crazybaby Posted March 7, 2008 Posted March 7, 2008 I caught my boyfriend of 3 years masturbating to porn.I was out and got back earlier than he obviously thought i would be. He had drawn the curtains had his trousers down and was masturbating. I just cant seem to get over this, it happened like 2 weeks ago. I was like " what are doing!" He got really defensive then ended up having a real go at me until i felt like a piece of crap on his shoe. He apologized later said he would never do it again. YEAH RIGHT! That morning i had tried to initiate sex but he just lay there so i thought fudge it, got up and went out.He tried to blame me by saying he had been horny in the morning.BULL. Horny for something else maybe. We have made home videos and have pictures why didn't he look at them! In fact he lied and said he had been looking at both but i knew he hadn't and he admitted he was lying about that. I just feel so sad and upset, angry.. i keep seeing this image of him. I thought we have a pretty good sex life, were pretty active and like to try new ideas. I said i had forgiven him and to him its been dealt with. I don't want to keep bringing it up i just wanna forget about it. I don't even know if i was over reacting to it, like he said.I know allot of people its normal or they don't mind their bf or husbands looking or even joining in but what about the women that don't like it, what did you do to forget?
fral945 Posted March 7, 2008 Posted March 7, 2008 I recommend the 1st thing you do is use the search function and search for "porn", searching post titles only. I found nearly 500 posts just with the title of porn in the subject. This is a fairly common theme of this site, mostly women like yourself catching their boyfriends watching porn, is it right or wrong, etc. I don't want to rehash viewpoints that have been discussed over and over. You can find a particularly long post at: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t141686/?highlight=porn There seems to be two schools of thought I've noticed on the boards here, and you'll probably hear from both sides: 1) All porn is bad, evil, it degrades women, etc. 2) Porn is ok if it's and outlet, something you use when you can't get laid or you partner doesn't have as strong of a sex drive The 1st group is deadset against any porn. I noticed this group tends to be 99.9% women and/or religious folks. They seem to think sex/sexual desire and love are synonymous. Personally, I think they are just clueless as to how mens' minds work. For men, sex is sex, it's simply an urge, like food. We always want more and more variety. It's doesn't mean we love you less if we're lusting after another women. For many women, that is hard to comprehend. The 2nd group (which includes me) sees it as a normal part of life, but something you use when you can't get sex. Let's face it, life doesn't always work out to give us readily available sex with willing partners everytime we desire. And what are the odds you'll find someone with all the qualities you look for in a mate with perfect sexual compatibility (frequency of sex, variety, etc.). There needs to be a release. There are certain urges you can't deny in life: food, sleep, and sex. Everything else is negotiable. Now that that is out of the way, my advice would be to ask yourself one question: Is he doing it in place of having sex with you? If he's not, don't worry about it. If he is, then it is an issue and you'll both need to discuss it and figure out the underlying cause/causes.
