Snowflower Posted April 13, 2009 Posted April 13, 2009 Well, I found the thread very helpful in dealing with my own situation. So kansas, something good came out of posting your question here! Yes, people make mistakes, bad decisions, screw up badly every day in their marriages, their finances and their lives. It doesn't mean that things won't get better as time goes on. All any of us can do is learn and move o. I agree that a lot of projection happens on forums like these, too-where people use their own experiences and perceptions to project/predict what will happens to others that are in a similar, but not the same situation. Most people here do try to help but sometimes it is hard to look past your own experiences and assume that everyone here will feel/react the same way. Hence, you get posts that say something a long the line of, "your husband will never get over it--it will hurt him until his dying day." Well, no one, except your husband, knows that for sure. It has been just under 5 months since d-day for me and according to some I should just be a bundle of raw emotions still. And yes, I still have rough days but my marriage is better than it ever has been. So, I don't think that 2-5 year time frame will apply to me. It is my plan that in 2 years this whole painful episode will be a distant memory and my husband and I will be continuing to enjoy our new marriage. I'm glad your marriage was one of the success stories, too.
Dexter Morgan Posted April 13, 2009 Posted April 13, 2009 And as I read - there are still some that can't forgive, forget or get past it. You think people can "forget" what a cheater did to them? Forgive, yes, but forget? That is impossible. It WILL come back to haunt the betrayed from time to time no matter how infrequent. Only way to stop the haunting, not the forgetting, is to make the cheater insignificant. As I said earlier, I think about what x-ho did to me once in a blue moon...difference is...if I would have stayed with her, the memories would hurt....now that she is insignificant to me, I laugh at her stupidity.
Snowflower Posted April 13, 2009 Posted April 13, 2009 I don't doubt you Snow, but mentally put yourself in that position, and if, for example, 3 years from now you find out of a quick short one night stand...would you really be done? i'd hope you would be. You don't deserve to have to put up with that. Oh yes, I would definitely be done if there was another ONS on my husband's part or even some type of inappropriate emotional involvement with him and another person. You're right, Dex. I wouldn't deserve that. I didn't even deserve it this time! I guess for me it was one of those risks I had to consider when deciding to give him another chance--if I could "bear it" if he did something like that again. I decided that I could risk it one more time--simply because of the better person he appears to have become. I decided he deserved the benefit of the doubt. And he has come through admirably-far exceeding my expectations and requirements that I placed on him if we were to try again. But I would be done if he messes up again. I absolutely know that and just as importantly, so does he.
Author confusedinkansas Posted April 13, 2009 Author Posted April 13, 2009 You're right Dex...Forgetting probably is not humanly possible. I should have left that word out. But the vividness wears off. It would be like me forgetting some of the dumb stuff my husband has done in the past.....I know I couldn't.
Snowflower Posted April 13, 2009 Posted April 13, 2009 You think people can "forget" what a cheater did to them? Forgive, yes, but forget? That is impossible. It WILL come back to haunt the betrayed from time to time no matter how infrequent. Only way to stop the haunting, not the forgetting, is to make the cheater insignificant. As I said earlier, I think about what x-ho did to me once in a blue moon...difference is...if I would have stayed with her, the memories would hurt....now that she is insignificant to me, I laugh at her stupidity. I get what you are saying here. This is one healthy way to handle the situation-by removing yourself from it and I have no doubt it was the right thing for you to do. And if it was different between my H and me-then yes, I would probably always look at him and think, "how could you do that to me." I would probably really be haunted if my H wasn't showing true contrition and remorse for his actions. If my H just kind of continued in the same way he had before the A (not that he was a bad person-just kind of neglectful, had messed up priorities and took things for granted), then I would have had a much harder time moving forward with him. Like I have said, this whole painful episode really made my H do some serious self-examination and he has turned into a much better person. This is why I think I can look at the positives in our relationship-the renewed sense of love, commitment and honesty and put the painful memories in their rightful place-in the past!
imagine Posted April 13, 2009 Posted April 13, 2009 Confused, There is a whole bunch of guys at the marriagebuiders site who are very, very happy with their "new" marriages to their old partners. Many, many post. There are also a few that are still battling and post on the "in recovery" section.
