what does it mean ...

[Tomcat33]

I can't walk away. I really thought I could. We need understanding, I need to understand why he wants to be alone. With Christmas approaching I know he has been busy and had a lot to do I told him that I understood that he was feeling overwhelmed but rather than pushing me away he could have just said the next few weeks are going to be so busy and I wont see you as much as I want to - that is all he needed to say ...

 

 

Sorry to say but no you don't you don't always get closure before you can move on and most certainly you don't always get closure from the person who is the protagonist of all the pain being inflicted on you. So what you need is to stop fantasizing that you will get him to come around and give you more than what he is giving when in reality all you are doing for him with your own actions is telling him "it's ok I am here for you even if I only to get half of what I deserve".

 

It's ok to be there for the person we love and it's ok to be the one that gives more at some points than others, but it's not ok when that situation never evens itself out. Because it is at that very point that you should ask yourself why am I giving so much to this person and being so unconditionally loving towards and things don't progress, nor is he looking to progress. When it starts to feel like it's all you giving and not enough FOR you, is when you need to take your powerback and stop relying on his answers and find your own answers to gain strength to move on.

 

One of two things will happen when you do come to this realisation, he will either realise that he was not doing what he could have and want to meet you half way or he will realise that being with you wasn't what he really wanted, either way wouldn't you want to know?

 

well you must love him to want to stick with it.

As long as kids are involved he will never get over it.

Men/fathers aren't all b*stards. We have feelings which are pent up inside. It is very very hard for us when we are separated from our family/kids.

Men/husbands get complacent to the extent that they lose there family and they regret the consquences forever. They know they have to plod on with there life wherever it may take them but they made there bed and they have to lay in it. I guess I am talking about myself and from what I have learnt over the years of other men.

 

The grass is not greener on the other side in most cases.

I wouldn't want to see this lady every day or night. I don't want to meet her parents or daughter. Not yet anyway. I am not in that right place.

And I don't think I ever will unless I get closure of my previous R/M.

I think its just company for me. With an attractive/intelligent/normal young lady.

I am not sure about the man in question here how he came to separate from his spouse and family.

 

yeah it's called living in permanent state of "guilt" which is a complete and utter waste of good energy. Guilt's only purpose is to warn us of something we are doing that is wrong, beyond that to live in that state of alarm is stagnating your growth as a human being and as a matureing pregressing adult. At some point you have to come to terms with your choices and either change your belief system to suit your new found decisions OR you need to change something to suit your old belief system but either way something has to give. A person that lives in constant state of guilt is a person who stopped progressing.

 

How are things TC??

 

Hi S-diddy

 

I'm good, had an interesting weekend went out to a christmas party at a friend of a friend's and met some really interesting people and was really on fire that night. I met two guys this weekend one was at the party the other I met shopping, Christmas is a great time to meet men because they are all out shopping hee-hee I was picking up a book (for myself) and he told me it was a really good, since he had read it. I must admit we had exchanged glances earlier in one of the isles and the rest just worked out like magic! LOL I tell you this is how I always meet men, when I least expect it. I am totally on again and looking foward to the new year!. Meow!!

 

How are you doing SD?

Edited December 23, 2007 by Tomcat33

[Tomcat33]

Family is what counts. You loved that person to marry them and you have a bond between you that is sacred. The kids.

 

 

Hmmm I thought kids were the product of profound love, respect and bond two human beings have with each other? I didn't think kids were supposed to be used as the glue that keeps two human beings together....?

[smileysmile]

TC. yes quite right.

 

Thats another way of putting it. Hey nobody is perfect. We all make mistakes and don't I know it.

[stampdaddy]

TC

I still dont have PM's and hate to threadjack.. I am still painting.. Have lots to talk about, wish I had PM's cause youre a cool cat I would like to chat with.. thoughts?

 

Sorry for the TJ

[bloom]

Smileysmile - thanks for your insight and your personal story...

[Tomcat33]

TC. yes quite right.

 

Thats another way of putting it. Hey nobody is perfect. We all make mistakes and don't I know it.

 

 

The reason I pointed that out smiley is because maybe you are now focusing on that as the magic fantasy of "what if" the idea that you did not try harder for the sake of your children is a reality of your current life. But one thing is doing everything you can to save a marriage for the sake of the children the other is doing everything you can to save the marriage for the sake of the two adults involved in that marriage. When you look back with regret do you have regret for the sake of your relationship with your exW or the children?

[stampdaddy]

TC. I just updated my profile so you can see a temporary email account set up.. I will edit once you get it. Thanks

[Tomcat33]

SD - done my friend!

[LucreziaBorgia]

I would often use the "I want to be alone" line when I met someone new and wanted more time for the new person. Have you ruled out an OOW?

