Dating while separated.

[JTLR]

Okay, kind of a long and involved story. I'll try to keep it short, but please bear with me.

 

Back in June I decided I was going to get divorced from my wife. The reasons don't matter; just trust me that the decision was made with careful thought and consideration (a couple years worth). Anyway, I met another girl. Neither one of us were looking for anything. We started by just talking. After a few days of that we just sort of “clicked”. We "dated", sort of, for a month or so. We never really did anything a typical dating couple would. We would just go sit somewhere and talk or something like that. After a couple weeks things got physical. We haven't had sex; just kissing, holding hands, hugging, etc. Everything was going great. We were both extremely happy. We would email all day long and call each other several times a day. Every time I would leave her she would call me on her way home just as soon as she left. I could truly tell how she felt about me. She would always make time to either see me or call me.

 

Anyway, one day (quite suddenly) the girl decided that she didn't want to be the "other girl". She told me that she wanted to wait until I was at least separated before we continued kissing, hugging, telling each other how we feel about one another, etc. I wasn't happy with it, but I understand it, so I agreed. We still talked every once in a while, but not nearly as much. We barely see each other anymore either. I used to send her an email every morning when I would wake up and she would reply as soon as she woke up. I’d always send one before I went to bed telling her goodnight and she’d always reply. After she told me we should wait until I’m separated, that stopped too. I still email her, but she rarely replies. We talk briefly on the phone every once in a while, but that’s about it.

 

A couple weeks ago she got upset with me because I wanted to know if she still felt the same way about me. She refused to answer because she said it wasn’t fair for her to have feelings for me until I’m not married anymore. I just want to know that she still cares for me. Well we had an argument about it. I left in anger. She emailed me on my way back to work from her house telling me that she does care for me a lot, and that she doesn’t want me to be upset. It was nice to hear her say that.

 

A little after that I was finally able to move out into my own place. I was finally separated. Yet nothing with her changed. She said that she wants to wait until I am actually divorced. Then she decided that she wants to wait even after the divorce is final so she can tell that I’m not “relationship dependent”. This absolutely kills me. I know I’m not dependent upon a relationship to be happy. But I also know that I want a relationship with her eventually. I never asked her to rush into marrying me or anything like that. In fact, I told her quite clearly that I wouldn’t be ready for marriage for a long time. But I still want a relationship with her. I think there is a big difference in wanting a relationship and needing one.

 

I know that this whole situation is totally screwed up. Trust me, I do. But I have questions. When I’m with her, I feel totally happy. I’ve not felt like that for a very long time. She helped me see that I’m actually worth something, and that I deserve to be happy. I know that I could have a very happy future with her. She has even told me that she feels the same way about me. I guess my biggest question is this: How do I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that she truly just wants to wait for me to be divorced, and that I’m not just being blown off? It’s just so difficult for me to believe that she cares about me when she won’t tell me or show me. I don’t know if that’s a defect with me or what.

 

This is only part of the story (most of the pertinent details anyway). I’m really hoping somebody has been in a similar situation and can shed some light here, because I’m really in the dark. I’ve never been in this situation before. Any and all help is appreciated. Thanks.

[Serenitynow]

A little after that I was finally able to move out into my own place. I was finally separated. Yet nothing with her changed.

 

It's hilarious how egotistical people are so shocked when others dont see things the way they do.

 

You're not divorced yet! Yet you think having your own pad makes it all ok.

 

You should join POF in my town, everyone is separated and looking to date.

[JTLR]

Well, for one, I don't think I'm egotistical. And I never said moving out would make everything okay. I said that she said it would. Yet, once I did, things changed again. I just don't understand the other side of the situation (her side). That is why I posted here, to help me understand it. I didn't post so people could reply with snide comments. Thanks for the effort though.

[carhill]

Welcome to LS

 

So, you're living alone now. Welcome to the club. How's the D going? We're about a year in from filing and it should be final in a month or two, depending on the court docket. Cali has a six month cooling off period. My ex and have had separate homes for around 18 months.

 

Here's a thread I started earlier this year about dating while separated. Perhaps it will be helpful and provide some female perspective.

 

My personal opinion would be to leave her be and get your divorce done. If there's a connection with her, it's not going anywhere. In the meantime, date women who don't mind dating a separated man. You have your perspective and should be true to it. Relationships are a two-way street. Every man is different. Personally, I'm relishing the alone time and have used it to expand my *male* friendships and travel the world and create a recovery plan from the financial hardships created by divorce.

