Is the slut-shaming as bad as the male virgin shaming?

[Woggle]

I am not ashamed of my sexual past and I'm not sure how you got that I was…

 

Slut shaming is the term used to define the tendency that people have of calling another woman who has a lot of partners a slut.

 

Of course, some promiscuous women cheat. Some non-promiscuous women cheat too.

 

This I agree with. I have known some women without a lot of partners who all of a sudden want to experience a wild single life and end up hurting their entire family. There is something to be said for somebody who has experienced the wild and can then fully appreciate a committed life.

 

I think that most men though are just trying to protect themselves the best way they know how. They see their friends getting their hearts broken and don't want that to happen to themselves.

 

I know it doesn't seem right nut in the eyes of most it really is about self protection instead of having a desire to control or punish women for no reason. In their eyes it is a perfectly rational stance to take.

[joystickd]

Players and shady men hurt people's feelings. They lie, cheat and manipulate the women they are with.

 

A promiscuous women won't do that. In some case she will be a player,sure, but you are mixing two behaviors here. Being promiscuous and being a player are two different things

 

By all means, don't date women with a promiscuous past - it's your choice.

 

All this 'value' is that you would be disgusted by a woman who has more partners than you think she should. To extrapolate this and decide all women who do this are bad is what I am fighting against.

So you want to fight against a person's own personal beliefs. What they are not allowed to have beliefs about women having more partners than them even if they weren't disrespectful about it? It's what they deem based on experience that would be more compatible with them for a long term relationship. I myself have no problem with unless she done gangbangs but that is a different issue.

 

Have you ever thought of any other reasons why men would be like this about this subject?

 

How many women have you known in your life to look at someone they use to date or had sex with and say "Hey I had that"?

 

One reason is that some men are just *********s. Say you meet a girl and you go out and a guy or two she let run a train on months or years ago brings it up. How do you think that guy would feel? You have guys that get jealous or love knocking down other men a few notches. That can cause confrontation. It's easy on the outside to say ignore it or it shouldn't matter, but it does just like being called a slut does. You think being joked on about your interests past is no less hurtful than being called a slut. Then the other thing is it depends on the guy.

 

At the end of the day no matter how much you argue it's not going to change men's opinions on this subject because it's based in reality. There are promiscuous women that are unfaithful. Perception is what matters and if it looks like a duck walks like a duck then it's a duck. It will only change when women change and show proof that promiscuous women are faithful, but then who would take the chance.

[joystickd]

I am not ashamed of my sexual past and I'm not sure how you got that I was…

 

Slut shaming is the term used to define the tendency that people have of calling another woman who has a lot of partners a slut.

 

Of course, some promiscuous women cheat. Some non-promiscuous women cheat too.

I didn't say you were. In general it's about protection from being hurt. What do you do to ensure you don't get hurt by men? Is it any different than this?

[Woggle]

Doesn't mean we can't fight to make this change.

 

You can change laws but you can't change feelings. All political correctness ever does is silence people. Just because you have silenced somebody does not mean you have converted them.

[joystickd]

Players and shady men hurt people's feelings. They lie, cheat and manipulate the women they are with.

 

A promiscuous women won't do that. In some case she will be a player,sure, but you are mixing two behaviors here. Being promiscuous and being a player are two different things

 

The thing is as a man how does he know she won't do that. It's just like as a woman how does she know that if she has sex with a man after the first or second date he will want to continue dating her when their is reality based evidence of the possibility that he won't contact her.

 

You are fighting a losing battle because these things are based in reality. I'm Black and I go out and people look at me funny because some Blacks commit crimes. I don't have an all out crusade to convince people that we all don't commit crimes. All I can do is control what I do. If you as a woman can have a history of promiscuity and be faithful then do that. That is all in this world you can control is YOU!!! It's understandable that people don't want to entertain the possibility that a Black man might rob them or a promiscuous woman might be unfaithful. That is their personal choice if they don't and you as an individual have no right to force them to change their opinions because YOU see it as wrong. Who gave you the authority to deem what is wrong and right?

[janedoe67]

I'd like to remind you that homosexuality was considered a mental illness until the 70s. People stood up against it and it is now an accepted sexual orientation. Some people don't like it but it is not 'politically correct' to shame homosexuals because of their choice of partner.

 

I don't think he was shaming homosexuals. he asked if, as a woman, you would feel comfortable dating a man who had been with men. As someone who married a person who has....murky sexual identify possibly, I can understand this question. My h had a few weirdly close same sex friendships, and looking back, I SHOULD have seen them as the red flags they were. Statistically speaking, it is way more common for a woman to "experiment" with women and actually be straight than for a man to do so.

