Think about what you are doing....

[jwi71]

Well I can tell you your post is completely wrong about me and the situation. I never wanted to 'win' as you so kindly put it. It was never a game to me.

 

No, I'm not wrong. Your previous posts are filled with "leave her for me". You certainly did want him to leave her and his son for you. At least be honest with yourself if no one else.

 

And no, its not a game.

 

Stop being defensive.

 

It's so easy for people to judge OW harshly. Some people make mistakes you know, big ones. I'm not denying that I am part of the mistake because I certainly was.

I'm sorry, but I see no one judging you CL. Again, more defensive screens.

And lets face it, two plus year A is NOT a mistake. Mistake is label attached to a course of actions which do not turn out as intended. As I alluded to earlier, you would posting a very different message had you "won" him. Yet, because he did not "end up with you" its suddenly a mistake. Owning your half of the A is also OWNING your consequences.

 

You can't half-jump which is what you are trying to do.

 

In essence, it sounds like you are trying to say "I did choose an A but I'm not responsible for the outcome". That is what I am reacting to.

 

And just for the record BNB posted on one of my threads over a year ago after I spoke about his abuse towards me and she stated 'get away from this monster'. I'm not asking you to see the abuse, but I SAW and FELT it and couldn't understand why I couldn't pull away from it.

You replied to bittersweet that he was physically abusive - which is news to me. You also indicate you didn't tell anyone. Now, lets be fair, if you withhold pertinent information how do you expect to get good advice? How can I comment on something I do not know?

 

In your initial update so to speak...you conveniently left the physical abuse out. So what I saw was an OW upset over being lied to. Over be played. Sorry...being lied to doesn't make you a victim. Be played doens't make you a victim.

 

Being physically assaulted MAKES you a victim. No doubt. NO ONE DESERVES THAT.

 

So don't retort I didn't see or feel it when YOU fail to mention it.

 

Sorry, but that really irks me.

 

A lot of women in abusive R find it hard to leave. Obviously I was one of them. Especially women with low self esteem. How hard would it be for them to leave? That's all I was trying to say...

CL...I'm glad you are in therapy. To help heal your wounds from the physical abuse...to help reclaim that once strong, intelligent woman you were (and can be again). And, in my world, part of that is OWNING the consequences as well. I'm not talking about the physical abuse...I'm talking about coming to grips with the lies and deception and gaslighting.

 

And why you ignored all the red flags.

 

I'm not attacking you. Just giving you what I think you need to do.

 

Hey, I was the BH in my situation. I had to do it too. It sux. I know.

 

But, hold your head up high, face yourself, face your demons and you will, some day soon, realize that YOU feed them and keep them alive. And when you reach that point, its like Atlas sets down the world. That's the day you reclaim your life.

[Brokenlady]

Jwi71,

With all due respect- why must we play devil's advocate here? She says he's abusive, so why not just take her word for it? Must she "prove" everything when she's here for support? And whether it's "true" or not doesn't make all that much difference if she believes it to be true with all the emotions involved.....

 

I think she's accepted that she has responsibility for the A and it's consequences. It is reasonable to expect that she would not be "chosen", however, it's not as if he just told her he's going back to his W - he systematically gaslighted her, smoke and mirrors. To me, that could not have been anticipated, and i don't think it's fair to judge for for not forseeing that anymore than it would be fair to say she should have known he'd slap her.

[White Flower]

I actually accept full responsibility for my actions in getting involved in the A.... if you read my thread properly, you will see that I said I am 'unwell' too. Not just because of him but because of myself...my past threads also state this as well.

 

I know how wrong I was... I am not denying that, but the very fact is this man was also abusive, physically and emotionally. I don't know how I got so caught up in it and yes I get angry at myself that I did put myself in this position.

 

All I was trying to say in my post was what happened and to help OW see that they need to take care of themselves first.

 

But I guess attacking an OW for some of you is just that easy.

I won't attack you.

 

I know what you mean about ignoring clues. I'm glad you learned from all of this but I'm so sorry you had the extra joy (being sarcastic) of ending up with a narcissist. I left one for a MM who ended up being a serial cheater:laugh:, lucky me!

 

I won't bother you with a long and boring update, but MM is in counseling so at least I had one positive influence on him.

 

My heart goes out to you and I wish you best of luck in future endeavors.

 

((((crystal_lostheart))))

[crystal_lostheart]

No, I'm not wrong. Your previous posts are filled with "leave her for me". You certainly did want him to leave her and his son for you. At least be honest with yourself if no one else.

 

And no, its not a game.

 

Stop being defensive.

 

I'm sorry, but I see no one judging you CL. Again, more defensive screens.

And lets face it, two plus year A is NOT a mistake. Mistake is label attached to a course of actions which do not turn out as intended. As I alluded to earlier, you would posting a very different message had you "won" him. Yet, because he did not "end up with you" its suddenly a mistake. Owning your half of the A is also OWNING your consequences.

 

You can't half-jump which is what you are trying to do.

 

In essence, it sounds like you are trying to say "I did choose an A but I'm not responsible for the outcome". That is what I am reacting to.

 

You replied to bittersweet that he was physically abusive - which is news to me. You also indicate you didn't tell anyone. Now, lets be fair, if you withhold pertinent information how do you expect to get good advice? How can I comment on something I do not know?

