I know my story is no different than most, but...

[whichwayisup]

Do all taht you can to ignore her. NO personal conversations, no flirting, no touching, nothing. Business as usual and that's it. You can do this! You have to.

[IamASelfishSOB]

Hey SSOB,

How are you doing?

How has the work week gone with OW?

 

Care to give an update?

 

I'm very encouraged. I know it's only one day, but I received no indication that it will be a problem. We had normal pleasantries and some very unimportant small talk. She is doing some work for me, so I do have interaction with her. Most all the discussion centered around the work and I didn't feel at any time that she wanted anything different. I'm very hopeful that all is well. I think that both of us know that we made a mistake. Plus, my wife and I are going out tonight. Should be fun. When we get home, I'm going to make an attempt at this. :-)

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t130410/

[Mustang Sally]

Good luck with the squirting, SSOB!

 

But, truthfully, it (the squirting) is probably something your wife will have to learn to do for herself, if she is new to it, before you will be able to "do it for her"....

(Just one squirtin' woman's opinion...)

 

However...don't let that stop you from trying!

[Flyin in Clouds]

Are you really sure you will be ok knowing that another man is xxxxxxx you wife? Ever thought about that it might be fun at first, but what kind of emotional mess it can create and that you might never look at your wife the same way again because she was just with another man the other night?

 

Well... uh, no I wouldn't actually know how I'd feel afterward or long term with 100% certainty.

 

BUT, what I think I would feel would be OK so long as

 

1. she wanted to do it and I wanted to do it.

2. we got equal play time (me with other females).

3. we both had veto over others we played with.

4. we had other mutally agreed to rules about others and abided by them (i.e. no cheating on whatever rules we agreed to... no lying or deception.)

 

I can seperate sex and love. Can you?

 

I can have sex with someone I love because I love them and it's part of expressing that love.

 

I can have sex with someone just because it's fun and has nothing to do with deep romantic life long love.

 

Because I love my wife in a very deep way I would not want her to be denied any pleasure she desired, even if that ultimately might hurt me. I might be torn between two feelings, one that I was happy and glad she was happy and one of jealousy. But I would hope my love for her would win out and let her have all she wanted to have without my selfishness getting in the way.

 

Now my wife on the other hand has no desire for others nor would she want to do anything to hurt me. So I doubt even if she thought it might have been fun to experience two men at once she wouldn't do it because she'd be afraid it would hurt me.

 

And all of that is theoritical. We've discussed these issues some but haven't acted on any of them.

 

My wife's exact comment about an MFM is that "she thought it would be weird" -- not that she thought she wouldn't like it.

 

I guess what some people would be worried about is that someone else might make their partner a better lover than themselves. But if that is the case then isn't denying them that person being rather selfish? Is that what love is about? Keeping my partner less happy because I might not be as good as some other guy? My wife once told me she wanted to know that I choose her over all other women. Well if I don't experience (all? yikes) other women then how would I know that I choose her?

[Flyin in Clouds]

T... I need the encouragement to face the confrontation that MUST happen.

If two people really love one another why is it so hard to confront one another? Because we don't want to risk hurting the other person? Because we are taught all conflict is bad from a very early age? If two people love one another aren't they supposed to care deeply about the others well being?

 

After years of depression over our relationship and the dwindling sex (which yes made me feel totally unloved and totally useless. What use is a man to a woman if he can't please her sexually? None. That is how men think of it. OK, at least this man thought that way. Maybe I'm the only one, but some how I doubt I'm all that different than other men.), depressed to the point of thinking about suicide, cheating and / or divorce as the options I was still hard to get to the confrontation stage. But I had to get there if I wanted to save the marriage or save myself. It is just not easy to communicate with someone you love when things you have to say might hurt them and hurt yourself.

[Flyin in Clouds]

Bish is really not trying to be helpful, so I put him in my ignore list. I'm pretty sure the guy just has no tolerance for anyone that has ever cheated and figures we can all rot in hell. ...

