[aares]

I need some advice. Im going to make this as short as possible. My ex gf (18) and I (20) were together for almost 11 months, up until three weeks ago. The first 4-5 months were great, even she says so. Then, for the next 5-6 months I pretty much made her cry every night/everyother night keeping her up when she would have to go to school. I would either accuse her of ****ing other guys, her wanting her ex bf's, doing drugs in which she quit when we started "being a couple", and just stupid other **** like bringing up the past.

She tells me that she was afraid to even go to the store when she was with me, because of what I would say (aka: who were you ****ing etc.) To sum it up, I mentally abused her for 5-6 months. I never touched her physically though. I hardly let her see her friends, because the few she had, were the ones she did drugs with so I didnt want her to see them.

I broke up with her three other times during our 11 month relationship, for pretty much the same reasons (aka: me mentally abusing her/making her feel like ****), but I broke up with her all of those times. All of those times we broke up, we got back together less than a day later. Three weeks ago, I break up with her again.

Now, I want her back. For the first week of being apart, I kept nagging her, asking if she still wants me, when we are going to be together again, stuff like that and mostly every answer she gives me is, "I need time". I keep telling her how everything is going to change in which it will, because for once I finally am hurt because she told me she doesnt have those same feelings for me anymore. I start crying (without her knowing) which is VERY VERY rare. She tells me she is still attracted to me, and she still loves me, but she doesnt feel the same and she is scared it wont work out. She hasnt mentioned since about the feelings that she doesnt have anymore, so Im not positive that she really meant that.

She is easily persuaded but I cant convince her I have changed...I finally feel what it is like to be hurt...all the other times we broke up I never was hurt. I am hurting now, not her and she keeps saying the same thing over and over about "how you should have changed when we were together" and "I need more time". I went over to her house about a week and a half ago and she was saying the same stuff. I asked her if her mind will ever change, and she said, "give me more time", but I cannot wait myself. I am so used to being with her and I cant stand it. I realize what I put her through and what I did to her all of those times. I cant believe I didnt see what was going to happen eventually, which is clear and present now.

I contacted her best friend, she gave me her advice, which was to not bug her all the time about getting back together, for like a week and see what happens. She said that my ex gets really angry when I keep bugging her, so I took her advice. This was a little less than a week ago. The next day after taking her advice, we met up and went out to eat, and I felt that we both had a good time, and I didnt nag her about getting back together. For the next three days, she called a couple times, left me a few text mesages but I never answered her calls or responded to her text messages. The day after the three day no talking spree, I messaged her and told her, "I love you". She messaged back "You cant even answer when I call and you tell me you love me? Yeah right." I then called her and we talked a little, and she asked me about what I have been doing, and if I have met any other girls. This is really weird because her asking that makes me think that she doesnt want me with any other girl. It was just plain weird for her to ask that out of no where. I tell her yes, because I actually did meet new girls but I told her "I didnt try and get to know them or anything because I want you." Again, she didnt believe me. I asked her the same, and she told me that she didnt meet anyone new, and that she wasnt interested in anyone. This brings me to this morning, I just got done writing her a letter about my feelings and about what I miss about her. Im not sure if I should give her that or not but anyways I have no idea what to do...I am lost.

Does the whole "ignoring" thing work? I ignored her for three days which was hard as **** to do, and she gets pissed off. I ask her if she wants me to leave her alone completely, and she can use that time without me and figure what she wants, she says no. She wants to see me (not nearly as much as when we were together) and we have already met up like six or seven times since we have been apart. She definitely doesnt want to talk as much, and she admits to not wanting to talk as much. When we do talk, its usually for less than 5 minutes but there are exceptions. Several times she has said, "you are not going to change you will be the same" and she says this I think because her best friends ex did the same thing, and he never changed but I need to show her that I have changed and that I am still changing. It pissed me off because she excels at being free...it really seems like she doesnt miss me much at all or anything.

