Feminists are ruining men.

[threebyfate]

Oh, come on. You really think the fact that these little old ladies have vaginas should entitle them to special treatment?

Damn, that made me burst out laughing!!

 

Those self-entitled little old ladies. They're just taking advantage of men.

[Anela]

Damn, that made me burst out laughing!!

 

I was just about to say the same thing. Mme. you are funny.

 

Those self-entitled little old ladies. They're just taking advantage of men.

 

[kaylan]

Stupid thread is stupid.

 

OP, if any of your older threads are an indication, entitled attitudes and behavior like yours is what keeps good men away from you. Feminism hasnt ruined men, the good ones just dont want you.

 

You are the common denominator here. Sorry, just being honest.

 

/thread

[dasein]

Those self-entitled little old ladies. They're just taking advantage of men.

 

One flaw in that bon mot is that those "little old ladies" actually did conduct themselves as "ladies" their entire lives, very few, if any, women in the dating pool today do. Did I spoil the funny joke? Awwwwwwwww.

[kaylan]

P.S. - Most women are not hardcore feminists like you tried to paint in your OP. And even the feminists I went to school with appreciated guys with manners. And as I said before, self entitled women are why chivalry is dead. Any guy will tell you that.

 

And kissing a girl on the hand is for scrubs. Its 2012 and that stuff is cheesy.

Edited April 3, 2012 by kaylan

[Anela]

One flaw in that bon mot is that those "little old ladies" actually did conduct themselves as "ladies" their entire lives, very few, if any, women in the dating pool today do. Did I spoil the funny joke? Awwwwwwwww.

 

You didn't spoil anything. I still think that what she said is funny.

[Els]

P.S. - Most women are not hardcore feminists like you tried to paint in your OP. And even the feminists I went to school with appreciated guys with manners. And as I said before, self entitled women are why chivalry is dead. Any guy will tell you that.

 

I think it's a combination of both, honestly. I really have witnessed women ripping on a guy for trying to offer them a chivalrous gesture. V also isn't the first woman I've heard admitting to arguing with guys who attempt to be chivalrous. Entitlement is certainly a huge killer, though IMO nothing gets you down like having a nice gesture thrown in your face.

 

I really don't think chivalry is dead though, or at least not in many cultures.

[kaylan]

When was the last time, you opened a car door for your BF?

 

Women wanted to be educated, have careers and equal pay.

 

So if a girl is just as educated as me, has a career like me and earns just as much as I do then why should I pay for stuff? Shouldn't things be 50/50?

 

Women want equality when it benefits them and inequality when it benefits them.

This.

 

He makes an entirely valid point. qft

Exactly. So why is it becoming so rare?

 

It has nothing to do with being able to afford it. A man is sexy when he pays and shows he can take care of a women and take her out.

 

My guess is that you're single.

Society has groomed you to feel this way. Thank god women I go after dont give a crap about this. My ability to pay for them has nothing to do with how sexy they find me.

Edited April 3, 2012 by kaylan

[Mme. Chaucer]

One flaw in that bon mot is that those "little old ladies" actually did conduct themselves as "ladies" their entire lives, very few, if any, women in the dating pool today do. Did I spoil the funny joke? Awwwwwwwww.

 

How do you know, oh omniscient Man?

 

I bet a whole bunch of those crones acted just like men with vaginas. You know, voted, had a job, etc. Some of them might have even been feminists.

[FrustratedStandards]

Pretty much. The kindness of strangers, et al.

 

I was parking in a pay lot a long time ago where you had to get out of your car to buy a ticket from a machine. Before I had even parked, some guy came up to my window and offered me his ticket since it still had over an hour left on it. What an absolute sweetheart! I thanked him profusely where he just said "pass it on" so since that time, if I have over 1/2 hour left, I pass on my ticket of which people are also grateful in return.

 

That it's happened more than once since that time, makes me feel warm inside that passing on courtesy freely, somehow comes back freely.

 

This is news? I thought everyone did this? It's common from my experience...

 

Yet, the cell phone get's busted out and texting commences, or that phone call during the date.

 

Are you serious? That's really rude. I never even look at my phone when i'm out for coffee with a girlfriend.

 

Oh, come on. You really think the fact that these little old ladies have vaginas should entitle them to special treatment?

 

LOLOLOLOLOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

 

Also, let me make another point here:

 

Gentlemen don't make a habit of doing things solely for women. They do things for EVERYONE. Because it is in their nature to be kind, it's not even a conscious action, it's a mandatory gesture that isn't given an afterthought.

 

Yes. This is such a beautiful quality in a person.

 

Damn, that made me burst out laughing!!

 

Those self-entitled little old ladies. They're just taking advantage of men.

 

Ahaha.

 

One flaw in that bon mot is that those "little old ladies" actually did conduct themselves as "ladies" their entire lives, very few, if any, women in the dating pool today do. Did I spoil the funny joke? Awwwwwwwww.

 

That's true. Women these days carry themselves and behave differently. There aren't many "real women" or "ladies" anymore.