Reggie Posted April 13, 2009 Posted April 13, 2009 The end result , reconciling or divorcing, is so dependent on the folks involved. Some cheaters show true remorse and will work their asses off to help the BS recover. Some just want to sweep it under the rug and dismiss the BS's pain. Also, some BSs have had past abandonment trauma and this is just too big a betrayl to get past. No one should expect someone with a huge sensitivity to this to be able to get past it. Apparently, for most couples, it is a death blow.
stampdaddy Posted April 13, 2009 Posted April 13, 2009 The end result , reconciling or divorcing, is so dependent on the folks involved. Some cheaters show true remorse and will work their asses off to help the BS recover. Some just want to sweep it under the rug and dismiss the BS's pain. Also, some BSs have had past abandonment trauma and this is just too big a betrayl to get past. No one should expect someone with a huge sensitivity to this to be able to get past it. Apparently, for most couples, it is a death blow. Which, for EITHER reason, is maybe why we havent heard from Confused.... Wonder what is happening with the 'ol gal...?
stampdaddy Posted April 13, 2009 Posted April 13, 2009 wrong confused... I was talking about Confusedmomnb... now me confused. Oy vey
Darth Vader Posted April 13, 2009 Posted April 13, 2009 Well, I think being asked to spend the day rooting around in the bushes to help a man find his balls is a little excessive Actually, this was for the poster of the Thread.
Bluebird In My Heart Posted April 14, 2009 Posted April 14, 2009 I know it "reigned" in my situation, for over 4 years... But now, it just "rains".. H is divorcing her, and I don't think I can get over being the "cake" Wow. I didn't know about this development. Too much has happened, I guess. (?) There's only so much anyone can put a person through, sooner or later there is a breaking point. *hugs and healing to you* ########## ... I had two major surgeries during my XWW's affair. In both, I had to get a friend to drive me to and from the hospital. My sisters flew out to help care for me, as MY WW would do nothing. She never visited me in the hospital or inquired about my condition. So, with all the other crap preceeding the affair, I know there was never any love. That is...abhorrent behavior. Sooooo incredibly selfish, there are no words. I am glad she is your ex. She doesn't deserve you.
Author confusedinkansas Posted April 27, 2009 Author Posted April 27, 2009 My H & I had some indepth conversatinon this weekend regarding this thread. Here is his take. He thinks those of you that say TOSS THEM TO THE CURB have every right to think the way you do. It's just not the way he looks at it. At All! He doesn't see that an affair is the end all of a marriage. He believes love can conquer all, it is possible to work thru indifferences & move on. It hasn't devistated him & he says, because it hasn't devistated him, doesn't make him any less of a man or a husband. Also, doesn't mean he doesn't love me. He really doesn't give it much thought whatsoever (unless I ask questions) about the 'past' & my affair. He thinks I shoud stop posting here, it makes me think too much!! Yes, I am speaking FOR him, but I just thought that it was rather interesting when I told him some of the posts here. Just an update.
Owl Posted April 27, 2009 Posted April 27, 2009 I would agree that marriages can be recovered. What I cannot fathom is how a man (or woman) who is truly engaged, emotionally attached, and committed to the marriage could not be devestated and traumatized by their spouses affair. I'm not saying that he was. I'm not saying that he doesn't love you. But I'm telling you that from my personal experience and good amount of time and research into this subject, I've never yet met a BS who was truly and deeply in love with their WS that was not devestated by the news of their spouses cheating. I have occasionally seen people who were emotionally distant (ESPECIALLY those who were engaged in their own affair) remain relatively undisturbed by their spouse's affair...but I've never seen one who was emotionally engaged and mentally healthy (and not involved in their own affair) who was not devestated by their spouse's infidelity. I'm NOT bashing you or your H, CIK...but I'd honestly be looking deeper into your H's side of the marriage, given his extremely peculiar reaction to your cheating. I'd suspect him of being relieved that you cheated, as it gives him an "out" on some unnamed behaviors on his side. And again...this isn't an attack...I'm just being very honest about what I'd suspect if I were you, or your MC.
