herenow Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Why is it that when MM tells the OW he loves her and that his marriage is miserable, the OW is convinced that the MM is telling her the truth and that he only lies to his wife, but, when the MM wants to go NC or he tells the OW that he is happy with his wife and he doesn't say he loves the OW, he is covering up something and there has to be another truth behind his words?
saintfrancis Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Why is it that when MM tells the OW he loves her and that his marriage is miserable, the OW is convinced that the MM is telling her the truth and that he only lies to his wife, but, when the MM wants to go NC or he tells the OW that he is happy with his wife and he doesn't say he loves the OW, he is covering up something and there has to be another truth behind his words? I don't know if this is really answering your question - however I never assumed that my ex-MM was NOT lying to me. In fact, the fact that I knew for certain that he was lying to his wife and children made me keenly aware that he may be doing the same to do me. Ultimately I found that he was indeed, lying to me too.
Author herenow Posted February 6, 2007 Author Posted February 6, 2007 I don't know if this is really answering your question - however I never assumed that my ex-MM was NOT lying to me. In fact, the fact that I knew for certain that he was lying to his wife and children made me keenly aware that he may be doing the same to do me. Ultimately I found that he was indeed, lying to me too. Exactly. It goes both ways. What I don't understand is how so many OW can pick and choose what they want to be the truth and then when it doesn't go their way the MM must be hiding something. So many threads about what NC means. I just don't get it.
saintfrancis Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 I don't know either, herenow. I was an OW, it's true. There was a time in the beginning when the love was at its height where I really did think he wouldn't hurt me. I guess I was just blinded by love. But that trust gave way as I saw how he treated his family, and eventually, me. I can't speak for other OW out there. Maybe they are living with far too much hope in their hearts. Hope can be a very powerful thing. It was for me.
Meredith63 Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 My MM never told me his marriage was miserable, that his home life was terrible, that his W was a b*tch. He did tell me he loved me. I just assumed that, if he was with me, that was where he wanted to be. However, had he told me that he was in love with his W and his homelife was fine, I certainly would have been out of there. While I don't believe that ALL MM lie, I'm actually not even sure that mine even lied to his XW, I do believe that both BW and OWs are selective about what they choose to believe as the truth.
Author herenow Posted February 6, 2007 Author Posted February 6, 2007 While I don't believe that ALL MM lie, I'm actually not even sure that mine even lied to his XW, I do believe that both BW and OWs are selective about what they choose to believe as the truth. I agree that there has to be some sort of denial on the part of everyone involved including the MM. What I don't understand is why when a MM goes NC with an OW, there is any question about what it means.
BenThereDunThat Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 My sad truth is I never fully believed him. I was pretty much hateful to him throughout. He took A LOT of abuse from me. I knew he was a liar and a cheat, but I was so low and got addicted to the very thought that someone who I perceived as "smart" telling me he LOVED me (puke). In poring my heart out to him over the divorce, I gave him every single tool he needed in order to manipulate me. So, he would tell me some nonsense, I would float on that for a day or two, then I'd be back into b***tch mode, calling him everything but a red-headed step-child. And if I ran out of my own stuff to say, I would even read some stuff here where people were REALLY going off on the MM. I'd cut and paste the meanest stuff and send that to him too! Then he'd whine. Why are you so meeeean to me?? Damn. Guy sure musta been horny to put up with that. If someone said to me the things I said to him....
Author herenow Posted February 6, 2007 Author Posted February 6, 2007 My sad truth is I never fully believed him. I was pretty much hateful to him throughout. He took A LOT of abuse from me. I knew he was a liar and a cheat, but I was so low and got addicted to the very thought that someone who I perceived as "smart" telling me he LOVED me (puke). In poring my heart out to him over the divorce, I gave him every single tool he needed in order to manipulate me. So, he would tell me some nonsense, I would float on that for a day or two, then I'd be back into b***tch mode, calling him everything but a red-headed step-child. And if I ran out of my own stuff to say, I would even read some stuff here where people were REALLY going off on the MM. I'd cut and paste the meanest stuff and send that to him too! Then he'd whine. Why are you so meeeean to me?? Damn. Guy sure musta been horny to put up with that. If someone said to me the things I said to him.... Hey BTDT, so many people on this forum could learn so much from you. I guess there are a few that are not ready for that type of education.
Meredith63 Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 I agree about the NC stuff. If my MM had ever told me he wanted NC to work on his M, think about his life, contemplate his navel, whatever, I'd have been out of there so fast his head would have spun.
