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3 years of waiting...for nothing


The Other Man / Woman The other side of the story: Support and discussion for those who find themselves involved with a committed partner.

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Old 21st December 2017, 10:27 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by PhillyLibertyBelle View Post
You know me better than anyone. I have shared my deepest desires, hopes, passions, fears, and anxieties with you. I have cried with you, from the heart cried with you. You have said that I need to sort myself out and you are absolutely correct. My actions and my decisions do not align with what I want most and therefore I am in turmoil.

An apology can only begin the mending and to truly heal completely I will need to sincerely and with integrity align my every action with what I truly want for me and for my life. Your gift of friendship after my appalling behavior is very meaningful to me however we are more than friends. I am unable to separate my intense emotions of desire, romantic and intellectual, from my feelings of connection and friendship. Our shared experiences elucidate my true wants and desires and the intoxicating rush of love is truly overwhelming. I am wholeheartedly distraught and utterly apologize for disrespecting your time, your feelings, your emotions, and your open arms. You deserve a whole person response.

I am bent, not broken. I am a problem that I can solve.

You deserve better and you will receive and enjoy better.

Yours,
Anthony dressed as Hamlet

DELETE
The nerve!

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Originally Posted by PhillyLibertyBelle View Post
Afterthought.. an apology to me is his healing? Holy narcissism!
Has this man never heard of the UNSENT letter? Geeez. It's been FOUR YEARS. LEAVE IT BE!

PhillyLibertyBelle, Ella Fitzgerald sang it best:

Now you say you're lonely

You cry the long night through

Well, you can cry me a river

Cry me a river

I cried a river over you

Now you say you're sorry

For being so untrue

Well, you can cry me a river

Cry me a river

'Cause I cried, I cried, I cried a river over you

You drove me, nearly drove me, out of my head

While you never shed a tear

Remember, I remember, all that you said?

You told me love was too plebeian

Told me you were through with me and

And now you say, you say you love me

Well, just to prove you do

Come on and cry me a river

Cry me a river

'Cause I cried a river over you
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Old 22nd December 2017, 1:46 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by elaine567 View Post
Trouble with all these promises and believing them was the context.
This a not a single man telling her "We will be together always" and a week later showing up with a proposal and a ring, this was a married man trying to get back with his wife, telling his OW to basically wait around.

Is it not up to her to go "Wait a minute, something ain't quite right here."?
Is it not an unrealistic level of naivety to wait around for a man who had basically shut her down in favour of his wife and kids?
You’re missing the fundamental point

He wasn’t trying to get back with his wife, those were lies too because he was with OP at the same time.

I’m concerned at how you portray MM as having abdicated all of his own personal responsibility for his fidelity and thrown that responsibility on OP. If he’s working on his marriage go work on it.

Unless you think OP is that kind of movie star good looking with the body of a Playmate. Ultimately reconciliation is on the responsibility of the WS not the OW/OM
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Old 22nd December 2017, 2:28 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by PhillyLibertyBelle View Post
Lots. AP are all fantasy!

It’s like being a dry drunk and not sober!
No, it's not!

It's more like saying you are sober while you're drinking! The guy is a blatant liar and a thief...stealing your heart and your time because he's deceived you on several levels.

Sure, you had choices. Now you know to never wait for any man ever again. When a man REALLY wants to be with you - NOTHING stands in his way!
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Old 22nd December 2017, 3:05 AM   #64
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This is an excellent illustration of the type of man you are dealing with - and will hopefully help you see him for what he is and move on.

I was an MM in an affair and that makes me (or made me) a complete POS. But after several months of cheating and lies, I began to break down. I couldn't handle it - the stress, the duplicity, the cheating, the lies. I became unhinged, depressed, desperate. I couldn't sleep at nights, I ended up losing my job because my performance levels dropped so low....the thought of ending it all even crossed my mind (but I never seriously entertained that idea).

Getting myself in that kind of mess meant that my A was quickly discovered, confession followed and the A ended. My wife and myself are now two years into reconcilliation - it's very tough, but we are doing much better than I could have hoped two years ago.

So, having been through this, I am always amazed when I hear of people maintaining affairs for 3, 4, 5 - even 10+ year, leading that double life. I was falling apart just after a few months. Equally, I don't understand people who have an affair, end it, reconcile...and then have another affair! I just can't belive that having made that mistake once, people get themselves intot hat situation again. I can officially say that there's more chance of me landing on Mars than having another affair - and I don't own a spacesuit!

