I used to work for a state agency that dealt with child support issues, among other things. I was always amazed at how many men would complain about women "threatening" to make them pay child support.
Let's be clear: it is not the woman in question who says you have to pay child support. It is the STATE that says you have to pay child support. Paying child support is a legal duty, not a punishment.
Now, if a woman doesn't go to court, no order to pay child support will be issued. Courts can't enforce the law if they aren't aware of a violation. But legally, a man is required to pay child support regardless of what the mother does or deosn't do.
What is these guys' reasoning process? Should they be free to father children and stick the mothers with the bill? C'mon guys. Get serious.
These men are losers. They don't want to own up to their responsibility. They should be shot.
If you bring a child into this world, you should help support and raise this child. If you don't want to raise the child, that's your decision. But you HAVE to support your child.
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And any lawyer will tell you that the terminology "Child support" is misguided.
Its used by the custodial parent, for whatever they care to do with it. Not a dime need be delegated to the childs needs . Only a few US states allow the court ordered parent to challenge the management of their Child support money.
So gosh the parent who is getting reamed with high support payments whilst the custodial parent gets their nails done and spa treatments , really isnt supporting the child ....but instead well lets just say pampering the account of the custodial parent.
No custodial parent is MANDATED to go to court for support, its optional and that is that. Unless you are on state funded programs for the kids - food stamps, healthcare...etc.
Been there and never asked for a dime for my kids! They were priceless and the best thing to be given from the marital demise. Why ask for custody if you cant prove to the courts you can raise them yourself!! Pull up the boot strings and deal with it. My sons are full grown adults and neither feels that they went without....
Wouldnt it be a wonderful world if the parent who got custody would just be happy and grateful for having the years and special moments with the kids. But then, geee....guess they wouldnt have pretty nails or that luxury car without that support check....
Editors notes: Yes my view point is less then pleasant yet it comes from seeing people of my own gender get greedy and use the kids for financial greed and personal wants. And yes, not a dime went to those kids and it still goes on.....
Tayla, the amount of child support is a seperate issue. Some men (and it's usually men) do get "reamed." But in most cases, the reason they get reamed is they don't show up in court. Or, if they do, they have no documentation proving their income or expenses. Legally, the court has to award something. So, if the man doesn't come to court or lacks documentation, the court simply awards whatever the mother asks. They have nothing else to go on.
Forgive me, but I think not "asking for a dime" is foolish. Is it really worth risking having your kids go without just so you can brag about what a great mother you are? That's terribly selfish.
Enema, your plan would basically give men the right to force women to have abortions whenever the man wanted them to. That would never pass legal--or moral--muster.
Enema, your plan would basically give men the right to force women to have abortions whenever the man wanted them to. That would never pass legal--or moral--muster.
No. Read it again.
If the woman wants to have the kid, she can. Without his money.
This just gives both sexes equal power in choosing to be a parent.
Enema, I did read it. And your plan would enable men to basically blackmail women into having abortions by threatening to deny financial to children they themselves fathered. Legally, that is coercion.
And any lawyer will tell you that the terminology "Child support" is misguided.
Its used by the custodial parent, for whatever they care to do with it. Not a dime need be delegated to the childs needs . Only a few US states allow the court ordered parent to challenge the management of their Child support money.
So gosh the parent who is getting reamed with high support payments whilst the custodial parent gets their nails done and spa treatments , really isnt supporting the child ....but instead well lets just say pampering the account of the custodial parent.
No custodial parent is MANDATED to go to court for support, its optional and that is that. Unless you are on state funded programs for the kids - food stamps, healthcare...etc.
Been there and never asked for a dime for my kids! They were priceless and the best thing to be given from the marital demise. Why ask for custody if you cant prove to the courts you can raise them yourself!! Pull up the boot strings and deal with it. My sons are full grown adults and neither feels that they went without....
Wouldnt it be a wonderful world if the parent who got custody would just be happy and grateful for having the years and special moments with the kids. But then, geee....guess they wouldnt have pretty nails or that luxury car without that support check....
