Delarocha Posted February 12, 2007 Posted February 12, 2007 Hello all, It's been a while since I have posted in here and I just felt the need to say hello and give an update on where I am in life. My wife is moving into her own apartment on Friday and will have the lease for at least a year. I guess in my mind I view this as pretty much the final step before an official divorce, and have accepted it. I feel I have done everything I can do, and am continuing to try and make myself a better person. I am trying to do things to make myself happy, but at times (like right now) I get very overwhelmed with a sense of loss and sadness. About a month ago I started taking relatively low doses of an antidepressant called effexor to deal with my depression and my general anxiety. Although it has helped tremendously it is not, nor did I expect it to be, any kind of magic bullet fix that makes me numb to the pain I am feeling. I am continuing my therapy sessions, reading, writing, and a regular workout schedule. I have not started lifting weights yet and my cardio workouts (combined with stress) have eaten all fat (and probably a lot of muscle) from my body. Since December I have gone from 170lbs to 150lbs and I really hope to not lose anymore weight. I am eating normally, sleeping well, and focusing a lot more clearly on general things like work. I have been a lot more social lately and do feel that I have a lot going for me. Now on to the tough part. There are times (especially lately) where I question why it is I feel about my wife the way I do. Why is it that I feel in love with her, but when hearing the garage door open (her coming home) will fill me with an anxious feeling. I have tried so hard to be happy around her even when I am truly not happy. The other day I woke up and felt sad (as I usual do in the morning). She could see I was upset and immediately got mad!.. I tried to tell her that I was just waking up, and needed a few minutes to get my thoughts together (and let my pill digest). Now I have not been upset around her in WEEKS because I have worked very hard at controlling my emotions (both for myself, and so that I don't make her feel guilty.) At this point she basically blows up and tells me how she is handling everything (which she kind of is) and I am being selfish and making her feel guilty. She said she hasn't even really been able to focus on herself, and think about us, or how she feels because she is so wrapped up in this and me making her unhappy. I am SO SICK of being responsible for her unhappiness, and told her so. I am starting to realize that she is incapable of love in the same way I am. I don't think she was EVER capable of that love. Hell, on our wedding night we were fighting and she was telling me she wanted an annulment. Well friends, I should have just listened then... but love is a bitch that blinds you. The fact is, I am being blamed for making her unhappy... so go... go on with your life and good luck. She told me once she didn't intend on ruining my life, but I feel empty inside and heartbroken. That said, I am in many ways pulling away from her emotionally and starting to see that I can be happy alone. Although, I still feel like crying even now. I do love her, and I don't want to. I don't want to feel this pain anymore and time has helped, but it doesn't seem like it will EVER be enough. I know now that part of what I am feeling is a codependent weakness in myself and part is my obliterated self image. I guess I see myself as weak, ugly, uninteresting, etc. even though I know these things are not true. I am trying to break through this with the help of my therapist and my own reading, but it scares the sh*t out of me that I won't. I realize now that I am in fact scared of being alone. Not so much in the immediate. I know that I can be happy and have a social life living on my own. I know that I can go out and have fun, and meet people. The problem is I don't know if I will ever find someone I see as beautiful who is equally fascinated with me. Part of the reason I married my wife is I THOUGHT I had finally found that. Although I am trying to better myself and be a confident and attractive person the fact is I will always be me. I have never been good with meeting attractive women, and I guess I have this fear of ten years down the road still being alone. The other side of this coin is I am not LOOKING right now. I am well aware of the fact that I am not, and will not, be ready for a long time to even think about dating. First of all, I am still married. Second, I need to work on myself a lot. Third, I don't know what this separation means exactly. Neither of us are currently wearing our wedding bands. I am not wearing mine because it just reminds me every time I feel it of what I am losing. I don't know where I am going with this other than a major fear I am dealing with. Like I said, it's not like I want to jump out and start dating. I just don't know what the hell I am doing, and know that I have enjoyed sharing my life with someone. I got married because I was ready to settle down and have those things. I am twenty eight years old, which I know is young, but I feel old. I feel I have missed out on so much. I want to have a beautiful person that I love. I want to have a normal sex life. Is it normal to fear never being able to acquire those things while your young enough to truly enjoy them? (Again, not now... someday) I guess it drives me nuts because my wife is beautiful and can go out and get any guy she wants. Women have that advantage I guess... I guess part of me trying to work out is trying to be physically attractive so when I get myself emotionally attractive (someday) I will be a whole person. Am I being crazy? ( I feel like it sometimes. ) *sigh* ok, I know a long post and not really any questions... I guess I was just spilling my thoughts. I know many of them are unhealthy and believe me I recognize that. I just am trying to figure out what is healthy and how to get there. I hope everyone is doing well.
