Am I missing something?

[LoveLace]

Girl friend and I went to see C's band at the park last night (which he invited me to). We found a spot in the grass and we could see him by the stage, but I didn't feel comfortable approaching him. He eventually just approached us, and we chatted a few min. This was with one of the same friends with me at the show 2 weeks ago, where they swore he was sooo into me. Anyway, I had other friends show up and the park got crowded...so I was only able to chat with him one other time on a break, then again before we left.

 

My girl friend invited C to join us for an outing afterwards, but he said he would have to see how he felt because the band played 5 gigs this weekend alone and I could see he was absolutely exhausted. He was drinched in sweat and wiping himself with a towel the whole time. So after the show, he was pretty anxious to get home and relax and decided not to join us.

 

During the break, we talked music talk and he made me laugh as usual, my girl friend was there as a 3rd party convo, but most of the talking occurred b/tween he and I. I heard the band cover and INXS tune last time; and they had done another one last night. So during the break, I said "I love those INXS tunes"...then when they were on stage a few minutes later, they did yet ANOTHER one. I don't think they normally cover 2 songs by the same band in one set....I don't know but my friend has dated a lot of musicians and she was convinced he did that on purpose...I danced in the front of the stage and again, saw him staring at me countless amount of times - especially during the other INXS song, I was all smiles! At one point, he said "you should have came to ----'s last night, it was a great time!" - my friend and I did in fact consider going there but I didn't want to show up 2 nights in a row like a follower; but apparently he doesn't see it that way...the band doesn't have to do much to get fans to their shows - they have hundreds already; so it isn't as though he's pushing for promotion necessarily..

 

However on the way home, my friend kept saying "oh he is definitely interested"...what I saw was a repsectable guy cool enough to come over and say hi, and chat whenever we had the chance. And it WAS cool if he arranged that song for me, and its cool he likes it when I go see him, but I'm not seeing where my girl friend is getting the "definitely interested" part. She says nature is totally taking its course; and it feels like that in a way but I don't know...and now I"m a huge fan of the band, and I feel the addiction coming on that I"ve heard so much about with them. So now I DO want to go to more shows and I don't know if there is a line to draw between friends with the sax player/just a fan. I know its hard to have any insight when you are not there to see things happening; what is my girl friend seeing that I don't see? I used to think I knew a lot about guys..but I'm clueless.

[shadowplay]

I think you should give up on him. He would have made a move by now; he's had ample opportunity.

[Ronni_W]

<whew!> I was pretty sure my ten bucks were safe, but still good to get the confirmation . Oh-so-sweet that he directed having a song performed JUST FOR YOU .

I am with your girlfriend on this one -- he is DEFINITELY INTERESTED! I would suspect that he has the same problem as you, but from the other side -- that is, doesn't he want to come on like some imbecilic-girl-hunting-sex-addicted-musician-freak. (And really may be feeling as 'clueless' as you are, too.)

 

But. One of you is going to HAVE to break the stalemate, though, and just get an open, honest, grown-up conversation going. And that may as well be you, yes?

[carhill]

OP, when he comes to see you or ask you out you'll know he's interested. Viewed within the vacuum of this thread, it's about you being interested in him and he is facilitating that, albeit in a polite way. I've been around muso's a fair amount the last couple years and, married or single, they can be very friendly and polite when they want to (and often sincerely). Such is what expands their audience

 

My best indicators when I've had sit-downs with muso's is when they take an interest in my travels or interests of mine, not just music. I love what I do, and it can be pretty important to the people I do it for, but it's just what I do, not who I am. Learning about others is much more interesting. Look for that balance

[LoveLace]

I think you should give up on him. He would have made a move by now; he's had ample opportunity.

 

I wouldn't say there is anything to "give up on" in the 1st place, really. We've always been acquaintences and that won't change. He's inviting me to shows, so I go to them if I can. I haven't even been able to make all the ones he's asked me to. Anyway, I just wanted to know why my friend feels so strongly about the sitch.