I think most of us are offering our opinions for your consideration. You might not like them... most on here take a mighty dim view of cheating, even if it's just one night.

 

How would you feel if your wife did what you did? Just one night? Would you forgive her? What would it do to you emotionally? What would help you get over it. More importantly would you want her to tell you about it or would you be better off if she never told you anything about it? Of course how you feel about these issues may not be how your wife feels about them.

[Flyin in Clouds]

...

 

I'll be honest, while I am very attractive and am told so, I never had a hot body and I never dressed to flaunt what I had (which I have discovered is part of the equation.) I don't live to get men's attention and so I never dressed to lure. Turns out, I needed to be thinking that way to lure my H.

Could you talk to my wife.... please? That is her to a T. I talked to her about it, but she still doesn't go as far as I'd like. I'm waiting for the day when she goes to V.S. and wears something sexy home.

 

I think one problem is she's a VP in a large corp. And working in a "man's world" (it's a very chauvinistic company) she's had to compete as a man. That I think has damaged her ability to be feminine.

 

I never knew how important that was to him. He didn't say so for obvious reasons.

He loved you and didn't want to hurt your feelings even at the expense of his own suffering. We guys are told we should be self sacrificing that way.

 

I had gained a lot of weight

Just curious how much is a lot? 10 lbs, 30lbs, 100 lbs? 10% increase, 50% increase, 100% increase over your marriage weight. Some women think gaining 10 lbs means they've become obese. To most guys it's nothing. Now doubling your weight... well that's probably a little different.

 

and while it didn't affect his sexual desire for me (I'm not sure why) it did make him feel that I didn't respect him or care enough for him to make myself look the best I can be.

Well that's exactly how I feel... my wife just doesn't care enough about me to be bothered fixing her self up to be attractive to me. She can say she loves me all she wants, but the proof of that would be to drop some weight, get in shape, and buy some damn sexy cloths. those actions would speak far louder than words.

 

I'm not sure my wife would even know how to seduce me. I used to worry her lack of sex meant she was getting elsewhere. But I don't think she could seduce any guy. And that is depressing.

 

I told him later, that would have been the way to say it to me because I don't want him feeling that I don't care. It hurt him and I guess made him feel neglected in a way.

If we tell you that we get shot down because we are "whinny or needy or ..."

 

He has never been one to compliment and so in the absence of positive feedback I just thought he didn't care at all. Knowing my looking good makes him feel good, not just about me, but about himself (and in comparison to other men)was highly motivating to me.

What man wants a frumpy looking wife? What man wants his wife to be uglier? Every man wants to be proud of his women and his ability to "catch" a babe. The more attractive, sexy, desirable the women the more of a man he is.

 

I'm not saying you can fix all the things you lack with your wife, but maybe there are somethings. You should ask her what she wishes she had from you. You might be surprised.

I keep asking but don't get an answer.

[Flyin in Clouds]

... Men often experience love through sex. It isn't just a physical sensation. Unfortunately, that fact is why so many men's hearts are lost when they start what they think will be a just for sex affair.

A man's manliness is his ability to give sexual pleasure to a woman, or so some of us guys think. If you don't crave sex with us what does that say about our abilities as a lover? As a man? And what guy wants to be a lousy lover? We'd all like to be Don Juan, Casanova, and Sean Connery or <you ladies can fill in the blank>...

[Flyin in Clouds]

... if his attentiveness depends on how hot your body is. That just means it will change when you gain weight again.

You don't state your gender but I'd bet it was female. "Love me for who I am no matter who much I change from the woman you married." Yeah, right....

 

It's more about attitude than actual appearance. It's not about the perfect body but the perfectly sexy, seductive dirtly little mind... It is about saying, in a very non-verbal way, "I am your woman and I want you to take me NOW!!!". It's about stimluation. It is about being willing to try to be a fantasy girl for us. It is more about the effort you are willing to expend being sexy for us that matters.