The MM in this case fits into this category. He is able to lead double lives for years without it affecting his ability to appear and behave normally, and rpesumably without feeling too much stress or guilt. This takes a very special type of person (and not in the complimentary sense). He is a very angerous person to be in a relationship with and could probably never be trusted. Just try to be glad that you can see this clearly now and try to release yourself from his spell.

Good luck x
I agree with you Jenkins. You are just one of those( no offence intended) dopey guys who gets involved in an A and can't handle it because basically you are a person with integrity and feelings.

xMM I was involved with was , in hindsight, a man with a personality disorder. I regard him as an extremely dangerous person nowadays. I missed so many signs due to the oblique references he would make to his wife and the situation. Affair Fog!!!

It was a long term on/off A and he never showed and ounce of guilt or remorse. He said what his wife didn't know, wouldn't hurt her.

There is a vast difference between that and what you did Jenkins.

I have printed out and saved all the emails he sent me. If he contacts me again, I will use them to get rid of him, or send them to his wife. The psychological damage that I have suffered is being repaired and there is no way I want contact with him again. Yes ... I know somebody will say it was my own fault. Granted. Narcissists are very good at attaching themselves to needy good hearted people. I was very needy for sure.

It took years for me to wake up to what he really is.

You are a good person and I have much admiration for the way you have addressed your life issues.... I'm a little bit keen on you in a maternal way ...LOL

Seasons Greetings,
Poppy.
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Old 22nd December 2017, 4:13 AM   #65
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I agree with you Jenkins. You are just one of those( no offence intended) dopey guys who gets involved in an A and can't handle it because basically you are a person with integrity and feelings.

xMM I was involved with was , in hindsight, a man with a personality disorder. I regard him as an extremely dangerous person nowadays. I missed so many signs due to the oblique references he would make to his wife and the situation. Affair Fog!!!

It was a long term on/off A and he never showed and ounce of guilt or remorse. He said what his wife didn't know, wouldn't hurt her.

There is a vast difference between that and what you did Jenkins.

I have printed out and saved all the emails he sent me. If he contacts me again, I will use them to get rid of him, or send them to his wife. The psychological damage that I have suffered is being repaired and there is no way I want contact with him again. Yes ... I know somebody will say it was my own fault. Granted. Narcissists are very good at attaching themselves to needy good hearted people. I was very needy for sure.

It took years for me to wake up to what he really is.

You are a good person and I have much admiration for the way you have addressed your life issues.... I'm a little bit keen on you in a maternal way ...LOL

Seasons Greetings,
Poppy.
Thank you Poppy for the above. How amazing it fits my situation perfectly as well. It's like you're writing out my own thoughts/feelings.

At the end of the day, if you're a person with integrity, no matter how needy you are, one day you'd wake up and see the situation for what it is. For me, it took almost 4 years to be able to get out of the affair fog. My x-mm is exactly like yours, word by word. A master of manipulation, who approached me when I was at my loneliest and most needy/vulnerable position. Also, he told me he never felt any guilt. Huge sense of entitlement. It seems for people like him the concepts of "lie", "deception", "betrayal", "guilt" don't exist.

I, too, now see him as a dangerous person I never want anything to do with ever again. Indeed, i told myself i'd rather die of loneliness than get on that hell of a roller coaster ride again.
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Old 22nd December 2017, 7:24 AM   #66
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Originally Posted by Poppy47 View Post
I agree with you Jenkins. You are just one of those( no offence intended) dopey guys who gets involved in an A and can't handle it because basically you are a person with integrity and feelings.

xMM I was involved with was , in hindsight, a man with a personality disorder. I regard him as an extremely dangerous person nowadays. I missed so many signs due to the oblique references he would make to his wife and the situation. Affair Fog!!!

It was a long term on/off A and he never showed and ounce of guilt or remorse. He said what his wife didn't know, wouldn't hurt her.

There is a vast difference between that and what you did Jenkins.

I have printed out and saved all the emails he sent me. If he contacts me again, I will use them to get rid of him, or send them to his wife. The psychological damage that I have suffered is being repaired and there is no way I want contact with him again. Yes ... I know somebody will say it was my own fault. Granted. Narcissists are very good at attaching themselves to needy good hearted people. I was very needy for sure.