Do I just still keep from nagging her and give her more time or what? It has been around three weeks since we have been apart, and she has been spending a lot of her free time (besides school and work) with her best friend, and I think its because I never let her see her best friend when we were together, so maybe she is catching up on lost times? How much time should I give her? I still ask her if she thought about the whole situation, everytime we talk and she says yes, I just dont bug her more than that. God my mind is processing 1 million thoughts a minute and I just dont know. Do I act like I am not interested as much? I feel like if I act that way, she will say forget you and just get with someone else.


Suprisingly, she still has all of her pictures of me up in her room, my picture on her keychain, my picture directly above her bed so she can "look up at me" before she goes to bed, and the pic of me in her car. She still let me cuddle her in her bed with my hand under her shirt on her stomach, and she still kisses me and tells me she loves me. I need help. Thanks for your time, trust me this is as short as I could get it...it could be like a trillion pages long from what is going on inside my head. I appreciate any input/advice/comments other than how I am a dickhead and how I deserve everything that is happening because I already know most of that.

[lindya]

I have some respect for your honesty in describing the way you behaved towards this girl - you certainly haven't shied away from the fact that you acted like a dickhead, as you say.

On the other hand, have you really addressed what it is within you that made you want to exert so much control over this girl - to the extent that you would level abusive accusations at her both in public and in private?

You say that you've broken up with her before as a result of your emotionally and verbally abusive behaviour. You also say that the break-ups were your decision. Did they come about because you were concerned by the effect your behaviour was having on her and didn't want to subject her to further upset... or were the break-ups themselves designed to be abusive?

I'd be worried that if the two of you get back together you'd be on best behaviour for a while, but that the controlling side of you would gradually re-emerge and start making her life miserable again. If she were a friend of mine, I'd be telling her not to get back with you. Not out of any desire to hurt or punish you, but because you seem to have become enmeshed in a pattern of behaving badly to her, charming her into getting back with you, then treating her like crap again.

You've more or less said that you should have seen this (ie the break up) coming. That indicates to me that you're still stuck in a place where you're less concerned about the emotional harm you have caused to this girl, and more concerned about the fact that you've broken up with her and are missing the companionship. Would that be a fair assessment?

[d'Arthez]

Change of this magnitude takes more than 3 days of crying to achieve. Don't fool yourself, but admit it to yourself. And work hard on your issues to overcome them.

She is very wary, as she has experienced the Janus-faces of you. Which one is the one she will get, and if she does get one, is it independent of the other face? That is something she must figure out herself. And the more you pressurize her, the less likely it becomes that she returns in a healthy relationship with you. Frankly, I doubt if that is possible at the moment.

Also, it is somewhat worrying that you made the whole post about yourself, and your sufferings. 3 days of crying does not compare to six months of misery.
Do you realize what damage you have created? The accusations you threw at her for almost 6 months, have done nothing but corroded the image she has of yourself, and now she seems to have had enough for a while. Possibly she might never give you another chance, and you can't blame her for that.

Sadly there is no magic course to solve your issues, nor her issues. There are a few possibilities on what your issues might be, and sadly they can't be solved in three weeks time. The same might be true for the issues she has now.

[aares]

Wow...you people suprised me, no pun intended. I didnt think anyone could be on the same level with me but I guess I should have expected that since this is a relationship message board.

lindya - I am certain that the reasons in which I would control her, is because of my undying fear of being cheated on/decieved. The past break-ups were not because of my concern for her, but to try and gain more control. Damn I feel like a dickface right now. I feel like an evil dictator now that I think about it. I am really not a bad person...everyone says so...everyone including their parents, grandparents, and other family love me. I dont know wtf went wrong with me.