Author confusedinkansas Posted April 27, 2009 Author Posted April 27, 2009 Owl - Thanks for your comments......I completely & totally understand what you're saying. didn't think you were bashing. You were just giving opinion. Perhaps he has had his own 'indiscretion' - he claims in counseling he has had opportunity but never acted on it. It's neither here or there at this point. That was the past. We used to 'party like rock stars'...some things happened, yes alcohol was to blame for 90% of it. But it is truly in the past. A past life, if you will. A way of life that we don't participate in anymore. All water under the bridge. We're both different now. We're closer, talk more, and things really are better than they have been for years. Not perfection....But really - What is perfection anyway
stampdaddy Posted April 27, 2009 Posted April 27, 2009 I was thinking the same thing as OWL.. And like him, NOT trying to "stir the pot".. But something didnt/doesnt add up. I also thought that maybe it is just "easier" for him to sweep it under the rug, so to speak.. "OH! don't to talk about that, nope, how's the weather? What? The past?? Hey, I have an idea, let's go garage saling...."
Author confusedinkansas Posted April 27, 2009 Author Posted April 27, 2009 Just read this online.........Thought it was fitting so I thought I'd post it. A new tell-all reveals that Paul Newman once cheated on Joanne Woodward. In the 1960s, Paul had a year-long affair with a journalist, causing the Hollywood couple to briefly split. It only seems to have strengthened their bond, since they stayed together for another, oh, 40 years. (April 24)
Snowflower Posted April 27, 2009 Posted April 27, 2009 I agree that an affair shouldn't be swept under the rug and forgotten. In fact, if a couple does do that then I think the stage is set for all sorts of unpleasant 'reminders' about the affair to keep surfacing: resentment, a revenge affair by the BS, a repeat affair by the WS, unresolved anger, take your pick. But at some point, the couple needs to decide when to let the issue of the affair go if the marriage is going to continue successfully. The timeframe for this will vary from couple to couple but honestly, why rehash the affair for forever and a day? My H and I are at 5 months from D-Day (he confessed) and honestly, we don't talk about the A nearly as much anymore. I know this doesn't seem like a long time to some but my H and I have talked and discussed the A to the point that we figured out what it was and what it wasn't. At first, we talked about it to exhaustion. But, after finding out everything that I needed to find out...asking the same questions over and over and in different ways to see if I could trip him up, I found that there is little to discuss anymore. Not to say that we will never talk about the A again...it's just that my H and I became much more interested in the issues between us and how to recover and build our marriage. And, for a marriage to successfully recover, IMO this is where the real work needs to take place in order to move forward.
Author confusedinkansas Posted April 27, 2009 Author Posted April 27, 2009 I Not to say that we will never talk about the A again...it's just that my H and I became much more interested in the issues between us and how to recover and build our marriage. And, for a marriage to successfully recover, IMO this is where the real work needs to take place in order to move forward. This is IMO how it should be as well. When my H & I ever have any chats about it - They are brief & few & far between. That is until I brought this website up. But, it was a GOOD talk...for both of us that we had this weekend. And, not it will not be discussed again for a very long time. It's just how it is. (mine was some 3 odd years ago)
Snowflower Posted April 27, 2009 Posted April 27, 2009 This is IMO how it should be as well. When my H & I ever have any chats about it - They are brief & few & far between. That is until I brought this website up. But, it was a GOOD talk...for both of us that we had this weekend. And, not it will not be discussed again for a very long time. It's just how it is. (mine was some 3 odd years ago) And I think this is a healthy attitude to have...especially if you have completely recovered your marriage. I hope that in 3 years my H and I will seldom discuss his affair. Sure, there will be times when it will probably enter into our conversation but it is my hope that it will be infrequent and for a specific purpose. I know I want to put this whole painful episode behind me. Not forgetting about it exactly but begin putting it in perspective. This is one of the big reasons why I handled the whole affair with my H in the healthiest way I could think of, for me. I want to continue to heal from it and for neither me nor my husband to ever allow our marriage to get to that terrible point again. I'm not completely healed yet but I do have a different perspective on it now and posting here does help.
stampdaddy Posted April 27, 2009 Posted April 27, 2009 And I think this is a healthy attitude to have...especially if you have completely recovered your marriage. I hope that in 3 years my H and I will seldom discuss his affair. Sure, there will be times when it will probably enter into our conversation but it is my hope that it will be infrequent and for a specific purpose. I know I want to put this whole painful episode behind me. Not forgetting about it exactly but begin putting it in perspective. This is one of the big reasons why I handled the whole affair with my H in the healthiest way I could think of, for me. I want to continue to heal from it and for neither me nor my husband to ever allow our marriage to get to that terrible point again. I'm not completely healed yet but I do have a different perspective on it now and posting here does help. Just a question: were your affairs (your husbands and Kansas's) more of the physical type? I mean, I can see as hard as that would be to get over or past those, wouldnt it be MUCH harder if the emotional side of it were more "real"?
