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Too hot to trot. True story.


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Old 9th March 2019, 9:05 PM   #1
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Too hot to trot. True story.

Hi, I've got an odd kind of problem. I've had very low self esteem all my life. Is I've gained in confidence as I've got older, I'm discovering that, much to my surprise, i appear to be rather attractive to women. Part of my low self esteem appears to be something akin to stage fright. But as i've got this under control, the boot is now on the other foot. Women appear to be terrified of me.

I often get appreciative comments made about me just in ear shot, but when I turn around I find a woman trying very hard to ignore me. I get followed around supermarkets. All kinds of hair flicking, long distance eye contact, and clothing removal "it's so hot in here!" I catch women taking sneaky photos of me etc etc But when I actually try to talk to these women. They often gush out a torrent of animated dialogue so I can't get a word in and then they run off or hide behind their friends, or are toe curlingly rude.

The list goes on. In clubs there is often a ripple hair flicking, eye contact, and animated gestures when I walk in. But groups of girls then contract in to very tight huddles and pointedly ignore me. If I try to start a conversation, I get treated like I'm something that they've just scraped off their shoe. Women suddenly become very attentive to their boyfriends.

I can't get a date or a hookup, I've not been in a relationship for 4 years, and not had sex for over a year. And yet everybody assumes I'm a player. It's deeply depressing. I feel like a leper. Any ideas? I've already investigated the possibility of being a monk. Or going gay, but I don't fancy blokes. I'm a nice guy... honest!

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Old 9th March 2019, 9:20 PM   #2
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Well, that is a peculiar problem. I guess they fear the cold approach and I would think you would do very well indeed in a situation where you meet women more organically and work with or get to know them through a hobby or whatever, so think about that. Go to community meetings, maybe take a cooking class. Kayaking, whatever. Get a dog and walk it or go to the dog park.

Approachability may be the issue. Are you smiling at them openly? Do you raise your brows at least in acknowledgement when you pass by someone?

I do think you'll do better with repeat meetings. Maybe start going to a particular pub or cafe regularly and become known there, or if you're in an office building, go to the coffee shop and start letting people get used to your presence.
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Old 9th March 2019, 11:39 PM   #3
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l got stuck on the they take pictures of you.
Holy hell where do you live that women will take pictures of you ?
Anyway , one thing to know is women look , a lot , and all this body language bs does not mean jack. They often do it all even with the bf or h right beside them or on his way back with drinks or in the next isle , waiting at home or whatever.
And they flick hair while talking to their grand mother, or brother , or a dog, means nothin.
So l'd say you could rule out 3/4 of them as being taken already and just perving , women are shocking pervs , worse than guys l'd say. But just because she's looking doesn't mean she's in any position to touch and will shyt herself if you walk upto her later, especially just out and about somewhere or in a shop or something.

It'll just be things like all that in some way or another with a lot of them.

Last edited by chillii; 9th March 2019 at 11:42 PM..
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Old 10th March 2019, 12:06 AM   #4
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Well congratulations on the blossoming confidence ... and the sudden hotness, bro.

Now you've got to switch your approach. You apparently are coming on to people because they show interest in you ... No, you want to pick a person who seems worth approaching and focus your energy there.

You're probably approaching these women with hookup energy in mind ... and they aren't up for hookups ... And you might be too eager to approach ... Let them look at you ... chill ... you might have to be a bit standoffish ... just as an experiment ... you might be coming on stronger than you think ... so sometimes we have to run these opposite experiments to figure out what's going on.

But be clear clear on your interest ... If you really want to ask a woman to dance, go up to her and ask her to dance ... Let her say no to your face. And more important, the right woman for you won't run away. So you might be approaching the less confident women. You need a woman who can smile at you and hold the smile ... and then you approach and she doesn't run ... then you start your rap ...

