Wife says she doesn't know if she wants to stay

[Chuck66]

Wife calls me up from work and sounds strange. I ask whats up she says nothing.. This is our typical dance before an issue comes up. She asks me if I have hired a PI to follow her. I say no why? She said the same vehicles have been behind her all day. She asks if I put a GPS tracker on her car? I said No and if I did then I would have no need to pay for a PI. She says she has a different lawyer (female) and I said well thats good because my lawyer is probably going to draw up D papers this Friday. She says what do you want to do with the kids. I said I want full custody. She asked if I set her up on the overdoes pills? Is she serious? She takes too many, with alcohol, and has to have 3 hours of blood tests and fluids and that's my fault. She said I know you will use that against me at a custody hearing. Actually I said I was going to use the comment your parents made about them putting their house up on the market because they do not like the changes they have seen with you and they do not like the way you treat the children. She says, Well you spank them I don't. But I am also not absent from their lives. You work 55+ hours per week and looking for more work on the week end. And really, De Ju Vu comedy club waitress for college guys? I did not look up a job there. Yes you did. No I didn't and where are you getting this. Your laptop craigslist site stays purple on the places you've been. Well the job was just temporarily on the weekends. You said you didn't even look for a job there.

 

And the cherry on this entire sundae, I said, is that you told your first attorney that your think I will cause you physical harm or ruin your things in the house or try to get you fired. Have I ever done any of those things once? No. That just tells me how far off your mind is in lala land. Well do I get to come home tonight. We its a house it was never a home. Well do I get to come to the house. It's yours too.

 

And the equity is the only thing they will split on the house and land. Don't forget the barn she says. I say I don t forget anything just like 2 weeks ago when you said I can have the house and the money and you don t want any of it. She said again...I still don't. 5 days ago she did. (yeah right). I told her we have a lot in our accounts that will be split up that she can live comfortably. She goes how do I know to believe you since I don't have access to those accounts. Your lawyer will run our SSN's for all accounts. They haven't told you that? Hmmmm.

 

She says why? I said for 20 years I have been begging for affection and sex. You yourself early in the marriage called your self defective. Later in the marriage you said its just the way you are. I got to thinking after all the pain you've out me through these past weeks with I don't know if I want to stay in the house or get my own apartment but its not about you its about me....and I thought, even if you came to your senseless and came running back to me the best I will ever have is no affection and little sex. I said I used to say that was your vice like a wife who does not like her husbands smoking but tolerates its anyway because she loves him. I used to thing of no affection like that. Like it was your vice. But Affection/sex is closer to the core of intimacy and the inner relationship than smoking and takes on a much more meaningful importance and I can not just overlook it like your hiding a cig behind the garage. Besides you want some space....you got lot's of space now sister!

 

She says, I guess I'll see ya .. pause.. At court, I add. No at the house...

 

Chuck

Edited July 6, 2010 by Chuck66

[hopesndreams]

Looks as though she's going to do some damage control.

[Chuck66]

What exactly does that mean? My snitch said she had to go to a meeting and she stormed out of work!!!

[hopesndreams]

She's not ready to set you free just yet. Her plans aren't in place. She needs more time. You are messing her up, no wonder she's angry. Can't you just be something on the bottom of her shoe for just a bit longer?

[What_Next]

Keep pushing ahead with your plans. DO NOT let her delay, push back, or throw up roadblocks.

[Chuck66]

She called back and asked if I could get the kids because she has to work late???!!!! She asked if I wanted child support from her if I get the kids. I said no. She said you say that now but the person with the kids can change their mind at any time. She said she worked just as hard as I did why do I get to keep the $500k house and you will never have to work. Its not fair. I said I will make $3,000 (retirement pay) per month and you make $2,600 per month. I will have to get a job to keep this house!! I told her I'd right her a pretty good check so she wouldn't have to get an extra job waiting table for the college guys and can probably turn down an apartment and get a house. I'm thinking a check for $40K plus the money in her accounts that equal around $15k and she should do alright. She said she really doesn't want to pay for a lawyer and could we use a mediator instead. I said sure I'll look into it. She said no let me look into it. I said ok. She also said why I moved money around in the bank accounts. I said to protect me and my kids. she said MY KIDS TOO! I split our joint checking account and place the other half into her account. I took my half and opened a new checking. I moved $1k from one of our 2 joint savings account into a savings acct of my own and left her $1k alone in the other account. I got her name taken off MY credit card but could not do that with one JOINT credit card. So I had them lower the limit to $500 and left my name on there for the time being. This way she at least has a way of buying without cash. She can easily call up and ask them to increase the limit and run that joint account up.