It took years for me to wake up to what he really is.

You are a good person and I have much admiration for the way you have addressed your life issues.... I'm a little bit keen on you in a maternal way ...LOL

Seasons Greetings,
Poppy.
I am so glad for you that you saw him for what he was.

Most of us bs are not bad people. We may not be perfect, but we are just like everyone else, trying our best to get along. If a mm/mw can continue to lie to their bs over an extended period of time and not feel guilty abut it, what does that say, and I am not referring to the bs?

I know it can be so hard to realize that you've invested so much emotional energy, time and more on someone who simply isn't capable of returning it. I think many of us have been there, whether or not it's an affair.

You fall into the trap of feeling like if you can just be a little bit better, give a little bit more, keep putting them first a little bit more then they'll be who you want them to be. If you just keep investing love, they'll eventually see how much you care and return that back.

It's like being on a treadmill.

You just keep running and running but get nowhere. hoping for something the person simply isn't capable of giving.

( sorry for the link...but it does show what I mean, and I also thought it might make you smile a bit...I don't know why, but it makes me laugh when I see it)
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Old 22nd December 2017, 9:29 AM   #67
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Originally Posted by PhillyLibertyBelle View Post
You’re missing the fundamental point

He wasn’t trying to get back with his wife, those were lies too because he was with OP at the same time.

I’m concerned at how you portray MM as having abdicated all of his own personal responsibility for his fidelity and thrown that responsibility on OP. If he’s working on his marriage go work on it.

Unless you think OP is that kind of movie star good looking with the body of a Playmate. Ultimately reconciliation is on the responsibility of the WS not the OW/OM
Of course anything the WS does is up to him, but the OW is not a passive player in all of this, she needs to take responsibility for herself.

A man who is ostentatiously reconciling with his wife, no matter how imperfect that may be in reality, is NOT a man to gamble her life away on.
She was not in the dark, she knew the state of play, yet she chose to ignore reality and live in a world of fantasy.
The OP was 1.5 years in NC, no meetings, no sex, what was she waiting for?
She cannot blame the MM for any of that really, yes he may have strung her along somewhat, but she allowed herself to be strung along.

How many women would stick by a single guy who was reconciling with his ex?
Not many.
Why in the world would it be OK when the guy is married?
It is just madness.
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Old 22nd December 2017, 10:39 AM   #68
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The OP was 1.5 years in NC, no meetings, no sex, what was she waiting for?
She cannot blame the MM for any of that really, yes he may have strung her along somewhat, but she allowed herself to be strung along.

.
ELAINE..not quite sure where you get I was no contact, just because I didn't allow myself to meet him for sex doesn't mean I didn't have contact with him via text, calls, skype..whatever

Please...you've beat the dead horse with all your comments on my thread. I appreciate your input, but dang...haven't you said the same thing 5 times already. I don't know what your story is (BW, AP, WS...but I know I wouldn't continue to badger you)
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Old 22nd December 2017, 10:41 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by PhillyLibertyBelle View Post
You’re missing the fundamental point

He wasn’t trying to get back with his wife, those were lies too because he was with OP at the same time.

I’m concerned at how you portray MM as having abdicated all of his own personal responsibility for his fidelity and thrown that responsibility on OP. If he’s working on his marriage go work on it.

Unless you think OP is that kind of movie star good looking with the body of a Playmate. Ultimately reconciliation is on the responsibility of the WS not the OW/OM
I don't think Elaine is missing the point. The OP
waited around for an unavailable man.

When I was dating and a single guy said marriage and settling down wasn't on The cards for 5 years... I walked away... and he didn't have a wife and family.

You can't go through life blaming others for your pain... when you caused it by getting involved with another woman's husband.

That's the starting point in accepting responsibility.

Now and again situations happen where you blame others... I've done it myself... but on reflection I realised that had I spoken up and put my foot down...the issue wouldn't have reached the point it did.

At the time I was so angry with another person... till I took responsibility.

It serves no purpose hanging around in hope that things didn't work put and he'd be yours.
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Old 22nd December 2017, 10:52 AM   #70
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OP, I was seven years. Even though it hurts, you will one day look back and be thankful it didn't drag out longer....like mine did. Then you get to the kicking yourself in the backside stage where you should have walked away sooner. But that's ok, life lesson learned.

