MM filed, served papers and moved out

[howcouldInotknow]

But I find the irony too, in that if she wasn't "chosen" hell hath no fury.... as evidenced by the "rage if not chosen" thread. I've learned that OW seem to hold a "toddler's creed" in that it's however they see things and those views may be fluid i.e. he's a great guy since he chose the OW vs he's scum that will continue to cheat if he didn't choose her. Seriously?

 

 

 

Now this is a very general statement. I am a former OW and you know what I didn't think he was scum then and I don't think he is scum now. Granted I was not an OW in the typical terms of what an OW usually is but you know what I was not the person he chose in the end and if she is who makes him happy he made the right choice and I am okay with that. No rage, no hatred, no bitterness, no anger at not being the one that was chosen. He was a nice guy then and he is a nice guy now. The way things ended has not changed my opinion of him

[SerenityX2]

Now this is a very general statement. I am a former OW and you know what I didn't think he was scum then and I don't think he is scum now. Granted I was not an OW in the typical terms of what an OW usually is but you know what I was not the person he chose in the end and if she is who makes him happy he made the right choice and I am okay with that. No rage, no hatred, no bitterness, no anger at not being the one that was chosen. He was a nice guy then and he is a nice guy now. The way things ended has not changed my opinion of him

 

I think it's a huge differentiation between you (and other posters I know of) thinking you are dating a seperated man vs knowing that they are married, albeit supposedly unhappy.

 

I can not imagine how much that must have hurt as I've been damn lucky in that I always had a criteria that anyone that I dated had to be 1+ years post D and even some of those still had issues or wanted me to be insta-mom, however that was my personal choice.

 

I understand that for some, a shorter time frame would work for them, just as many will say that you should never marry someone without years of dating, since I defy that I get that there are no hard and fast rules as long as there are no red flags.

 

You sound like you are v. level headed, unfortunately I have seen quite a few posters to the contrary, so your wish for him to be with whomever is rare. I do usually try to qualify statments with "many or some" and I didn't with that, so you are right and I do apologize.

 

I hope that life has even better things for you.

[howcouldInotknow]

I think it's a huge differentiation between you (and other posters I know of) thinking you are dating a seperated man vs knowing that they are married, albeit supposedly unhappy.

 

I can not imagine how much that must have hurt as I've been damn lucky in that I always had a criteria that anyone that I dated had to be 1+ years post D and even some of those still had issues or wanted me to be insta-mom, however that was my personal choice.

 

I understand that for some, a shorter time frame would work for them, just as many will say that you should never marry someone without years of dating, since I defy that I get that there are no hard and fast rules as long as there are no red flags.

 

You sound like you are v. level headed, unfortunately I have seen quite a few posters to the contrary, so your wish for him to be with whomever is rare. I do usually try to qualify statments with "many or some" and I didn't with that, so you are right and I do apologize.

 

I hope that life has even better things for you.

 

 

Thank you. Life throws people curve balls every now and then. I just think in general here at LS people should try not to be so harsh.

[SerenityX2]

Serenity - you are right about one thing - all of the negative posts don't sink in.

 

Honestly, I only posted this update under the encouragement from some I was PM-ing with. Otherwise, I knew it would end up like this - just a lot of nasty comments from some very unhappy women. I get that, I really do. Which is why the posts are ignored entirely.

 

My guy and I are grown adults, and fully aware of what we are doing. Negative reinforcement from online strangers doesn't crack our veneer, nor does it make either of us pause. We are doing really well, and will continue to do so.

 

Remember folks, all relationships are risky, and every one of us has issues to manage and deal with. And ultimately, opinions are like azzholes - everyones got one. So for now, he and I will carry on with our very happy life together, and advise each other when issues arise, or, seek counsel of our friends or trained professionals.

 

Until then, feel free to post away with negativity on the thread. I wont be checking it again, as there is no point in reading venom that is based on someones own unhappiness or agenda. I will still read the PM's from those who have something valid and worthy to say - OW and BS's alike.

 

Ill update when we set the wedding date. :love:

 

Well, I see you've just proven my point. BTW I think Trimmer is a guy.

 

You couldn't be more off the mark with the unhappiness comment and ALL r'ships are risky?

 

LMAO nope, not my marriage one of the big reasons I married him:love: sorry you feel that way. but I understand why you would but please don't assume ALL do....oh, I know you're not reading anymore.

[jennie-jennie]

I was coming at it from the perspective of what other OW's might want to consider about their own relationships, especially if they've been an OW for years and are still waiting around for MM to do something. Waiting around indefinitely is not the answer.

