Dating Someone Out of Your League?

[xxoo]

My flaws and neuroses are about the only things that ARE unique about me. There are lots of girls with my "better" qualities, in bigger quantities, and with better qualities of their own. The only way I am unique is in my negatives.

 

Go tell that to a counselor. That's an area for therapy.

[january2011]

From what you have said, he has done nothing to show that he thinks you are out of your league.

 

According to V, he has told her that she is out of his league.

 

Neither of them think much of themselves, yet they have found each other again and think the other one is the better person.

 

I'd imagine that most couples would perceive such a situation as akin to winning a multi-million dollar lottery. They wouldn't be arguing that the money is counterfeit and insisting that they're not rich at all because last time they had a surplus of cash, Bad Things Happened. And then asking for advice on the internet about how to live because they have no money.

[verhrzn]

If we are talking science, have you read this article?

 

The MRI of Love

 

It shows how much and where his brain lights up when thinking about his average wife, in comparison to when he thinks about Angelina Jolie. Fascinating!

 

Uh, maybe because he isn't all that attracted to Angeline Jolie? How about a person who has similar features to his wife, but in better proportion/coloring/etc?

[denise_xo]

According to V, he has told her that she is out of his league.

 

Neither of them think much of themselves, yet they have found each other again and think the other one is the better person.

 

I'd imagine that most couples would perceive such a situation as akin to winning a multi-million dollar lottery. They wouldn't be arguing that the money is counterfeit and insisting that they're not rich at all because last time they had a surplus of cash, Bad Things Happened. And then asking for advice on the internet about how to live because they have no money.

 

:laugh:

 

That's a good way to sum it all up.

[verhrzn]

According to V, he has told her that she is out of his league.

 

Neither of them think much of themselves, yet they have found each other again and think the other one is the better person.

 

I'd imagine that most couples would perceive such a situation as akin to winning a multi-million dollar lottery. They wouldn't be arguing that the money is counterfeit and insisting that they're not rich at all because last time they had a surplus of cash, Bad Things Happened. And then asking for advice on the internet about how to live because they have no money.

 

So I should be thankful he has low self-esteem and can't appreciate all the ways he's better than me?? The thing is, for this to continue, he either has to continue having low self-esteem. If his confidence level ever rises, he will start getting a wandering eye.... just like the other guys.

 

It's even happened with him in the past. We used to get into very nasty fights because girls flirted openly with him and he didn't dissuade them. Not so much because he wanted to be with them, he claimed, but because it fed his ego and boosted his confidence. Something I DIDN'T go for him (because I am not a prize.) So when he gets to grad school, is financially independent, has a successful career and is surrounded by women similar to him, why wouldn't his eye go wandering then?

[xxoo]

Uh, maybe because he isn't all that attracted to Angeline Jolie? How about a person who has similar features to his wife, but in better proportion/coloring/etc?

 

You didn't read it!

 

He is attracted to Angelina Jolie. That's why they picked her for the experiment.

[verhrzn]

You didn't read it!

 

He is attracted to Angelina Jolie. That's why they picked her for the experiment.

 

Obviously not that much. Again, how bout somebody that looks like his wife only better?

[xxoo]

Obviously not that much. Again, how bout somebody that looks like his wife only better?

 

Omg, did you read the article? He is very attracted to AJ!

[verhrzn]

Omg, did you read the article? He is very attracted to AJ!

 

Obviously not that much. And it doesn't dispute my point of the difference between two women, who are equally compatible personality-wise but one is more attractive. He has NO idea what Angelina is like as a person. If she was a fantastic person, would he really still dig his wife? Or if they Photo-shopped his wife to be more attractive, would his brain still prefer the "average" version?

[january2011]

So I should be thankful he has low self-esteem and can't appreciate all the ways he's better than me?? The thing is, for this to continue, he either has to continue having low self-esteem. If his confidence level ever rises, he will start getting a wandering eye.... just like the other guys.