Ladyjane14 Posted February 12, 2007 Posted February 12, 2007 Are you still on the low dose of Effexor, Del? You might want to talk to your doctor about either bumping up to the higher dosage or even changing meds. Sometimes it takes some time and some tinkering in order to get relief from your symptoms. Give it some thought. I'm no professional, but you still sound really depressed and anxious to me. You might also try reading some posts from other folks who've made alot of progress working through those feelings of loss. Sometimes it's uplifting to see that other people have made it through similar experiences and have come through it acually feeling more healthy. Debilou, Dgiirl, and CryingCanuck spring to mind.
OldEurope Posted February 12, 2007 Posted February 12, 2007 Dear Delarocha, First of all, no more drugs. Nada. It is not chemical "tinkering" you need, you simply need to bear a bit with the problem of romantic suffering and loss. You could develop a dependency on the drugs and then for problems, large and small, start to lose control. This is a very personal point of view, of course, but I am absolutely anti-drug in this (and all respects) as it will cover your problems, neither manage nor solve them. You are going to go through a series of emotional stages--some liken it to getting over the death of someone--and you take it slowly, with self understanding. In other words, you are supposed to be feeling mixed emotions, and extremes of those emotions here and now and for some months to come. Talk to yourself as if you were talking to a friend. Treat yourself "objectively". When you start to slide, begin to ask yourself questions as if your were helping a friend cope, or a coach getting a depressed star player back into the ring again. You will see a certain patience and calm emerge when you get into this habit. Whatever you do, do not get "frightened" by the kind of foreign emotions that will overcome you--new ones that you didn't think were part of your "normal" self. Your sub-conscious, your memories, and your "dark side" (i.e. all those fears and anxieties we push to the side in order to get throught the business of living) are all now going to go into overdrive. Just expect it and be patient with yourself. It is no "feel good" talk when people advise you to get busy. It is absolutely the best advice. It has to be creative busy though, intelligent busy. You need to feel your life having "worth" right now so if you add some interesting new study or hobby or health plan, you will feel self confidence again. That ol' self esteem is a finicky beast--needs to be properly fed and taken care of! Just remember Churchill at times like this: "When you are going through Hell, just keep going". OE:rolleyes:
Author Delarocha Posted February 12, 2007 Author Posted February 12, 2007 LJ, I am still taking 37.5mg twice a day of the Effexor. It actually has helped a lot, and I don't want to increase the dosage just yet. First of all, this week is just going to be extra stressful regardless. I mean she is physically going to be moving all her stuff this weekend, and I am going to go stay at a buddies place. Second, I have read a lot about this particular medication and apparently it becomes somewhat difficult to stop taking when you've been on large doses. I do feel a hundred times better about life in general than I did the last time I posted here. I am anxious for this week to be over because I know if she is not around I will have a chance to really start dealing with myself. I have been using this AD medication in the hope that it simply takes a bit of the edge off my social anxiety and depression, and it has. Taking the edge off simply has allowed me to once again focus mainly on living and working again. I do, as instructed by my doctor, take an extra pill (37.5 mg) when I am feeling overly anxious or depressed, but I try to limit that. What I do NOT want to do is use medication to not feel these things. I need to deal with why I feel these things and I am trying to reprogram the way I think. (This idea is not coming from some book, or my therapist, but rather my own way of explaining what I hope to accomplish.) Just an example here... (and I am sure this is common) Let's say I walk into a party and know one person there. I am so shy and quiet I will stand and talk only with that one person ALL night. I fear talking to new people for many reasons I won't get into here, but taking medication won't fix this. Only by getting over those fears and learning to take risks can I ever hope to improve my social skills and be more normal. I know I sound crazy, but believe it or not I have taken big steps (and risks) in making friends with people I normally wouldn't hang out with. I believe I might just be making a few new friends because of this whole situation. Anyway, I guess I just have not been and am not getting exactly what I wanted out of life. I thought I'd be in a stable, loving, romantic, and sex filled marriage. At least now I can face reality, but I admit I am somewhat scared. The question is what to do next with my life ... I think...