When you mentioned that I would be as nice as possible then my "evil controlling" side would return; everyone says that and I understand why...but I feel like I am in control of my mind now, I feel that I am willing to completely trust now because of me hurting. It was more than three days of crying...I have been hurting 100% of the time. The assesment you mentioned used to be correct...in the past the break-ups lasted a day long, because I lost the companionship, but this time it is different. I miss the woman I used to call baby, I miss the companionship, but I feel horrible for waht I have done moreover than how much I miss the companionship. I cannot possibly realize how much I have hurt her for those 5-6 months, but all I know is that I am hurting like a mother and it is not fun, that is why I can say I am more concerned for her sorrow than how much I miss us being together. I just want her to realize why I know I am changing, and how we are perfect for eachother when we arent fighting.


Arthez - I feel like I have changed and that I still am changing, and I think the only way I will know if I have TRULY changed is if she puts me to the test and see what happens. How else will I know if I have changed? I feels as if I have changed now, but I dont know how to make it official.

Why do you say that you dont think her returning in a healthy relationship is possible at the moment? What could time do? Im not good with this stuff as you can see. I know I cant blame her for not wanting me back, but in my head I invision a relationship with her that is perfect (though every couple has their problems, just not major ones like this) and she and I are both perfectly happy. I know it is my imagination, but I can feel it happening. How can I go about solving things? What would be the noble thing to do? If I truly havent changed, I feel it will be possible to supress my controlling/abusive feelings until they subside.

I have told her that I will go and seek professional help if she believes it is needed. She said that she doesnt know. What do I do in this time apart? I have told her that I am not seeking anyone else, and I am going to keep my faithfulness (no sex) to her until she comes around.

Thanks again for the replies I truly appreciate it. Oh, and what is the abbreviaton "NC" mean? I see it everywhere on here but I cant find the meaning.

[aares]

Well we had a talk in the evening yesterday, basically she told me that she needs time alone for now...it is so black and white but I dont understand. Here is the conversation:

Her: I am sorry about everything but that is how I feel right now and please just accept it. I dont know if this is the right decision it might be the wrong one but I will have to live with it if its the wrong decision.

Me: You know you are making the wrong choice in yout heart you still have feelings for me and dont let anything get in your way. You know that I am still changing for you and you need to understand that everythnig would be perfect but you cant see that. You tell me you love me and if you really did you would want to try again. I am not te controlling and abusive person I was dont listen to anyone esle but your heart.

Her: I am listening to my heart and I need to be by myself right now until I can figure myself out.

Me: No you arent listening to your heart you are going by your feelings that are in your brain. I know you can look past all of the rough times you went through. We are perfect for each other and you said so yourself. Is your love fake highschool drama love or is your love for me real? Think about it.

Her: My love is real for you but right now I need to be alone.

Me: If your love is real you would see through everything. What do you need to figure out? Didnt you say we were meant for each other and togerther always and forever?

Her: Yes I did say that I just need my time to myself so give it to me ok?

Me: Just realize that I am not the immature guy that I was. This is a learning experience for me and I still am changing. We have something and we can continue it together. Look how mand relationships nowdays are all about control...we can be the more intelligent couple who have a non abusive non controlling relationship and show everyone how happy we are. I am in love with you and that is the bottom line.

Her: Just let me go for now please?

Me: How do you just let someone go that you love? Obviously your love is false and your heart is cold to tell me to just let you go.

Her: No its not

Me: Then you tell me how you let someone go that you are in love with? Why is it easy for you? Why arent you the one who cries and who hurts and who misses you everyday? Why dont I pop up in your head right when you wake up like you do for me?

Her: Because I used to be like that with you but you never realized it and I do think about you and love you but I need to be by myself right nowand you need to understand that and I am sorry.

Me: Why cant you be like that with me now? We could have more love and more respect for each other than anthing. Isnt that what you wanted? Wouldnt that be great? I should have realized that before but I do realize it now. I dont think you want to forget about me and I dont want to forget about you.

Her: Just let me alone for a while.