 

Do you think someone you've known a few months loves you? You were his way out of a sh*tty marriage.

Real love does not grow in a short 5 months. It takes years.

 

So on one hand we OW shouldn't wait around for years, on the other hand we shouldn't expect a man to love us after only months. It seems we are damned if we do, and damned if we don't.

 

Which I am sure there are many BSs out there who would only be so glad to agree with.

[Trimmer]

I do think using the term "fairy tale" is somewhat mocking of the OP, so I actually do not think that is a word we all should use.

I apologize, I thought that the OP had used it herself, but I see that it was another poster. I will note that this was a decidedly non-mocking tone, though:

 

...I felt like reading a fairy tale when I read your post, only that it is real, which makes it so much better.

 

Congrats and all the best!

Anyway, I should have dialed that back.

 

Well, I see you've just proven my point. BTW I think Trimmer is a guy.

I think so too. Lemme check - I'll get back to you.

 

So on one hand we OW shouldn't wait around for years, on the other hand we shouldn't expect a man to love us after only months.

Actually, that's advice I would give to anyone in an evolving a long-term relationship, wouldn't you? But to add to it, the most important part of my point is that I would want to see what and who a partner is when he is standing on his own, as an individual (i.e. the beginnings of a non-affair-based relationship), to get some idea of who he might be as a partner. (And reverse it to "she" for a woman - works both ways...)

 

So yes, I do agree with your advice, with the added question: "Who are you, when you are not escaping a bad marriage, involved in an affair, using me as an excuse, etc..."

[norajane]

So on one hand we OW shouldn't wait around for years, on the other hand we shouldn't expect a man to love us after only months. It seems we are damned if we do, and damned if we don't.

 

Pretty much. That's the nature of affairs, though, isn't it? Starting a relationship as an OW/OM almost inevitably puts you in an untenable position.

[complicatedlife]

You couldn't be more off the mark with the unhappiness comment and ALL r'ships are risky?

 

Yes, even marriage - relationships, no matter the nature, whether long term, co-habitating, common law, or even marriage, comes with a guarantee, so yes, it is quite rational and logical to think that there is SOME risk.

[complicatedlife]

5 months really isn't a long time to know someone. I was friends with my fMM before he became separated, before he went back home and we embarked on an affair, and I STILL did not know him nearly as well as I do now, 3 years later. I am not saying that it's impossible to feel love in 5 months - just rare, and pretty much not the norm.

 

Good advice was given here, but I'd like to expand on some of the advice:

 

1. His daughter - as a woman who loves my fMM/current BF, I encourage him to have a relationship with his children at all times. That comes BEFORE our relationship, and I think that any woman or man who does otherwise should do some self-reflecting as in my opinion, to NOT advocate for their relationship is borderline selfish...and hasn't there been enough of that in an OW/OM situation?

 

2. Do not make party plans or wedding plans yet....you have NO IDEA what things are about to be like. You thought the affair was rough? You ain't seen nothin' like some divorcin' folk! I have lived through an affair and now a divorce - the emotions, the changes, the hot and cold, the back and forth, the "but why am I suffering - I am NOT her - I didn't do any of that to you!" Let me tell you - it's not easy. But sacrifice, compromise, patience, understanding, supportive family and friends, love, and last but certainly not least - PRAYER - if you believe in a higher being...can possibly get you through it. Some situations like this can be easy, but most are not. Please keep that in mind.

[RedDevil66]

Nope, Trimmer you're not, but once again you'll have the 2 camps that will form, those that will cheer this on and say that those who don't are bitter:rolleyes: And those that can see the red flags and many of those people will remain silent, as from past posts the OP does not want to hear anything other than validation.

 

But I find the irony too, in that if she wasn't "chosen" hell hath no fury.... as evidenced by the "rage if not chosen" thread. I've learned that OW seem to hold a "toddler's creed" in that it's however they see things and those views may be fluid i.e. he's a great guy since he chose the OW vs he's scum that will continue to cheat if he didn't choose her. Seriously?

 

So even if you had 20 or so people respond that she should be careful at the least hard times lie ahead, those people will be written off as bitter BS's when some of us don't fall into either "camp". All I need to see is the posters that are aligned with her victory and those that see the flags... that says it all.

 

But since you asked a specific question, thought I'd answer, no you're not alone.

 

 

An excellent post and words so true.

[RedDevil66]

So on one hand we OW shouldn't wait around for years, on the other hand we shouldn't expect a man to love us after only months. It seems we are damned if we do, and damned if we don't.