JerseyShortie Posted March 7, 2008 Posted March 7, 2008 I don't like porn but I don't think it is "evil". I however do think it degrades women. I understand why men are turned on by it but I think it can be very telling about what men think about women. I noticed this group tends to be 99.9% women and/or religious folks. They seem to think sex/sexual desire and love are synonymous I don't think sex and love are synonymous. I do think when you are in a relationship and are making a committment, you should value that commitment. A man seeking out other women indirectly in porn isn't harmless. He mentally isn't valuing his committment. He is seeking other women to turn himself on. He could even be thinking about those other women when he is with his SO. It is an issue of respect sometimes. We always want more and more variety. I understand that men do like variety. But if a man likes variety so much, then why would he tie himself to one woman in a relationship? Is porn a way men get to have their cake and eat it too at the expense of their SO? It's doesn't mean we love you less if we're lusting after another women. For many women, that is hard to comprehend. I agree that it doesn't mean a man loves you any less, but it IS hard for women to comprehend that because the evidence speaks louder then the words. We know men are attracted to other women, that is how you started a relationship with us. That is how it all starts. To think that a man's attraction to other women isn't a threat at all is about as ridiculous as it is to think that a porno won't turn a man on. The thing of it is, that alot of men rather put their SO in a position to feel insecure and undervalued in a relationshiip then to just put the porn away. THAT is what is messed up. I see it ALL the time with men that on this site rather defend porn instead of their own woman. The 2nd group (which includes me) sees it as a normal part of life, but something you use when you can't get sex. Let's face it, life doesn't always work out to give us readily available sex with willing partners everytime we desire. Yes, life doesn't always give you everything you want. But within a relationship, it isn't just about your own desires any more. Too many men scarfice the secuirty of their relationship for their own desires and the one that ends up getting hurt isn't him, its his SO. If you need to statisfy every urge you have the moment you have it, you aren't acting maturely. If I ate cheesecake and icecream everytime I wanted it, I would be fat. But for some reason, men don't feel like they need to exercise self control and that is actually a huge turn off for many women. It isn't just a hurt that he is engaging of porn of other women, it speaks of an immaturity that there is no self control being used. Both men and women want a partner that is able to have self control. Is he doing it in place of having sex with you? If he's not, don't worry about it. If he is, then it is an issue and you'll both need to discuss it and figure out the underlying cause/causes. I believe this to be unfair. She has already presented it as an issue. To tell her what should or shouldn't be an issue within her own relationship, when she already made it clear she has an issue with it, is completely unfair. The fact is that many men today use porn and their real life SO interchangably to statisfy themselves. And there is something about that that is completely disheartenting.
Arch Posted March 7, 2008 Posted March 7, 2008 lol wow, I can't believe people still have a problem with porn, females masturbate and you never hear men having a problem with it. The female gender as a whole seems to be too sensitive about the subject.
LucreziaBorgia Posted March 7, 2008 Posted March 7, 2008 This is another case of making the mistake of thinking that a man's sex life and his masturbation life are the same. Sex is with a partner - it is private between the two of you. Masturbation is private, period unless he chooses to include you. None of your business, in other words. The only way it would be your business is if he was masturbating intstead of having sex with you. Why did he lie? Because you backed him into a corner and gave him no choice. Would you rather he say ... "When I want to have sex, I am turned on by you but when I want to simply masturbate I don't get turned on the same way when I look at pics/vids of you that I do when I look at new material." Sorry, but that is simply how it is for nearly all men (excluding those few who deny masturbating and/or fantasizing).
tanbark813 Posted March 7, 2008 Posted March 7, 2008 This is another case of making the mistake of thinking that a man's sex life and his masturbation life are the same. Sex is with a partner - it is private between the two of you. Masturbation is private, period unless he chooses to include you. None of your business, in other words. The only way it would be your business is if he was masturbating intstead of having sex with you. Why did he lie? Because you backed him into a corner and gave him no choice. Would you rather he say ... "When I want to have sex, I am turned on by you but when I want to simply masturbate I don't get turned on the same way when I look at pics/vids of you that I do when I look at new material." Sorry, but that is simply how it is for nearly all men (excluding those few who deny masturbating and/or fantasizing). 100% agreed.
JerseyShortie Posted March 8, 2008 Posted March 8, 2008 Then maybe men shouldn't have real life relationships that delude women into thinking that they actually care about them and want to actually be loyal and make a commitment. Since it is obvious men don't really want to make a commitment to their partners at all or value them. It seems like the only way a man can be happy is if he can use a real life girl and porn interchangably to be happy. If that is how men feel, then why do they even bother having relationships? It is obvious that a man's porn is just as important as the real life person in his life. And of course this doesn't suck for men, they get to have their cake and eat it too. It only sucks for women because they never to be important or matter or be beautiful to him. I hope in my next life I can come back as a man then I can crap all over my partners in the name of porn and only care about myself.
LucreziaBorgia Posted March 8, 2008 Posted March 8, 2008 A man's (or a woman's for that matter) personal and private masturbation habits have nothing to do with his or her ability to commit to someone. Commitment is between two people. Masturbation is entirely between a man and his penis, or a woman and her vagina. Masturbation and sex have nothing to do with each other in the way that people are making the mistake of thinking that they do. When he or she has sex with you, they want you - only you and are turned on by you enough to want you. When he or she masturbates privately that is the one and only safe and secure chance to explore their very human sexuality and desire for new things. Masturbation requires variety, and porn is simply a tool, a means to an end - sex with a partner doesn't work that way.