Ladyjane14 Posted February 12, 2007 Posted February 12, 2007 Just an example here... (and I am sure this is common) Let's say I walk into a party and know one person there. I am so shy and quiet I will stand and talk only with that one person ALL night. I totally understand that. I'm a rather anxious person myself, and social anxieties were always one of the most challenging aspects of it. I've learned in dealing with my own "worry wart" tendancies though, that this is also sort of a "lens" that I'm apt to look at life through. Good news is... knowing that the "lens" is there and that it's capable of distorting the image is half the battle. I think you're right on track. You're working with your doctor and with your therapist. You're doing all the right things in terms of keeping your body healthy. You're also correct that Effexor is one of the more difficult meds to wean from... but it's not a time released medication, and I've seen people break the 37.5's into much smaller dosages in order to wean off without discomfort. You should always work closely with your doctor when stopping ADs though. All I'm saying is.... don't be afraid to ask for more help if you get bogged down. Sure, there are emotional aspects to a break-up that must be dealt with and worked through. But by the same token... clinical depressions are very REAL in physiological terms. People who suffer from clinical depression aren't necessarily doing something wrong. They're not asking for it. It's not caused simply by having a poor attitude. It's a chemical imbalance within the body which affects mood and judgement. In some ways... it's kind of like the question of the "chicken and the egg". Depression can sometimes precede interpersonal problems. And in other cases, the emotional disturbance might be causal in the chemical imbalance.
mum2three Posted February 12, 2007 Posted February 12, 2007 Yes, it seems like the common line in LS for WAS. My H is the same way. Not only does he blame me for his misery but he is also arrogant, angry, and vengeful. So what you wife is doing is not surprising. She wants the divorce yet she is rejecting you, hurting your feelings, not feeling remorse, and then reacts angrily at you like you have caused all this to transpire. It is hard to see the light but I finally did. Ask yourself if your wife will care for you in a loving way anymore? Would she be considerate of your feelings? Could she even be your friend in the near future? Would she sacrifice anything for you? If they can't be there as a spouse or even a friend or treat you with any respect or kindness, it it time to let go. It is much harder for us since it isn't our decision and we were holding on to what we believe was love. But we have to realize that they redefined love and that is not what they are giving you anymore. Call up a good friend or blog here when you are feeling that way. You need some good support right now. It is good to hear from you.
Gunny376 Posted February 12, 2007 Posted February 12, 2007 The simple fact of the matter is that there are more women than they're are men. In fact, for the first time in American Histroy, 51% of all women are single. (US Census, MSNBC, Newsweek), if you get the current edition of National Georgrphic, it will show you a map of the US and in which parts of the the country where single women outnumber single men. In NYNY, there are 185,000 more single women than there are single men. This generally holds true for your major metropolitian areas. The older you get, the more women there are, just because of men dying doing stupid things, dangers inheirent to their jobs, etc. The reason, that so many women marry badly is because they're so few "Princes" aka guys that have their head and azz wired together, that have their act together. A man finding a good woman is easier than a good woman finding a good man. They're like a good job ~ they're out their, but what ones there are tend to be taken already, the people that have them intend to hang on to them and you're going to have to fight them to get them away from them. You're only 29, and you've got your whole life ahead of you. The truth be told and known, you, I and many of the rest of us had 1/10th of the education, knowledge, and experience to make a marriage work in the first place. It takes a Hell of a lot more to make it work in this modern day and age than standing up in front of the preacher and saying, "I do!" You're shy, reserved, your social skills are weak, guess what? All that can be overcomed. You're not good at approaching beautiful women? That too can be overcome. Goggle: Hellen Kreidman's Light Her Fire Program David DeAngelo's "Double Your Dating" Program Carlos Xuma's "Dating Dynamicss" "Secrets of the Alpha Male" Proogram Take dance lesssons, you can dance? You can get yourself another woman.