Author confusedinkansas Posted April 27, 2009 Author Posted April 27, 2009 stamp: I was head over heels in love with the man I had an affair with. Although, Not in love enough to leave. Neither one of us wanted that. When his wife left him for another man, he was devistated. I was heartbroken for him (yeah, keep laughing - it's funny now......but in the heat of the moment - was a hard time) Anyway, I thought he loved me too & when he & his wife split he kept saying to me "I like things this way between us....Don't leave your husband" Should have been a red flag at the time. I see it all more clearly now. When I did leave my husband (this was 2 years after we had broken things off - didn't leave my husband for this man) & he found out about it - He'd come round again....looking for the same thing....Although HE was in a relationship -- With, Yes, You Guessed it Kiddies....A married woman!! I had already decided that I wasn't going to cheat on or with anyone again - so out the door he went! I tried to be friends at first, just didn't work out. Haven't spoken to him since.
Snowflower Posted April 27, 2009 Posted April 27, 2009 Just a question: were your affairs (your husbands and Kansas's) more of the physical type? I mean, I can see as hard as that would be to get over or past those, wouldnt it be MUCH harder if the emotional side of it were more "real"? Yes, my husband's affair was a very brief PA (ONS with a colleague), which for ME made it easier to start to put it in perspective both in terms of the very short duration of the A and the fact that he was NOT emotionally connected to the OW. I agree though that had his A been for a longer time or had emotions been involved it would have been much more difficult for me and I very likely would not be in as good of place as I am right now with the whole painful experience. I'm not minimizing his affair though, it was very painful and wrong and if he ever does something like that again, it will be the end. I just know what the A was and what it wasn't and can put it in perspective from there. My marriage had a lot of issues before the A--some I/we knew about but most of them we did not. It took a real crisis and a lot of MC and exhausting conversations for my H and I to recover our marriage. It's still ongoing but getting better all the time.
stampdaddy Posted April 27, 2009 Posted April 27, 2009 OK, ladies, if you don't mind the thread jack, let me ask you: Kansas. How in the world does your husband do it, KNOWING (or does he?) that you were SO in love, amd had all of the emotional side of it? Snowwy: you are more the "norm" I guess, OR, most BS's don't get all of the info that would devestate, and do the "wear and tear" of the marriage.. I guess what I am getting at is this. I have been here a while now, and we all know that there are "different" types of affairs. There are different people, different faiths. Different countries. Different upbringings. Different towns, cities, villages, etc... Obviously, that girl that lives in a "village" can't very well just stroll into the local cafe (as there is probably only one) and with what, 200-2,000 people that live there, everybody knows everybody so an affair can't be much. Now, take a big city, where you can more easlily go out to lunch, dinner, movies, the zoo, where ever you want and the odds of being "seen" are miniscule (yes it is a small world, but...) How would a BS survive, knowing (or NOT knowing) that the WS and OM/OW have been to this or THAT restaurant. Maybe seen a movie at THAT theater. Took a trip to THAT town. I know I am rambling, but, ALL I practically see here on LS is the "affair", like it is just a "shell". ALL of the "reality" about the affair is protected inside and out of site for the BS. Kansas, how would your husband feel that you knew his favorite food? His birthday? That you cooked for him, shared wine with him over a candle light dinner, and then made love to him? Snow, I already know how you would feel....
Snowflower Posted April 27, 2009 Posted April 27, 2009 "Snowwy" I like that nickname! And very appropriate if you knew where I lived! Stamp, I'm not sure I get what you are asking here?
stampdaddy Posted April 27, 2009 Posted April 27, 2009 "Snowwy" I like that nickname! And very appropriate if you knew where I lived! Stamp, I'm not sure I get what you are asking here? well, you really already answered it.. If YOU had to move forward with your husband, knowing/not knowing where he and the OW had been, for example. You are sitting at your favorite restaurant, during recovery, and it strikes you" "have THEY been here? Did he share "our" favorite spot with HER?" Or, knowing that he knows ALL about her, all the little details of her life.. Did he buy her a nice present or lingerie for her birthday, while all you get is a card... But, you have already said that you couldnt handle that..
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