JerseyShortie Posted March 8, 2008 Posted March 8, 2008 When he or she has sex with you, they want you - only you and are turned on by you enough to want you. So you know for sure what is going on in the heads of every male out there having sex with their SO? And you think not one male out there isn't thinking about sex with another woman or isn't thinking about porn when he is physcially with his woman? Come on. And how many men want to use porn to get turned on so that they can have sex with their SO. That isn't about being turned on by "you and only you". Basically they want to get turned on by other women and then sleep with a real one, the best of both worlds for them. But not so complimentary to the woman they claim the care so much for, respect and are so committed to. I think it is easy for men to be committed when they can use porn as tool to supplment themselves. And in turn, I don't think that says alot about the effort they are willing to put into a relationship to be committed. I also guess I don't see cheating as purely a physical fault, I think it can also be a mental avenue. And how many men every day mentally cheat on their SO and don't treat her like the most important woman to him? About a billion dollars worth of porn tells us the answer to that. When he or she masturbates privately that is the one and only safe and secure chance to explore their very human sexuality and desire for new things. Masturbation requires variety, and porn is simply a tool, a means to an end - sex with a partner doesn't work that way. That is exactly my point. If men want new things so much then why do they bother with a real life relationships with one woman? Men want it both ways, they want the one woman who loves him and x amount of other women to get off to having sex. It doesn't take much effort to be loyal or to be committed if this is the case. And it is disheartening and frustrating. Add into the amount of time and the type of porn that is out there today and more men are spending more time online, more then ever in history. It's sad. It's really hard to trust men or have faith in them now-a-days.
LucreziaBorgia Posted March 8, 2008 Posted March 8, 2008 Its basic human biology - a man gets aroused by a variety of stimuli - you can thank brain biochemistry for that. I think you have some idea that when a man is looking at porn it has something to do with his mate, or he is looking for a new one. All he is doing is looking for some visual stimuli to strengthen his orgasm. It isn't meant to replace anyone. If it does, then yes - that is a problem. Masturbation should not replace sex in a relationship. If it does, then something is very wrong. A lot more going on than 'mental cheating' - resentment, anger, etc. Now, that said - if the only way he can get aroused, even with a partner is with porn then that is a problem too. Either he is not attracted to his mate, or he is but has trained his mind to respond only to the sexual overkill of porn. Bad both ways.
John Who Posted March 8, 2008 Posted March 8, 2008 I myself have never been into porn,as far as masterbation i think everone has tried it. Guy's do not need porn to masterbate. Sorry but you can't just make someone give up masterbation,just because he does this,does not mean he does not love you. Try not to get on his as- because he does this,it'll just piss him off. Sometimes a guy jut wants to masterbate it has nothing to do with the gf or w,does not mean you are doing anything wrong or you don't satisfy him. Remember this is very normal,there is not anything wrong with it,just relax.
Author crazybaby Posted March 9, 2008 Author Posted March 9, 2008 Thank you every one for your input. I don't see why a man's sex life and his masturbation life are separate tbh. I have masturbated when he has been away at work, but i was thinking of him and i told him when he came, he found it a small thrill. I don't feel the need to go on the internet and look at porn when i have images and memories of us that i can use. LucreziaBorgia You make it sound as if a man doesn't masturbate they will simply explode just cos hes horny. I think men in society have tried to say this is ok behavior so women wont complain. i think is called having a cake and eating it to. Greedy and selfish. I can honestly say that if the shoe was on the other foot by BF would have acted the same way as me. Hes quite a jealous person. But heyho i already said i accepted his apology i ain't gonna go back on it now or bring the discussion back up with him. It would feel like i was just trying to bring it up to make him feel bad again or something. I just wanted to see what other people thought thanks for all the advice specially Jerseyshortie as you seem to have same point of view as me
LucreziaBorgia Posted March 9, 2008 Posted March 9, 2008 Look up testosterone, and do some research on the differences between sex hormones in the male and female brains, and how brain function and sexuality are different for males and females. Learn a few basic things about biochemistry and what triggers masturbation in males. If you can't or won't do that, then there isn't much that can be said. I think men in society have tried to say this is ok behavior so women wont complain. i think is called having a cake and eating it to. Greedy and selfish. This is how you see masturbation? I'm speechless. Seriously. I think your boyfriend will just start lying more effectively, and hiding things from you better.