[Flyin in Clouds]

...that his lack of romancing made me feel neglected and unappreciated.

my wife said virtually the same thing and that's why she didn't feel she needed to bother trying to look sexy for me.

[Flyin in Clouds]

...

It is horrible, worse than knowing your husband cheated on you. By not telling her she will see it as you trying to protect the other woman and her feelings over the wife. It will make a difficult situation much worse. Please take this advice from someone who was in your wifes position. If you refuse to tell her who the other woman is, she will obsess over every woman you have come in contact with, friends, co-workers, neighbors......it will be horrible for her.

If my wife told me she cheated on me but she wouldn't tell me with who, there would be no hope of staying together. I'd kick her out right then and their. You want to keep a secret from her? That's goingn to rebuild trust? I don't think so. Every woman around you she'll be wonder if that woman was the one.

 

And the reason you don't want to reveal the OW is to protect the OW... and I doubt that will help you with your wife. You seem to have more concern for the OW's well being than your wife's.

[Flyin in Clouds]

....

I'd like to think I'm a good guy. I'm not as good a guy as I thought I was, however. I'm going to make right. That's all I can do. Hopefully without any significant drama at home or the office.

 

If your wife did what you did how could she make it right?

 

If you keep it secret how is that making it right?

 

If you tell her all you won't have a secret between you but with it out in the open how can you make it right?

[OpenBook]

What use is a man to a woman if he can't please her sexually? None. That is how men think of it.

 

Funny, that's how I think of it too.

 

Flyin you're a man after my own heart.

[smartgirl]

FIC - You had a lot of interesting comments. I have to tell you something though (and I don't think I'm clueless in the sex department) I really didn't have any idea that pleasing a woman sexually was such a big deal to men. I found that out in all my reading. What was also strange to me was how many men fear they don't please their wives and instead of talking to her about it they go screw another woman. To me, that seems a little more like they want to feel they are great in bed to feel good about themselves and less that they are concerned about whether their wife is happy or not. IMO.

 

As far as the dressing sexier thing - VS was one of my first stops when I started losing the weight. (You asked about that and I cringe as I write that I had gained about 40lbs gradually after the kids were born. I had my doctor pull my records and I was gaining about 6-8lbs a year. Creeps up on you. So on a 5'4" frame, I looked very overweight. So I lost all that and added a lot more muscle vs. fat.)

 

Back to the dressing sexy thing. Partially through my reading and partially by asking questions, I learned more about the visual impact and how important it is to building arousal. It became apparent that the OW tended to flaunt herself through dress, hair, jewelry, etc. Her face is not that pretty, but with her implants, fit body and longer hair she made more of a sexual statement I guess. I have always dressed in a flattering way, but more modestly. I am in the client service business and I had enough problems with clients hitting on me without showing cleavage. That became my style and I didn't have a different style for when I was with my H. But now I wear tighter clothes, show more cleavage (at appropriate times), wear high heels when we go to dinner, etc. But I'm not getting implants. That would just be sinking too low for me.

 

Maybe it would help if you spent some time in the relationship section of your book store and found some books for your wife that talk about these things (and buy one for you about pleasing her so it is even). They have books that cover a lot of this stuff -- what men like, etc. But I have to say, it is very, very hard for a woman to hear these things and not feel that she has always been a disappointment to her husband. That is where more romancing from you would really help.

 

Being romanced IS important. It makes you feel more feminine and desireable and then you feel more comfortable dressing more feminine. I don't know why, but it seems to work that way. Mars and Venus in the Bedroom was a big help in some of this.

[bish]

I think most of us are offering our opinions for your consideration. You might not like them... most on here take a mighty dim view of cheating, even if it's just one night. you feel about these issues may not be how your wife feels about them.

 

Well SOB here tells everyone that he won't do it again, but then says he only "thinks" this won't be an issue any longer.