It's ironic: but chasing people just because they show interest in us ... is actually a bad strategy ... You want to approach selected people because YOU are interested.
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Old 10th March 2019, 4:08 AM   #5
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Is this real? "Too hot to trot?" What young man would ever say that.
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Old 10th March 2019, 4:14 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Whalebone View Post
I often get appreciative comments made about me just in ear shot, but when I turn around I find a woman trying very hard to ignore me.
Can you elaborate? What kind of comments have you heard?
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Old 10th March 2019, 4:57 AM   #7
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Thanks

Thanks so much to anybody who has replied. I've tried to discuss this before once or twice but have been badly trolled. So thanks to everyone for being adults.
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Old 10th March 2019, 5:39 AM   #8
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Is this real? "Too hot to trot?" What young man would ever say that.
Men who don't care about the feelings of others perhaps? I have the ability to do a great deal of emotional damage in a very short time frame; I still am in fact. The problem is I'm not owning it fully. When I enter a room I bring the crazy.



Married women who are hanging on to their husbands arms flirt outragously with me. Often they don't realise they are doing it, assuming that their love keeps them safe. I'm looking at the anxious husband expecting a scene. Eventually she realises what she is doing, and gets super embarrased. She then treats me like a convicted paedo for the rest of the evening. Often I can't get away because I can't get a word in, even to excuse myself for the bathroom, or she comes and finds me dragging her bemused husband behind her.



I've tried hiding behind booze, drugs, bad hair, baggy clothes, bushy beards, girlfriends and poor personal hygene but I always get found out, and the emotional fallout always ends up at my feet. Literally sometimes. In my teens I was at a party, in the kitchen, wasted, as usual. I woman tried to throw herself into my arms. I wasn't paying attention properly and she ended up in a heap at my feet. I was too far gone to even notice, the poor girl got quite badly bruised. I only remembed the next morning.



You can't go through life not owning this stuff. You run out of friends very quickly, which is what has happened and is still happening.


But, now I am sober, well dressed, lean and looking life in the eye. I want a healthy love life, but I want to be a good human being too. Is that too much to ask?
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Old 10th March 2019, 6:06 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by Whalebone View Post
I want a healthy love life, but I want to be a good human being too. Is that too much to ask?
No, but it's entirely within your control. Honestly, what I'm finding the most odd isn't so much your level of 'hotness'; it's the fact that you're seemingly asking for tips on how to be a 'good man'.

Be considerate and respectful of others. Really, that's pretty much all you have to do.
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Old 10th March 2019, 6:11 AM   #10
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Can you elaborate? What kind of comments have you heard?
"Hmmm, nice."
"Hmmm, that's perfect."
"Perfection"

(Gasp) "delicious"

"Phwooor!"
"Ohhhh, arms."


Sometimes they are unmistakable. But often these comments appear to be unconscious and are therefore, deniable. Usually it's in a situational context. Such as, heaping an insane amount of praise on a woman's choice of lunch when in the que behind me, (always behind, never in front.) "Oh what an amazing pasta bake! OMG, I could eat so many portions! So delcious."


Or looking at aftershave a few christmases ago. Two girls standing behind, "Oh I so love that aftershave, I would so do any guy wearing that right now!" (I was less confident then and just rubbed my neck in embarrassment.)


Annoyingly, as I've got more confident this last kind of more direct comment has become much less common. Its like women know I'm more of the real deal now and are much more cautious around me. It happens more often, but is more cryptic and more deniable.
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Old 10th March 2019, 11:21 AM   #11
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I won't diagnose you as being delusional, so if this is not a joke, you simply have to work on your self esteem, it's that simple. It shouldn't be that hard to get at least one of the thousands of women that think you are a super hot male model, don't you think?
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Old 10th March 2019, 11:49 AM   #12
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Dude, that's exactly me. At some point suddenly the tables turn in men's lives. We become more confident in ourselves. We've been to the gym for 5+ years. We are more established in our careers and we actually know how to talk to women and we know what they want. Women realise their time is running out, on their last fumes as their beauty begins to fade, all just as they reach their sexual peak. They're just looking for a nice guy.

I say, be the person they expect you to be, a hot guy, but also funny, nice and approachable. Be a story teller and a good listener. Don't be so direct. Also - Don't go for girls in groups of 3 or more, and girls with boyfriends.
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Old 10th March 2019, 12:20 PM   #13
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Tho it's mighty flattering to raise that kind of attention, the down side is that they see you as probably a player, so they won't touch the idea of dating you with a 10 foot pole.