JosieMcCoy Posted March 9, 2008 Posted March 9, 2008 When I have a boyfriend, he can masturbate all he wants! I don't take it personal. Hell, I masturbate too! That's how people are! I would have blew his mind if I saw him masturbating to porn. I would have encouraged him to continue and kneel between his legs and help him out.
Author crazybaby Posted March 9, 2008 Author Posted March 9, 2008 I'm sorry i have a hard time trying to type making sense of what my thoughts are. "I think men in society have tried to say this is ok behavior so women wont complain. i think is called having a cake and eating it to. Greedy and selfish." No i have no problem with masturbation, as i said i have done it myself. On my own and with my boyfriend. I meant having a loving relationship healthy sex life but plus still having to go watch porn. The problem i had with it was that he was masturbating to porn when he knew i wouldn't be to long back. We coulda done it together ,watching our videos. We have videos and pictures of our selfs and it hurt my feelings that he didn't use these. Why do you need to watch random strangers making fake love to be able to get it off when you have a gf quite willing to have sex/make love. maybe i might just do what you say LucreziaBorgia or maybe not
LucreziaBorgia Posted March 9, 2008 Posted March 9, 2008 Do a google search for the "coolidge effect" and see if that sheds any light on it. It will be the first hit you get.
tanbark813 Posted March 9, 2008 Posted March 9, 2008 So you know for sure what is going on in the heads of every male out there having sex with their SO? And you do?? Based on each of your posts, LB understands how a man thinks much better than you do. It's really hard to trust men or have faith in them now-a-days. Please. Watching porn has nothing to do with trustworthiness. And secondly, it's not exactly easy to find a trustworthy woman these days either, but that's getting on a tangent. Finally, there are women out there who enjoy porn also. And those women tend to be less prudish and easier to get along with anyway.
JerseyShortie Posted March 9, 2008 Posted March 9, 2008 Its basic human biology - a man gets aroused by a variety of stimuli - you can thank brain biochemistry for that. I think you have some idea that when a man is looking at porn it has something to do with his mate, or he is looking for a new one. I don't need a biology lesson. I understand why men are turned on by porn. I also understand why women are hurt by it. With that in mind, we are more then just are biology and that being the case, excusing certain behaviors based on biology is only half of it. Just because something is biological related, doesn't mean it is right. It certainly doesn't solve the problem for the millions of women out there and on here that post about their hurt over pornography. And yes, I DO think porn has something to do with a man looking for a "new one". Indirectly at the very least. You are the on that later posts about the collidge effect. Yet here you try to make the case that men aren't looking for new partners, when that is exactly what the collidge effect is about. They are looking for new partners, they are just finding ways around their desire for also having a relationship with one women and all the positives that come with that, and all the positives that come with still seeking out other women indirectly. They can have their cake and eat it too. And it doesn't suck for him, like I said it sucks for her that knows that in the time he is looking at whatever porno, that she IS being replaced for that time. And women are suppose to feel good about that? Seriously, I'd like a man to answer that. Women are suppose to feel good knowing the man that *claims* he cares for so much IS replacing her in those moments whenever he looks at a porno of other women. You say in one case it isn't used to replace anyone, then you mention the collidge effect. Those two statments contradict each other. Hey, if a man wants variety that is fine. I am okay with that. But don't get into a relationship claiming you want one woman, and then turn around and say how you need porn because of your biology and you can't fully commit. THat isn't fair to the woman you are supposedly making a promise too. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- John Who: Sorry but you can't just make someone give up masterbation,just because he does this,does not mean he does not love you. Try not to get on his as- because he does this,it'll just piss him off. Well, for alot of women it makes them *feel* like they aren't loved. And that is as good as if they really weren't love. Because if they don't see the actions that support the way they feel loved and secure in a relationship, that is a good reason not to feel safe in her relationship with him. As for getting on a guys ass for porn pissing him off, well then what do you suggest for a woman that is just as pissed in her own right for his porn use? I mean you say not to piss a guy off but he is already pissing her off with his porn use. --------------------------------------------------------------------- Crazybaby: I just wanted to see what other people thought thanks for all the advice specially Jerseyshortie as you seem to have same point of view as me I think alot of women feel the way you and I do Crazybaby. I think alot of women are okay with it. What gets me is when people who are okay with porn use try to tell the women that don't like it to just "shut up and accept it and get over it". I mean, if it was that easy, you would have already gotten over it. It is a hard issue for alot of women. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- I think your boyfriend will just start lying more effectively, and hiding things from you better. Then that is HIS fault and HIS mistake and HIS disrespect to their relationship along with the porn, to lie to her about who he really is. Her negative response might cause him to lie but you expect her to what?.....Not voice her opinion and shut her feelings up to spare his?