 

It's even happened with him in the past. We used to get into very nasty fights because girls flirted openly with him and he didn't dissuade them. Not so much because he wanted to be with them, he claimed, but because it fed his ego and boosted his confidence. Something I DIDN'T go for him (because I am not a prize.) So when he gets to grad school, is financially independent, has a successful career and is surrounded by women similar to him, why wouldn't his eye go wandering then?

 

No, be thankful that he thinks that you are the better person, despite your poor assessment of yourself.

 

What I don't think you see is that he is comparing you to him, not you to other girls. If anything, you'd be justified in being concerned that he's rather competitive when it comes to his SO, especially if competing with a romantic partner is not your thing.

 

I thought you'd explained the other girls flirting with him previously as a folly of youth?

 

If you are so certain that all this will come to pass, why are you not nipping it in the bud now to avoid the pain? That is, why not just dump him because of his predicted future behaviour?

[verhrzn]

No, be thankful that he thinks that you are the better person, despite your poor assessment of yourself.

 

What I don't think you see is that he is comparing you to him, not you to other girls. If anything, you'd be justified in being concerned that he's rather competitive when it comes to his SO, especially if competing with a romantic partner is not your thing.

 

I thought you'd explained the other girls flirting with him previously as a folly of youth?

 

If you are so certain that all this will come to pass, why are you not nipping it in the bud now to avoid the pain? That is, why not just dump him because of his predicted future behaviour?

 

Well he isn't comparing me to other girls because there ARE no girls around to compare me to. But that will change once he's at a program with women his age, in a big city.

 

Folly of youth, or just part of the pattern? It seems that more and more it is looking like my usual pattern.... guy dates me out of desperation, I raise his confidence, he gets more attention from girls, he dumps me for them.

 

If nothing else, I don't dump him so I don't come back here in the months following complaining about being single, and having all of you be like "But you dumped him!", completely ignoring the "why." I get WAY too much of that from friends... "But, you stopped sleeping with him." "Yeah, because he was just using me for sex." "Yeah but you rejected him!" *Headdesk*

 

I'd rather be miserable in a relationship than miserable and single. Might as well wait it out and see what I can get. Why rush it... so I can go back to watching Netflix all by myself every day?

 

 

i can't even get a girlfriend. why are you whining so much? be grateful for what you have cause i don't have it.

 

You want a girl to use you and then dump you for someone else? I'm sure you could find someone willing to; be my guest.

[Pirouette]

Never been hit on, never been approached, never been pursued. I can't even get guys to message me online. I guess a man somewhere in the middle of Africa might kind of think I'm cute, but that does no good for me here in the Midwest. By all practical measures, there is not a single man within a reasonable distance of my location who finds me attractive. Can we just acknowledge this fact??

 

I also never get hit on, pursued, approached, etc. I am also a homebody and can't expect people to knock on my door to tell me how beautiful I am. But is also doesn't happen when I do my errands, go to occasional events and bars. So should I believe that I'm ugly? I don't, for the record. I just don't think I'm TV fiction beautiful land where strangers will be waiting in the wings for the chance to tell me how awesome I am.

 

You're in a relationship right now. The rekindling of an old flame, is it not? If he found you so abhorrent, why would he come around to you a second time for a relationship? If, as you say, he's desperate, and you're so awful, surely he could find someone better than you for even the interim?

 

I believe you pride yourself on being logical and realistic. Look at all the couples around you, look at the people on the news. Most of them are average, or even below average as these days average in most people's minds seems to be pretty damn attractive and slim. These people are in relationships and stay in them. Do you think all these couples are so evenly matched that neither of them would think to look elsewhere, or are they so awful that they have no hopes of getting someone better so they settle for each other and will forever be bitter that they couldn't do better?

 

Can you also imagine that not everyone goes around sizing people up and calculating on a scale who is better than them and who is worse? Sure, subconsciously, most of us know who we are attracted to and who we aren't. For the most part, when we find someone we are attracted to and possess the characteristics that we like in a partner, we are happy with that and do not constantly think about who else out there could be better matched. And chances are, if you aren't looking for it, you're not going to find it, and what you don't know doesn't trouble you.