I went through a phase where guys thought I was untouchable/too expensive to date. If any guy did hit on me/approach me, it was the wrong kind of guy. So I took matters into my own hands and starting asking guys out, and going for whom I would want to date, not the other way around. Had positive results. So you need to break down that barrier of misconception with those ladies.
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Old 10th March 2019, 12:32 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Whalebone View Post
I can't get a date or a hookup, I've not been in a relationship for 4 years, and not had sex for over a year. And yet everybody assumes I'm a player. It's deeply depressing. I feel like a leper. Any ideas? I've already investigated the possibility of being a monk. Or going gay, but I don't fancy blokes. I'm a nice guy... honest!
I have to then wonder how much of this fawning and admiration and flirting is in your mind.

Sorry, man, but if you're this hot and consistently striking out all the time - either you're misinterpreting all the supposed flirting, or your behaviour with women in person is putting them off for some reason.
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Old 10th March 2019, 6:51 PM   #15
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I won't diagnose you as being delusional, so if this is not a joke, you simply have to work on your self esteem, it's that simple. It shouldn't be that hard to get at least one of the thousands of women that think you are a super hot male model, don't you think?

Thank you so much for not not believing me

And I'd like to thank all the brave ladies who have vertured out of the safety of the deep forest to attempt to get this profoundly dim man into bed. But they have mostly failed, because when it comes to dating and seduction I'm as dumb as a box of rocks.

But I've only told you half of the story, the second half is wierder and sadder. As a teen I was far too shy to date women or even kiss them for that matter. I had a terrible stammer and zero social skills, I had appalling hair, clothes and ate with my mouth open. Still they tried. God they were brave. And amazingly I mangaged to get laid! Lord knows how. At a fancy dress party once a very pretty girl sat next to me on the stairs for most of the party holding my hand. I had no idea what it meant and no idea how to find out. At some point her flat mate introduced this young lady l to someone else saying "This is Clarissa and this is who she is going home with tonight." This was the first time that evening that I had any idea what was going on. I was terrified, but I hung on to her hand like it was the last living thing on a dying earth and tried not to melt from shame.

Amazingly, I actually made it to her place, sharing a taxi with her flat mate who was trying really really hard not to laugh for most of the journey. I said nothing, I just didn't trust myself. In bed, I could'nt get it in to her and felt even more embarrassed. She said "Err...well, you are very big you know." This was news to me. But I thought this was a bad thing and appologised profusely. I had a had a hang-up about this for years especially when I discovered that I couldn't buy condoms to fit here in the UK. You still can't, I have to get them mail order from Germany, not that I ever get to use them. True story.

I only banished this hang-up years later when I was dating a lovely and very patient German woman who adopted a matter-of-fact approach to the problem. We printed off a sizeing tool (yes, they exist) and size chart. We sent off to Germany for a big box and I no longer feel deformed. Result!

Anyway, so I'm at Clarissa's, I've somehow managed to do the deed and have just been kicked out on the street at 6am on a Sunday morning, somewhere in Central London with no breakfast, a foul hangover and dressed as a Cavalier from the English Civil War. Oh, and no money. I mangaged to sneak onto a train without paying. Hung-over underwear model, dressed as one of the three Musketeers gets on and off of a train and avoids paying. How? probably because I was fast asleep and almost missed my stop. I snapped awake and jumped off of the train as it was pulling away. The guard was so angry with me he forgot to check my non-existent ticket.

So this was my sex life in my teens. A desert of emptiness with the occasional acutely embarrasing episode which involved a lot of confused fumbling. I got to college and got ambushed in the first week by an experienced woman who taught me that sex can be about the best thing ever invented! Who knew? We were together for most of my college years and I am eternally greatful to her for pretty much saving my life. I was continuously in relationships for the next 15 years not knowing how I got from one to the next. There were three serious ones, one lasting 10 years. It only ended because she was and still is, mentally ill. Much as I loved her, I just couldn't do it any more. She is married now; to a man who loves her very much, we stay in touch and she says she is happy. I think I believe her, but knowing her like I do, I'm not entirely convinced.

I got very sick back in 2008 after my last serious relationship ended, I was bed ridden for about 2 years and a virtual zombie for a further 5 years. Just about holding down a job and just about content to survive. I thought I would never fully recover and assumed that my love life was over for ever. I had no energy for relationships or any kind of social life. I was a sad, fat, depressed, middle aged dude with high blood pressure, high colesterol and no real prospects.