 

I have several friends who married a man who turned out to be gay, and the years they spent questioning themselves because their husband didn't want them were torture. And based on my own experience, if I were to date, I would not choose a man who had experience with men. It would be too emotionally scary.

[joystickd]

I don't think he was shaming homosexuals. he asked if, as a woman, you would feel comfortable dating a man who had been with men. As someone who married a person who has....murky sexual identify possibly, I can understand this question. My h had a few weirdly close same sex friendships, and looking back, I SHOULD have seen them as the red flags they were. Statistically speaking, it is way more common for a woman to "experiment" with women and actually be straight than for a man to do so.

 

I have several friends who married a man who turned out to be gay, and the years they spent questioning themselves because their husband didn't want them were torture. And based on my own experience, if I were to date, I would not choose a man who had experience with men. It would be too emotionally scary.

I'm glad there is someone that gets it

[GoreSP]

I don't think he was shaming homosexuals. he asked if, as a woman, you would feel comfortable dating a man who had been with men. As someone who married a person who has....murky sexual identify possibly, I can understand this question. My h had a few weirdly close same sex friendships, and looking back, I SHOULD have seen them as the red flags they were. Statistically speaking, it is way more common for a woman to "experiment" with women and actually be straight than for a man to do so.

 

I have several friends who married a man who turned out to be gay, and the years they spent questioning themselves because their husband didn't want them were torture. And based on my own experience, if I were to date, I would not choose a man who had experience with men. It would be too emotionally scary.

 

No, no I brought it up as an example. In the 70s, we thought homosexuality was a mental illness. Today we know it's not. (Some idiots still think it is, but we all know they're just that - idiots. It's not a 'value' to be homophobic.)

 

The same thing can happen to today's women who are called sluts because they have a lot of sex.

[GoreSP]

I'm glad there is someone that gets it

 

I disagree with you therefore I don't get it?

Right...

[M30USA]

People need to get lives and mind their own business.

[Woggle]

The funny thing is I actually know gays both men and women who won't date promiscuous partners. It seems that right or wrong all across the board people use this as criteria.

[GoreSP]

The funny thing is I actually know gays both men and women who won't date promiscuous partners. It seems that right or wrong all across the board people use this as criteria.

 

I think I've said at least ten times already this wasn't about the people having their own 'list of requirements' in a partner.

 

If this is the only argument you can bring to the table, I think we're done here.

[joystickd]

I think I've said at least ten times already this wasn't about the people having their own 'list of requirements' in a partner.

 

If this is the only argument you can bring to the table, I think we're done here.

What's the issue then here? Most everyone that has an issue with it sees it as one of the requirements in a partner. Sounds like you want to change the overall perception that promiscuity can indicate unfaithfulness. Women look at promiscuity and see that men could possibly be unfaithful. As Woggle said gays do too. Hell you hear gays call another one slut. They don't make a big issue out of as you call it "slut shaming".

 

Ideally you want to force men to accept behavior they deem unacceptable and not compatible because you feel it's wrong to see it as such. What gives you that right?

[joystickd]

I disagree with you therefore I don't get it?

Right...

The emotion has affected your logic. I think that user fully explained the point I was trying to make. You are the one making an argument like you are fighting for promiscuous woman's rights. WTF!!!! Bring it down quite a few notches please honey

[GoreSP]

What's the issue then here? Most everyone that has an issue with it sees it as one of the requirements in a partner. Sounds like you want to change the overall perception that promiscuity can indicate unfaithfulness. Women look at promiscuity and see that men could possibly be unfaithful. As Woggle said gays do too. Hell you hear gays call another one slut. They don't make a big issue out of as you call it "slut shaming".

 

Ideally you want to force men to accept behavior they deem unacceptable and not compatible because you feel it's wrong to see it as such. What gives you that right?

 

I want to change the perception that promiscuous women are also unfaithful. This correlation as never proven.

 

Aaaaaand for the 11th time, I do not want to force anyone to accept certain behaviors in their partners.

 

I do however have a huge problem when people quote studies that don't exist, twist actual studies to support the premise that promiscuous women will cheat on their partners. It also bothers me when they justify their 'value' with false accusations like this.

 

By all means, expect your partner to have a certain sexual history - but don't pretend it's because of this false correlation or this whole 'self preservation' bull****.

 

You have decided that a certain number of partners is 'too much' and anything more than that number is going to turn you off.

[ThaWholigan]

Basically it just makes it harder for promiscuous women to be able to have fulfilling relationships just because they like sex. It's easy for us to say "that's just the way it is", but that doesn't exactly help matters, merely exacerbates them as we perpetuate shame on these women and also exacerbate the idea that promiscuity while single automatically equals cheating. I've known women who got around but were excellent and faithful girlfriends to their men - conversely I know "good" girls who cheated. So I have as much trust for a woman with a low number as I do a woman with a high number. Essentially the number means jack.

