piggin_string Posted February 13, 2007 Posted February 13, 2007 I agree...unconditional is like saying the word "never"....I can love someone with all of my heart and think that I am in it for ever, but let a man touch a child inapropriately or something of that nature and I can assure you that the emotion I had will disappear quicker than you can spit......don't believe in unconditional love...except in children....
Topper Posted February 13, 2007 Posted February 13, 2007 Yes she does have a life and her life is being my little sex slave. Don't pay any attention to me I'm in a really goofy mood this evening
dropdeadlegs Posted February 13, 2007 Posted February 13, 2007 While I do believe in real love or true love (basically an unselfish love, not one sided as in "what betterment do you bring to my life" but more like "how do we enhance one another's lives") I am skeptical of unconditional love. As many have stated I do place conditions on a love relationship. It may be a matter of semantics, but I can't use the word unconditional.
RecordProducer Posted February 13, 2007 Posted February 13, 2007 Insomnie, your avatar seems to describe you better than you think. If he claims he loves you unconditionally, how does that make HIM take YOU for granted? If anything it implies the opposite: that you can take him for granted, because he would love you no matter what. In the least what he said was BS, but he, of course, didn't lie to you; he believes that's what his feelings are. Don't obsess with what he said, just take it as an "I love you very much" statement. You shouldn't take ANY relationship for granted. And this one already had its downs and break-ups. The term unconditional love does not apply to "events" that can occur and ruin a relationhip. So you're saying that as long as she doesn't do something to hurt HIM, he loves her unconditionally. But if she does hurt him then the love becomes conditional. "Unconditional" is a word that you can't apply in a romantic relationship, unless you want to describe pejoratively that someone loves their partner in a sick way. He would love her if she killed someone, right? But as long as it's not his mother... cuz that would ruin their relationship. So he would love her even if she gains 100 lbs or stinks really badly. Even if she loses a body part in a terrible accident, God forbid! As long as it doesn't jeopardize their relationship, of course... If she becomes an alcoholic and a drug addict, he will still love her and never leave her. Oh, wait! We didn't say he wouldn't LEAVE her, we just said he wouldn't stop LOVING her. Right. He would dump her, but still love her unconditionally. WTF is "love" anyway? It applies to more static traits and qualities. To unconditionally love someone, you love their personality, faults, weaknesses, appearance, and silly quirks. Once an event occurs that is disruptive to a relationaship, UL goes out the window... You're right about that!
Author insomnie Posted February 13, 2007 Author Posted February 13, 2007 I'm not sure I believe in it either, and of course it is a matter of degrees and semantics...but I think what he meant was that as long as I did not act completley out of character for who I basically am (by cheating on him or beating him, for example) he loved me no matter what. Of course that is a condition in itself, but it's the only one. I think what he meant was that he had accepted my flaws, does not have any expectations for my behaivior as long as it's not on the side of "exteremely hurtful and out of her character", and would love me no matter what choices I made about my life, as long as they were not made with the sole intention of hurting him. Basically, he has absolutely no desire to judge me for anything. Maybe this is perfectly normal for a relationship....and perhaps "unconditional" was not the right word to use (accepting or nonjudgemental would have worked better)... but my relationship is finally headed that way. That's a big step for (if I am honest about some of MY flaws) two very judgemental people. I also wanted to point out that loving someone and accepting their unacceptable behaivior by remaining in a relaitonship with them are two different things. If he cheated on me I would not stop loving him right away....but I would stop being together with him and would make an attempt to cut him out of my life and move on. That's called not being a doormat. So in that sense maybe some of our love IS more unconditional than peoeple give it credit for being.
Touche Posted February 13, 2007 Posted February 13, 2007 I commend you for not ever accepting being a doormat BUT by that virtue your love is NOT unconditional. There are many conditions attached to love for another and one of them for you is that you are never going to be in this relationship if you have to act like a doormat. I loved my ex-H like no other. He treated me like a goddess....at the beginning. But it changed. He became domineering and verbally abusive. That's where I had to draw the line on my "unconditional" love. No such thing as unconditional love unless you're the biggest doormat in history...and you clearly are not.
Author insomnie Posted February 13, 2007 Author Posted February 13, 2007 don't be available for him 24/7. Don't spend all weekend with him. Have other plans. See him no more than 2 times a week. Don't call him. Let him call you. Return calls every once in a while. Don't tell him everything and everyone you do other things with like go to movies, etc. Be nice to him, of course.....but don't be so available. He is getting too familiar with you and bored. There's no mystery left about you, there's nothing new for him to learn about you. The 'chase' and excitement is gone. Have other plans on Friday nights sometimes, don't have a routine of automatically spending it with him. Gotta shake things up a bit and get him wondering....get The Rules. Do these things, you will be a more independent woman with your own interests who doesn't hang around constantly with her boyfriend and become too familiar (and boring) to him. It's not playing games, it's becoming your own person. Yes, you can (and should) use the rules even if you have been together a long time, even after married. They will work. I have been doing this on a guy I have been seeing a month and he has already called me his girlfriend and calls me a few times a day. Drives him crazy that I am not so predictable and not falling all over him and chasing him like he's used to (he's rich & good looking so he's got lots of women after him) and not calling him. You have to get this feeling with this guy because right now, I'm sorry, in about 6 months he's going to break up with you, as magichands said...he's not thinking marriage with you. Total....wow. I agree that people in a relationship should have their own lives (and I do), but I'm not looking to trick anyone into marrying me. That's what your "rules" boil down to: pure manipulation. Instead of getting to know somoene as well as possible for the sake of the pleasure of intimacy...instead of spending time together and being there for someone for the mutual benefits involved in healthy relationship....you want to reduce relationships to a chase and a series of games. I WANT him to know me well...that's the entire point, of relationships, for me. I want to be understood as well as possible, I want a witness to my life, to who I am...and for me that happens best when I have one person to share most of my life with. If your "rules" are what it takes to get and stay married...I am not sure I want to have anything to do with marriage. Ever read the Marriage boards? Lots of misery...and I wonder if it isn't because some of those people were duped.