chadnickole Posted February 12, 2007 Posted February 12, 2007 Hello all, I hope everyone is doing well. Hey my friend, I hope all is as good as it can be. I know kinda how your feeling as alot of us here do, so you spill and spill and spill untill your heart is content!!! I'm in the same boat, buying the same damn farm and it absoulutly sucks!!! BUT and it is a Huge BUT!!! I would not take back what I have learned from this exsperiance, I'm getting and have gotten a so called life and it does make things easier..........Hell I'm still playing Ping Pong with my wife that girl is still back and forth!!! tell ya what it sucks when you wanna work on things and show you've changed, but you sure as hell can't force em!!! thing is Gunny is right "There are plenty of fish in the Sea!!!" And it just make take her/them seeing just how happy another fish is with us for then to realize what they gave up on !!! You never know what you have lost till it gone, we seen that when the wives walked away and they'll see it when we're scooped up by some other chick, I'm sorry we have got to go thru this crap for our eyes to be wired open but if that what it took for me than I'm all for it!!! There are a Ton of screwed up people all thinking that some other Man or Woman is gonna make em happy, the grass is greener an the other side Yadda Yadda Yadda!!! No grass is green when they're head is burried so far up their ass (or someone elses ass for that matter ) that they cannot see daylight!!! give em time and space let em pull thier head out and look to the sky!! Your in my thoughts, take care Chad
Author Delarocha Posted February 12, 2007 Author Posted February 12, 2007 Yes, it seems like the common line in LS for WAS. My H is the same way. Not only does he blame me for his misery but he is also arrogant, angry, and vengeful. So what you wife is doing is not surprising. She wants the divorce yet she is rejecting you, hurting your feelings, not feeling remorse, and then reacts angrily at you like you have caused all this to transpire. It is hard to see the light but I finally did. Ask yourself if your wife will care for you in a loving way anymore? Would she be considerate of your feelings? Could she even be your friend in the near future? Would she sacrifice anything for you? If they can't be there as a spouse or even a friend or treat you with any respect or kindness, it it time to let go. It is much harder for us since it isn't our decision and we were holding on to what we believe was love. But we have to realize that they redefined love and that is not what they are giving you anymore. Call up a good friend or blog here when you are feeling that way. You need some good support right now. It is good to hear from you. Well, the thing is my wife and I actually get along great for the most part. The more time passes the less I blame myself for my part in this whole marriage falling apart. Could I have changed some things about myself sooner?, absolutely. Do either of us think the other is completely to blame?, no. The thing is, right here and now I wanted to make things work because I am in love with my wife. However, she loves me but is not "in love" with me and wants more out of life. Ok, so I understand... and I am sure a day will come where we both feel that way and who knows where we go from there. I guess my point is that I do see us being able to be friends to some degree, just not right away. (Maybe never, who knows.) That said, I am done taking the blame for her unhappiness. She has not been the same person since her dad died and has not done much to face that. We both let ourselves fall into our own holes of depression and it destroyed our relationship. I think her being at home for months on end looking for a job changed the way she looks at life. When she had a job I think she felt differently about us. You are ABSOLUTELY right though, somewhere along the way she redefined what she feels "love" means. I guess when I asked her to marry me, and stood on that alter I felt the commitment we made was to work with one another through anything (excluding physical or mental abuse). At the very least I thought the commitment meant we would TRY to be with one another. I can honestly say that I tried everything I could. I have done and am doing my best. We went to one marriage counseling meeting that my wife showed up to thirty minutes late for and basically said she had already made up her mind. *shrug* What's the point in going back and spending $120/hr if there is zero willingness to try. I do feel better about at least knowing sooner or later I will pull my heart away from her. I see a light at the end of the tunnel now. I am certainly disappointed, embarrassed, scared, and at times resentful. However, how can I blame someone for how they feel? If she knows she doesn't love me, and never will love me the same again, then she's making the right choice. I honestly don't understand how you agree to marry someone, ask for a separation a year later, and then tell that person it wasn't right from the start. It makes me scream in my mind, "Why did you say 'I do'?!?!" I feel a bit cheated in life as this experience has made me never want to marry again. I just don't see the point as the "commitment" of marriage is meaningless in this day and age. I feel like even if I meet someone I may have wanted to marry they will always feel like they were my second choice. I find myself wondering what kind of person I am, what kind of person I could stand being around, and am just generally confused. My plan is to spend the next six months to a year of my life focusing on being the best person I can be (for me). I've been trying to figure out what that means exactly, but it's a slow process. I have always been a "quick fix" kind of a guy, and it just isn't going to work for this. I know this post was rather dark, but I actually feel good. I know in a year I will look and feel completely different. This website has really been a great outlet for my feelings. I know most of my posts are probably ignored, and maybe that's a good thing. I tend to ramble on and repeat things, but this writing process is a LOT about me figuring it out as I go. I appreciate those that do read and those who respond. I hope someday when I know what the hell I am talking about that I can help others. For now, all I can do is say thanks...
mum2three Posted February 13, 2007 Posted February 13, 2007 I forgot you were only 29! Emotionally, you sound light years ahead of my 34 soon to be exH. You have got a whole world waiting out there for a nice guy like you. Don't worry about not finding someone else. You have really come to know yourself. You have a lot to offer. The only thing holding you back would be your past. You have financial/job stability, career focus, friends, and no children from the marriage. So you have leverage into getting back in the game. When my H left for 2 wks 6 yrs ago b4 the birth of my first son, I should have divorced him then. I don't think I knew myself well enough to have the guts to do that and love is blind. We never addressed communication issues to the core so it seems like a premonition to what has transpired today. Now he is leaving me again but this time, the stakes are high since i have 3 toddlers. I haven't worked the last few years and job/financial stability is an uncertainty. So i have my plate full and alot of challenges to face especially with custody arrangement. Hence, i see the grass is greener on H's side and yours. But maybe I will have better opportunities w/o him. I just need to move forward and not look back. I honestly don't understand how you agree to marry someone, ask for a separation a year later, and then tell that person it wasn't right from the start. It makes me scream in my mind, "Why did you say 'I do'?!?!" I feel a bit cheated in life as this experience has made me never want to marry again. I just don't see the point as the "commitment" of marriage is meaningless in this day and age. That is exactly how I felt especially just having my daughter 2 yrs ago. It just doesn't make sense. How can i choose to have a child with somebody who is not going to make an effort to stick it out? If they were conceived out of love, then why break up the family a year later? What is trying your best and shouldn't one go to the moon b4 throwing in the towel? I feel like my daughter has been cheated out of a loving family with a full-time mommy. But i just have to accept that he doesn't want to fix it. Sounds like your W since she doesn't even want MC either. I don't know how much therapy is going to take for me to "get over" this. Hopefully, you will find resolve soon too. Keep your chin up! We'll all make it thru at LS.