 

Anyway, good luck and spend some time reading here. I'm sure it will help

[JTLR]

Thank you for the perspective. And thank you for the lack of disdain in your reply.

 

The divorce is going. My state only has a 30 day waiting period if it is uncontested, which it is. I think that may be a unique thing in my situation. I don't hate my soon-to-be-ex. We just grew apart over the past seven years. Neither one of us is bitter at the other. We just both realized that we're happier apart and as friends. We both even agreed to date other people while separated (just no sex).

 

I have tried to leave her alone. It's so hard though. I know that relationships take work, and I know that I want a relationship with her. She has told me before on a few occasions that she "isn't going anywhere". And I believe her, but after a few days of not hearing from her (like the past two days) I start to wonder again. That's where I get confused. I don't know why I have a hard time being happy with what we have now (basically just a close friendship) until the time comes.

 

And as far as dating other women goes, I don't really want to. I wasn't looking to date when I met her. It serisously was an accident. We just connected. I've never been a date-around kind of guy. I like to date one person at a time and see where it goes.

[Cee]

I had an "easy" divorce and the whole process took a year. There was financial and emotional damage that I still feel to this day, but for the most part I am completely healed. The divorce was final in early 2005.

 

I dated someone 90 days after separation and I realized that I was using him to not be alone. I went into therapy to get over my dependency on men. I waited 4 years after my separation (3 years after divorce) to date again.

 

I don't know how long you need to wait, but I think the more time you give yourself, the stronger you will feel. I also think your perspective on your girlfriend will change over time. She doesn't have to be your life preserver. You can make a whole network of new friends who will support you.

 

I have had the experience of dating guys who were separated & I didn't enjoy it at all. They seemed to have so much chaos in their lives - child custody issues, court dates, financial hardships, phone calls with the ex, loose ends. I don't think every separated guy is like that, but that was my experience.

[carhill]

Here's a point where the confluence of marriage, divorce and MC helped me. They taught me the concept and value and health of acceptance. Like your ladyfriend here....if she told me she wasn't going anywhere but didn't want to date me while I was separated, I'd accept that. Prior, I'd pour on the romance, convince her of my value and worth, and try to be invaluable to her. Now, I'd say, and have said to the women who have rejected me in various forms and for various reasons, that 'I understand. Thanks.' Someone who really wants to be with me will be with me. It won't be a hard-won battle.

 

Since you aren't bitter, don't hate your ex and don't date around, you seem like a perfect candidate for acceptance. Accept that you like her, would like to have a relationship with her and that she, at this time, does not want the same kind of relationship you want. If that means you accept spending time alone because that's OK with you, and not dating others, that's what it means. If you enjoy the company of other women and want to socialize while in the divorce process, than that's what you enjoy. There are compatible people for all aspects of what you want, if such involves another person.

 

So, if you made the decision to get divorced back in June, you and your ex are in agreement and won't be contesting, and your jurisdiction has a 30 day cooling off period, how's the docket look? One of you has been served, the cooling off period has run; where are you now? We're at the MSA (settlement agreement) stage and that's done, just waiting for the asset list to make it through the legal blender. Then, it's merely filing that and waiting on the court seal on the judgment and decree. My ex, as I did not contest, filed for a default judgment with a settlement agreement. Very simple.

 

If you're not talking about the process in a clear and calm way with your ladyfriend, OR you're stalling the process for whatever reason, she'd have every reason to be cautious. Women look at *actions* in a man.

 

Good luck

Edited October 5, 2010 by carhill

[JTLR]

When we were all hot and heavy for eachother (which lasted quite a while) she would tell me all the time that she wanted more and that she wanted a real relationship. That is the hardest part for me I guess. She said that she doesn't feel right having those feelings for me until I'm divorced. I understand that. I don't like it (obviously), but I do understand it and can respect it. After all, I want it to work out in the end too. But the hardest part is that she's not telling me that any more. She has told me a couple times since that day she told me we should just be friends for now that she does still care about me and that a future with me is very possible. I just don't know why I can't accept that and hold on to it.