 

I told him he ought to divorce his wife. Of course he doesn't want to hear it from someone on the betrayed end. He is selfish.

 

And then the egomaniac thinks he is gonna gain some points with the forum goers by telling everyone he is going to take her out to dinner then try to get her to squirt.....LMFAO.

[blowingthetrout]

Well SOB here tells everyone that he won't do it again, but then says he only "thinks" this won't be an issue any longer.

 

I told him he ought to divorce his wife. Of course he doesn't want to hear it from someone on the betrayed end. He is selfish.

 

And then the egomaniac thinks he is gonna gain some points with the forum goers by telling everyone he is going to take her out to dinner then try to get her to squirt.....LMFAO.

 

 

SOB, selfish, egomaniac

 

ugh bish can you stop wearing out that mirror!

[bish]

SOB, selfish, egomaniac

 

ugh bish can you stop wearing out that mirror!

 

oh wow....witty.....not

[Flyin in Clouds]

FIC - You had a lot of interesting comments. I have to tell you something though (and I don't think I'm clueless in the sex department) I really didn't have any idea that pleasing a woman sexually was such a big deal to men.

to some selfish men pleasing the woman isn't all that important. But to a lot of guys knowing "we're the man"... well that's a good feeling.

 

 

. That would just be sinking too low for me.

I don't think implants are at all necessary. It's what you do with what you got that counts. I think the art of dressing sexy is being a bit of tease. Show some but not all. I think a woman can be far sexier by revealig a little but not all... makes me want to find out more about what isn't showing. ...

[rockerdude]

Be a man...tell your wife you want a divorce, that you have become uncontrolled with respect to other women and the pleasure they offer you. While your at it...tell the other man your intentions of being with HIS wife. Then...have what you desire, without hurting anyone. That is IF the other woman still wants you after you tell the truth.

Ah...let's see, is there something I forgot, ah...oh yeah...first tell your wife that you did made out with this woman but stopped before intercourse, and that you realize that if you really still loved "her" you wouldn't be able to do that, that you want to be honest with yourself and her and that, you are truely sorry for doing that before letting her know. I'm sure she will be hurt but appreciate your honesty and that you love her enough to not hurt her with "adultery", until "after" you and her divorce.

 

Good Luck with all that.

[smartgirl]

to some selfish men pleasing the woman isn't all that important. But to a lot of guys knowing "we're the man"... well that's a good feeling.

 

 

I don't think implants are at all necessary. It's what you do with what you got that counts. I think the art of dressing sexy is being a bit of tease. Show some but not all. I think a woman can be far sexier by revealig a little but not all... makes me want to find out more about what isn't showing. ...

 

Thanks FIC - it was nice to hear a man say those things. I don't have any problem with working hard to look good, but implants just seem wrong to me. My H said much the same thing, but I know her body drove him crazy so I wasn't sure how sincere it was. Thanks again.

[BestAdvisor1]

How are things at work? Is your wife still in the dark?

[MrsHellnoFire]

"Kissing would be cheating to my wife."

 

To your wife??

 

"Forsaking all others..." <- Remember saying that?

 

 

Doesn't matter? You let another woman suck your knob for pete's sake. Sure kissing might be considered cheating to her, but you actually had SEXUAL relations with this woman.. oral sex IS sex. That's just a hell of a lot worse and you already stepped into that territory and the scary part is that you don't feel remorseful.

[PollyIvy]

SOB, I almost literally could have written your original post myself. I struggle with the same things, don't really have any advice, but just wanted to say you're not alone in your feelings and your personal dilemma.

[IamASelfishSOB]

How are things at work?

Friendly, but professional.

 

Is your wife still in the dark?

 

Somewhat, but I'm working on it. I promise that I will update someday with either success or failure. Thanks again to everyone who gave thoughtful advice.

[whichwayisup]

Post an update soon and I hope all goes well.