Author Delarocha Posted February 13, 2007 Author Posted February 13, 2007 mum2three, Thanks... I REALLY needed to read your post this morning. Last night was one of the worst nights in my life. We are trying to rush together this separation agreement and I have caused such enormous problems. Basically, I just don't want anything from my wife. I don't want her responsible for any of our debt, or any mortgage payments. BUT, I don't know if I can refinance and still afford to keep the house. (I am worried refinancing on my own will be at a much higher rate, even though I make more money now than when I financed.) So, basically if I cannot refinance I will be forced to sell... and if the house sells for less than we payed my wife will not agree to split the remaining balance of the mortgage. I understand she wants to walk away clean without worry, but it leaves me in a tough spot. I felt guilty trying to bring that up so late in the game, so I just completely lost it, felt beat up, and spent most of last night alone in the dark crying. I am going to call my mortgage company this morning and see what to do. I know they probably won't be able to tell me much. I know I have a year (basically) to refinance... I am so sick... She has stated multiple times how she doesn't want to take me to divorce court, but will if she has to. She wants to be able to walk away from this situation clean, I get it. Last night was the first time in weeks I had horrible thoughts about hurting myself again. Never serious, but it scares me. I make good money for my age, but am clueless when it comes to this stuff. My own job is very technical and detail oriented, yet when I read financial and legal documents I feel like a toddler... Today is just a bad day. I am starting a new project and have to meet with my boss. AND I have to figure out this situation.. Anyway, thank you for your kind words... I needed them.
Ladyjane14 Posted February 13, 2007 Posted February 13, 2007 She has stated multiple times how she doesn't want to take me to divorce court, but will if she has to. She wants to be able to walk away from this situation clean, I get it. She wants to walk away "clean"? So??? I'm sure EVERYBODY who gets a divorce would like to. That doesn't mean it's gonna happen. Don't you lay down like a doormat and accept all the debt from this thing, Del. If there's any debt left... you make sure she gets her half of the bill. Later on down the pike, you're not going to be feeling as sorry for her as you do right now.... I promise you. Last night was the first time in weeks I had horrible thoughts about hurting myself again. It's important to work through your feelings whenever you're in a crisis situation. I think we all know that. But.... what I'd like to see you doing is stepping back from the situation a little bit whenever you find an emotion to be particularly overwhelming. That way, you can take a more "clinical" look at these feelings. It's okay to make a choice to defer these especially tough moments until later. You can say to yourself, Scarlett O'Hara style... "I'll think about that tomorrow". And then, when you're feeling a little stronger, drag that experience back out and examine it. Try to look at it and determine what's causing it and how you might better cope with it. You know, it sounds weird... but I tend to TALK to my "stinking thinker" when it's troublesome. I allow the duality of my emotional self and my logical self to communicate with each other. It's kind of like taking BOTH sides of a debate. My own job is very technical and detail oriented, yet when I read financial and legal documents I feel like a toddler... There's a couple of things you can do about that. One, is that you educate yourself on the subject in a more proactive way. Two, is that you ask for help from the experts when you need it. Someone once told me that if you really hate a particular chore... the way to make peace with it is to make it something that you're really good at. Bottom line... "This too shall pass", Del. The whole stinky situation WILL pass. When you look at some of the other folks around here... Gunny, for example... who are experiencing happy and well-adjusted lives, it's not hard to see that divorce isn't the worst thing that can happen to a person. For some of these folks, it's been more of a "beginning" than an "end". And it can be that way for you someday too. Believe it. The first step is to CHOOSE it as a goal. Bringing Del out of this situation, happy, and healthy, and better than he was before, needs to be your GOAL. :bunny:
Author Delarocha Posted February 13, 2007 Author Posted February 13, 2007 Thanks LadyJane, I have in fact chosen to be happy. I guess the problem right at THIS moment is I cannot truly progress with my wife in this house. I need a month or two of taking care of EVERYTHING on my own before I feel my legs stop wobbling under me. I like your approach though. I cannot possibly be confident until I experience those things on my own, so I will think about it later. I am always amazed by the quality of responses and what seems to be a genuine caring by everyone here at LS. Over the past few months I have really gone through several stages of both grief and self awareness. I honestly can say that I am not sure I could have done any of that without a little direction and sometimes harsh reality checks by those here. I find myself at a crossroads in my life. I can continue to live the way I have in the past and be content, happy sometimes, but mostly bored and