 

Anyhow, sure it does happen that a partner does happen to meet someone else that they have an overwhelming attraction to and who could be a better match, and they bail. That may also have nothing to do with society's standard markers of success in jobs, salary, and looks. There is also a risk that your partner could be killed in an accident or come down with a terminal illness. Is the probability that your relationship could end, like all things eventually will, a good reason to never get in a relationship in the first place?

 

When it comes down to it, regardless of who is better looking, makes more money, has more education, etc, in a relationship, you are both owed honesty, kindness, and fidelity. If you suspect that he cannot give you that, then you're "better" half, truly is not worth the paper his graduate degree is written on.

 

You need to sit him down and really talk. You need to tell him what you need out of this relationship and you need to believe that you deserve it. You need to stop accepting anything less. No one can treat you badly if you do not allow it.

[denise_xo]

Obviously not that much. And it doesn't dispute my point of the difference between two women, who are equally compatible personality-wise but one is more attractive. He has NO idea what Angelina is like as a person. If she was a fantastic person, would he really still dig his wife? Or if they Photo-shopped his wife to be more attractive, would his brain still prefer the "average" version?

 

By this logic, it would be impossible for absolutely anybody to seriously engage in a relationship, because there will theoretically always be someone 'better' available. No couple is a 100% match, and people change over time, often in different directions.

 

When you decide to commit to someone, you can't keep saying 'oh he might meet someone else tomorrow who's better', or alternatively, 'well I might meet someone better tomorrow'. A long term relationship requires a higher level of commitment, and that mutual level of commitment has to be established by way of open communication and continuous investment into a relationship. Over time, that investment and the history that a couple builds collaboratively are some of the most important things that will distinguish that relationship from the next man or woman you might meet on the street. That investment, in turn, requires hard work. You can never fully escape the risk that a marriage will break up over infidelity - but if you enter it with the mind set of 'either of us will just move on if we find something better', then it sure as hell won't last.

[Lonely Ronin]

If they are better Me's than I am, why wouldn't they make him feel a certain way?? Sorry to dash all these romantic dreams, but science has demonstrated that love really isn't all that big of a mystery. There are reasons we are attracted to some people and not others, and it has nothing to do with their "soul."

 

Initially you are correct, but if don't understand the difference between initial physical attraction, and what's going to work long term, then I'm sorry but you have never had a real relationship.

 

As someone else has said on another thread, the only thing physical attraction will do is get your foot in the door. Your personality is what keeps you inside the house.

 

When you find someone truly compatible, that's not something that you are going to discard for some trivial reason. Someone you are truly compatible with is hard to find, and two it takes a long time to learn if you are truly compatible.

Edited September 6, 2012 by Lonely Ronin

[verhrzn]

Ugh, I give up. You all want to be convinced that love is Rainbows and Feelings, and that relationships that last aren't build on practical considerations (who is the breadwinner, what sort of lifestyle do you want, how is the sex gonna be after she's gained 15 pounds, do you understand each other's hobbies, etc.) then go ahead. Some of you have gotten lucky. Me, I'd rather live practically. And dating someone outside your league is NOT practical.

[todreaminblue]

How do you deal with the idea that you are dating someone out of your league, or alternatively, that you are dragging someone down?

 

I'm currently seeing a guy that has a very bright future ahead of him. He is currently applying to Masters and PhD programs in counseling. It's almost a guaranteed that he will need to move; so in order to stay together, I'd need to go with him.

 

The thing is, I really don't really have a lot of good career skills. I was a History major with a low GPA (3.0 on graduating.) So I have no hope of getting into grad school myself, and I don't have a lot of marketable skills. I was lucky I got the job I currently have. If I move, it's pretty much a given I'll be in a low-paying job, like fast food or retail, especially given the state of the economy.

 

The guy I'm dating is also very adventurous... he wants to live in exotic places and locations, and doesn't want to really settle in one location for long. I am more of a homebody.... I've lived in my current city for about 2 years, and have started setting down roots. I also don't like the logistics of living a plane ride away from my family and old friends.