 

I'll give you a shining example. Last Friday we had lunch. She surprised me and stopped by the office. It was very nice. We had a good time. When we were leaving she told me that she was falling in love with me and that she had to stop herself because it wasn't right. That meant the world to me. I was on cloud nine for a while because I finally knew exactly how she felt. Then on Saturday I invited her to an event later this month. She told me then that she'd check her schedule and let me know on Sunday if she could make it. Well Sunday rolled around and I hadn't heard from her so I asked her if she had been able to check her schedule. She told me she'd call me Monday. I didn't hear from her all day Monday at all. Now it's Tuesday and I still haven't heard a word from her. This is why I question what is going on. She has told me that she was falling in love with me, so it's obvious how she feels. And if those feelings were true (which I believe they were), then they don't just go away overnight. Why do I question her then? I think this is an issue with me more than anything else. Rah! So frustrating that I can't even figure out my own emotions, much less someone else's.

[carhill]

Here's a tip. Be less concerned about how she feels and more concerned about how you feel. You say this dynamic is confusing, with her seeming hot and cold, 'it's not right' and 'I'm falling in love with you'. Accept that. Next time you talk, say 'I feel confused'. If she asks why, explain how you *feel*, rather than investigate the meaning of her actions/words. Accept the result of that communication. If you still feel confused, accept that.

 

Another tip. When we've been rejected, as in divorce, we ache for the validation that another human 'likes' us. Normal. It also can be unhealthy. I see it as a sign of lack of completeness. We are missing something in ourselves, something divorce and the end of a marriage has taken, and we're looking for it in the validation of others. Completeness, health and happiness come from within us. Ladyfriend's aren't responsible for that, even incidentally. We share ourselves and our happiness with them.

 

Did you and your exW have any MC? IME, it really helps, even when divorcing. Acceptance and communication were items I clearly worked on there.

[irc333]

LOL...I've been to some singles mixers in my town, and I think half of them were in the middle of a divorce!

 

There was this one woman that had the hots for me, she was at a singles mixer and wanted to go out with me, we kept in touch by email and thats it, but turns out she admitted to not being 'entirely divorced.

 

I decided to perhaps talk on the comptuer until she got a divorce, the seperation just lingered on and on....I dropped contact with her, then I bumped into her again, and sh was STILL together with the husband, apparently she moved back in with him again...because he got injured, and felt pity for him because the kids missed him.

 

Also, I met 2 Brazilian former "mail order brides", I call them that because I think they came to this country on the coat tails of the men who married them.

 

I was talking to one, and she asn't "really single", she just dumped him (as if you can dump a husband like you cand ump a bf.

 

I asked her, "So, how long have you been in this country?"

 

Her: "2 years"

 

Me: "How long have you been married?"

 

Her: "2 years"

 

 

Um...see the pattern here?LOL

 

 

It's hilarious how egotistical people are so shocked when others dont see things the way they do.

 

You're not divorced yet! Yet you think having your own pad makes it all ok.

 

You should join POF in my town, everyone is separated and looking to date.

[2sure]

She is being reasonable and fair to herself and you should do the same for her.

 

"Back in June I decided I was going to get divorced from my wife."

 

You met this woman while you were married. You decided you wanted a divorce from you wife. You did not divorce or separate at that time.

 

This new woman does not want to be OW to a separated and not yet divorced man.

She does not want to be the rebound a MM runs to when he decides to end his marriage.

She does not want to be involved in the drama of your divorce.

She does not want a relationship with you until your marriage is over, the divorce is over and you are able to move on with your life independent of that baggage.

 

She is a smart girl.

[JTLR]

No, we didn't really do any counseling or anything. Like I said, it was a mutual decision to divorce. Neither one of us are upset about it. We're not mad at eachother, we just aren't in love like we used to be. Very strange, and hard to belive, but the truth. I'm not torn up about the divorce at all. Neither is she. We're both looking forward to moving on and staying great friends. We always were good friends. It's just that now we have a kid together.

 

As far as looking for validation in another's affection, I see that. I don't know if that's what's going on, but I really don't like to think it is. I don't feel I need to be in a relationship with her. I feel I need a cigarette, but not a relationship with her. But that doesn't mean I don't strongly want one. Maybe I am incomplete. I don't know. There are many things I don't know. But there are things that I'm certain about too. And one thing I'm certain about is that I really like her. She's a wonderful person, an excellent mother, she's funny, smart, compasionate, caring, you name it. She's great. The thing I love most about her though is that she makes me smile even when I'm determined to be in a bad mood. I'm not even wanting to rush things. I'm fine with waiting until the divorce is final. I'm even fine with taking it slow once it is and not "picking up where we left off". What I'm having dificulty with is reading her signs. You're right, the "hot and cold" is giving me whiplash.