Poppy nailed it. The MM's that string their OW along, build such a story that their M life really is terrible, no sex, roommate existence, separate interests, you're the only one for me and on and on. If the word narcissist had a picture beside the definition in the dictionary, it would be of my xmm. Jerk.

I too kept all the emails, texts and pictures....and not for sentimental reasons.
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Old 22nd December 2017, 11:29 AM   #71
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Of course anything the WS does is up to him, but the OW is not a passive player in all of this, she needs to take responsibility for herself.

A man who is ostentatiously reconciling with his wife, no matter how imperfect that may be in reality, is NOT a man to gamble her life away on.
She was not in the dark, she knew the state of play, yet she chose to ignore reality and live in a world of fantasy.
The OP was 1.5 years in NC, no meetings, no sex, what was she waiting for?
She cannot blame the MM for any of that really, yes he may have strung her along somewhat, but she allowed herself to be strung along.

How many women would stick by a single guy who was reconciling with his ex?
Not many.
Why in the world would it be OK when the guy is married?
It is just madness.

I don’t like those blanket statements that are repeated over and over again. I like to believe people and situations are different. In OP’s case, what she said was this:

“So in August after a couple of months of silence my Mom was sick, almost died in the hospital and he popped up again. So i asked him straight out what the deal was...why did he keep doing this to me. He said he still loved me and cared about me and didn't want me out of his life. To have faith that we had a future together

Well he has decided to finally file for divorce and take off that wedding band...”

So apparently he WAS working towards a D, bc he didn’t want to stay married any longer to his BW. These things happen. I don’t think it’s op’s fault that she believed what he told her. And I think what he told her was what he truly believed in that moment. The fact that he found somebody else later has nothing to do with that situation at all. It can happen to all of us. But telling the op that it’s all her fault and she basically has to now bear the consequences of her gullibility, bc she should’ve known that all cheaters ALWAYS lie when they say they want to get a divorce is not helpful. It just doesn’t always apply in all cases.
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Old 22nd December 2017, 1:16 PM   #72
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“So in August after a couple of months of silence my Mom was sick, almost died in the hospital and he popped up again. So i asked him straight out what the deal was...why did he keep doing this to me. He said he still loved me and cared about me and didn't want me out of his life. To have faith that we had a future together."
Ok but he could have told her any story he liked, but she didn't need to believe him did she?
That is where the unrealistic level of naivety comes in.
Silence for months then "I love you and I want to spend my future with you" - pull the other one...
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Old 22nd December 2017, 6:52 PM   #73
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Elaine I can sense from your posts that you have been hurt somehow and I get it. From your details I can see you have been around LS for awhile.

You must have some wisdom and constructive feedback to share instead of what you’re giving out.

OP admits waiting was foolish. No need to belabour this point.
He could have told her any story. Anyone could tell anyone any story true or false. Mostly you go on the assumption that people are telling the truth. To treat everything that’s said to you with suspicion and doubt makes one become an unhappy and paranoid person. Of course anyone wants to believe what someone they love says, they are human beings!

To make a blanket statement that no one who ever splits with a partner (married or not) after taking some space and sampling life doesn’t ever come to the realisation that actually they really loved the person they parted with.

OP has asked you nicely to stop posting badgering posts on her thread. I’m asking you to post something helpful and relevant that is constructive instead of taking pot shots with is beneath you and us too.


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Ok but he could have told her any story he liked, but she didn't need to believe him did she?
That is where the unrealistic level of naivety comes in.
Silence for months then "I love you and I want to spend my future with you" - pull the other one...
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Old 22nd December 2017, 8:09 PM   #74
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Ok but he could have told her any story he liked, but she didn't need to believe him did she?
That is where the unrealistic level of naivety comes in.
Silence for months then "I love you and I want to spend my future with you" - pull the other one...
I agree that she shouldn’t have waited because it’s been few months but LETS BE REAL HERE. She is obviously madly in love with this guy, just like the rest of us are/were in love with our exMM or exMW or whatever.

On a grand scale of things yeah it’s ridiculous that she waited but...when you’re in that situation....you don’t think straight at all, we all know that and have experienced that so it’s unfair to say “oh you should have seen it”.