Me: Ok but you know we have something special and now that I have changed we whould have the perfect relationship that not many people have. I am not trying to get with anyone else and I am remaining faithful until you have come around and realize that you made wthe wrong decision but at the same time I am not going to be your back-up guy or whatever I am not going to give you loads of time to realize ****. Just think about how it would be.

This is so messed.

[ReluctantRomeo]

Originally posted by aares
Her: My love is real for you but right now I need to be alone.

Her: Yes I did say that I just need my time to myself so give it to me ok?

Her: Just let me go for now please?

Her: Just let me alone for a while.

Let me try to interpret what she's saying here.... girls can be so indirect and unclear sometimes

My 2 cents: you need to take this one on the chin. Kudos to you for accepting that you have behaved badly - you now have to be prepared to pay the price.

So respect her decision and stick with this. In the meantime, go get therapy to sort out your underlying issues - control, manipulation, etc. This will be good whether or not you ever get back with her.

In the meantime, start by not attempting to control her now.

[Devildog]

I don't think you have changed a bit with this whole thing. You say you are not the "controlling" person you were, but your every response has been to pressure her and try to tell her how she should think, and what she feels in her heart. That, in an of itself, is controlling. She knows better than anyone what is in her heart and her mind.

[d'Arthez]

Originally posted by aares
Arthez - I feel like I have changed and that I still am changing, and I think the only way I will know if I have TRULY changed is if she puts me to the test and see what happens. How else will I know if I have changed? I feels as if I have changed now, but I dont know how to make it official.

That logic does not apply. If you were physically beaten up by someone, normal behavior is to avoid that particular person, especially if you have to give up the control of the situation. A relationship is that way. She has given you chances enough to show that you love her and are mature enough to handle the responsibilities. You blew it.
She might not give you another chance, but she is not responsible for your issues, and she is not responsible to help you through your issues.

Why do you say that you dont think her returning in a healthy relationship is possible at the moment? What could time do? Im not good with this stuff as you can see. I know I cant blame her for not wanting me back, but in my head I invision a relationship with her that is perfect (though every couple has their problems, just not major ones like this) and she and I are both perfectly happy. I know it is my imagination, but I can feel it happening. How can I go about solving things? What would be the noble thing to do? If I truly havent changed, I feel it will be possible to supress my controlling/abusive feelings until they subside.

I can imagine myself to be married to Britney Spears, or someone close to me. Does not improve the likelihood of that happening.
You can't control your controlling / abusive feelings until they subside. The human psyche does not work that way. You need time to deal with your issues, and she needs time to deal with your abuse. Perhaps, you will come together to form a healthy relationship, but it cannot happen before the issues are resolved; and then you or her might meet someone else instead.

In your conversation, you try to manipulate her back in a relationship, whilst that is under the current condition not the healthiest option that is on her mind. You use blatantly manupalitive tactics, in for instance

Her: My love is real for you but right now I need to be alone.

Me: If your love is real you would see through everything. What do you need to figure out? Didnt you say we were meant for each other and togerther always and forever?

or

Her: Just let me go for now please?

Me: How do you just let someone go that you love? Obviously your love is false and your heart is cold to tell me to just let you go.

You have no right to any of her emotions or feelings. She is responsible for hers, and you are responsible for yours. By using this tactic, you make her responsible for your happiness, and that is a responsibility no man or woman can bear. Clearly you are not as recovered from your abusive ways as you believe.

I have told her that I will go and seek professional help if she believes it is needed. She said that she doesnt know. What do I do in this time apart? I have told her that I am not seeking anyone else, and I am going to keep my faithfulness (no sex) to her until she comes around.

Professional help is needed. But you should not do it for her, but you should do it for yourself. The are no guaranteed outcomes, especially with regards to your (ex)relationship, nor with the immediate results of professional help.

Thanks again for the replies I truly appreciate it. Oh, and what is the abbreviaton "NC" mean? I see it everywhere on here but I cant find the meaning.

NC= No contact; you avoid all contact with your ex, in any form. No emailing, no IM-ing, no phoning, and obviously not seeing eachother.