[What_Next]

I am in a similiar situation, PM me for the details if you like. I don't want to post it on an open forum.

[blizzard]

I agree with 2sure...

 

She is a very smart woman.

[CrestfallenNoMore]

Then she decided that she wants to wait even after the divorce is final so she can tell that I’m not “relationship dependent”. This absolutely kills me. I know I’m not dependent upon a relationship to be happy.

 

She helped me see that I’m actually worth something, and that I deserve to be happy.

 

She's very wise to back away from you right now. I've dated separated men in the past, and while I'm not going to stereotype here, you're absolutely displaying some of the hallmarks of men the men that I dated.

 

I bolded the above, because you're not only contradicting yourself, but because that is something you should either already know, or you need learn on your own as a single person.

 

I've dated men who claimed to be "just fine" about their divorces. But my experience is that, deep down, they weren't. NOBODY is "just fine" going through a divorce unless there was zero love there. I don't care who you are, your self-esteem, doubt, and all kinds of other things get affected (as the above quote reveals). And it's even worse IME with men because women will go to therapy or talk with their friends, but men are taught to "keep a stiff upper lip" and keep it all inside. So what I eventually discovered I was to a separated man was what I call "a shoulder and a vagina girl." Don't get me wrong, these were perfectly decent guys, but what they really wanted me for at the time was comfort - external validation in the form of sex and a sympathetic, society-endorsed shoulder to cry on even if they weren't talking about their ex. And even in the context of trying to date me, they were using me to help them feel good about themselves. They were blind to our incompatibilities and other issues that would have been obvious had they been in a different place.

 

I know, that's not you. I know, you really, really like her. I know, you haven't felt this way about anyone in a long time. I know. You're different...

 

I've stayed friends with a couple of the separated men I dated (who, incidentally, I didn't have sex with due to my realization) and at the time they thought I was crazy, that they were "better than that," or whatever, but both have since acknowledged I was absolutely dead right. As much as they liked me, they weren't in a position to be good partners and had no business trying to establish a healthy relationship until they got healthy first. But, both acknowledged that there was no way anyone was going to convince them of that at the time.

 

I think this girl is showing incredible intelligence and is taking good care of her own emotional well-being. I think you should do the same, and then, if you still feel as though you want to give it a try after the divorce, then contact her. But hear her, and respect her wishes in the meantime. If you push her, she's going to push you out of her world entirely, as she should in that case.

 

Good luck to you.

Edited October 5, 2010 by CrestfallenNoMore

[Serenitynow]

JTLR, a coupla points:

 

1. You seem to have a hard time understanding why a person would not want to get deeply involved with someone who is separated but still married.

 

Ego . . . cough

[walktheline]

Glad to see that someone out there has a similar situation going on, though mine isn't nearly involved as yours.

 

I too was separated physically for a few months, emotionally for over a year and in the divorce process when I too met someone by accident. We did nothing more than talked on the phone and texted back in forth, though she too felt that it was improper for us to be talking like we were while I was still legally married. So it was let's "just be friends" and then when that was too hard it went to no contact really at all, except when I occasionally saw her at work.

 

It's been hard going from friends, to having that connection, back to friends and then to nothing and I've had a couple weak moments I'm not too proud of with one email a few weeks ago telling her that I missed talking to her. Stupid really.

 

So for me I have the sinking feeling that I've screwed this up before it even got a chance to really start. My divorce is final next week and earlier in the summer when we were still texting she indicated that she liked me and that maybe we could start things again after my personal life is sorted out, but at this point I'm not sure if that's still a possibility. Besides, I have no idea how to transition back to where things were before. Another of those "What if's?" and lesson learned I guess.

 

Go with the advice and stop pushing her and trying to make it into something before it's time has come. If she really likes you she'll wait, if not then that's life I guess.

[tami-chan]

It's hilarious how egotistical people are so shocked when others dont see things the way they do.

You're not divorced yet! Yet you think having your own pad makes it all ok.

 

You should join POF in my town, everyone is separated and looking to date.

 

Aren't you being a little too harsh to the OP? I do not know if you read that the woman did tell him that she would wait until he got separated...which he did...that was his premise.

 

To the OP. You should just respect her wishes and let her be....