 

And kissing a girl on the hand is for scrubs. Its 2012 and that stuff is cheesy.

 

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO it not!! Just as an experiment, do it to the next girl you introduce yourself too. Now watch her melt. It might be cheesy, but since it's so uncommon and almost extinct, if you start doing it again it will be a grand gesture.

 

I know I loved it last weekend when I met an Italian. For them it's a common/normal thing to do. I honestly felt like such a lady, and in my eyes he was such a man. We exchanged contact info.

[veggirl]

I've never met a guy who lets doors slam in a gals face. I've never met a guy who doesn't at least offer to pay on an early date.

 

If we were going to say something "ruined" men, I would never attribute it to feminism. If anything, it's the raunch sexual culture that has "ruined" many people and made courting unnecessary, actual dates an oddity to younger people, and expectations fly all over the place with both genders.

[iris219]

When was the last time, you opened a car door for your BF?

 

Women wanted to be educated, have careers and equal pay.

 

So if a girl is just as educated as me, has a career like me and earns just as much as I do then why should I pay for stuff? Shouldn't things be 50/50?

 

Women want equality when it benefits them and inequality when it benefits them.

 

This.

 

He makes an entirely valid point. qft

Society has groomed you to feel this way. Thank god women I go after dont give a crap about this. My ability to pay for them has nothing to do with how sexy they find me.

 

 

Not discriminating against women in the workplace, in academia, etc. doesn't mean there aren't gender roles, and it doesn't mean males and females should be expected to behave exactly the same in relationships.

[Mme. Chaucer]

I think I'd crack up if a man kissed my hand when introduced to me.

 

What if the woman had poor hygiene?

[dasein]

How do you know, oh omniscient Man?

 

I don't know, but give them the benefit of the doubt. Not omniscient, but I am a very kind and courteous man...

 

...until I see them screeching drunk and passing out in the streets with their tattooed asses hanging out, doing jaeger bombs in bars, wearing their ankles on their shoulders for ten years then deciding it's time to settle down and "attach to a host," acting entitled to discriminatory legal treatment, spouting out BS feminist statistical lies and historical distortions re: wage gaps, oppression, patriarchy, the evils of men, waving "slut power" signs, turning workplaces into drama laden sets of their own personal soap operas, chugging down antidepressants and xanax like candy to no effect, and constantly bleating about "where did all the good, gentlemanly men go?"

 

I don't see many little old -ladies- doing those things, but if I do, they can open their own damn car doors and pay for themselves too.

[Woggle]

I have no problem whatsoever with equality but these manhaters who hide behind feminism have ruined it for women who appreciate old school chivalry. A few decades of being treated like we are the enemy or like we are all patriarchal pigs does not exactly put us in a chivalrous mood.

 

I think that many men are just sick of being hated because we born with a penis and many men are in full backlash mode. Our attitude is that if some women want to act like men or rather the misandrist stereotype of what a man is then why not treat them like a man? Also much of the time they want you to play your stereotypical male role but ask a woman to play the traditional feminine role and a man gets his head bitten off.

 

I am not saying it is all women's fault but it is refreshing to hear a woman admit that it is not so one sided instead of just blaming men. This is the world the militant feminists wanted and now they have it.

[Anela]

I don't know, but give them the benefit of the doubt. Not omniscient, but I am a very kind and courteous man...

 

...until I see them screeching drunk and passing out in the streets with their tattooed asses hanging out, doing jaeger bombs in bars, wearing their ankles on their shoulders for ten years then deciding it's time to settle down and "attach to a host," acting entitled to discriminatory legal treatment, spouting out BS feminist statistical lies and historical distortions re: wage gaps, oppression, patriarchy, the evils of men, waving "slut power" signs, turning workplaces into drama laden sets of their own personal soap operas, chugging down antidepressants and xanax like candy to no effect, and constantly bleating about "where did all the good, gentlemanly men go?"

 

I don't see many little old -ladies- doing those things, but if I do, they can open their own damn car doors and pay for themselves too.

 

I didn't do this either. I'm pretty much squeaky clean. It sounds like you would assume otherwise, just based on my gender and my age.

[shorty7]

Well I like being treated like a lady, because I am one.

 

This is news? I thought everyone did this? It's common from my experience...

 

Well by the same token, I assume that you're doing to others as you expect others should behave to you. Most women I see that claim themselves as a "lady" have very astute double standards. They gossip about the men who they don't think aren't gentlemanly enough, they'll trash some guy they dated openly on the internet, they'll verbally abuse someone behind that person's back and get others to do the dirty work for them... They'll act prim and proper around men they feel are a benefit to them, suuuuuuure, but as soon as you show that they aren't entitled as they feel they should be... whew!

 

How do you know, oh omniscient Man?

 

I bet a whole bunch of those crones acted just like men with vaginas. You know, voted, had a job, etc. Some of them might have even been feminists.

LOL. Shouldn't suffragettes be a better term for the ladies in that age description? :-p

 

Kaylan, lemme know if you've got more of that popcorn of yours.

