she didn't make it out BUT don't let it take you down a notch by assuming you're inadequate is THE reason. 1
RonaldS Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 Girls are flaky... at least one out of every two will stand you up at least once. Is that a fact? Doubt it. I've never been stood up once in my life.
CarrieT Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 Is that a fact? Doubt it. I've never been stood up once in my life. And I'm a girl who has been stood-up a number of times... It is not a GIRL thing. It is a FLAKY PEOPLE thing. People who disrespect others and are generally rude are those who stand-up dates. 2
Mo_Do Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 Totally, totally, totally disagree... A "league" is a mindset that someone has and forces them (his or her) into self-imposed limitations, keeping them from approaching others because of this concept they are not good enough of another. Too many miss out on life's opportunities because of these societal-imposed "leagues." While I agree with your statement... Are you willing to go on a date with 400lb Jeb that lives in a trailer park and drives a 1981 Ford truck that's 8 different colors?
Stay Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 I know how you're thinking but try not to think like that, I try not to think about leagues and think if I would date them or not. Girls are lucky to date me and not me lucky to date them. As long as you bring more to the table than the girls you are better than her so if your life is great you are out of her league not the other way around. When you think a girl is out of your league you start to put them on a pedestal since you don't want to mess up this chance, etc. Others may disagree but this is the only way to be the best you can be in my opinion.
Trnamakesnse Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 Secret I learned. There are no leagues. I'm overweight, weird, and have no style. There is not a single woman I see and tell myself "She's too hot for me". I do however wonder "is she kind? would she treat me right? is she patient or quick to anger?". Love isn't baseball. Just my view anyway. 1
Stay Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 While I agree with your statement... Are you willing to go on a date with 400lb Jeb that lives in a trailer park and drives a 1981 Ford truck that's 8 different colors? Exactly, there's someone out there that would and that 400lb Jeb would think the guy is out of her league but she can't think like that because that guy actually likes her for who she is. Same concept here, although a girl might be out of a guy's league she genuine likes him and if he keeps thinking she's out of his league he'll just ruin his chances and kill the attraction she would've had with him.
Trapp-er Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 Seriously, dude. Just go have fun. If you have fun, they will have fun. And if you have fun and they don't have fun, that's their loss. This is all about you figuring out whether you want to see them ever again. Don't make it into anything more than it is. At least not until you meet them!
Stay Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 Secret I learned. There are no leagues. I'm overweight, weird, and have no style. There is not a single woman I see and tell myself "She's too hot for me". I do however wonder "is she kind? would she treat me right? is she patient or quick to anger?". Love isn't baseball. Just my view anyway. You are completely correct and I think this is the only way of thinking, although naturally we think we have leagues but when it comes down to it I try to make it either a 0 or 1. 0 = Wouldn't date and 1 = Would date. 1
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