 

I guess you could be right Ronni (maybe, big maybe!) but I wouldn't know how to start a conversation like that, I'd also have to end up in the right place at the right time for it, or else it's message him on MS - and I don't think I want to use MS for such a thing. I did message him to tell him how impressed I was by the show last night (for some reason much more impressed than the 1st time - they played more songs and just sounded better I guess) but I left out anything suggestive of interest.

 

At the show 2 weeks ago when we 1st started talking, right away he asked "have you seen me since my divorce?" (that was 2 years ago)...he didn't remember if he saw me last before or after that. I recalled we've seen each other once or twice since then (but he had a g-friend at the time, so it never crossed my mind to take more interest in him)...it was almost like he was trying to figure out a sudden interest in him...? By now he probably thinks my interest is strictly in the band, which a lot of it is, but I guess that could be considered caught in the "fan zone" instead of "friend zone" lol.

[LoveLace]

OP, when he comes to see you or ask you out you'll know he's interested. Viewed within the vacuum of this thread, it's about you being interested in him and he is facilitating that, albeit in a polite way. I've been around muso's a fair amount the last couple years and, married or single, they can be very friendly and polite when they want to (and often sincerely). Such is what expands their audience

 

My best indicators when I've had sit-downs with muso's is when they take an interest in my travels or interests of mine, not just music. I love what I do, and it can be pretty important to the people I do it for, but it's just what I do, not who I am. Learning about others is much more interesting. Look for that balance

 

 

 

Well that's what I put in my original post here...that I saw a cool friend and musician making it a point to acknowledge friends/fans. However, at both shows so far I'm the only "fan" or "friend" I've seen him talking to, other than band mates.

 

Far as music goes, I've known him several years, so we've had many conversations in the past that were certainly not just about music...I saw him go through a hard break-up once, he also confided in me during a rocky brief marriage he went through. So we've had some personal convo's before. Music IS a lot of WHO he is though, and he likes it that way, he's never been shy about making that clear.

[Ronni_W]

Yeah...it's definitely not a conversation for MS.

Not really sure how you might proceed. What about, next time you have an in-person chat, say something about how you'd like it if you can treat him to a drink on one of his night's off...to entertain him for a change, instead of it just always being you having a good time at his "expense" as it were.

 

It's kind of non-committal enough...really, just you wanting to do you friendly bit, isn't it? And it gives him an opening which, it is my guess, he'll accept (though it might be some time before he actually has a free night -- that's the downside of trying to get into something with a musician or restaurant worker, etc.) Anyway. Over drinks, you'll both at least have a chance to have a conversation that isn't interrupted by his work or work obligations.

[LoveLace]

Yeah...it's definitely not a conversation for MS.

Not really sure how you might proceed. What about, next time you have an in-person chat, say something about how you'd like it if you can treat him to a drink on one of his night's off...to entertain him for a change, instead of it just always being you having a good time at his "expense" as it were.

 

It's kind of non-committal enough...really, just you wanting to do you friendly bit, isn't it? And it gives him an opening which, it is my guess, he'll accept (though it might be some time before he actually has a free night -- that's the downside of trying to get into something with a musician or restaurant worker, etc.) Anyway. Over drinks, you'll both at least have a chance to have a conversation that isn't interrupted by his work or work obligations.

 

 

Gee, this takes me back to 2 weeks ago before I left that show...when he said "you know that one shot wasn't enough"...then I said we'll make up for that sometime and he said, "Yes on a night when I can actually hang out and drink more" or something along those lines..but I was on my way out the door so that was one of those fly-by things.

[Star Gazer]

His behavior is demonstrative of a guy who'd be down for a NSA hookup at his convenience, but nothing more.

[LoveLace]

His behavior is demonstrative of a guy who'd be down for a NSA hookup at his convenience, but nothing more.