 

She wants joint custody of the kids. After she asked me to get them from school I asked her when was she ever going to find time to be a parent. I will read up on sole physical custody AND joint legal custody.

 

Her dad called and asked if we were still on for Golden corral tomorrow. I asked if that was a good idea? He said sure! He said his daughter would be there too!!!! WTF!!!!!!! He said she may sit at the other end of the table but we will not talk about anything that's going on. I said I'll be there. What sucks about that is when we get together my W says she will buy and asks me for my credit card...been there done that.

 

W also explained that she never had on EA or PA ever!!! I told her her vagueness about her schedule and disappearance for 3 hours at lunch and her phone always being turned off warranted my snooping. Whether its true or not you did not communicate nor reassure that those things were not going on and the most suspect was you were not cutting back on her 55-60 hour work week and weekends too to even engage the family let alone have a single conversation on the subject.

 

What is going on!!!!?????

[Chuck66]

What kind of roadblocks. She thinks I am filing D papers on Friday and I let it slip that is just info gathering for him to start D paperwork... I can always say he can file by the end of the day!!

[hopesndreams]

That's strange. I thought she was hightailing it home. Perhaps someone came to her rescue, she seems to have all the answers now and knows for certain what she wants and how to go about it getting it.

 

Don't back down now. Follow through. And, quit being so obliging. It doesn't score you any brownie points.

[Chuck66]

Talked to her on the phone. She doesn't want me to have primary custody because she says I can force her to pay child support any time I am mad at her. She said this all got started when I was wrongfully accused of sexual harassment in Japan. She said she was the ONLY one who supported me and after 2 years of appeals the Secretary of The Air Force said I did not commit sexual harassment. She said the reason for the charge has always bothered her like I was some big shot that could get away with anything. I said I didn't do anything. She said I was acting like a big shot anyway. She was sick of me typing on the computer night after night to appeal at different levels. She just wanted it to be over with. Then our 6 year old son was having anger issues and was hitting teachers. He was expelled form a daycare and suspended from kindergarten...She said she started focusing on herself more and less on the family. It grew until there was nothing left for us. She increased her work hours. She started buying clothes. She stil says their is no OM and there is nothing I can say or do to convince you. I want to buy a house but you moved all the money except $6k from my account. I said it was a joint account and I started a new acct with the exact same amount. But the large investment's are all in your name she said. So she is going to fight for the kids...and probably the money too. She didn't have an answer why she has not been affection/or very intimate all those years before these issues....

[hopesndreams]

Those that leave their marriages are cowards. When the going gets tough, the tough get going. You've done all you can. In your case, you may never 100% know if she was cheating unless she admitted to such. That's the proof that you are looking for. What she says. How can you tell if a cheater is lying? Their lips move.

 

Her actions say different. So many marriages end with the admittance of an A and many more marriages end without it. Once the D ball is rolling, OM will come out of the woodwork and there you will have your answer.

 

If you want to believe she is a strong, independent lady fighting for her kids, leaving an H that loves her, to go buy a house with no one by her side, that's your choice. However you want to look at it, she is leaving you.

 

Don't look at it as the end of the world. There is life without her. She's the one that gave up, not you.

[What_Next]

Chuck, I agree with hopesndreams on this one. At this point it really doesn't matter whether or not there is a PA/EA. She is done, she is leaving.

 

You sound like you're hanging in there and keeping it together. Continue to do that.

 

This is classic walk away wife if you ask me.

[Chuck66]

My snitch says she was crying all day at work and looked a mess. Eyes all swollen. She cancelled the lunch with her family and stayed at work. In between arguing how much mowing I did or did not do and the resentment she felt since she was the only one by my side during the sexual harassment case she also re-iterated she did not have an EO or an PA and I said I feel like I want to ask the OM that. She said please do!!! I have never met him...