Editors notes: Yes my view point is less then pleasant yet it comes from seeing people of my own gender get greedy and use the kids for financial greed and personal wants. And yes, not a dime went to those kids and it still goes on.....
Child support is reimbursement to the custodial parent for monies spent.
If I felt like it, I could wallpaper my bathroom with it.
Do you really think a court is going to say the child gets the money to use as they see fit??
Sounds like somebody is married to someone who has to pay child support and he doesn't want to.
Don't have unprotected sex if you aren't willing to pay for the aftermath.
There are plenty of custodial parents who use the child support GRANTED TO THEM BY A COURT for the children. But again, it is reimbursement to the custodial parent.
Every court SHOULD mandate c/s to the custodial parent - whether that be the mom or the dad.
I received c/s for 12 years and NEVER increased it and he got away with a bargain. The courts would have doubled it had we gone through the state system; but I was too anxious to just rid myself of him that we bargained before court. I was stupid and I should have gone back every year I could have to have it upped.
Enema, I did read it. And your plan would enable men to basically blackmail women into having abortions by threatening to deny financial to children they themselves fathered. Legally, that is coercion.
I totally agree.
How about men not have unprotected sex if they don't want to pay for a child?
How about men not have unprotected sex if they don't want to pay for a child?
What a bogus answer.
Plenty of men have unprotected sex and the woman still gets pregnant, either through accident or design.
The result is - SHE gets to choose what to do with it. The current system is completely a one-way street. There has to be a better way to protect mens rights.
Last edited by Enema; 22nd October 2009 at 11:19 PM..
Enema, I did read it. And your plan would enable men to basically blackmail women into having abortions by threatening to deny financial to children they themselves fathered. Legally, that is coercion.
Enema, condoms are darn near 100% foolproof is used consistently and correctly. The 80% figure you see on condom failure rates include people who don't use them all the time, as well as those who use them improperly--e.g. using a petroleum-based lubricant, which destroys latex.
Your plan would let men knock up as many women as they wanted and, simply by refusing to sign a paper, get off scott-free. Meanwhile, the women would have the choice of submitting to an abortion they didn't want or raising the child with no support from the father. Either way, the women get screwed.
Your plan would let men knock up as many women as they wanted and, simply by refusing to sign a paper, get off scott-free.
You're being purposefully dense I think.
Women have a multitude of ways to stop getting pregnant, both before and after the deed. Men can't "knock up as many women as they want" - get real.
The piece of paper gives men their rights back. The right not to have a child.
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Meanwhile, the women would have the choice of submitting to an abortion they didn't want or raising the child with no support from the father. Either way, the women get screwed.
How is that fair?
So, their only two options are to have an abortion, or raise a child alone?
No, enema, you're being dense. You're also changing the subject from child support to birth control. Now, I fully support birth control. I fully support the right to choose abortion.
But we were talking about what happens AFTER conception. My point is that a man has a choice about whether or not to become a father at the point of conception. And that's it. After conception occurs, his choices are gone.
Under your plan, men would get a free get-out-of-paying-child-support ticket. All he would have to do is refuse to sign said paper, and walk away. No, matter what, they win.
Not so the women. They cannot suddenly choose to not be pregnant. So, they would either be forced by the state to get an abortion, or they would have to raise the child without the father's financial support. Either way, they lose.
What incentive would there be under your plan to get men to use contraception? None. On the contrary, by totally eliminating their obligation to pay child support, they'd be even less likely to give a damn about birth control.
In a way, this is a useless point. There is no way in hell the legal system in this country would force women to get abortions. Not a single legislature would vote for it, not a single court would find it constitutional. That's the kind of stuff you can get away with in dictatorships, not libera; democracies.
I think the easier way, and the only way for men to truely take control of their own reproductive rights, is to bank their sperm and then SNIP, Vasectomy City.
Then we wouldn't have any of this horse **** of men saying "wahhh, I didn't want to be a father even though I know sex can lead to pregnancy wahhhh! SHE should have her womb scraped out cuz I don't wanna think about anything but getting laid! Wahhhh!"
But none of you will put in that commitment.
__________________
may your sons' wives rejoice as often as your own; may your daughters marry men of your worth.
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