[ReluctantRomeo]

Originally posted by d'Arthez
I can imagine myself to be married to Britney Spears, or someone close to me. Does not improve the likelihood of that happening.

d'Arthez and Britney? Now that's an unexpected match

Professional help is needed. But you should not do it for her, but you should do it for yourself.

Word.

NC= No contact; you avoid all contact with your ex, in any form. No emailing, no IM-ing, no phoning, and obviously not seeing eachother.

Exactly. Give *her* the control and let her decide. Right now she has made it clear what this means.

[aares]

I havent had any form of contact with her since yesterday. Should I call her or message her and tell her that I love her? I feel like I need to keep mentioning to her that I love her and I am thinking about her. On the other hand, I dont want to get too pushy/annoying to her. Would it be a bad thing to ask her to go out to eat or go to the movies or something as friends, or should I just let it go until she contacts me? I AM afraid that she will find someone else during this "break", thats why I feel the need to let her know that I havent stopped loving her/caring for her and that I want her. Again I dont know is this is a good thing or a bad thing?

I want to concentrate on her feelings and think about everything that must have been going through her head during the abusive months and I want to try and change everything around and try and help her with the damage I have done. Do I let her know that I want to help her with this? I really dont think I can help her, but maybe I should let her know that I am thinking about everyting I have ****ed up on, and how she must have felt?

Our conversation does make me seem arrogant/controlling/pushy, but I just wanted to get my point across. I am normally like that, I always try and be persuasive but no one ever has said anything about me doing it. Thanks again for the replies!

[outdated]

YOu say you want to concentrate on her feelings, but you still want to contact her when her feelings don't want you to. If you were truly listening to her feelings, then you would know what to do.

[aares]

Well I am really stupid when it comes to stuff like this...so I shouldnt even message her and tell her I love her?

[Treasa]

No. Leave her alone.

[ConfusedInOC]

Originally posted by d'Arthez
Change of this magnitude takes more than 3 days of crying to achieve. Don't fool yourself, but admit it to yourself. And work hard on your issues to overcome them.

She is very wary, as she has experienced the Janus-faces of you. Which one is the one she will get, and if she does get one, is it independent of the other face? That is something she must figure out herself. And the more you pressurize her, the less likely it becomes that she returns in a healthy relationship with you. Frankly, I doubt if that is possible at the moment.

Also, it is somewhat worrying that you made the whole post about yourself, and your sufferings. 3 days of crying does not compare to six months of misery.
Do you realize what damage you have created? The accusations you threw at her for almost 6 months, have done nothing but corroded the image she has of yourself, and now she seems to have had enough for a while. Possibly she might never give you another chance, and you can't blame her for that.

Sadly there is no magic course to solve your issues, nor her issues. There are a few possibilities on what your issues might be, and sadly they can't be solved in three weeks time. The same might be true for the issues she has now.

I agree.

Implementing change is not easy. Have you gone to counseling?

[North Shore]

You should absolutely leave this poor girl alone.

How dare you tell her that the love she professes for you is false? If she didn't love you then she wouldn't have taken quite so much sh*t from you now would she?

You made mention in your 1st post that you never hurt her physically. So what? Emotional abuse such as you inflicted can often be harder to recover from.

You seriously need professional help. Seriously. You say that your own pain makes you realize how bad her pain must be. That's bullsh*t. From everything I've read here, in your own words, you still can't see beyond your own wants, needs and desires. There are no needs beyond your own. If you loved this girl, truly loved her, then it would be HER happiness that concerns you, not your own. You don't miss the companionship, you miss the control.

I say again - seek professional help. You are young enough that you can overcome your own behaviors and insecurities before you emotionally damage another girl. And that is what you have done here, inflicted emotional damage and saddled her with more relationship baggage than a girl her age deserves. Leave her to heal the wounds you inflicted - DON'T inflict more.