I just have a little scenario that I would like some input on and how you would go about the situation.
I just left a 10 year abusive relationship and the ex and I have 2 girls together, one is 9 the other is 5. I have full legal/sole custody of them because their father and I were NOT married when we had the girls and NEVER married after that, so I was automatically given full/sole custody in my state (Minnesota). My issue is that I feel the girls and I deserve a little vacation to take not only my mind off of the split, but to take the girls' mind off of the split. I was planning to take them on a one week vacation to go see some friends of mine in Virginia. I had already talked to the girls about going to the beach, going to Busch Gardens... etc.... they are so excited.
I didn't tell the ex about it yet since I didn't get the tickets yet. But he found out through one of the girls bringing it up to him. So... he called me while I was at work to ask me when I was going to tell him about the trip. I said I was gonna tell him once I purchased the tickets becuase I wasn't 100% sure yet that we were going. He got extremely mad at me and told me that I was not allowed to take them with me. Even though he has no legal rights to the girls... My lawyer told me that I am able to take them anywhere even move out of state since he has no legal rights to them and I don't need his permission. But... he's telling me I'm not allowed to take them there!!! For only one week!!! he said "i" can go but I have to leave the girls with him... I asked him where the girls would stay and he said "I dunno"
He said I can take them ANYWHERE but Virginia because I have friends there that he is jealous of. I'm so sick of his childish ways. I don't know what to do anymore. I don't want to put my girls through more of his abusive ways... and this I feel is robbing the girls of some "fun" time to get their minds off of all that has happened.
Has anybody else been through this before? What should I do? Friends and family say "go anyway"... what would you do? I would be going July 5 - 12... not like I'm gonna be gone for 1 year!! Any advice is welcome! thanks...
PS... i also asked him why he won't let me take them... he says because I am unfit and that when I go there I will be unstable.... I feel that he is using the kids to get to me which is not fair to the kids... can't he let them live??
ignore him, and pay attention to your lawyer. Or if you're still dubious, contact the local women's shelter and talk to the counsellor there about your rights (she'll prolly tell you the same thing the lawyer does, that you're free and clear to travel), and that your ex is merely doing his best to intimidate you. If you're STILL hesitant, check with the police station, take notes and leave them someplace safe. In fact, do that with every person you talk with so that when your ex tries to pull something stupid – and he will, because it's still all about him exerting control over you – you've got back-up in writing.
meanwhile, don't let him get on you about this ... after all, you're not 100 percent sure the trip is on, so he's blowing hot air at you until the decision is fully executed, you know?
__________________ "It's the longest Hail Mary pass in the history of either football or Marys," said Rep. Barney Frank, one of the chief bailout negotiators.
Travel with a copy of the custody documents. When I travel out of country with my kids, I carry documents signed by my XH indicating that he knows that I am taking them, where we are going, and for how long. That is now almost a requirement for one parent to take kids out of the country - married or divorced. But we have shared custody, so he does have a say.
Legally, he has no "legal" rights to the girls because in the state of MN... if you are not married when you have your kids... physical legal custody automatically goes to the mother, because they make the unwed father sign a form saying... yes, i am the father but I am giving all "legal" rights to the mother since we are not married.
So... legally... he has no rights to the kids. I do let him see them regularly though. I don't keep him from his kids. If he wants to establish any type of custody then he has to go to court to establish it, which he hasn't so far.
They can't "make" you sign anything. Anything that requires your signature requires your consent. Anything that doesn't require your consent comes in the form of a court order.
Your story sounds a little "dicey" in that area, but it doesn't really matter. It sounds to me like he signed away his parenting rights willingly. Probably in exchange for not having to pay child support. Regardless of the reason, he signed them away, and he'll have to live with that or petition the court.
If he has no right to tell you otherwise, and it is a harmless vacation, right? Simply do as you please.
__________________
The beauty of the soul shines out when a man bears with composure one heavy mischance after another, not because he does not feel them, but because he is a man of high and heroic temper.
- Aristotle
Why is he jealous of your friends in Virginia. I mean, from what you have posted, its obvious you can take your daughters there regardless of whether he approves or not, so its not really an issue. But there must be something more to this if he is so threatened by some people you know in virginia that he resorts to these kinds of childish tactics. Is there another man there? One you might potentially be involved with romantically? If that's the case then he is probably scared that he might be replaced one day as the 'daddy' to his girls and this is his way of trying to stall the inevitable. He probably doesn't like the idea of his daughters seeing some other guy spending time with mommy. Of course, this is just an assumption on my part, and if its wrong I apologize, but I think the reasons for you choosing to visit these friends in Virginia is probably pretty significant to your dilemna and you won't put your ex at ease, or yourself until you confront and resolve this particular issue.
They can't "make" you sign anything. Anything that requires your signature requires your consent. Anything that doesn't require your consent comes in the form of a court order.
Your story sounds a little "dicey" in that area, but it doesn't really matter. It sounds to me like he signed away his parenting rights willingly. Probably in exchange for not having to pay child support. Regardless of the reason, he signed them away, and he'll have to live with that or petition the court.
If he has no right to tell you otherwise, and it is a harmless vacation, right? Simply do as you please.
I live in Minnesota, and have the same situation as the OP.
What happens here is if you are not married when you have a baby, and even if the father signs the birth certificate and a recognition of parentage, sole legal and physical custody goes to the mother. The father has to petition the court for visitation rights to have a 'say' in the upbringing of their child (remember that I'm speaking that this is how it is legally, not how it should be ethically). Until he does so, the mother has the reins in any decision regarding the baby. And, even if he's paying child support this is how it is.
So, to the OP, it sounds like you know that you are able to (legally) take them on a vacation--are you trying to ask if doing so is worth suffering his wrath?
