Update: Not Dating American Women Anymore

[tigressA]

This comment is based on what? I've read nothing that would prompt me to believe you have any kind of point.

 

So.... What exactly are you implying? Because with the knowlege I currently have... this question makes no sense.

 

That post was not meant for you, UF...

[tigressA]

I cannot believe you said that. Wow.

 

I know, right?!

[Taramere]

I've never had any complaints. My partners don't cheat on me...probably because I don't drive them insane.

 

 

If that's how you perceive things - ie that a person who gets cheated on brings it on themselves - then I hope for your sake you never get cheated on. I don't know how you would deal with taking responsibility for someone else's crappy behaviour on top of all the hurt that being cheated on causes.

[sanskrit]

@amerikajin

 

Just so you know, at least some of the folks reading here have a sense of humor, and think you handled the personal insult tossed your way very well as opposed to responding in kind.

[amerikajin]

That's because you pick partners with no self-esteem.

 

Thank you for bolstering the argument of the OP. This is exactly the kind of thing that the *stereotypical* (North) American woman might say. "Yeah, well your foreign partners have no self-esteem," or "She's a mail order bride," or "She's a slave." That just reeks of bitterness.

 

And TBF, don't try to slink away from this discussion as the victim here. You have basically been stalking me over the past month or so, showing up on random threads and tossing in one-line barbs just so you can even the score (probably from one of those discussions on economics or Islam - not sure which one). Give it a rest. God knows I've got my own issues, but I at least try to own up to them. I really think you to take a good, long, hard look in the mirror. You don't always have to be "right".

[Untouchable_Fire]

That post was not meant for you, UF...

 

Even so... unless it's based on some kind of inside joke... It makes zero sense in this context.

 

And I assume since she is unwilling to provide said context... that she is intentionally being vague to hide the inaccuracy of her statement.

 

That's because you pick partners with no self-esteem.

 

No... Wrong! People who are easy going do not automatically have low self esteem.

 

It's actually quite the opposite. Those with low self esteem desperately try to control the world around them to feel better about themselves.

 

If that's how you perceive things - ie that a person who gets cheated on brings it on themselves - then I hope for your sake you never get cheated on. I don't know how you would deal with taking responsibility for someone else's crappy behaviour on top of all the hurt that being cheated on causes.

 

I was pretty down on myself for months. It's natural that when someone tells you its your fault you begin to internalize that somewhat.

 

It doesn't help that so many people on this board WILL blame you if your GF or wife cheats on you.

 

Thank you for bolstering the argument of the OP. This is exactly the kind of thing that the *stereotypical* (North) American woman might say. "Yeah, well your foreign partners have no self-esteem," or "She's a mail order bride," or "She's a slave." That just reeks of bitterness.

 

Thats how I read that comment too.

 

However, I didn't see it as bitter so much as pure condescending arrogance.

[amerikajin]

No... Wrong! People who are easy going do not automatically have low self esteem.

 

It's actually quite the opposite. Those with low self esteem desperately try to control the world around them to feel better about themselves.

 

Someone who hangs on to a relationship despite being neglected and abused...yes, that's having low self esteem. But you're right, someone who has to "win" arguments all the time, or someone who constantly competes with others because she feels inadequate and can't just be herself...that's also low self esteem. In fact, the latter is worse because the person is masquerading as being confident, when in reality, the behavior represents a complete lack of confidence. In short, it's fake.

 

I am not going to bash all American women here, but there are some traits about your stereotypical American woman that I just can't deal with anymore. Sometimes I feel like American women are marketing themselves, for lack of a better description. Huge turn off. Some I have met put up some sort of front and pretense about being worldly or sophisticated. Granted, sometimes it's just a lack of maturity, but I think that American women are more overt whereas even other Westerners tend to be more circumspect. Of course, the same applies for men as well. Maybe it's the dating culture here I find not so attractive anymore, as opposed to this being some sort of gender-specific issue.

[Untouchable_Fire]

I am not going to bash all American women here, but there are some traits about your stereotypical American woman that I just can't deal with anymore. Sometimes I feel like American women are marketing themselves, for lack of a better description. Huge turn off. Some I have met put up some sort of front and pretense about being worldly or sophisticated. Granted, sometimes it's just a lack of maturity, but I think that American women are more overt whereas even other Westerners tend to be more circumspect. Of course, the same applies for men as well. Maybe it's the dating culture here I find not so attractive anymore, as opposed to this being some sort of gender-specific issue.

 

I've been thinking about this as well.

 

Our dating culture is derived from the courtship system, then modified heavily by the sexual revolution and media influences.