 

On the flip side, it is exactly the same for male virgins at times! Albeit less volatile and vociferous, their experience is not exactly any better. There are all sorts of sh*t leveled at them regarding inexperience (he'll probably pop within 2 mins and be crap in bed), lack of maturity (can he even handle a relationship?) etc....

 

I can understand the self-preservation argument, and that's perfectly fine. If YOU don't want to date that person, cool. Do not then propagate things about that person or what you deem their behavior to indicate then shrug your shoulders afterwards and say "that's just the way it is" when there is an inevitable backlash. I sympathize with promiscuous women for this reason - it is a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation in that regard.

[GoreSP]

The emotion has affected your logic. I think that user fully explained the point I was trying to make. You are the one making an argument like you are fighting for promiscuous woman's rights. WTF!!!! Bring it down quite a few notches please honey

 

Ok so now not agreeing means I'm emotional.

Right.

 

I am fighting for promiscuous women's right.

 

Promiscuous women's have the right to have the sex life they want to have without being called a cheater and a whore.

[janedoe67]

I do get what Gore is saying.

 

I know, I know, who cares what anyone thinks if your own partner is fine with it? BUT, as someone who has cheated ( and who BTW was a virgin on my wedding night), I feel the tremendous weight of what it is like to be defined completely (or FEEL defined completely) by one aspect of yourself. Maybe it "shouldn't" matter, but it does. It hurts that you feel written off as a person because of one part of your life.

 

I will confess, when I was single I never would have considered a guy who'd "been around the block a bunch of times" as a lifetime partner (or even dinner date most likely because of my beliefs). Now, however, as someone who is in her 40's instead of in her 20's surrounded by the "Bill Gothard Cocoon," and having experienced redemption myself, I can see why it feels hopeless and painful that a whole group of people wouldn't even consider who you are now because of who you used to be. I know it is their right, and I know everyone has a right to want the kind of partner they want, but hearing about it over and over and over just drives that "label" in deeper.

[ThaWholigan]

Ok so now not agreeing means I'm emotional.

Right.

 

I am fighting for promiscuous women's right.

 

Promiscuous women's have the right to have the sex life they want to have without being called a cheater and a whore.

In 2012, not long after I lost my virginity, I had a sexual relationship with a girl who had a lot more sexual partners than me. Not an excessive amount IMO, but a lot. I ended up sleeping with her the first day I met her. We got on very well and were close for a time - and I absolutely would have dated her seriously and indeed I considered it. The number certainly wasn't a dealbreaker in any case. She wasn't a cheater and she certainly wasn't a whore. She was a very nice and sweet girl - and she liked to get f*cked. That was all.

[Woggle]

Basically it just makes it harder for promiscuous women to be able to have fulfilling relationships just because they like sex. It's easy for us to say "that's just the way it is", but that doesn't exactly help matters, merely exacerbates them as we perpetuate shame on these women and also exacerbate the idea that promiscuity while single automatically equals cheating. I've known women who got around but were excellent and faithful girlfriends to their men - conversely I know "good" girls who cheated. So I have as much trust for a woman with a low number as I do a woman with a high number. Essentially the number means jack.

 

On the flip side, it is exactly the same for male virgins at times! Albeit less volatile and vociferous, their experience is not exactly any better. There are all sorts of sh*t leveled at them regarding inexperience (he'll probably pop within 2 mins and be crap in bed), lack of maturity (can he even handle a relationship?) etc....

 

I can understand the self-preservation argument, and that's perfectly fine. If YOU don't want to date that person, cool. Do not then propagate things about that person or what you deem their behavior to indicate then shrug your shoulders afterwards and say "that's just the way it is" when there is an inevitable backlash. I sympathize with promiscuous women for this reason - it is a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation in that regard.

 

There are plenty of things that keep people men and women from having a relationship.

 

A man's height which is a trait he has no control over keeps him from having a relationship as does baldness and things of that nature

 

There was a time when a woman having career success hurt her love life though that has changed quite a bit. Studies show educated women get married more often and get divorced less.

 

If a woman got around and some men don't want to date her why would she want men like that anyway? It is obvious her and them would not be compatible.

 

In dating people have preferences and those preferences might not always be fair.