 

But with all the house plans and not wanting to pay any child support and her wanting "her fair share" does sound like she is already gone.

 

I'll just keep my eyes open here to make sure I am not too far off the line...

[Chuck66]

Not so sure about what I'm doing. Wife says she want's some time and had been looking at apartments online but never been out to one. I respond to this and other reasons with ..."You want some time, my lawyer is drafting D paperwork." Doesn't sound too supportive on my part. Still no proof of OM. We are both experts at NC.

[hopesndreams]

."You want some time, my lawyer is drafting D paperwork."

 

That's all you have left in your arsenal. You've been supportive long enough and it got you no where. Keep that in mind.

[Chuck66]

I'm 20 years military so it's tough to do nothing... patience is not my strong suit. But you did use a military analogy even I can understand. I will defer to the advice of those that have gone before me.

 

Thanks.

[vestigalvirgin]

Chuck:

 

First, thank you for your service to our country.

 

Second, you seem to be handling a tough situation rather well so far. Don't do anything crazy. Definitely don't try and open anyone's doors with that key, you could get in trouble and it could hurt you in the divorce.

 

Third, pretty astounding that your wife's only concern expressed re: who gets custody is the issue of whether she would have to pay you child support, NOT that she wanted primary custody because she actually cared about the children. But typical I would imagine.

 

Fourth, many many red flags that she's in not just an EA, but a PA as well.

 

You mentioned in one of your posts that she's been "trimming." I assume this means her private parts. That's a 100% certainty that she's "trimming" for someone else's view, the OM.

 

Now as to who it is. Well it may or may NOT be the "obvious" guy, her manager. Remember, she works at a truck stop/bar. The OM could be ANYONE--for example some other employee who works at the bar. It's just a walk down the hall, after all.

 

It sounds like you've tried your best, now you have to do what you can to protect yourself and your children legally. Lawyer up.

[Chuck66]

You are welcome.

 

Too late on the key. I tried it and it didn't fit.

 

Yes, private parts.

 

My snitch works in her outer office so it would be tough for another employee but nothing is impossible. If it ain't guitar guy then its no one. Playing all those GD Bob Dylan songs around the house on the guitar I bought her I'm going to puke. She wants me to ask the OM in person since I wont believe her. The OM still has the scary biker chick GF that works at the bar every night. I still don't know whats going on with all that. I do know that someone unhappy should have spoke up and not wait to say I need space. She never did tell me about apartment hunting, I just happened to find that on her computer.

 

She has been using a different tact this week. She still does NC toward me like a champ. We still sleep in the same bed for heaven's sake. But now she has engaged so much with the kids you'd think she was up for mom of the year. For months she wouldn't even read them a story. Now its kid games with both of them for over an hour each night. Is this to get her in goo at the custody hearing? The kids go to summer school. I am not working. Should I take them out of summer school on the pretest of saving money (it would save $185 per week) and watch them all day until school starts. That way I am truly a SAHD (Stay at home dad) and not just some Air Force retiree collecting $3k and not watching my own kids?

 

Still not why she wants me to speak to possible OM? I've always been able to read people so I could tell if there was something there but maybe not. My Spidey senses my be masked with all that I have been through.

 

Chuck

[hopesndreams]

Set up the couch for her to sleep on. Nothing worse than laying next to someone you no longer know. If she refuses to sleep on the couch, then you are married to one very cruel woman. The sooner you get her out of your bed and the house, the better, for you. You need to strengthen up and detach from her. Now. It's time to make her very uncomfortable. You need to follow the 180 to a tee. By doing so, it will help you tremendously when she leaves, for good. You need to be the one in power in the powerless situation she put you in.

 

Definitely be the SAHD and watch them all day. They are going to need a constant, good influence in their lives during this difficult time.

 

A cheaters mind is a dark and dangerous place. I do believe she is protecting someone. Perhaps he is married with kiddies of his own OR it could be Guitar Dude with the scary gf. Or, she is just saving face for now and waiting for the right moment, as in being separated and living apart from you, to let him come out and play.