Then, amazingly, I found a way out of the maze that is chronic illness (a whole other story.) My doctor said that if I wanted to get off my blood pressue meds I needed to lose a ton of weight and do some serious cardio. So I did. I lost about three stone (40 odd pounds) and got back in the pool. I was always a big swimmer and well into yoga for years before I got sick. I had the skills, I just needed to wake my body up without tearing something.

So there I was, like Lazarus, risen from the dead.

And women dug me. And not any women. All women. Even and especially younger women. Intially I tried to ignore it, just happy not to be heading for an early grave. But all the problems that I had as a teen came rushing back, social anxiety, the stammer, the panic attacks, not knowing what to do with my hands. So here I am, a man in his fifties, travelled the world, had two successful careers, survived a life threatening illness, shared my life with beautiful, talented women, am emotionaly literate, financialy secure, well educated. But totally clueless when it comes to dating and seduction. I just missed that bit of my growing up. I just skipped over it.

But as an older, confident man who has a big energetic footprint quite appart from my not-at-all fading looks, (I look like I'm late thirties apparently.) I'm expected to know what I'm doing and be sexualy confident. And I'm just not. Or rather I was not. So I've been treating this like a school science project, I have no other way to describe it. But I don't drink or smoke anymore. I'm just too old. I've no props or supports. I've just got to keep going out of my comfort zone, stone cold sober, try to chat to women, then try to flirt with women, see what happens and try to figure out what the hell happened. Rinse and repeat, rinse and repeat. I've no peer group to exchange notes with; they are all married, or bitter and divorced, or in some cases dead. Four years so far and progress is slow, but there is progress.

But the biggest thing I have learned is that less is more for me. I'm very lucky, still. Most dating advice consists tedious behavioural analysis checklists, escalation strategies and attempts to part you from your hard earned money. This doesn't work for me, if a women wants me she is often pre-escalated. I dance Salsa sometimes. About two years ago I was at a class; you all stand in a circle each man with a women. You practice a move and then she moves on and you practice with someone else untill you practice with your first partner again. One women I was dancing with was making very intense, laser lock eye contact with me from the get-go. This was stange because most women I dance with treat eye contact with me like they will catch a disease from it. She was so intense that it looked rather painful for her. I'd never seen this before, I later realised that I've spent my whole life avoiding eye contact with women, finding any excuse not to do it. But as I've got more confident I've been letting them in, so to speak. Become curious, rather than afraid. But she kept doing it, around and around and around. She was clearly getting quite upset, almost in tears. I had no idea what to do, I started to ask her if she was alright or if I had upset her in some way. After the class I went over to see if she was alright, by this point I has some hazy idea that something romantic might be behind it all. She was with her mates and really angry with me, I got sent away, feeling somehow dirty. On the way home I was driving along and suddenly realised that her behaviour was a huge come-on, and that she'd taken a big emotional risk in front of her friends, exposing herself to possible rejection from me. I felt sad to my core for me and for her. I was so upset with my own stupidity that I pulled over and cried for a solid five minutes.


Women look at me and see a player. They assume I'm and arrogant twat. But just a frightened teenager, fumbling around trying to make odd bits of a jigsaw fit together with no idea what the finished picture is supposed to look like. Often the best thing I can do is sit on my hands and not look, not look, not look. Wait, even though I can feel women's eyes on me, even though I'm melting with anxiety. I am older guy so I'm expected to be cool even though I'm about the least cool guy you could meet. I want run around like a six year old and do fun stuff. But this appears to terrify women. I have to be cool and wait, wait, wait. Eventually a woman may drift over towards me, maybe stand or sit just out of direct line of sight. She might cough politely, she might talk just a bit too loudly to the waiter, or "drop something." By this point I'm about ready to explode, but instead of exploding I have to be cool, "Hi, how are you, I'm Whalebone (not my real name.) Wow, amazing handbag, I love the detailing." Sometimes I can pull this off even though I'm dying inside. More often though, I relax and become the excitable six year old who is fascinated by anything and everything. Want to share that fascination and the simple joy of being alive, but it just ends up with me looking at an often shapely pair of legs making a hasty and confused exit. It feels like there is too much of me. I can't cut myself down to fit in to the safe box of cool that people, not just women, need to feel secure. Life so so short and people seem to be afraid of just about everything. I have to work hard not to be scary. Its exhausting.
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