 

I doubt that...only because I've only known of him to be in steady relationships and he takes them all pretty seriously, he doesn't tolerate "cheating" or "premiscuous" behavior at all. I consider him one of the more "traditional" guys when it comes to women. I'm sure he's had his NSA's like the rest of us, but from what I can tell, I dont think its much his cup of tea. Plus since we have mutual friends and we've known each other for years, I just can't see him having his way with me like that, maybe he's attracted to me or something but I haven't had any inklings that go beyond that, because he really doesn't appear to be a "sexual" person on the surface...he's basically the intelligent, artistic type - you'd almost think he'd prefer talking over sex (ugh!) I've never even heard talk ABOUT sex, just relationships in general. But I don't believe he's gay LOL! He's very masculine, just not in the beer-gut-sports-guy kind of way...though he does have a beer gut he he.

[shadowplay]

I doubt that...only because I've only known of him to be in steady relationships and he takes them all pretty seriously, he doesn't tolerate "cheating" or "premiscuous" behavior at all. I consider him one of the more "traditional" guys when it comes to women. I'm sure he's had his NSA's like the rest of us, but from what I can tell, I dont think its much his cup of tea. Plus since we have mutual friends and we've known each other for years, I just can't see him having his way with me like that, maybe he's attracted to me or something but I haven't had any inklings that go beyond that, because he really doesn't appear to be a "sexual" person on the surface...he's basically the intelligent, artistic type - you'd almost think he'd prefer talking over sex (ugh!) I've never even heard talk ABOUT sex, just relationships in general. But I don't believe he's gay LOL! He's very masculine, just not in the beer-gut-sports-guy kind of way...though he does have a beer gut he he.

 

I don't want to be mean, but I think you're in denial, LL. He's clearly not interested. Guys don't behave like this when they are unless they're developmentally challenged. You should try to forget him. You act like you couldn't care less either way but have started many threads on this guy who hasn't even asked you out on a single date! Please...give up. For your own good.

[carhill]

So we've had some personal convo's before. Music IS a lot of WHO he is though, and he likes it that way, he's never been shy about making that clear.

 

Is that your truth as well?

 

Tell me, when you've had occasion to relate something meaningful or important in your life to him, what has been his response?

[paddington bear]

I don't want to be mean, but I think you're in denial, LL. He's clearly not interested. Guys don't behave like this when they are unless they're developmentally challenged. You should try to forget him. You act like you couldn't care less either way but have started many threads on this guy who hasn't even asked you out on a single date! Please...give up. For your own good.

 

I'm beginning to agree with shadowplay on this one. Again and again I've seen that with men, if they like you they will do something about it - the hard part is deciding when to give up on them, how many 'strikes and you're out' do you give? I'm not sure. At the moment, he may be getting a kick out of seeing you, knowing you like him (if you think he doesn't, you'd be wrong). It's flattering when someone is attracted to you, even if the attraction isn't mutual. From what you've written so far, he seems to like you, enjoy chatting to you in a friendly way.

 

I was told recently that a guy was 'totally into you' by a relation. For a few brief hours I was all 'yaaaay! he does like me, I knew it' and then I thought, well, hang on a minute here, he doesn't like me that much, he's willing to carry on, not asking me out, willing to lose me to some other guy. If you really like someone you can't bear the thought that someone else might be the one to get them and want to take them off the market asap.

 

I know this is not what you want to hear, but really, I think it's time to move on...and you never know, if after seeing you a couple of times now and then you suddenly disappear it may just make him think 'hey, I thought I had that one in the bag' and actually do something.

[Star Gazer]

I guess this is just another thread that seeks validation and agreement and encouragement to follow a pre-chosen path rather than insight and help. *shrug*

[2sunny]

LL-

 

if he wanted to spend more time with you - he would have figured out a way by now to AT LEAST make an effort in that direction. end of story... no need to explain more and justify situations to us any further. find the next target.

 

move on.

[LoveLace]

I guess this is just another thread that seeks validation and agreement and encouragement to follow a pre-chosen path rather than insight and help. *shrug*

 

um huh what? Sorry that sentence is overwhelming to me...

 

 

Carhill do you mean how does he respond to me if I talk about myself? He listens, he asks questions, just like we'd always done from running into each other over the years. We've had a lot of those "catch up" convos because we've gone months and even a year once without seeing each other around. But I don't know for sure if thats what you were asking.?