LucreziaBorgia Posted March 10, 2008 Posted March 10, 2008 The part of the coolidge effect that I was referring to was specifically about porn use and masturbation, and how men don't get aroused as much viewing the same material over and over. I wasn't referring to the part about looking for multiple partners. Not voice her opinion and shut her feelings up to spare his? Voicing opinions and feelings are fine. Attacking someone - particularly attacking someone's sexuality, and then resorting to tears, emotional blackmail and threats aren't. If she can find an objective way to discuss this, which involves compromise rather than emotionally based demands for him to change his very brain chemistry and sexual habits on her behalf, then that would probably get her further. Otherwise he will just lie to make things easier. I can't imagine someone being truthful about something like this if doing so will result in the verbal and emotional doghouse that it got him into.
JerseyShortie Posted March 10, 2008 Posted March 10, 2008 The part of the coolidge effect that I was referring to was specifically about porn use and masturbation, and how men don't get aroused as much viewing the same material over and over. I wasn't referring to the part about looking for multiple partners. I'm not trying to argue with you Lucrezia but if you want to use the coolidge effect as an example here, you can't just pick and choose the aspects of it you want to use or not use. Attacking someone - particularly attacking someone's sexuality, and then resorting to tears, emotional blackmail and threats aren't. I do agree with this. I also know that has a woman, when something hurts you like that it is hard to not have a strong reaction.
canadian_jeff Posted March 10, 2008 Posted March 10, 2008 When I have a boyfriend, he can masturbate all he wants! I don't take it personal. Hell, I masturbate too! That's how people are! I would have blew his mind if I saw him masturbating to porn. I would have encouraged him to continue and kneel between his legs and help him out. I think im in love lol
LucreziaBorgia Posted March 10, 2008 Posted March 10, 2008 I'm not trying to argue with you Lucrezia but if you want to use the coolidge effect as an example here, you can't just pick and choose the aspects of it you want to use or not use. I'm not picking and choosing. Here I'll quote the article: The Coolidge effect has sometimes been mentioned as an explanation of why pornographic images are exciting to the male when first purchased, but after repeated viewing can "lose its effect". Coolidge does address multiple partners. It also addresses porn use and masturbation without a partner. That's the part I was focusing on. Any guy who uses porn as a masturbation tool will tell you though, without a nary bit of research that watching the same thing over and over to masturbate to is boring. The spank bank account is one that is always on a declining balance and must have continuous deposits in order to be effective. I find that to be true even of myself - I rarely watched the same stuff more than a few times before it just became mundane. Time to find something new. Did it effect sex with my partner? Nope. Because it had nothing to do with him. It was my own private time with me and my toys. Was he threatened? Not at all. Why would he? He's a man, he understands. As for why pics/movies of girlfriends don't work well - well, its simple really. Its someone you have in real life. Someone you see every day, sleep with at night, etc. There are a lot more 'reality' factors involved. It isn't a lack of attraction, so much as it is a separation of masturbation from sex. Men respect their partners, and don't usually like to have them reduced to porn. Porn is just that - porn. Not something you snuggle up with, fall in love with, spend your life with - just a tool. Who wants their girlfriend to be a tool? The spank bank women aren't even women really (not meant in a demeaning way - but I know girls in the 'business' and the ones I know all know the deal and don't feel demeaned or humiliated - it is hard work, but they like the paycheck) - they are a collection of erotic thoughts mapped onto body parts moving on a screen. A chance to let the mind wander freely and safely through 'forbidden' territory. Just something to make the orgasm quicker and stronger when you masturbate. Some guys prefer it, others don't. Depends on