wanting more; or I can take this ugly painful experience and try to make something amazing happen from it. Obviously I choose the later, but I admit there are times it would be far easier to just continue living as I was. I am currently floating on the surface of my own ocean of self pity, but at least I'm not under the water anymore. There IS a difference when you know not necessarily HOW you're going to get out, but that eventually you WILL get out. I know it's a hack analogy, but I feel my eyes burning today from a night of crying. For what? Why am I torturing myself? Was life THAT great in my marriage? The answer is... not really. So yeah, love was there, but that was it. Sometimes love is not enough, especially one sided love. I feel very strange today, almost calm. I'm trying to take your advice LJ and step back and look at this situation more rationally. I need to take some time to dwell on the positives in my life, because the past few months have been nothing but dwelling on everything that's wrong. Right now feels very much like either the calm after or before the storm. I hope it's after.
Author Delarocha Posted February 16, 2007 Author Posted February 16, 2007 Well, Update for all. My wife left for work about ten minutes ago. She is moving out this weekend, and I am staying at a friends. So, this is officially the last time we will live together possibly ever. Who knows. She was very sweet to me, and I tried my hardest to be strong. As my eyes welled with tears I just tried to bite my tongue as hard as I could and keep strong. Honestly, however, this is much harder than I thought it would ever be. I know that us being separated right now is the only answer to all the problems we have (both individually and the relationship, whatever that is). There is no promise of what the future holds, and I will not hold on to false hopes. We plan on having fairly constant contact, and I know this is a good and bad thing. I will need some time to get to a place where I don't look at the relationship we have as a marriage. As I write this all I want to do is curl into a ball and cry, but I won't. I will not slip back into my old ways!.. I will not let these hard earned changed go!... Today is not really a day for advice. I suppose I just need some words of encouragement, or anything anyone can give me. I know when I am done here I WILL cry, and I feel weak. I don't understand why God has placed me in this position in life, but I do know I can't blame anyone but myself. I am probably not making much sense, so I guess I will just stop. I am just hurting at this moment very bad. This pain in incredible, and even a few kind words from some of you might help. I know it's asking a lot, and I thank you all so much from the bottom of my heart for your past words. If you believe in God, please pray for me. I need strength now more than ever. -Me
PWSX3 Posted February 16, 2007 Posted February 16, 2007 If you believe in God, please pray for me. I need strength now more than ever. -Me I feel things do happen for a reason and we may never know what they are, but God does and you just have to trust him. It sounds to me that you are being positive about the situation even though deep down its hard and you are keeping it friendly and that is the only thing you can do at this time. You haven't flown off the handle & and if you show the W respect (even though she is moving out) she will down the road have respect for you I feel. Coming to LS will be the best medicine, it was for me and you know people here are going threw or have gone threw the same thing so they will understand. After all the dust has cleared you will be a better man!
Ripples Posted February 16, 2007 Posted February 16, 2007 You're getting such good advice here, so I have nothing more to add but hugs and to share a story with you that the following thing you said reminded me of My own job is very technical and detail oriented, yet when I read financial and legal documents I feel like a toddler... I know of a lady who was divorced after being married for 30 years. The same year she divorced she had to do her tax return on her own for the first time. She had no idea where to start so she called the Inland Revenue for some help with it. She was put through to this guy who after being told of her predicament, said in the most patronising tone "Madam, I really can't see why you would have a problem, it's terribly simple" To which she replied "Look, sonny, can you make a brioche?" She got all the help she needed and a date with the guy!
Gunny376 Posted February 16, 2007 Posted February 16, 2007 I don't understand why God has placed me in this position in life, Sometimes God whacks us upside the head with a 2x4 to get our attention, so that we'll wake up, and learn what we need to learn, and grow into the person that we need to be. The intersting thing about it is, that He just simply lets us have "free will" and like a little child do it "our way". Its hard for you to see it right now, as it was when I went through it, but I've definately grown, and learned from it all, and I'm definatley a better and different person than I was all those many years ago. The "storms of life" are rolling over you right now, and they just keep coming and coming ~ but this too will pass. The sun will come out again, and a smile will be upon your lips and laughter in your voice. There will be heartache, and their will be emotional pain, but you will adapt and overcome, and come out a stronger and better person for the experience.