Couple of months could be 3-4 months and it is not enough to simply move on from somebody who you are madly in love with, who comes back in your life and tells you that he/she loves you and wants to be with you....that’s a whole new level of manipulation that only a narcissist can pull off or somebody with severe BPD where they don’t know wtf they are doing and as you said are just doing it and meaning it at THAT moment, but few days later it’s back to the same old story.

The reason she is suffering the most now is because she was there with/for him thru thick and thin, he told her he loved her after she had a major life situation(mom). Of course she will fall for that story again because she loves him and believes him, why wouldn’t she?? We all have/had a hard time learning to judge our ex-mm/ex-mw based on their actions instead of their words so it’s super easy to fall back into the same situation. The reason is because you so BADLY want them to “change”, so when they bombard you with with “love” and all other things that come with it, you automatically think “omg, this is it, they ARE changing and we will be together now(finally!!) and it will all be ok from now on”.
I guarantee you when she took 1.5yr break she told him she is done until he figures himself out and if he wants to be with her, so when he comes back with “I love you” her brain automatically sinks her right back in the place because that’s what’s she’s expecting from her ex-MM and that’s how she programmed her brain, that one day he will change and be with her...(OP am I right or way off here but I think I’m right). Even thou she took 1.5yr break she actually never took it because her brain is programmed in a certain way which is amplified if there is contact and she stated they texted, Skype and all that. I guarantee that during that 1.5yr he was telling her how he hates his life bla bla bla which is more then enough validation for her brain to make her subconsciously wait for him....

So the OP was there for him, had him come back into her life and then just jump ship to a new girl. For those people who have experienced this situation, they know...the amount of pain/anger/confusion going on at the same time is indescribable...it really is, especially if you’re an emotional person. I personally remember in August holding my gun in my hand thinking how “easy” it would be to just end it all with just a gentle squeeze of a tigger and POOF, just like that all the pain is gone...that’s some scary **** man.

She is literally battling two battles in her brain right now.

One battle is the anger. Knowing that she did everything in her power for him to accept her and give her his love, she was there for him thru everything only to see him give his time and energy to a different new person, who was never there for him, had no idea how hard she “faught” for him, the stuff she has been thru because of him. It seems so unfair that the new person all of a sudden is more important than you, even thou the “new” person was actually never there for them for anything....this stuff messes with your mind BAD. I never understood how people could take their life away...I understand now completely how you can get to that point.

The 2nd battle is the disbelief. In her mind her ex-MM should have certain values that she fell in love with at the very beginning. In her mind she knows(or thinks) how he should act and whatnot but I guarantee you that she didn’t think he would go to a 3rd person SO QUICK in a million years. As a matter of fact I don’t think she even thought that option was going to happen so that’s why it’s such a shock that it DID happen.
This part of her brain simply cannot connect reality of what happened to the fantasy or I should say her “perception” of what should have happened and what’s she knows about him. In other words her perception tells her no way that happened, YOU KNOW that he would NEVER do that to you but than the reality shows her a different picture....that is something very hard to come in terms with and battle, it is extremely hard. I personally am still battling with it and I don’t wanna update my personal story until I am completely healed. Last post I did I posted that I was fine, and I was at that time, but over time you regress HARD when your brain starts connecting reality and you start understanding just how abused and used you were. It’s infuriating at that point and you STILL cannot distinguish reality from fantasy because you still love them even thou you hate them from the bottom of your soul.

It is my hope that within few days I can post something that will help her heal and move on faster. She’s is currently destroyed and our comments now shouldn’t be “it’s your fault you waited” but should be on how she can move on and heal because he will reach out to her again, I KNOW that, I am 1000% sure he will.
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Old 22nd December 2017, 8:25 PM   #75
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Origin,

I am constantly saying to myself nowadays...."SHOULDA SEEN THAT". Yes, I should have seen many things but I didn't. Just like many others here. It is hateful to have somebody rubbing salt into an already bleeding wound.

It has taken me almost 9 years to get the big picture of what happened with xMM. I am a very intelligent successful woman, who met the wrong person at the worst time in my entire life. He never let go... isolated me, and controlled me (and I suspect his wife) with the love bombing and constant attention
I feel as though my whole being has been destroyed by the A and it needs a complete makeover.

The disbelief is called cognitive dissonance. It is the most difficult thing to come to terms with. It is my opinion that there is a long battle ahead for many of us here.

Poppy
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