 

All together, I feel like he is far outside my league, in terms of intelligence (grad school), career prospects, and certain traits (adventurousness.) He tells me that he loves me and am happy with me.... but I feel like he's selling himself majorly short, and will dump me as soon as a hot, adventurous, successful girl comes along.

 

What do you guys think? How do you handle your partner being outside your league in terms of the future?

 

 

is there a requisite to join a dating league...i didn't know there was one...i thought people were people and males and females dat e regardless......isnt that human to date the opposite sex and do you need a grad score to date well i guess im set to fail........look i don't think there is a league and if there is im moving to mars.......and ill date a few rocks.....if you love this man and this man loves you then being together anywhere you are should be enough you cant hang on a sec

 

i am being a huge hypocrite because i don't follow my own advice but i will give it to you anyway maybe it might spur me on....by proxy self motivation....

you shouldn't be worried about losing your guy, if he is with you then if he truly loves you there is no other hot girl......or degree that will take the place of you...

 

adventurousness would not be the same if you weren't there beside him it would lose all appeal, you should try something adventurous occasionally god put mountains out there so people can be closer to him to climb them to see the view from the very top he also put mountains there to tire you out so you appreciate going home....there's no place like home...so click your heels three times say i can do this he loves me shut your eyes for a second ...open them....and your mind is now open......do you feel alive......enjoy the view?

so will he when he is with you.....hope i helped...best wishes many happy days at home and an adventure or two.....step out when loves about......good luck....deb ps leagues are better fro sports than love i play a grade.....i would happily play with a c grade player maybe they can teach me to be short stop in fact they should mix it up and change the rules of grades in sport how can you get better if everybody on your team bats the same average where is the growth in that...so league rule makers...change it its getting old...my motto for the day no more leagues.......deb

Edited September 6, 2012 by todreaminblue

[denise_xo]

Ugh, I give up. You all want to be convinced that love is Rainbows and Feelings, and that relationships that last aren't build on practical considerations (who is the breadwinner, what sort of lifestyle do you want, how is the sex gonna be after she's gained 15 pounds, do you understand each other's hobbies, etc.) then go ahead.

 

Who exactly has said that? Because I haven't seen that claimed anywhere here in this thread.

[ThaWholigan]

Ugh, I give up. You all want to be convinced that love is Rainbows and Feelings, and that relationships that last aren't build on practical considerations (who is the breadwinner, what sort of lifestyle do you want, how is the sex gonna be after she's gained 15 pounds, do you understand each other's hobbies, etc.) then go ahead. Some of you have gotten lucky. Me, I'd rather live practically. And dating someone outside your league is NOT practical.

There's a difference between practicality and self-sabotage. Just so you know. You can be practical about who you choose and not think it's all gonna end horribly and be forever mad about it.

 

My last point before I bow out.

[xxoo]

Obviously not that much.

 

If you would read the article, you would see that you are wrong.

 

Objectively, he admits that AJ is more beautiful than his wife.

 

Subjectively, his brain is more attracted to his wife.

 

That's how love works. There is no better when you feel in love with someone.

 

When love fades, trouble happens. Most loss of attraction and infidelity is tied up in other relationship issues, and fading feelings.

 

Best solution? Choose someone with good relationship skills, have good relationship skills, and take very good care of the relationship!

[oaks]

Ugh, I give up. You all want to be convinced that love is Rainbows and Feelings, and that relationships that last aren't build on practical considerations

 

Pretty sure that's not what I said at all.

[Pirouette]

Ugh, I give up. You all want to be convinced that love is Rainbows and Feelings, and that relationships that last aren't build on practical considerations (who is the breadwinner, what sort of lifestyle do you want, how is the sex gonna be after she's gained 15 pounds, do you understand each other's hobbies, etc.) then go ahead. Some of you have gotten lucky. Me, I'd rather live practically. And dating someone outside your league is NOT practical.

 

Who the heck is saying that? All we're saying is that you don't have to be a model, doctor, <10% body fat, Pulitzer prize winner to be in a happy, mutually satisfying relationship.

[Lonely Ronin]

And dating someone outside your league is NOT practical.

 

Your simplistic view of leagues is NOT practical.