Author Delarocha Posted February 16, 2007 Author Posted February 16, 2007 Thank you again everyone. I read every word posted and have to admit that right at this moment I do feel a bit better. I have yet to understand if everything does in fact happen for a reason, or if life is simply a series of random events chained together. Either way I suppose we make those events count for something and live life the way we want OR we simply "accept our fate" and pretend that we have no control over what happens to us. Believe it or not, I do see that I must take this situation and learn from it. I feel that I have been both types of incompatible partners in various relationships throughout my life: the heavy and the doormat. In the past I have been the one who takes their partner for granted, does what they want, and makes every moment about themselves regardless of who's feelings get hurt along the way. When I met my wife I was in the process of regretting that lifestyle and flip flopped into the role of doormat. Whatever I could do to just make her happy (right or wrong) I did. If I felt something was going to "hurt her feelings" or rock the boat in any way I did not do it. Rather than take a stand and be a man I consistently backed down to avoid confrontation. I viewed all these things as strengths in the relationship, after all how could my wife become unhappy if her husband does whatever is necessary to let her do whatever she wants. I viewed conflict as a weakness in the relationship. Only after the fact can I see how this pattern of behavior not only reduced my self image to rubble, but also removed any respect my wife may have had for me as a strong, attractive, and worthy partner. I began to hate myself in not only the way I acted and felt, but in the way I looked. As I grew more and more contemptuous towards myself I also became increasingly dependent on my wife and the relationship as something that defined me as a good person. "Look at me! I may be a thin ugly guy who is too fragile to stand up for himself with others, but I have this amazing beautiful wife and therefore I must be a real catch." As more and more time passed it became common hat to simply ignore problems in the relationship rather than deal with them. After all, if I question the direction this boat is sailing I might upset the captain. Further isolation from my friends and family was merely a byproduct of my own co dependence and fear of making things even worse. I see now all the times my wife tried to tell me, tried to show me, tried to get me to help myself. After a while it all became too much for her to even want to try and deal with. Love, as it seems, is both the strongest and the most fragile concept. When it's there is seems as though nothing, no matter how frightening, can make it retreat. Yet it can be lost, or hidden, in what seems like the blink of an eye. I will smile again someday. In fact, I have no doubt that even today I will have times where I feel like laughing. I realize it may only be for moments, and only when I am distracted by being with friends. That's ok. I can only deal with the here and now. That said, I do have plans for the future. My future will involve getting to know myself. I know that I will never be the most suave or outgoing person on the planet, but I can be something more than I am now. I guess I figure as long as I am honest with myself and others, I can never really look back with regret. I have what seem like very long term goals, perhaps life long goals. At first I looked at achieving these goals as the only way to be who I want to be. Thinking about it now, it is much more accurate to say that the journey towards achieving those goals is far more important. A hack concept I know, but very true. I may never feel totally comfortable introducing myself to strangers, but just by working towards doing so will make be (at the least) better at it. I may never be able to fully understand and react to my emotions, but I have no doubt that I am better at it today than I was yesterday. Right now I am wounded and healing. I know these scars will be with me for the rest of my life, but in time they can't possibly hurt as they do now. As a bonus, I hope that this pain will in fact teach me. Wow, another long (and probably boring) post. I don't know where the above came from, it just kind of flowed onto the page without me thinking. I read the responses to my earlier post and my thoughts just flowed. Let's hope I am walking the right path this time. I don't want to flip flop into some other self destructive behavior. All I can do is what I THINK is right.
what2donow Posted February 16, 2007 Posted February 16, 2007 So how did you realize that being a "doormat" (I really don't like that word!) wasn't healthy? How did the light bulb finally go off? I'm asking because you could have written your last post about my H. I have been really trying for over a year now to get him to understand that I want a partner to go thru life with, not someone that just tags along and does what I want just to avoid a "fight". He just dosen't seem to get it. Like you said, he thinks I should be the happiest woman on earth. Looking back now, was there anything your wife could have said or done to make you realize all that before a divorce?