[passionateconfusion]

I would often use the "I want to be alone" line when I met someone new and wanted more time for the new person. Have you ruled out an OOW?

 

I asked him that and I dont think that is a possibility. He wants to spend the time with his kids not another woman.

[smileysmile]

TC.

Just had a chat with my mum. All these years and she finally tells me that when my dad left at 8 years old for Canada and never really stayed in touch I took it hard. She is now referring to my anger in both my marriages when they both left because of my unreasonable behaviour and kept 'testing' them by pushing them away with my verbal actions to see if they would leave or stay. Would they give me reassurance.

I am not making any excuses but my ex tells me my issues are engrained in me from youth. I can't change etc.

Nobody wants to admit they have a problem especially when they don't know where it stems from. I seem to hurt the closest to me. And that was my ex. Same goes for my first M. I don't have a problem with friends and colleagues or anybody outside my R.

I have a self destruct button. When she said she was finally leaving I didn't believe her and pride got in the way to actually do something about it. I did at the very end cry so bad that I didn't know why I was like this..please help me. But why should she and my daughter be brought down. She gave me many chances.

I finally went to a counsellor for 5 hrly sessions a mth ago and I think we were side tracked onto something else. So he wasn't much good now I want to see somebody else and talk about what the real issue is.

 

We are all products of our genes and environment. My both exes come from good familys with both parents still together and still in love.

I have a good family. But shakey at times in my youth.

We were very close when my father was here.

That was in the late 60s and early 70s.

My ex gave me chances to see a counsellor for my anger issues.

And other issues that wanted to push her away.

I didn't think there was anybody out there who cared enough to want to help and also I didn't know where to look and I felt I was making excuses.

 

I have deep issues. And I have ruined 2 relationships. Its not because now I have lost it I want it back. And that I regret what I have done because I have now lost it.

I have issues which if somebody knocked on my door and said he could help and really help to deal and understand my deep rooyed issues then maybe we would still be together today.

 

Sorry to have taken your thread up.

[Tomcat33]

TC.

Just had a chat with my mum. All these years and she finally tells me that when my dad left at 8 years old for Canada and never really stayed in touch I took it hard. She is now referring to my anger in both my marriages when they both left because of my unreasonable behaviour and kept 'testing' them by pushing them away with my verbal actions to see if they would leave or stay. Would they give me reassurance.

I am not making any excuses but my ex tells me my issues are engrained in me from youth. I can't change etc.

 

it's not an excuse you know what the root of your problem is you suffered seperation anxiety or abandonment at an age where you could not process it in any other way than to see it as being disowned or not loved. That's understandable you were only 8. You anger stems from that and you have been acting out from that childhood trauma.

 

Nobody wants to admit they have a problem especially when they don't know where it stems from. I seem to hurt the closest to me. And that was my ex. Same goes for my first M. I don't have a problem with friends and colleagues or anybody outside my R.

 

you do know where it stems from now you do, and that's fine but knowing the root is not going to change your learned behavioural patterns that you have engrained in your personality. the reflex of your actions do stem from there but your choice to behave in a distructive way is nothing more than learned behaviour and you must use that knowledge to change your pattern. you can't change your past but you can change your future and the furure of your next relationship but it has to start somewhere even before you enter your next relationship otherwise you will do the exact same thing again.

 

Of course you don't have that problem with friends of colleagues and it really amazes me that men use that comparisson so non-challanltly your ties with friends and colleagues are not as deep and you don't become vulnerable to them as you would in a romantic relationship. So keep that in mind when you think they can all be grouped in the same bag. it's not the same. Our unresolved issues and destructive patters only come out in our close relationships not the superficial ones like friends and colleagues, that's not to say you don't have close ties with them but it is different.

 

I have a self destruct button. When she said she was finally leaving I didn't believe her and pride got in the way to actually do something about it. I did at the very end cry so bad that I didn't know why I was like this..please help me. But why should she and my daughter be brought down. She gave me many chances.

I finally went to a counsellor for 5 hrly sessions a mth ago and I think we were side tracked onto something else. So he wasn't much good now I want to see somebody else and talk about what the real issue is.

 

We are all products of our genes and environment. My both exes come from good familys with both parents still together and still in love.

I have a good family. But shakey at times in my youth.

We were very close when my father was here.

That was in the late 60s and early 70s.

My ex gave me chances to see a counsellor for my anger issues.

And other issues that wanted to push her away.

I didn't think there was anybody out there who cared enough to want to help and also I didn't know where to look and I felt I was making excuses.

 

I have deep issues. And I have ruined 2 relationships. Its not because now I have lost it I want it back. And that I regret what I have done because I have now lost it.

I have issues which if somebody knocked on my door and said he could help and really help to deal and understand my deep rooyed issues then maybe we would still be together today.

 

Sorry to have taken your thread up.