 

Honestly some of the attitudes I've seen on this thread from some female posters borders on crazy. Helping a guy put together a presentation or cooking some meals is tantamount to subjugation?

 

Yet I've seen no such response in threads regarding sex on the 1st-3rd date.

 

So... what does that tell you?

[donnamaybe]

I've been thinking about this as well.

 

Our dating culture is derived from the courtship system, then modified heavily by the sexual revolution and media influences.

 

Honestly some of the attitudes I've seen on this thread from some female posters borders on crazy. Helping a guy put together a presentation or cooking some meals is tantamount to subjugation?

 

Yet I've seen no such response in threads regarding sex on the 1st-3rd date.

 

So... what does that tell you?

You know, you have a point there. But I have to say, I believe you would have gotten better responses, PARTICULARLY from us American women, had you not effectively lumped us all into one collective group and told us we were all no good at the outset of this thread.

[Knittress]

But I have to say, I believe you would have gotten better responses, PARTICULARLY from us American women, had you not effectively lumped us all into one collective group and told us we were all no good at the outset of this thread.

 

Heh. Yeah. But did you see that "LS men are turning me off men," thread? Fair's fair.

[Mad Max]

Heh. Yeah. But did you see that "LS men are turning me off men," thread? Fair's fair.

 

 

Yep. Complete double standard. And I don't recall seeing too many women coming to the defense of men in that thread either.

[donnamaybe]

Heh. Yeah. But did you see that "LS men are turning me off men," thread? Fair's fair.

I supposed I could have gone into that thread and told them it wasn't a fair assessment. But I also didn't go in there and chime in that it was reality either, now did I?

[Woggle]

Thank you for bolstering the argument of the OP. This is exactly the kind of thing that the *stereotypical* (North) American woman might say. "Yeah, well your foreign partners have no self-esteem," or "She's a mail order bride," or "She's a slave." That just reeks of bitterness.

 

And TBF, don't try to slink away from this discussion as the victim here. You have basically been stalking me over the past month or so, showing up on random threads and tossing in one-line barbs just so you can even the score (probably from one of those discussions on economics or Islam - not sure which one). Give it a rest. God knows I've got my own issues, but I at least try to own up to them. I really think you to take a good, long, hard look in the mirror. You don't always have to be "right".

 

I fully agree. To say that faithful women lack self esteem simply proves our point for us.

[Woggle]

You know, you have a point there. But I have to say, I believe you would have gotten better responses, PARTICULARLY from us American women, had you not effectively lumped us all into one collective group and told us we were all no good at the outset of this thread.

 

I say all the time I am not talking about all American women but there are trends you can't ignore. If you are not like this be proud of it instead of being offended.

[Untouchable_Fire]

The crux seems to be that many many American women seem to be taught that it is actually bad and degrading for them to enter a marriage or relationship with the purpose or objective of making the man happy. They also seem to think that a woman who does see her primary role in a relationship as making her man happy, as an inferior sort of woman.

 

I'm not sure where your from... but I appreciate your input.

 

But OP did not say American women were "no good." What he said was that in his opinion, as a group, they had certain characteristics which made them undesirable as potential mates.

Many of the responses in this thread provided support for his position. Your response does, as well--it's an overly defensive distortion.

You can be as belligerent as you want, and you're just "as good" as any other woman on Earth. However--a belligerent woman who always has to "win" an argument is MUCH LESS desirable to the average man as a potential mate.

Men who are looking for mates or wives are not looking for a good debating opponent. You and others can argue that notion all you want, but it won't change the opinion of anyone who counts--that is, the men who are looking for wives/mates and are dissatisfied with much of what American womanhood has to offer.

 

Very true!

 

There is a line between having an opinion and creating an argument. I can see in my relationships over the last 6 years... that line has been very blurry. I'm fairly easy going. I only get really worked up over important matters, which means I get tired of fighting over small stuff. I'm sure at times I may come across as a pushover because of it.

 

I think men in the U.S. are often beaten into a "Yes, Dear" attitude.

[theBrokenMuse]

LOL...I guess anything can be speculated-you just happen to think of the worse.

Suggesting that someone might be overcompensating in some area to get someone to like them is hardly the worst and if you think it is then you seriously lack any shred of an imagination.

 

Well, if making a negative spin makes you happy, by all means...you seem good at it!

Why should commenting on something to do with a complete stranger affect my mood whatsoever?

 

Correction: I was not implying...I believe you were suggesting it.

Yeah, it did look like a flat out assumption, as it turns out to be, but I really wanted to give you the benefit of the doubt.

 

 

Well, I think you were probably projecting how you are-you know, the motivations the drive you to do "nice" things to others.