how much testosterone is flooding the brain at a given time. I've been with men who spanked it to porn, and I've been with men who didn't. It is not unheard of for a man to be turned off by porn. I know a few, but not many. Men love their women. They also have that private and taboo time of masturbation that predates even their sexual life - back to being really young and filching a Playboy and feeling an orgasm and ejaculation for the first time. A self soothing behavior that starts long before girls actually come along. Maybe its because I had brothers, - or perhaps having nearly all my friends being male and comfortable with talking about this stuff to me. I also have a fair deal of knowledge of sexual action and interaction between males and females in biological terms. And, perhaps part of it is my own 'male' side from when I dated women. I will say this - a man is not a woman with male body parts. They think differently, they act/react differently, their bodies and body systems work differently. I think sometimes that women don't really want a man. They want a woman with male parts. Someone who doesn't have that pesky testosterone problem that makes them want to masturbate and fantasize about things other than the person they are committed to. Of course, without the very thing that drives that fantasy/masturbation there wouldn't be sex at all. Talk about picking and choosing! You can't just choose the parts of a man you want, and expect him to ditch all the others. That would be like demanding that a woman stop having PMS every month. I do agree with this. I also know that has a woman, when something hurts you like that it is hard to not have a strong reaction. Yes, that is true. It is always important to understand though that with strong reactions, you will get equally strong and defensive actions and the actual problem won't be solved or discussed at all. It will be lost in the attacks and defenses. That is one reason I am such an advocate of couple's counseling. An objective third party keeps the discussion firmly on the issue and does not address the forms of attack or defenses, except for to offer alternative ways of discussing things.
fightingforlove Posted March 11, 2008 Posted March 11, 2008 For all the men out there that overuse and abuse porn you should know that it can make you a horrible lover. I have noticed this trend in my own relationship. The more he looks the worse he gets. I am guessing this is two fold. One, when men masturbate they are getting themselves off QUICKLY which leads to faster ejaculation with their SO. Very frustrating for us women! Secondly, when they are in bed they are trying to live up to what they have seen, what the women they saw liked, and trying in general to recreate instead of CREATE something together. I realize this is not true of all men but I KNOW several women who have said the same thing. None of us has told our SO but we are pretty dissapointed compared to what it used to be when they where truly with us. Why don't we say anything? Because of all of the defensive statements you are making here and what I have seen on the other forums. Because it is hard to hurt someone you really care about. Because it will sound like we are "whining" about something that is "totally natural". The internet and cable have brought something into our homes that could of at one time been considered normal as an occasional habit ie. going to a strip club every few months with friends to looking at girly mags on occasion. Now it is available 24/7 and can be as damaging as alcohol, drugs or gambling. I hope these men(porn abusers) realize that they are the ones ruining their sex life. I am very open to trying just about anything legal and respectful that my spouse would want to try. But, I have to be honest that with the way it is headed and where his head seems to be going more and more I am less and less interested in trying it with him! Good luck to everyone in the "GREAT DEBATE"
LucreziaBorgia Posted March 11, 2008 Posted March 11, 2008 (edited) Using porn while masturbating is one thing. Abusing it to the point where it ruins your sex life is another. In this case: I thought we have a pretty good sex life, were pretty active and like to try new ideas. Porn wasn't a problem until it was made one because of him being 'caught'. Edited March 11, 2008 by LucreziaBorgia
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