 

 

Myth # 1 no one is going to come a knocking at your door to help you change you have to do it on your own.

Anger is managable but it is also self taught, with or without external help you need to learn to manage your anger and when that "botton" is detonated you need to learn to control that but all that happens from within, counting to 10 is the oldest trick in the book but it has to be put into practice in order for it to truly work.

 

you're right the past relationships may have been failures (and I'm not sure they were ALL your fault they never are so one sided a such) but your change for the future it is never too late and it is NONSENSE people don't change you just have to really really want it. Do you really want it?

Again, holding on to past mistakes is doing nothing to improve your future you need to be conscious of your past in order not to go down that path again but you can't live in regret that's not progress that is just being choosing the path of bieng the victim.

[smileysmile]

wise words TC.

 

I wish I had done something before. My ex (not D yet) and I have been separated from our marital home approx. 4 mths to temporarily move into her parents house until our separate houses were ready to move in to.

Of course we are both now in our houses. She lives 10 mins away.

 

We had only been together since Sept 2004 and my previous R was 12 yrs. M last year.

But my ex is hurting and it is according to her deep rooted and she wants me to stay humble as she gets over it. She tried desparately to save our M. She couldn't take anymore and says she only left me because of my behavoiur and not because she fell out of love etc.

But to this day still can't believe the way I treated her as her eyes swelled up.

She doesn't believe the counselling has worked and didn't think it would and thats why she would never come back. Doesn't believe I could ever change.

As said before in one of my posts, why so soon after our split would she fall for a work colleagues attention? (Now ex colleague) who apparently only married in June 2007 and is now separated because his W doesn't want children. I am not quite sure if there is any truth in that or if he is spinnig her a yarn to get into her pants. She is a very good looking girl and I know men will flock around her. She had known her ex colleague 3 yrs so she does know he is a nice guy. A guy who she told to sort his own marriage out and tells me he "persisted" which I can see paid off!

A bit of "light care" and "support" for there mutual separations I have been told "because of the crap I put her through".

 

How can I possibly understand my exes "hurt" if this happens? Low self esteem? What is it? Oh my insecure ego has been bruised because she has moved on before me..at least physically.

 

Yes she likes him..yes she fancies him otherwise this wouldn't have happened. And of course they share the same star sign and they get on.

But he is balck and her father wouldn't be happy as she is very fair skinned. How black I am not sure. But I have told her if you love him then nobody else matters. She says she doesn't but part of me is saying shes telling you all this to HURT you for all the pain you put her through!!

 

Sorry I have taken over again and a whole can of worms have been opened..and its 1am here

[whichwayisup]

when a man says he wants be alone?

 

I know it sounds simple and straight to the point but I guess I dont understand why anybody would want to be alone.

 

I've been on a rollercoaster with him for most of 2007. It all stemmed that he felt he needed to be more of a full time father (which he has been doing). He has been seperated for 6 years and has never divorced - more for financial reasons than anything else. After him figuring out he doesnt want to move back to the marital home things seemed to be fine. He had a few awakenings of sorts and then I brought up the future whick led him to pull away and then the arguments ensued. He wants me in his life but says he wants to be alone. Do you think the term 'dating' would passify us both - gives me a status and gives him a 'non commitment' idea in his mind?

 

I'm sure he's been riding the dramatic rollercoaster with you as well and is probably sick of it.

I could be wrong, but from the way you have worded things and from your previous posts, he's saying that he wants to be alone. Men say what they mean...He doesn't want a full time relationship as he wants to put his kids first and spend alot of time with them.

 

If anything, I would back off and leave him alone. The more you push the future on him, the more he will head for the hills and detach from you.

[whichwayisup]

I asked him that and I dont think that is a possibility. He wants to spend the time with his kids not another woman.

Even if there is another OOW, he won't tell you. Why would he? If he is detaching and slowly getting you to see that there is no hope, no future for the two of you, he isn't going to throw a stinkbomb in the midst of it and upset/piss you off by admitting he's interested in someone else...

 

I doubt there is anyone as he wants to be alone and with his kids. Sorry, but he has that right to change his mind. Even if it hurts you, this is something that you have no control, it's his choice.

[frannie]

Even if there is another OOW, he won't tell you. Why would he? If he is detaching and slowly getting you to see that there is no hope, no future for the two of you, he isn't going to throw a stinkbomb in the midst of it and upset/piss you off by admitting he's interested in someone else...

 

Very odd point of view. Why would he not tell her? He might choose not to, he might lie, anyone might. But to categorically state that he wouldn't..? How on earth could you know that?

[passionateconfusion]

Very odd point of view. Why would he not tell her? He might choose not to, he might lie, anyone might. But to categorically state that he wouldn't..? How on earth could you know that?

 

There is not an OW I not that for certain.

 

He's coming over for lunch today so we will see how that goes ...