Sorry, I figured you were speaking about something that was highlighted in the block of text. So, let me get this straight... because I can look at someone else's actions and come up with other plausible motivations for said actions, that must mean that *I* embody those same motivations? Umm, okay......

 

 

 

Good for you! Some people are happy sowing negative stuff!

Once again, who cares if something is negative? Something being negative doesn't negate anything. We are all adults here and we should all be able to handle the fact that unpleasant stuff exists. If dealing with the fact that there are unpleasantries in life is enough to give someone the vapors then they might want to refrain from conversing on the internet... Just Sayin'. Edited September 30, 2010 by theBrokenMuse

[threebyfate]

Thank you for bolstering the argument of the OP. This is exactly the kind of thing that the *stereotypical* (North) American woman might say. "Yeah, well your foreign partners have no self-esteem," or "She's a mail order bride," or "She's a slave." That just reeks of bitterness.

Incorrect. If you review my initial question to you, it's asking what you bring to the table when asking for so much from a partner. It devolved with your blatant barb about cheating.

 

And TBF, don't try to slink away from this discussion as the victim here. You have basically been stalking me over the past month or so, showing up on random threads and tossing in one-line barbs just so you can even the score (probably from one of those discussions on economics or Islam - not sure which one). Give it a rest. God knows I've got my own issues, but I at least try to own up to them. I really think you to take a good, long, hard look in the mirror. You don't always have to be "right".

Me, stalking you? Don't be ridiculous. I've barely been on LS for the past month. Go back and see who jumps into who's threads. Your perception is royally screwed and paranoid to the max.

[Untouchable_Fire]

Suggesting that someone might be overcompensating in some area to get someone to like them is hardly the worst and if you think it is then you seriously lack any shred of an imagination.

 

I understand why you made that comment. I'm pretty sure it is not the case, but it's something that was originally on my mind anyways.

 

To be totally honest, having a woman use nice deeds to make me like her more, or increase my interest level is a completely refreshing change. If that where her actual motivations I would not be disappointed, as I'm sure it IS a part of why she has been so nice to me.

 

I'm really burned out with women who try to use sex to achieve the same goal. The dating pool here is just an enormous conga line of women convinced that sex is the best way to get what you want.

 

This last round of dating I literally walked away from 2 women that tried to get me to sleep with the on the first date. Eh... Yeah I get it... they have needs and blah, blah, blah. That argument is like the stripper paying for college. You hear it every time... but actually finding one is like a Unicorn Hunt.

 

Sorry, I figured you were speaking about something that was highlighted in the block of text. So, let me get this straight... because I can look at someone else's actions and come up with other plausible motivations for said actions, that must mean that *I* embody those same motivations? Umm, okay......

 

Yes! Though not always, most people first think of what would motivate them to take similar actions.

 

Once again, who cares if something is negative? Something being negative doesn't negate anything. We are all adults here and we should all be able to handle the fact that unpleasant stuff exists. If someone is reading something that isn't pleasant to them and it is enough to give them the vapors then they might want to refrain from conversing on the internet... Just Sayin'.

 

I've had enough negative in dating the last few years... I think it's really hard to hurt me.

 

Oh... but you can rob me blind in court. That pisses me off.

[aerogurl87]

Well after reading through this whole thread I've come to a few conclusions.

 

1) Some people's life experiences have made them extremely bitter.

2) Some people buy into stereotypes way too much.

3) Some people are way too sensitive.

[theBrokenMuse]

I understand why you made that comment. I'm pretty sure it is not the case, but it's something that was originally on my mind anyways.

I am sorry if I rub folks the wrong way. I tend to normally look at things online from a much more detached and unemotional perspective then I probably should sometimes. I guess I've just gotten much more used to posting in a hardcore debating style since debating certain topics have been a hobby of mine for years.

 

To be totally honest, having a woman use nice deeds to make me like her more, or increase my interest level is a completely refreshing change.

To be honest, I would say that it's not that uncommon but I notice it much more with women who don't feel that secure about being able to obtain the affections of a love interest but irregardless, it certainly does feel great to have someone go the extra mile simply because they want to make you happy.

 

If that where her actual motivations I would not be disappointed, as I'm sure it IS a part of why she has been so nice to me.

Of course, it's only natural to try and bolster your chances of someone you like returning your affections. I'm sure you've both done things in that regard.

 

I'm really burned out with women who try to use sex to achieve the same goal. The dating pool here is just an enormous conga line of women convinced that sex is the best way to get what you want.

Yeah... I haven't been into the dating pool in quite some time and to be honest I don't know if I'd ever want to jump back in it again. The dating world seems very dysfunctional. I will say however that if a certain tactic is really pervasive then at some level it's probably working. I'm not saying in an emotionally healthy kind of way but in a way that's producing some result that is satisfactory enough that they keep returning back to it.