__________________ Expectations are premeditated resentments
After fighting with the ex the whole weekend and after tape recording all of his threats to do bodily harm to me... i have decided that I am no longer living my life by him and I have purchased the tickets whether he likes it or not. I tried reasoning with him that the kids deserve a vacation and he is wrong for trying to prevent that.
As far as Virginia goes... they are friends of mine whom I've known for 17 years. There is one (the oldest) whom I am romantically involved with but he is the most understanding of understanding people. He always says that children come first. We've already discussed issues and the insecurities that the ex has. My friend in VA has said that there is no one that could ever replace my girls' father... which is exactly what I have told the ex. But he's told me I could take the girls anywhere in the world but not VA... I got the tickets already and he says "We'll see about that"... another threat.
The reason I asked if I could take the girls was not because I know I can, but because I am afraid that this will set off their abusive father to do something to harm me. I am starting to fear for my safety and my therapist also told me that this is one of the most dangerous times to ever come around the ex.
That's why I was wondering what anyone else would do in this situation?? Would you go - knowing you have every right to take your kids... or would you go by the controlling manipulative tactics the ex displays??
The trip is irrelevant you need to worry about your safety while in MN. He could care less where you take the kids, he's trying to control you. So the question about custody is irrelevant.
I'd be getting a restraining order, and order of protection and/or whatever else is necessary. Frankly I'd be worry about him around the kids - has he ever been abusive to them?! Is there any concern that he will disappear with your kids? If yes to either one of these is yes, then I'd cease all visitation.
Are you afraid of his hurting you when you two exchange the kids? If so have someone else do it for you.
That's why I was wondering what anyone else would do in this situation?? Would you go - knowing you have every right to take your kids... or would you go by the controlling manipulative tactics the ex displays??
If my answer to the question wasn't clear - sorry hell yes I'd head to VA!
I live in Minnesota, and have the same situation as the OP.
What happens here is if you are not married when you have a baby, and even if the father signs the birth certificate and a recognition of parentage, sole legal and physical custody goes to the mother. The father has to petition the court for visitation rights to have a 'say' in the upbringing of their child (remember that I'm speaking that this is how it is legally, not how it should be ethically). Until he does so, the mother has the reins in any decision regarding the baby. And, even if he's paying child support this is how it is.
So, to the OP, it sounds like you know that you are able to (legally) take them on a vacation--are you trying to ask if doing so is worth suffering his wrath?
That makes more sense. Thanks!
As far as going to VA goes. You should go, and stay, after you get a restraining order with your recordings. Make him petition the court to see his kids if he likes threats. Voicing your distaste is one thing, threatening harm is another completely.
I just have a little scenario that I would like some input on and how you would go about the situation.
I just left a 10 year abusive relationship and the ex and I have 2 girls together, one is 9 the other is 5. I have full legal/sole custody of them because their father and I were NOT married when we had the girls and NEVER married after that, so I was automatically given full/sole custody in my state (Minnesota). My issue is that I feel the girls and I deserve a little vacation to take not only my mind off of the split, but to take the girls' mind off of the split. I was planning to take them on a one week vacation to go see some friends of mine in Virginia. I had already talked to the girls about going to the beach, going to Busch Gardens... etc.... they are so excited.
I didn't tell the ex about it yet since I didn't get the tickets yet. But he found out through one of the girls bringing it up to him. So... he called me while I was at work to ask me when I was going to tell him about the trip. I said I was gonna tell him once I purchased the tickets becuase I wasn't 100% sure yet that we were going. He got extremely mad at me and told me that I was not allowed to take them with me.
I guess it depends on the wording in the custody agreement. Granted, you might not have the traditional agreement like I have. Both of us are entitled to 2 weeks uninterrupted vacation with the kids as long as we give each other a fair amount of notice.
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Even though he has no legal rights to the girls... My lawyer told me that I am able to take them anywhere even move out of state since he has no legal rights to them and I don't need his permission.
Even if he had legal rights, as crappy as it is, if you are the custodial parent you still could move out of state with them if you wanted to.
But that could have undesirable consequences as well. A good lawyer can get it so that the father has to pay no child support if the mother takes his kids from him.
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But... he's telling me I'm not allowed to take them there!!! For only one week!!! he said "i" can go but I have to leave the girls with him... I asked him where the girls would stay and he said "I dunno"
He is wrong, you can take them on vacation if you want to.
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He said I can take them ANYWHERE but Virginia because I have friends there that he is jealous of. I'm so sick of his childish ways. I don't know what to do anymore. I don't want to put my girls through more of his abusive ways... and this I feel is robbing the girls of some "fun" time to get their minds off of all that has happened.
Has anybody else been through this before? What should I do? Friends and family say "go anyway"... what would you do?
If your lawyer says go, then thats all you need to know. Your lawyer will handle any crap he sends your way.
Legally, he has no "legal" rights to the girls because in the state of MN... if you are not married when you have your kids... physical legal custody automatically goes to the mother
LOL...physical custody goes to the mother no matter what state you are in. If a father fights for custody, no matter where he is, he WILL lose unless it can be proven beyond a reasonable doubt the mother is unfit.
Fathers get the shaft, period.
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because they make the unwed father sign a form saying... yes, i am the father but I am giving all "legal" rights to the mother since we are not married.
And if he didn't sign it? I don't get it. Why "make" him sign a form? Why not just make it law and cut out the signing altogether. Why not completely tell the father "tought sh#t"?
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So... legally... he has no rights to the kids. I do let him see them regularly though. I don't keep him from his kids. If he wants to establish any type of custody then he has to go to court to establish it, which he hasn't so far.
I hope that clarifies it a little.
Is he ordered to pay child support from a government that takes away his rights?
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