[Chuck66]

Well I did the exact opposite of everything you told me to do, then I read your post.

 

I picked up the kids and instead of heading home I took them to W's work. I brought them inside to see if OM was there. He wasn't. Biker GF was there and in the bar was the big boss who owns everything so I motioned the biker GF out to the hallway. Before I go I see pictures of the OM (I had never seen him before...he's good looking but the pictures are not recent) I said I am speaking with a L tomorrow about my W and it's not all about the rumors with your BF. She said OM told her it wasn't anything and not to get mad like biker GF sid in April.....?????????????????????????? What happened in April I asked. She said the bar was full and my W was in there talking with OM and telling him thanks for teaching her new chords and then gave him a hug before she left. Everyone in the room new biker GF was right there and lots of people saw it. Biker GF said all the way home she let OM have it and said "Who the f**k is she!!!" I told the kids to wait in the hallway and watch the tattoo artist through the window...They did not hear me a biker GF. I waslked the 30 feet in W's office and asked her about the hug she gave the OM in APril. She said she didn't. I went back down to the bar and told biker GF W said it didint happen. Bier GF turns to bartender #2 who says she was there and saw the whole thing and it happened. The kids have migrated to W's office and W sees I'm down the hall at the gar so she locks the kids out in the hallway and tells them to find daddy. I call on her cell and cant her or get hung up on. I knock on her door and she could spit nails. She did not like e in the bar. I said biker GF and bartender #2 both said you hugged OM in April...she said you are going to believe what you want to believe.

 

I left with kids and we drove straight to OM's house. She said once if you don't believe me ask OM, so that's what I am doing. I pull up in his driveway and leave the kids watching the DVD player. I ring the doorbell and he comes out and is the same guy in the picture but is not good looking. He is scruffy and heavier and 47 years old. I tell him who I am and he says I should have come to him earlier and that lots of stuff have been said about him. He said the boss called him in and asked about it. (They've known each other for 20 years) I asked about the hug in April and he said yes it happened and his old lady gave him sh*t for it all night. He said he taught her a few chords in her office with the door wide open and when she came down to the bar it was the first time and last tie he had ever seen her there. Said she had no idea his GF worked there. I said it was wrong for a married mom of 2 to be hugging onto a guy whether his GF was there or not. He said he was real sorry but there wasn't anything to it and while he was getting quizzed by his boss earlier in the week he almost talked about his over-sized prostate that makes intercourse painful so even if I wanted to I couldn't do anything but I assure you I wouldn't and didn't do that. His demeanor was sincere. He met the kids and shook my hand. Talked about his wife in 2004 getting the MLC and heading out to the bars and bumping into and embarrassing his eldest son. She detached form the marriage so he started dating biker GF. So he knows how it is with the MLC and doesn't wish that on anyone.

 

W was with her parents for a supper to say goodbye to her brother headed out of town. I took the kids home. I left the garage open for her, feed the kids, do the dishes, make a school project with them, and give the TV time. She gets home a few hours later and parks behind my vehicle and doesn ot use the empty garage. I tell her she can pull in. She says she's fine and asks if I need help loading some bookcase that were delivered today. Isay sure if you can lift them. She tries. she cant and says I'll go inside. Before she does she asks while am I so cheerful. I said I'm trying to be more than cordial and telling you that you can park in the garage and help me lad boxes isn't the happiest of conversations.

 

We get upstairs and we talk. She shoots some barbs and and detach and deflect. She said I need to know if you are filing for D tomorrow because I have an appt with a Realtor. I said you should buy a house right now because before the D everything will be marital property. She said I wasn't buy I wam renting and you 've said all week you want me out of the house. I said I was hurt and its easier not seeing you. I said you and I have piled a mountain of crap between us and neither one can see the other. Do you think we can de-escalate things. Do you think we can take baby steps and remove one teaspoon of crap from that mountain that is between us. I know its not much but it sure beats adding to the pile. I said I will even go first and I will not go to you work either unannoucnde or ever withouth being invited by you...she said that would be nice. She couldn't think of one for me and will tell me tomorrow. I asked her how this got changed from I am not happy with myself to I am not sure I want to be married to you? I said how can you say I love you at the end of phone calls and then don't know if you want to be married to me...she said she cant answer that. I told her poor people don't go through this. If you have no food or shelter you don't have time to say, I am really unhappy with who I am and I need to find out who that is, because you are too busy trying to survive or live by finding food/shelter. It's only when all of our needs met that we have the time to wonder what value do I have, or what is my worth, or what is my meaning in this world. We live in a 4k foot house and she has 2 cars and I have one. We have wonderful kids. No one is ever thankful. No one ever shows gratitude for the things we have.