 

 

Yes! Though not always, most people first think of what would motivate them to take similar actions.

Although, it can be the case I don't agree that whatever comes to mind first is necessarily what they would do. It could be something that they have witnessed often in those close to them or in society in general enough to recognize it immediately or perhaps have a weird love for abnormal psychology like me

 

 

I've had enough negative in dating the last few years... I think it's really hard to hurt me.

 

Oh... but you can rob me blind in court. That pisses me off.

Well, I hope you get to enjoy some positive dating experiences for a long, long time... and I agree men get screwed in court all too often and it really disgusts me.

[OpenBook]

I'm just happy and grateful and relieved to hear that you have withdrawn from the American dating pool, UF. One can only hope other males of your stature would also follow suit. Best of luck to you.

[Labster12]

The self entitlement issue people complain about in American women, I have only seen that MAINLY among White women, and not the conservative kind of White women but the Liberal type in most cases. Of course I am not attracted to White women and would not date one period but that is due to attraction but this whole being quick to divorce and having that princess mentality has just turned me away from White American women in general (Conservative women don't have this mentality AS MUCH but again, goes back to attraction).

 

I just notice that when you tell an Asian woman or Latina that you are just not attracted to them in general, they don't care! Tell that to a Black girl, she doesn't give a care, she will tell you to go screw yourself. Now on the FLIPSIDE, tell that to a White American woman that you are not attracted to them and look how quick they will be to call you a racist, to call you close minded and everything. YET they find that it is okay for them to criticize men of other races and say stuff like "Oh I won't date a Mexican, I won't date a sp1c and I just can't date a Black guy, wooo not for me".

 

I just can't date a White girl. "OH YOU ARE SO CLOSE MINDED, IN FACT, SCREW IT, YOU WILL BE MISERABLE FOREVER, IN FACT YOU ARE A RACIST IN FACT YOU NEED TO OFF YOURSELF AND DO HUMANITY A FAVOR YOU RACIST PIECE OF CRAP!".

 

That is basically how most White American women have been as I have seen both online and in real life.

 

Basically the US media has tried its best to elevate White women to such a high position that they think it is okay for them to say they won't date a certain race or ethnic group but the second a Hispanic guy says he won't date a White girl, OOOOOO NO HE DIDN'T!

 

Eitherways that is something I have noticed online and in real life among White American women. If you dare say you aren't attracted to them, they are quick to call you a racist. It is like if you are a non-White male and you are not giving them the time of the day, they get this bitter mentality to them.

 

Just something I really wanted to get off my chest, of course criticism matters little as I have my life and I date whoever I want. I could care less if some girl with self entitlement issues finds that it is illegal for me to not date whoever I want because of the color of my skin.

[Labster12]

I have met some decent White girls and White women who have been helpful and good people overall but they have been a minority. Also those have been the conservative type who take family and morals seriously. This self entitlement issue, I haven't seen it as much among Americanized Latinas or Asian girls.

 

My girlfriend was born in the US (Cali), raised on two different coasts (moved to NYC at the age of 7 and to Florida at the age of 12). I have learned so much from her and she comes of as such a warm person.

 

This whole American women are bad idea I don't agree with but the traits people describe them with as having a high sense of self entitlement and all that, I have seen mainly among White girls, liberal ones more so, rarely among conservative ones.

 

Just speaking my experiences and experiences of many others.

Edited October 1, 2010 by Labster12

[Labster12]

Ugh men are so superficial, they only date based on looks, why can't those morons look beyond what is on the outside!?

 

=P

[Untouchable_Fire]

I'm just happy and grateful and relieved to hear that you have withdrawn from the American dating pool, UF. One can only hope other males of your stature would also follow suit. Best of luck to you.

 

:laugh: Your Joking Right?

 

I was under the impression you only chased after Married Men. I've got no ring... so I was never in your dating pool. I suppose if I ever take the plunge again you'll be after me like a dog in heat ... but until then there is no shortage of guys with wives and without morals.

 

Why not go back to Trolling in the OW forum?

 

The self entitlement issue people complain about in American women, I have only seen that MAINLY among White women, and not the conservative kind of White women but the Liberal type in most cases. Of course I am not attracted to White women and would not date one period but that is due to attraction but this whole being quick to divorce and having that princess mentality has just turned me away from White American women in general (Conservative women don't have this mentality AS MUCH but again, goes back to attraction).

 

I'd never thought of it before now.... but your right. A huge chunk of the conservative women I know are really high quality.