 

Well hey, you don't see me fully convinced he's into it in my thread here, any more than the rest of ya, it's my girl friends that keep saying it, I just went to the show he invited me to, without any "hope" of any kind, and I had the most wonderful time! Me and my girl friend were estatic about it because it was a great ending to a great weekend we had. That's what I got out of it so there's nothing to feel disappointed about. She's seen me interact with a lot of guys and this is the 1st time she's ever had such an opinion. I don't know why though, trust me she seems to believe it a LOT more than I do. So telling me to "move on" or whatever is not some kind of hard thing to hear. But she shouldn't act so strongly about it like she does because it's only going to confuse me! I think the "extra" song they did is what made her more convinced, but to me it was just really cool, I've been around music enough to know that the band takes fans pretty seriously and if they want to hear something, any band will make that happen if they can. DUH, it keeps people coming back. If he invites me to more shows I'll go because their entertainment is phenomonal, and I'm never one to pass on something like that. So I guess there's really nothing left to say about it! Thanks everyone.

[paddington bear]

Is that your truth as well?

 

Tell me, when you've had occasion to relate something meaningful or important in your life to him, what has been his response?

 

I think he was trying to get you to figure out whether he was just shooting the breeze or if by any of his responses showed that he truly interested in something personal that you may have mentioned, or perhaps remembered something you told him before e.g. I love the rain - musician man next time you meet 'You must be having a great time, it's raining hard, didn't you say you loved the rain?'

[carhill]

Does he "remember"? A man who is into you remembers, especially in the beginning. The love of your life will remember forever. Not saying this is him, by any means

 

I'm very friendly with people. I ask questions. It's called being sociable. Do I remember the little details about their lives? Not usually. I will tell you, if a woman is special to me (as an example), I do remember details, often very irritatingly microscopic ones

 

Anyway, just wanted to qualify what I was seeking in my question. I know, personally, I'm the shy and retiring type and, after this much time and interest, I would've likely asked you out. Just sayin

[LoveLace]

I think he was trying to get you to figure out whether he was just shooting the breeze or if by any of his responses showed that he truly interested in something personal that you may have mentioned, or perhaps remembered something you told him before e.g. I love the rain - musician man next time you meet 'You must be having a great time, it's raining hard, didn't you say you loved the rain?'

 

 

Hm well, when I saw him 2 weeks ago (which was the 1st time in a year or so), he asked me how much nursing school I had left, but I didn't even realize he knew that I was still IN school, or remembered it was nursing for that matter. When we 1st started messaging on MS, I didn't even mention school. I remember feeling like that question kind of came from nowhere. But school of course is the most important thing I have going, so I guess he figured it was a good convo starter, I don't know. I have been in nursing school for 2 years now, so perhaps he just remembered that from when we saw each other last I'm not even sure. Half the time, people don't remember if I'm still in school or done or even what I'm going to school for. How did he know I haven't graduated yet? Could be something he got from our mutual friend I guess....the same friend I told "I should give up on dating for a while", just before seeing C again. It's possible she told him that. But it really doesn't matter. He also did ask if I still drive a chevy cavalier, which I haven't for over a year now, but that's just a car so that's not signifcant I dont' think! LOL..even though he never even got into my car! I just had such a great time last night, but his whole band is responsible for that, not him alone. It beats the h*ll outta nights I can't find anything to do or someone to hang out with, that's for sure.

[2sunny]

i say get some friends that have better reading techniques.

 

yours seem to be way off the radar... and you are listening to them too much.

[LoveLace]

i say get some friends that have better reading techniques.

 

yours seem to be way off the radar... and you are listening to them too much.

 

 

If I believed what she was saying...I would have been the one asking him out by now. But naturally it can confuse a person. And my friends are perfectly wonderful people that I don't know what i"d do without sometimes, so I don't want new ones, thank you very much.