 

I told her the OM who I talked with for 30 minute showed more concern and apologized more for what I was having to go through more than any family member or friend.

 

I told her I do not want her to leave the house. I told her I will speak to my L tomorrow but there will be no D filing tomorrow. I told her her to keep her first IC for next Tues and after a few IC's and then maybe MC then we will see where we stand. I told her I'm stressed. I said I arrived in Missouri at 184 lbs the same day my father died. For the next two years I have whittled away to 164 lbs. With the marriage troubles the last 5 weeks I now weigh 149 lbs. I told her I graduated HS in 1984 weighing 155. I weigh less now than I did in HS...that's crazy!!! I said let's slow things down. Lets de-escalate things. Go to our counsellings and then we will see from there. And since I was already breaking all the detach rules I will break another one and said is it too soon to give a hug goodnight...she said no. I hugged her and said I am staying up and she said goodnight, No love you's either way. Yes it was played all wrong in the 180/detach play book but sometimes you just got to say WTF and talk to the woman you've known all my life.

 

I did tell her OM said they hugged and she said it was a friendly goodbye...I thought you meant I was hugging onto him in some corner somewhere. It was out in the open and it was a quick goodbye, thats all. I didn't know that's what you meant by hugging onto him... I told W it was that moment that the rumors probably got started by those who watched that event. She said, I'm sorry.

 

I also said do you want to be married?. I told her if you don't know if you are committed then you are not committed and if you are not committed to this relationship then I don't want to be in it. She says she doesn't know how to answer that. I told her maybe the IC will help.

 

 

Chuck

Edited July 9, 2010 by Chuck66

[bizenlaw101]

You have to find some strength to hold back all of your emotional feelings, but it might be difficult, especially when you are in her presence, you have to stop expressing your desperation. When your wife says that she wants a divorce, you should keep yourself together, pull your best looking face and stay cool.The best plan of action is to suggest a trial separation. It might work wonders to re-ignite the lost feelings by invoking a situation in which your wife is going to miss you. Don't forget - keep yourself together!

 

 

Heinz

Philadelphia Divorce Lawyer

[vestigalvirgin]

Chuck:

 

Believe what you want to believe. It's tempting.

 

All I can tell you is that 9999 out of 10,000 times, no woman in your wife's situation is doing what she's doing unless there is already another man in the picture.

 

Whether that's the bar dude or not. And cheaters are very very good at gaslighting their victims.

 

Good luck.

[Chuck66]

bizenlaw,

So do you believe there is an OM or does it even matter? I didn't keep it together very well. It feels like she is being coached. The board games with the kids, the spaghetti strapped low cut shirts and high heels have stopped and she is wearing still the new clothes but now on the more conservative side of the closet. She upped the ante with "I need to know what you are going to do because I have an appt with a Realtor". I wasn't expecting nor was I ready for that.

 

Couple of things are bothering me. One was the OM talking about an enlarged prostate making f**king "damn near" impossible. Two things about that. 1) I told W that and she said, "Well there ya' go" like that was proof nothing was happening between them when you can do lots of other things with each other too. And 2) Whenever someone lies they like to give lots of extra details...I felt like this COULD be one of those moments. They have so many people watching them. My snitch at her work, her boss, his biker GF. I know I know you cant watch someone 24/7 whitish brings me to another interesting thing she said earlier in the week.

 

"Are you having me followed and are you tracking my car with GPS?" And I told her no. Now I kind of want to do something because if your not doing anything wrong wy would you have to ask those questions.