Author herenow Posted February 6, 2007 Author Posted February 6, 2007 I agree about the NC stuff. If my MM had ever told me he wanted NC to work on his M, think about his life, contemplate his navel, whatever, I'd have been out of there so fast his head would have spun. Sure you would, why would you waste your time with someone who is being honest about not wanting to have any contact with you? Makes a lot of sense to me.
BenThereDunThat Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Hey BTDT, so many people on this forum could learn so much from you. I guess there are a few that are not ready for that type of education. What's hilarious about it all is that the physical aspect was very brief and ended very early into it. So all that crap he took from me was in the HOPE that I would one day jump back into bed with him. Not that I'm so great, but he's just that pathetic. I know I can't respond to anyone directly with my point of view. If you're not ready to listen, you're not ready to listen. I was plenty willing to listen to, and believe, what people were saying to me. Then I'd have those small windows where I'd let myself think 'maybe, just MAYbe....' and I'd be in fantasy land for a little bit. In hindsight, I see I was using it all as escapism. It gave me something else to think about other than my divorce. He's not even someone I would be attracted to if he were single. Yeah. Try and figure THAT whole train of thought out. I sure can't!!!
Salicious Crumb Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Why is it that when MM tells the OW he loves her and that his marriage is miserable, the OW is convinced that the MM is telling her the truth and that he only lies to his wife, but, when the MM wants to go NC or he tells the OW that he is happy with his wife and he doesn't say he loves the OW, he is covering up something and there has to be another truth behind his words? A MM that wants to cheat will tell the OW whatever she wants to hear to get in her pants. But really...maybe these women that wonder such things should try to find their own man and quit fueling the cheating men's fire?.....hmmm?..maybe?....I don't know.
NearlyThere Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Why is it that when MM tells the OW he loves her and that his marriage is miserable, the OW is convinced that the MM is telling her the truth and that he only lies to his wife, but, when the MM wants to go NC or he tells the OW that he is happy with his wife and he doesn't say he loves the OW, he is covering up something and there has to be another truth behind his words? Why some people albeit OM/OW would believe that there is some kind of cover up. JIMO - If MM was to say to me, I no longer wish to see you, or however he was to word it, then that would be it. Why carry on wanting to be with someone who no longer wishes to be with you. If he was to say he was happy with his wife then I would either wonder then why he was with me or presume I was a kind of FWB. As for him not saying the words "I love You" , well, I believe those words are spoken far too easily, lightly and quickly and in some ways have lost their importance and meaning. Love is more than just the word, IMO. BTW - before anyone assumes anything from that I have been told. HN - a question for you, not disagreeing with what your saying but just moving on slightly, but do you not think that people who try to cling onto a relationship when 1 half has said that they want out can apply to all types of relationship and not just one involving someone who is married. NT
Author herenow Posted February 6, 2007 Author Posted February 6, 2007 HN - a question for you, not disagreeing with what your saying but just moving on slightly, but do you not think that people who try to cling onto a relationship when 1 half has said that they want out can apply to all types of relationship and not just one involving someone who is married. NT Oh absolutely. I think it applies to everything in life. I know that people cling to their hopes and dreams. Look at all those people on American Idol that beg for another chance while Simon is showing them to the door. I think that sometimes people ask for the truth and are not ready to accept it. But, when you're talking about relationships, as much as someone would like things to be different, it's time to move on when another person is clear that they don't want to have any contact with you. I'm sure it's hard, but at least there is no question about how the other person feels.
Je Ne Regrette Rien Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Why is it that when MM tells the OW he loves her and that his marriage is miserable, the OW is convinced that the MM is telling her the truth and that he only lies to his wife, My MM didn't tell me that his marriage was miserable. And I was never convinced that someone who lies to his wife would never lie to me but, when the MM wants to go NC or he tells the OW that he is happy with his wife and he doesn't say he loves the OW, he is covering up something and there has to be another truth behind his words? If my MM went NC (which I encouraged him to do on an occasion before) I would not be waiting in the wings. No contact is No contact. To me, NC should be called "MOT" [Move on time] I think it's unusual for many MM just to say "I'm happy with my wife. I don't love you. Please leave me alone now". I think that may be where some OW have problems understanding NC - it's all in the delivery... "I love you so much, it's just that my wife's dog is ill, all I ever wanted was to be with you, but because of my wife's dog I'm going to put my own hopes and dreams on hold and try to just hold it all together whilst I dream of the life I could have had with you. This is sooooo painful" Blah blah blah
sadbuttrue Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 my MM has told me that he is unhappy at home, but he does not talk about his wife in a derogatory manner to me. i know he is lying to his W, and i am always on guard that he may lie to me as well. i do not just assume he is truthful with me. he has never asked for NC, but if he did i would respect it. i have told him multiple times that if he needed to stop seeing me, i would understand. he just keeps telling me that he wants to be with me, kind of ironic since he wont leave his W.