 

In your initial update so to speak...you conveniently left the physical abuse out. So what I saw was an OW upset over being lied to. Over be played. Sorry...being lied to doesn't make you a victim. Be played doens't make you a victim.

 

Being physically assaulted MAKES you a victim. No doubt. NO ONE DESERVES THAT.

 

So don't retort I didn't see or feel it when YOU fail to mention it.

 

Sorry, but that really irks me.

 

CL...I'm glad you are in therapy. To help heal your wounds from the physical abuse...to help reclaim that once strong, intelligent woman you were (and can be again). And, in my world, part of that is OWNING the consequences as well. I'm not talking about the physical abuse...I'm talking about coming to grips with the lies and deception and gaslighting.

 

And why you ignored all the red flags.

 

I'm not attacking you. Just giving you what I think you need to do.

 

Hey, I was the BH in my situation. I had to do it too. It sux. I know.

 

But, hold your head up high, face yourself, face your demons and you will, some day soon, realize that YOU feed them and keep them alive. And when you reach that point, its like Atlas sets down the world. That's the day you reclaim your life.

 

I do agree with some of the things you are saying and thank you for the advice. However some points definitely not. You have to remember that YOU don't know ME. I wish I could write every incident that happened over the 2 years, all the things he said, all the stupid things I said. But it's just not that easy is it? So I guess you can only judge on the small parts you read... and that's fair enough. However, I will naturally defend myself when things are being said that are not correct. Wouldn't you?

 

Yes I know an A is wrong.... and I WALKED away many times because it was so very wrong. What upset me was that I never understood WHY I kept going back because he would let me believe again and again, it would work. And yes I know that I 'chose' to. But please who would really 'choose' to be in a terrible position like that? Why do other OW/OM stay when the outcome is mostly bleak? It's much deeper than 'well you chose to?'. Because if it were that simple, we would all just 'walk away' to solve it. That's what I am trying to understand about MYSELF now. And that's why I am in therapy. Co dependent behavior, low self esteem, stupidity, selfishness. Whatever it is, I am owning it and trying to move on with my life.

[crystal_lostheart]

Wow Crystal. Now I am even doubly glad that you are away from this man. He is unashamedly abusive and just an all around awful person. I'm so sorry that this happened to you. What a terribly painful lesson, please take care of you, you will be happier than ever away from this man.

 

Thanks again BL. A lot of this was my fault. I lowered my standards so much I was willing to try and 'help' this person because I kept believing he was going to be 'ok' and it would work out.

 

Hard lesson. You can't help anyone if you can't even help yourself and you are damaged yourself.

[fooled once]

I actually accept full responsibility for my actions in getting involved in the A.... if you read my thread properly, you will see that I said I am 'unwell' too. Not just because of him but because of myself...my past threads also state this as well.

 

I know how wrong I was... I am not denying that, but the very fact is this man was also abusive, physically and emotionally. I don't know how I got so caught up in it and yes I get angry at myself that I did put myself in this position.

 

All I was trying to say in my post was what happened and to help OW see that they need to take care of themselves first.

 

But I guess attacking an OW for some of you is just that easy.

 

CL **hug**

 

I want you to be angry at yourself for allowing yourself to be abused PHYSICALLY. ((hug)) Many of us don't realize the mental abuse until we are away from it, but we all recognize physical abuse. I admit to not running the first time my ex hit me, I used all the same excuses many people use "he didn't meant it", "he was drunk", "he was stressed", etc.

 

**hug**

 

But I will agree with BNB that many people (not saying YOU) throw around diagnosis all the time. The only person who can make an accurate diagnosis on another person is a trained professional. The MM you had an affair with probably DID have a lot of traits of a Narcassist.

 

I am just glad you are away from him -- because of the physical abuse.

 

YOU WILL get better! YOU WILL!! You are getting stronger each day!

[crystal_lostheart]

CL **hug**

 

I want you to be angry at yourself for allowing yourself to be abused PHYSICALLY. ((hug)) Many of us don't realize the mental abuse until we are away from it, but we all recognize physical abuse. I admit to not running the first time my ex hit me, I used all the same excuses many people use "he didn't meant it", "he was drunk", "he was stressed", etc.

 

**hug**

 

But I will agree with BNB that many people (not saying YOU) throw around diagnosis all the time. The only person who can make an accurate diagnosis on another person is a trained professional. The MM you had an affair with probably DID have a lot of traits of a Narcassist.

 

I am just glad you are away from him -- because of the physical abuse.

 

YOU WILL get better! YOU WILL!! You are getting stronger each day!

 

Thank you SO much. Really appreciate your words. It has made me feel just that bit better today

[crystal_lostheart]

I won't attack you.

 

I know what you mean about ignoring clues. I'm glad you learned from all of this but I'm so sorry you had the extra joy (being sarcastic) of ending up with a narcissist. I left one for a MM who ended up being a serial cheater:laugh:, lucky me!

 

I won't bother you with a long and boring update, but MM is in counseling so at least I had one positive influence on him.

 

My heart goes out to you and I wish you best of luck in future endeavors.

 

((((crystal_lostheart))))

 

I hope it all works out for the best... for yourself first of course.