RecordProducer Posted February 13, 2007 Posted February 13, 2007 Very well. I walk away with my tail between my legs to fight another day.Hahah! You are cute. Frankly, I don't think you said anything different from anyone else here; you just elaborated the semnatics of the word "unconditional" and admitted that romantic love is NOT unconditional. But some people can't recognize a similar opinion, unless you state "I agree!" with bold letters. I'm not sure I believe in it either, and of course it is a matter of degrees and semantics...but I think what he meant was that as long as I did not act completley out of character for who I basically am (by cheating on him or beating him, for example) he loved me no matter what. Of course that is a condition in itself, but it's the only one. I think what he meant was that he had accepted my flaws, does not have any expectations for my behaivior as long as it's not on the side of "exteremely hurtful and out of her character", and would love me no matter what choices I made about my life, as long as they were not made with the sole intention of hurting him. Basically, he has absolutely no desire to judge me for anything. Maybe this is perfectly normal for a relationship....and perhaps "unconditional" was not the right word to use (accepting or nonjudgemental would have worked better)... but my relationship is finally headed that way. That's a big step for (if I am honest about some of MY flaws) two very judgemental people. Insomnie, I agree with you. I just said that people SAY things that they don't think the next day anymore. He loves you "unconditionally" today, but tomorrow he may experience a change of heart. I thought I would die for my ex-husband; a year later I almost wished he'd die, that much he hurt me. Just accept his words as a love statement and don't read too much into it, because it's pointless. Total....wow. If your "rules" are what it takes to get and stay married...I am not sure I want to have anything to do with marriage. I believe that those "rules" really "work" but not in the sense that you can simply manufacture certain behavior for the sake of making the marriage work. I think clinginess always leads to misery for both partners as a rule, but you can't remove that pattern, by inserting another rule and following it. That just doesn't work. We can only observe marriages and derive conclusions that certain patterns work while others don't. Strategies don't work long-term. We want closeness and intimacy. If we have to play games, it may yield with some results, but only at the expense of the connection between you and your partner. The moment you fake or hide something from your partner knowing that telling him the truth (such as "I want to be with you all the time!") will only push him away from you, the fear and dishonesty make you feel very distant from them. I speak from my own experience. Only pure, genuine, close, trustful, and mature friendship between two people can bring true long-lasting love worth experiencing. Everything other than that is total bullsh*t and not worth the hassle... especially not the hassle of playing mind games. Only emotioanlly empty people play games in the long run and feel good about it. Total, you are trying to attract your guy by being hard to get and by intriguing his ego. That's short-term. Maybe your goal is to catch a rich, handsome guy, but Insomnie's goal is to have a healthy, close relationship so your rules don't apply in her case.
kbah Posted February 13, 2007 Posted February 13, 2007 I don't believe in unconditional love for romantic relationships...sometimes even friendships. I'd say my future children will be my only unconditional loves.
the_total_package Posted February 13, 2007 Posted February 13, 2007 and not being clingy (If you say 'I want to be with you ALL the time' to a guy...well, this is not a way to endear yourself into his heart.) You actually develop MORE intimacy in this, because you have separate interests, and the other person isn't your 'world'....I'm sorry but the OP's boyfriend isn't feeling the spark of passion anymore, she needs to not be spending so much time with him and being clingy, and spending the entire weekend with him. Make other plans on Friday nights sometimes, start out in baby steps. Don't always JUMP when he asks to do something. He will love you MORE. I'm not saying don't be intimate, DO be when you are together. You will have more to talk about not clinging on each other 24/7, it will be CONDUCIVE to intimacy actually. It's not manipulation, or games, it's having a life....because if you don't have a life, your life becomes all about the guy, he's gonna get bored and realize he has a 'cling-on' on his hands and feel about her like she's a SISTER, like he is now. That is what the unconditional love thing he's talking about. He ain't proposing anytime soon if she doesn't get a life. The talk he had with her this past weekend she should take as a HUGE wakeup call to get a life (do the rules.)
RecordProducer Posted February 13, 2007 Posted February 13, 2007 How did we come from her BF telling her he loves her unconditionally (which in other words means loves her a lot) to him being bored of her, because she is too available for him? Did she say anything like that somewhere? Having a life and playing games are two different things. Some people spend 24/7 together and their relationship is great. Some people spend 24/7 in the same room and are very distant and lead separate lives. Some people don't see each other more thna once a week and still are very clingy. Clinginess comes from lack of love - when the relationship is one-sided. All those books that impose rules are written for frustarted people and most of all, htier purpose is to make money, not to help. And you don't make money by saying "Be spontaneous and play by ear." You have to make up something artificial. It's no different than any other ridiculous mental wash machine, such as psychics or astrologists or magic stones, etc.
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