[carhill]

LL, just so I'm clear, I'm not challenging your perceptions, rather trying to gather information to form an opinion. You recitations lead me to believe that he does consider you as a friend. More? I don't know. IIRC, you and he haven't had significant contact away from his business, correct? Such contact, even if not an official "date", would be more significant, as this is what friends do. Feel free to correct me regarding the specifics.

 

As you said, you gain much enjoyment from the band's music and your participation, so go with that. What will be will be

[LoveLace]

LL, just so I'm clear, I'm not challenging your perceptions, rather trying to gather information to form an opinion. You recitations lead me to believe that he does consider you as a friend. More? I don't know. IIRC, you and he haven't had significant contact away from his business, correct? Such contact, even if not an official "date", would be more significant, as this is what friends do. Feel free to correct me regarding the specifics.

 

As you said, you gain much enjoyment from the band's music and your participation, so go with that. What will be will be

 

Yes I"d say he absolutely considers me a friend, or maybe just acquanitance, I'd say we're somewhere between the two. But I actually knew him before I ever saw him with a saxophone. I met him at the home of a mutual friend many years ago. He came to a couple parties I went to as well, but I don't recall talking with him much those times...then we ran into each other at an old favorite hang out on occasion. He would come by there after playing down the road for a drink. It was always a pleasant surprise to see him and once we noticed each other, it was a given that we'd sit next to each other, drink and talk. A couple times, the talks lasted hours. Then, other friends were inviting me to where he was playing down the road (which explained why I saw him at that particular bar so much) because that was a (different) popular band to see at the time. Back then, he would spend his breaks sitting with us, just like he does now. The one time I ever felt more interested in him, I blew it off quickly because I decided I probably wasn't good enough for him (back in the day when self-esteem was WAY lower than now!), plus he always had a girlfriend (not just one the whole time, but a few). I amounted him up to just a cool guy to know.

 

So that's what "contact" has amounted to, if you want to consider that "away from business" or not, I don't know. But in general it was always just, great to see ya, what's new with ya, let's goof off, drunk stupors. I remember a lot of talking, thing is I can hardly recall what we'd talk about, other than relationships, or music, or just making each other laugh.

I even saw him while he was married a couple times, and he wasn't shy about voicing his disappointments with the marriage. And of course I thought, "well that's another good one taken!". THEN one night out of the blue, I saw him at the bar, he walked up and said, "I'm divorced now. Can I buy you a drink?" and we laughed about it, but who knows if it was meant to be a joke or not. After that of course, we sat and he told me all the latest. I didn't consider any pursuing because he was freshly divorced. But I was always totally happy to be there for him. Was one of those things, it was very cool to run into eachother like that unexpectedly, but I'd say neither of us thought of taking it outiside the "bar" or whatever. In a way I feel like our type of "contact" has been "demoted" in a way, from friends to Fan knows Sax player. And now I see him because the shows are planned, VS. "running into each other", which was more fun in a way.

 

When he saw me last over a year ago, I was living with a guy. Some of you old-school LS'ers might remember my horrible living time with "Tim", whom I was only friends with, but C thought we were really "living together". We were at the bar talking, and Tim walked in. But he left fast because he thought that he was interrupting something. I think I explained that Tim was only my roommate, but that always went over people's heads like yea right. And to be honest, I don't know if C realizes I don't live there anymore! We haven't talked about it! Anyway, I guess that is the most specific I can get for you Car. lol.

[2sunny]

consider him a basic friend that you see when you want to enjoy his music.

 

to try to make this something further is wishful thinking. he would have asked you out in person or by way of your chats on IM at some point along the way.

[carhill]

Hi LL.....I think I will agree with the opinion that you have a good healthy friendship with this gentleman. By "away from business", I meant any contact which didn't involve his profession, music. Sounds like you've had other contacts over the years, so I understand better now. To me, perhaps, there is a timing issue going on. I think we've all dealt with this. It sounds to me like you both might be on the same page now, but no one is willing to take a risk, especially if you do value each other as friends. Others here opine it's the man's job to do this if he is interested, and I respect that. Is this muso a typical man? I don't know. We're all different.

 

How would you feel if you asked him out and he agreed? Really?