 

Why the preoccupation with the OM with me. I look at my bet friend for 21 years and I look at my twin 6 year old children and can not believe it has come to this. I know I am blind to much of what you are telling me and proof of the OM would make me mad enough to see through my own fog.

 

vestigalvirgin,

Those are not good odds. Other than a DNA swab I can't crack this nut.

 

She hugged me goodbye and asked me what I had on my agenda today and I said I had my morning appt. She knows its with my lawyer and got a little stern look and walked off.

 

I just told her I would not file today...I think the L just wants info to start if thats what I still want to do.

 

Then I will go to Sportsclips get a haircut and go clothes shopping for ME.

 

Chuck

[Chuck66]

I found this on another site. What is your take on LBS never being the one to file D papers? Here is the post.

 

Re: Exposed finally,,limbo land [Re: Optimust]

Allen A

Member

 

Registered: 09/26/07

Posts: 3158

Originally Posted By: Optimust

I’m a bit confused, I told her she needs to move out, and she understands we need to be separated. I don’t think I can serve her D papers, because she would just cave and sign and were done.

I guess I was just trying to tell her that I need my space so she needs to go find whatever she was looking for, the whole, you chose him, therefore you need to leave.

There must be a reason she has backed off the D word.

 

 

You aren't the one to serve D papers, that's got to be HER, YOU will support the marriage, your wife, and your family always... SHE is the one that will end things... you let HER pull the plug if sh'es gonna do it... its a DARE more or less...

 

When an affair starts, there are three different roads your wife is looking at :

 

a. Pursue an open marriage - in secret if possible

b. End the marriage, destroy a family, roll the dice with OM

c. End the affair, rebuild a marriage, and heal a family

 

your wife likes

 

choice a : it's simple, convenient, and causes HER the LEAST amount of inconvenience - its also incredibly addictive

 

choice b : This is a pesky one, particularly if OM is married too. It isn't a pretty option for her at all...

 

choice c : This is about equal to b. She LIKES her affair, her fantasy world, she does NOT wan to give that up any more than she wants to give up her marriage

 

When you EXPOSE an affair, you are RESTRICTING access or CUTTING OFF access to choice a... You are basically ripping it out of her hands and this FORCES her to choose b or c

 

You push her to do b AND c by

 

1. pressing her to leave the kids and the family home and find her own place to stay if she insists on acting out like a 17 year old child

2. pressing her to explore rebuilding a marriage with a professional therapist by GOING to one yoruself alone to set an example and by improving your desirability (MWD calls this getting a life)

 

You basically are forcing her to accept CHANGE of type b or type c... she is going to CLING to option a for as LONG as you will LET HER...

 

Exposure cuts her off of that route, particularly if you can get a lot of family support who tell her they will NEVER allow OM as part of their social circle and that they don't want to hear anything about OM... Go home and rebuild your marriage is the mantra you want friends and family to offer if they can and are willing (if they support OM ignore those people, you will learn who your friends are during this crisis I promise you that)

 

Whenever you approach your wife about her choices you NEVER present it as :

 

Choose me

Choose OM

 

NEVER NEVER NEVER DO THAT

 

The LONG TERM choices she has available are

 

Rebuild a marriage

Destroy a marriage

 

The long term success rate of affair couples is less than ONE PERCENT... they NEVER PAN OUT LONG TERM... when you press her its for LONG TERM OUTCOMES.. you BOTH want to make the right LONG term choices right?

 

Then Educate her on what they are :

 

Rebuild a marriage

Destroy a marriage

 

The OM will NOT be around in ten years, I can 99% guarantee that... Your wife has a simple but painful choice to make and you need to present that choice in that way... NEVER present it as her choosing one man over another, you will LOSE that choice

 

The choices she has available are

 

Rebuild a marriage

Destroy a marriage and destroy family (toss that in, its a biggie)

 

 

Edited by Allen A (06/07/10 06:48 PM)

[imagine]

Please read the articles at marriage builders.com.

 

These may give you a better insight into her and yourself. Improve your situation by looking and being better. She is confused now, increase her fog by being attractive.

[Chuck66]

I like that advice. Then no matter what I am still a better person... Focusing more on myself mat reduce my obsessing about my sitch.

 

Chuck