[FrustratedStandards]

Well by the same token, I assume that you're doing to others as you expect others should behave to you. Most women I see that claim themselves as a "lady" have very astute double standards. They gossip about the men who they don't think aren't gentlemanly enough, they'll trash some guy they dated openly on the internet, they'll verbally abuse someone behind that person's back and get others to do the dirty work for them... They'll act prim and proper around men they feel are a benefit to them, suuuuuuure, but as soon as you show that they aren't entitled as they feel they should be... whew!

 

These women ruin it for the rest of us.

[Woggle]

We need a new word for this phenomenon because if you look up feminist in the dictionary there is nothing to disagree with. I would prefer to call them the misandrist cult and unfortunately they hide behind feminism to defend their stances.

[dasein]

I think I'd crack up if a man kissed my hand when introduced to me.

 

What if the woman had poor hygiene?

 

Not that I've done it in a great long while, but if the lips touch the hand, it is being done wrong.

[dasein]

I didn't do this either. I'm pretty much squeaky clean. It sounds like you would assume otherwise, just based on my gender and my age.

 

Regardless of whether you do those things or not, there are lots who do, all the way up to 40 and beyond, and in agreement with OP, quite enough to spoil things for the rest of you.

[Desinova]

 

Not discriminating against women in the workplace, in academia, etc. doesn't mean there aren't gender roles, and it doesn't mean males and females should be expected to behave exactly the same in relationships.

 

question for you.

 

Do you believe things should be 50/50 or do you believe:

 

A man is sexy when he pays .

[Anela]

Regardless of whether you do those things or not, there are lots who do, all the way up to 40 and beyond, and in agreement with OP, quite enough to spoil things for the rest of you.

 

Well it would then be helpful, if you took us on a case by case basis, rather than lumping us all in together. The same goes for women where men are concerned.

[verhrzn]

I'm still a little confused, V. Wasn't it you who kept complaining that the men you know don't view you as a woman? But here you say they do, and you say you don't want them to. You even got into an argument with them because they tried treating you as a lady. The latter part of your paragraph also boggles me. You do know that probably 99.5% of men don't even post on relationship forums, right? Some of the male posters here are nowhere near representative of the male gender, and frankly it's insulting to other men to make assumptions about them based on those posters.

 

So, if you constantly react negatively to the men you know treating you like a lady, why are you unhappy that they don't view you as a woman?

 

If you are really concerned about the obligations bit, thank them and reciprocate the gesture in the future. Pay for drinks, or bake them cookies, or help them out with stuff, or get them a little gift.

 

I don't see "woman" and "lady" as the same.

 

"Woman" is a statement of truth. I am of the female gender. "Lady" has a lot of social and economic implications. One must act a certain way to be considered a "lady." It also has historical overtunes of class.... a lower class woman was not a "lady" due to her lack of proper birth and breeding. Words have power, and "lady" still calls to mind certain behaviors and mindsets.

 

The very idea of "lady" and "gentleman" is still seeped in sexist ideas. (I mean sexist in the strictest sense... that men should act like this, and women should act like that.)

 

I don't want to act like this. I want to act like me. I don't want to be a lady; I want to be myself. Who I am is a woman (because that is my gender), but I don't want it to define me any further than that.

 

If a guy is paying for my dinner BECAUSE I'm a woman, that's a problem. If he's paying for it because he thinks women and men act in a certain way (to be a "gentleman" he should pay, and to be a "lady" I should accept it) that's an even bigger problem, because of all the baggage that comes with the mindset of what being a "gentleman" and a "lady" means.

 

I do not understand why "woman" and "lady" must be connected. That to be seen as a woman, you need to act like a lady. Doesn't that suggest that to be seen as a woman, you have to follow some arbitrary standard of behavior: be this, act like that, don't do this? That is not an attitude I want to encourage.

 

I find the idea that I need to act a certain way to be seen as a woman by men, rather offensive. Whatever happened to "be yourself"? That assertion wipes out decades of progress towards equality; it means that dating-wise, we are still stuck in the 20's.

 

Should I daintily wave my fan, and call for my smelling salts at the faintest provocation as well?

 

And as far as the social obligation goes... how the heck do I ever know that I'll see this person again, that I can bake him cookies or give him a gift or whatever? With those examples, you're actually proving that there IS a social obligation to letting him pay: that I see him again. By letting him pay for my dinner ("act like a lady"), I am giving up my free agency to decide if I want to interact with him again.

[dasein]

Well it would then be helpful, if you took us on a case by case basis, rather than lumping us all in together. The same goes for women where men are concerned.

 

That sounds good, but in an environment where a giant portion of women do the things I list well up into middle age and beyond, and they sure as hell aren't going to wear that on their sleeve or fess up when sizing up the new sucker, how do you know? Just open the wallet and give the benefit of the doubt? Sorry, been there, done that too many times. These days they have to demonstrate a history with me of not being/doing any of those listed things until I even think about doling out special treatment from the past. Pull out a chair, open a door, sure, np. Shell out -any- money or make any traditional courtship gestures of chivalry. Nope, not right off the bat, not any more.