[GoreSP]

In 2012, not long after I lost my virginity, I had a sexual relationship with a girl who had a lot more sexual partners than me. Not an excessive amount IMO, but a lot. I ended up sleeping with her the first day I met her. We got on very well and were close for a time - and I absolutely would have dated her seriously and indeed I considered it. The number certainly wasn't a dealbreaker in any case. She wasn't a cheater and she certainly wasn't a whore. She was a very nice and sweet girl - and she liked to get f*cked. That was all.

 

Thank you!

[ThaWholigan]

There are plenty of things that keep people men and women from having a relationship.

 

A man's height which is a trait he has no control over keeps him from having a relationship as does baldness and things of that nature

 

There was a time when a woman having career success hurt her love life though that has changed quite a bit. Studies show educated women get married more often and get divorced less.

 

If a woman got around and some men don't want to date her why would she want men like that anyway? It is obvious her and them would not be compatible.

 

In dating people have preferences and those preferences might not always be fair.

You didn't read my post properly I feel. It's not a case of her wanting a man like that - it's a case of encountering them far more and being excessively typecast by them, often publicly too. That is when it goes beyond "preferences".

[joystickd]

Ok so now not agreeing means I'm emotional.

Right.

 

I am fighting for promiscuous women's right.

 

Promiscuous women's have the right to have the sex life they want to have without being called a cheater and a whore.

Just like people have the right to see someone as not being compatible because of them being promiscuous because it doesn't mean the whole world thinks that. Like I said before pornstars get married.

 

Have you ever stopped and considered the prospective of men or that just doesn't matter to you at all? That is the thing that gets me about some women they want men to see it from men's POV but the moment a man wants a woman to see it from a man's POV it's a big issue. It's not about you not agreeing. I understand on some level where you are coming from, but you just have to accept the fact action have consequences and not everyone is going to be all accepting of what one does. We are all different and basically attempting argue and force someone to do be accepting shows you have a lack of respect for individuals and their ability to form their own opinions about things. This interaction also showed your lack of an ability to see things from the other side. Some of the men on here understand where you are coming from but you fail to see our perspective on it to gain insight into why we do it anyway. That in itself says a whole lot. The fact that you talk about gay being a mental illness instead of addresssing the scenario itself and really thinking about it and getting insight says a lot. Another user came and basically got the point I was trying to make and you failed that. It's cool to be passionate about something but you also have to have the ability to see it from the other side.

[GoreSP]

Just like people have the right to see someone as not being compatible because of them being promiscuous because it doesn't mean the whole world thinks that. Like I said before pornstars get married.

 

Have you ever stopped and considered the prospective of men or that just doesn't matter to you at all? That is the thing that gets me about some women they want men to see it from men's POV but the moment a man wants a woman to see it from a man's POV it's a big issue. It's not about you not agreeing. I understand on some level where you are coming from, but you just have to accept the fact action have consequences and not everyone is going to be all accepting of what one does. We are all different and basically attempting argue and force someone to do be accepting shows you have a lack of respect for individuals and their ability to form their own opinions about things. This interaction also showed your lack of an ability to see things from the other side. Some of the men on here understand where you are coming from but you fail to see our perspective on it to gain insight into why we do it anyway. That in itself says a whole lot. The fact that you talk about gay being a mental illness instead of addresssing the scenario itself and really thinking about it and getting insight says a lot. Another user came and basically got the point I was trying to make and you failed that. It's cool to be passionate about something but you also have to have the ability to see it from the other side.

 

I'm sorry, you have obviously misinterpreted everything I've said. I'm not going to keep saying the same thing over and over.

[joystickd]

I want to change the perception that promiscuous women are also unfaithful. This correlation as never proven.

 

Aaaaaand for the 11th time, I do not want to force anyone to accept certain behaviors in their partners.

 

I do however have a huge problem when people quote studies that don't exist, twist actual studies to support the premise that promiscuous women will cheat on their partners. It also bothers me when they justify their 'value' with false accusations like this.

 

By all means, expect your partner to have a certain sexual history - but don't pretend it's because of this false correlation or this whole 'self preservation' bull****.

 

You have decided that a certain number of partners is 'too much' and anything more than that number is going to turn you off.

My question to you is: What would a man do in dating/relationship that would hurt you? Is it something that is based in reality ex. you experienced it or someone you know has? I'm not putting out studies or anything like that but the fact is that there are men that have experienced the hurt of a promiscuous woman being unfaithful. That quality doesn't mean they are going to cheat but in the end it can be an indicator of something. It can be that thing they can control. You can control whether or not you will pursue someone based on their sexual history or a woman can control how long she will wait to have sex.

 

In essence you are asking men to do a lot by changing this belief system. It's like telling a homeowner to leave their security system off, open every window and leave doors open because every person that happens to walk in their house is not trying to steal. We all know this but are not willing to take the chance especially when getting burned hits close to home.