 

Which I am sure there are many BSs out there who would only be so glad to agree with.

 

I cringe when you women call yourselves OW. Let's call it what it is cheaters

 

No, what cheaters need to do is not wait around for years, but gain some self esteem and respect and go look for a healthy relationship.

Not pining over some other woman's husband.

 

Cheating is a sickness folks, just an FYI! ugh!

[RedDevil66]

Otherwise, I knew it would end up like this - just a lot of nasty comments from some very unhappy women. :

 

Let me ask you, though I am sure you will avoid this question, what makes you think the people going against you are unhappy?

 

Are you happy?

[Impudent Oyster]

So on one hand we OW shouldn't wait around for years, on the other hand we shouldn't expect a man to love us after only months. It seems we are damned if we do, and damned if we don't.

 

.

 

Exactly. I think you've got it!

 

Bottom line, if you don't want to be damned, stay away from married men.

[jennie-jennie]

I cringe when you women call yourselves OW. Let's call it what it is cheaters

 

I have asked you before, but you did not answer. Who am I cheating on? I have not promised anyone anything.

[jennie-jennie]

good god!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

You still have no answer to that question. Well, then let's stick to OW. If you have any problem with that term, I think you should write in to LS' administration and ask them to rename this section of the forum. Apparently they are good with the term OW.

[RedDevil66]

You still have no answer to that question. Well, then let's stick to OW. If you have any problem with that term, I think you should write in to LS' administration and ask them to rename this section of the forum. Apparently they are good with the term OW.

 

If I have to answer your silly question for you to get it, then I shall

 

You are cheating his wife by having an affair. His wife is the OW, you're the cheater.

You can call it whatever you want to get through your day, but the bottom line is you're a liar and a cheater. If what you were doing was good, then why is this sick behavior frowned upon and kept so hush hush.

I'll tell you why, CAUSE IT IS WRONG!!!!!!!!

 

You see, there are two types of cheaters, ones who live with regret and admit they are weak and the ones who will never heal because they live in the deepest denial, you can pick the one you think you are!

[fooled once]

I will say I am very happily married

 

I am also a step parent.

 

And a 15 year old girl whose father has dumped the family she has known is going to make life heck for the woman dad was cheating on mom with.

 

15 year old girls are HARD anyway. VERY HARD. Throw in a father who doesn't want custody, a father who immediately moved in with his affair partner, a father whose main concern seems to be his affair partner and life is going to be tough.

 

I agree with the poster who said it wasn't the girl's job to contact dad. That is the ADULTS job. HE is the one who is responsible for his relationship with her. And let's hope the affair partner doesn't stand in the way of the father-daughter relationship. I have seen it happen MANY times.

 

Dad should be spending quality time with his daughter, not fitting her in. Dad should have a place where just THEY can be together, without the affair partner standing over them. Daughter should have her own space in dad's house. Daughter should have access to dad whenever she wants it.

 

I watched my son, who was 6 when me and his father split, have many issues over dad's new girlfriend (no, my ex wasn't cheating on me during our marriage). Dad had a new girlfriend a couple months after he moved out. Every time he came over to see our son, he brought the new girlfriend. Nice girl, but my son wanted to spend time with his dad - not his dad and the new girlfriend. DS didn't spend the night at dad's house for the 1st year after the split - because dad was too busy with the girlfriend to spend time with his son. My 6 year old use to ask me "why can't it be me and dad, why does Stephanie always have to be there". I had no answer for him.

 

I have an 18 year old stepdaughter. We have had some major hills and valleys over the 12 years I have been in her life. 15 is a TOUGH age, as is 16 and 17. TOUGH ages. I can't image how she would have reacted to me had I been the reason her parents split up. I can't image how she would have reacted to me had her father put me above her. And this is how 15 year old girls are. I don't foresee warm and fuzzy times between the daughter and the new girlfriend.

[jennie-jennie]

If I have to answer your silly question for you to get it, then I shall

 

You are cheating his wife by having an affair. His wife is the OW, you're the cheater.

You can call it whatever you want to get through your day, but the bottom line is you're a liar and a cheater. If what you were doing was good, then why is this sick behavior frowned upon and kept so hush hush.

I'll tell you why, CAUSE IT IS WRONG!!!!!!!!

 

You see, there are two types of cheaters, ones who live with regret and admit they are weak and the ones who will never heal because they live in the deepest denial, you can pick the one you think you are!