Author Delarocha Posted February 16, 2007 Author Posted February 16, 2007 So how did you realize that being a "doormat" (I really don't like that word!) wasn't healthy? How did the light bulb finally go off? I'm asking because you could have written your last post about my H. I have been really trying for over a year now to get him to understand that I want a partner to go thru life with, not someone that just tags along and does what I want just to avoid a "fight". He just dosen't seem to get it. Like you said, he thinks I should be the happiest woman on earth. Looking back now, was there anything your wife could have said or done to make you realize all that before a divorce? To be completely honest what2donow, I am not entirely confident that I have achieved my goal of "not being a doormat." All I can say, is that I finally realized that my behavior (although outwardly passive) was actually a way for me to manipulate situations. I hate to use the term passive aggressive, but in hindsight that is exactly what it was. Now, I want to be clear that this was not an intentional act. Although I take 100% responsibility for my actions, I also take 100% responsibility in being the one who finally woke up and saw the truth. My wife really did nothing in the way of helping me to see these things. Her ways of telling me these things was far from supportive or constructive, which only caused me to react by getting upset, getting defensive, and generally turning things back on her. In reality, if I could have seen then what I see now I would have worked on the real cause of the problems (my depression, anxiety, low self esteem, apathy, etc.) rather than work on the symptoms (staying home rather than going out, closing myself off to friends and family, not taking care of daily chores, not doing things to show my wife how I love her.) I feel that as this all was happening I needed her to fill some void in me by constantly reassuring me of her love. No matter how many times she would tell me she loved me it couldn't have ever been enough. That said, I would get completely down and dirty with your husband. If you love him and want to be with him (and he feels the same) than you both CAN change. Keep in mind that it's not only him that needs to change, and in fact he probably won't be the one to take the first step. I have never been a big Dr. Phil fan, but his book Relationship Rescue might be a great place for you to start. I truly feel if I had picked that book up six months ago my marriage would be in a completely different place. It's not like it's a magic bullet, but rather some ideas on how to connect with your partner and share how you are REALLY feeling. I know the first reaction to this is, "My situation is unique so how can a book possibly shed any light on what I am feeling?" Well, if you look around at the other men posting on this forum MANY of the stories are carbon copies of mine. I think men in general tend to focus on fixing the symptoms of a bad situation. I know this is an enormous generalization, and maybe I am way off base but let me give you an example. You stay late at work (or school or whatever) one night and arrive home to find things a disaster. You're husband is sitting on the couch watching tv and the sink is full of dishes and laundry is piled high. He sees you upset and the first reaction is to clean the house and do the laundry. In his mind, if he accomplishes this all is well with the relationship and you should now be able to switch into happy mode and join him on the couch. In fact, maybe the next time you are out late he cleans and does laundry before you arrive home because he has correlated (in his mind) those things getting done with you being happy. The real cause of the problem, however, may be the fact that you just wish he thought about how YOU felt. You feel that he is ignoring your feelings by sitting on the couch rather than being considerate of your time and energy and helping out. I know it's a simplistic and maybe silly example, but you can see how the man (in this case) has grasped nothing of what the real problem was. Rather he focused his attention on the side effect of him not thinking about you. So, when something else not related to cleaning and laundry comes up where he doesn't think about how it effects you; you get angry again because "he did it again!" Anyway, I know I'm no expert... but in my case I know I really had my head buried up my backside. Only when I stepped back and looked at how my supposedly generous actions actually looked (from another perspective) could I see what reality was.
what2donow Posted February 18, 2007 Posted February 18, 2007 Hey Del, thanks for the post. I do think my H is passive aggressive, in fact, our MC has told him that too. Unfortunately, he tossed that opinion out the window because he doesn't agree. We are fortunate in that we are able to sit down and have discussions without yelling or getting hateful.. most of the time anyway! I've explained with specific examples of his actions and how I interpret them. Example: one of the "issues" is that we don't pray together as a family; I do with the kids most every night and when he's home, he's watching tv or on the computer. I used to ask him every time if he wanted to say prayers with us and he would eventually come, but after several minutes and we were almost done. So I quit asking. He usually quit coming in. So at Christmas, he bought and wrapped a present for himself and put it under the tree. Come Christmas morning, he takes it, makes sure I'm looking, and opens a Daily Devotional book. Then makes a point of saying that he's going to do this every day. I know this is his way of saying "See, I'm trying", but it almost made me angry! Stupid, I know, but why make a big production? I need him to do things for himself, not because I want it or it's important to me, but strickly for himself. The first few weeks, he made a point out of reading it in front of me. I ignored him just to keep from feeling manipulated and angry about it. Anyway, sorry to be dumping on your thread I've bought and we've both read Divorce Busting, so maybe we'll try that Dr. Phil's book you mentioned next. Couldn't hurt at this point. I hope you're staying strong and focusing more on those positive days than the negative ones. I think just recognizing that it's all like a big roller coaster, full up ups and downs, helps with those down times. Keep posting--I'll be watching for ya!
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