[oldshirt]

I haven't read the other 17 pages of this thread (but I have the feeling it's kinda fruity and dysfuctional ) so forgive me for going back to the opening post and questions posed.

 

 

Yes there IS such a thing as 'leagues," and yes people generally try to date within their own league as a bare minimum and will often try to move up a rung on the ladder if they can.

 

And yes, if someone determines that you aren't what they want and they beleive that they will have better options they will dump you. And yes sometimes people will keep you around as bed-warmer untill the next one comes along.

 

All those things are true, they are all realities.

 

Here's the catch though, each individual has their own set of values and their own ideas as to what constitutes a "league." One person's prince is another person's pauper and vice-versa.

 

You obviously value education, earning potential and adventurous spirit and you feel that he is out of your league because he has more of those things than you do. Since you value those things you assume he does too and therefor he will judge you harshly and will dump you when he finds someone who is more educated, has better career opportunities and is more adventurous.

 

Guess what? He may not give a rat's @$$ about those things.

 

I speak from firsthand personal experience. I was never in grad school but in my youth I was very career oriented and pursued a lot of education and training in my field and climbed very high in field. I was also very adventurous (rock climbing, sky diving, scuba diving etc etc)

 

when I met my soon-to-be wife, I was attracted to her and liked her because she was NOT those things. I liked that she was more of a stable home-body and liked that she was not a driven, career-oriented person but was instead very much of a home and family girl.

 

I had enough "ME" in my life, I didn't need another "ME" around.

 

You think he's out of your league because he is educated and adventurous. He may think you are out of his league because you have nice legs and a great @$$.

 

Sure there will be women that will be attracted to him because of his education and adventurous spirit. You've proven that because you are attracted to him. But that is life. There are no guarentees. You are never guarenteed that other women won't bat their eyes and wiggle their behinds at him. There are no guarentees that he won't dump you some day. People break up all the time. getting dumped is just another part of life.

 

So you can choose the dysfuntional route and be miserable thinking that you are inadequate and that he might dump you some day and let your insecurities and self-esteem issues keep you from enjoying the time that you have together now.

 

You can even take the even more dysfunctional route of dumping him before he dumps you (they called it "preemptive dumping" on Seinfeld) and start dating a guy that is so unappealing and so low status that no other woman could possibly want him.

 

Or you can pursue the things that are important to you and that value so you can increase your own self-perception of what your "league" is and you can enjoy your BF for who and what he is and get the most enjoyment out of your relationship. That way even if he does leave you, you will just view it as something that happens in the world but you won't be devastated because you realize that relationships end and that you will soon have someone else special in your life because you realize that you have market value in your own right even if you don't have a masters in a high paying field and the thought of stepping in goat turds in the Himalayas really doesn't appeal to you.

[verhrzn]

Who exactly has said that? Because I haven't seen that claimed anywhere here in this thread.

 

I was paraphrasing all of the "It's about love! If he loves you, who cares, la la la!" Like nothing else matters, it's all feelings. Completely ignoring the evidence that at least 1 out of 4 men cheat on women they've married and claim to love, that the divorce rate is hovering around 50%, that people routinely leave their partners for new ones all the damn time.... Nope, it's all just magically feelings and souls.

[denise_xo]

I was paraphrasing all of the "It's about love! If he loves you, who cares, la la la!" Like nothing else matters, it's all feelings. Completely ignoring the evidence that at least 1 out of 4 men cheat on women they've married and claim to love, that the divorce rate is hovering around 50%, that people routinely leave their partners for new ones all the damn time.... Nope, it's all just magically feelings and souls.

 

Well, I don't think the way you are paraphrasing this sums up the discussion at all. I, as well as several other people, have pointed out that relationships are to a great extent about communication and hard work. But we have taken issue with the particular way in which you frame the question of leagues and compatibility. And yes, a lot of marriages are affected by infidelity. But if you view that as a reason not to be a relationship, then you just have to opt out of relationships, period. If you don't view it as a reason in itself not to be in a relationship, then it's something that has to be addressed within a relationship.