 

I am from a different culture and country than you are. All my friends and many of my relatives know of my relationship. None of them are frowning at it. What they think is wrong is that my MM is not leaving his marriage when he obviously loves me.

 

I don't lie and I don't cheat. My MM unfortunately does both. I wish he would not.

 

My MM used to cheat on me as well and have sex with his wife. He has stopped that now. I can agree with you that in that sense the wife is the other woman, since his primary love interest is me.

 

You see, my moral code is love, not marriage, and because of that I am unapologetic because I have not done anything wrong according to my moral code.

[jennie-jennie]

Personally, I agree with you.

 

Jennie Jennie, don't you see that your actions are hurting someone else. it doesn't matter if he loves you, doesn't love her- right now, that is irrelevant. He is married to her. he made a commitment to her. And while it is true that you made no such commitment to her, you are a human being, and purposefully, and with full knowledge, undertaking a course of action that is hurting someone else. This just doesn't seem right. maybe , even if he doesn't 'love her"( and you don't know that- maybe he's lying to you, he doesn't seem to have any problem lying. maybe he's telling his wife that he really loves HER), she still loves him. and the deception and lying is hurting her- how can you say that's acceptable? If you don't think it's acceptable, then how can you be a party to it, or encourage others to be a party to it? I just don't understand.

 

If this man is truly your "soul mate', then isn't it "agony" for him not to be with you? If so, why is he still with his wife? could it be that he really does love her every bit as much as he loves you? remember, he's lying to his wife- what makes you think you are any different? he may very well have said the same words to her that he says to you. I know you think he doesn't, but he very well could be. What if he meets another woman and says the same thing to her while he's with you and his wife? ( oh, but i forgot, his feelings for you are the only "genuine' ones he has, everything else "isn't real').

I know that you seem to feel that anyone who doesn't agree with you feels that way because they are 'bitter", but I figure they feel that way more because they are able to feel empathy towards another human being who is being hurt but something she/he has no say over at all

 

 

 

John Stuart Mill once put forth the idea that while we all have the right to be happier, we don't have the right to cause harm to someone else in order to get that happiness.

 

I am encouraging him to make a choice between the two women in his life. That is all that is within my power to do.

[norajane]

Who am I cheating on? I have not promised anyone anything.

 

Yourself. You are cheating yourself.

 

You are cheating yourself out of the kind of relationship you could be having, and out of time that you'll never get back while you wait for some guy to do nothing about leaving his wife.

 

You are cheating yourself out of the dreams you used to have. I'm sure you didn't dream of a part-time relationship with a man who is married and has a whole other life with someone. Why are you settling for that? Why would you cheat yourself out of what you've always wanted?

[jennie-jennie]

Yourself. You are cheating yourself.

 

You are cheating yourself out of the kind of relationship you could be having, and out of time that you'll never get back while you wait for some guy to do nothing about leaving his wife.

 

You are cheating yourself out of the dreams you used to have. I'm sure you didn't dream of a part-time relationship with a man who is married and has a whole other life with someone. Why are you settling for that? Why would you cheat yourself out of what you've always wanted?

 

I am having the best relationship I ever had with the man of my heart. I am enjoying every day of it. Happy Other Woman - have you heard that term?

[jennie-jennie]

that's a lie. You have the power to say " either be with her or me, but not both" and then walk away and stay away until his mind is made up, and he either leaves her for good or stays with her for good. But you aren't doing that. ypu've knowingly put yourself in this situation, and then refuse to accept any responsibility for it.

 

It is obvious you have not tried NC from a man you love and who loves you. I have, so I know it is impossible for me to walk away. That option does not exist for me, and that is a fact, not an opinion.

[RedDevil66]

I am from a different culture and country than you are. All my friends and many of my relatives know of my relationship. None of them are frowning at it. What they think is wrong is that my MM is not leaving his marriage when he obviously loves me.

 

I don't lie and I don't cheat. My MM unfortunately does both. I wish he would not.

 

My MM used to cheat on me as well and have sex with his wife. He has stopped that now. I can agree with you that in that sense the wife is the other woman, since his primary love interest is me.

 

You see, my moral code is love, not marriage, and because of that I am unapologetic because I have not done anything wrong according to my moral code.

 

Whatever gets you through the day

[jennie-jennie]

Whatever gets you through the day

 

The thing is if you had been born and raised in my country, you might think like me.

[RedDevil66]

Frozen, save your energy, only once the fallen break do they listen to reason.

For now all you sound like to them is Charlie Brown's parents "waa waa waaa waaaa"

 

They don't get it. They are lost souls in a sea of their own pain!