puddleofmud Posted February 7, 2007 Posted February 7, 2007 I think that, perhaps, in the END persons such as myself (EX-MM just disappeared) don't know WHAT to think so in order to comfort ourselves we dig in our heels and begin to analyze every word, nuance and gesture. This is not uncommon via any break-up, is it? One's mind searches and searches for something for comfort, especially when one is an emotional MESS? We need to believe that there must have been some redeeming factor, something to which we can cling other than just the F OFF notice (or lack there of). Perhaps later one may come to an understanding that one has been "played" / "abused"/ "fooled"--or even that the subject of one's desire is just GONE for whatever reasons, etc. but one does not wish to feel the fool at initial the impact of the break-up. I feel that it's just normal to want to feel loved when "love" leaves even if one makes irational excuses or genuinely believes that love is/was a factor. This may be one aspect of how one emotionally SURVIVES the loss. And surviving the loss is immediate lest we all swirl the proverbial drain and go down to places we can't get back up! Better for one to kick and scream believing one was loved than having to face that one was less than loved. Later, maybe months or years, one may know better--but it's a process and every one is different in how they handle their process. Sigh...we all do our best, don't we?
Babybird Posted February 7, 2007 Posted February 7, 2007 Why is it that when MM tells the OW he loves her and that his marriage is miserable, the OW is convinced that the MM is telling her the truth and that he only lies to his wife, but, when the MM wants to go NC or he tells the OW that he is happy with his wife and he doesn't say he loves the OW, he is covering up something and there has to be another truth behind his words? My MM tells me he loves me and that his marriage is miserable. She goes to bed between 6:30 and 7 in the evening(she gets up at 4:30). When he comes home she doesn't say hello or ask about his day. They very rarely go out together. She hates that he plays softball, bowls, and golfs even though these are things he has always done. They haven't had sex since Oct. There anniversary is on my birthday. Think I was born to interfere?? LOL I know he lies to her and I know he lies to me. His lies to me are more to protect my feelings. I know this because when I catch him, and I always do, it's double the hurt and thats why he hid it. He has to be covering up because the OW has such low self-esteem that she can't be with a single man and doesn't recognize her own self worth. That's what many here would say. I think it's just because it hurts to damn much to think he doesn't want you or he wants her more.
GreenEyedLady Posted February 7, 2007 Posted February 7, 2007 Sure you would, why would you waste your time with someone who is being honest about not wanting to have any contact with you? Makes a lot of sense to me. If that's what he's actually telling the OW... From what I've seen the OW goes NC and the MM keeps calling... and calling.... and calling... and calling... and texting... and did I mention calling...
casoria99 Posted February 7, 2007 Posted February 7, 2007 Sure you would, why would you waste your time with someone who is being honest about not wanting to have any contact with you? Makes a lot of sense to me. In my relationship we both ended it and we both got back together. If NC means ending it, then we did it too many times. But it was just a part of the relationship. It wasn't healthy to always end and get back together but that was the pull of it because the "honeymoon" phase was always great and then the cycle, a VICIOUS cycle, would repeat and we would end it once again. Also, we believe him the same that the wife believes him. My exMM, I found out, had slept with other women and he was caught with me but still kept coming back to see me. This last time was it for me and him. I am tired and fed up! So she also believed him that he was done seeing me just like he was done seeing the other women. I think that all the women are lied to. And as a woman, if I listen to him and I am the OTHER WOMAN, and we are having a good time, then why would the WIFE, who is also a woman, think that they are having a good time and there is nothing wrong. Neither of us know that we are being lied to. And neither of us know the truth. At least in my situation, I spent the entire time trying to stop the confusion. And with the last year, I told him that he had a politician/lawyer way of answering questions. He was good at giving answers that would make your heart melt and then when LOGIC kicked in, I realized that I was still in the same boat. We even joked about how noone could tell the truth from his conversation but because you are so drawn to him, you believe him. He has a very docile, kind-hearted nature so you would never expect him to be a liar. I think that OW don't know what's the truth because it's only enought of the truth that the MM wants to say to keep screwing and cheating. We are all women, emotional beings, and just fall for the same lines as the wife. The difference is that we have an opportunity to heal from it to the point that we can rid ourselves from him. Whereas the wife will always have her self-esteem based on the words coming out of his mouth and how do you ever trust him completely. And what type of eggshells you have to walk on to hope that you are acting right so he doesn't get mad and go cheat again. It's a man's world....
casoria99 Posted February 7, 2007 Posted February 7, 2007 If that's what he's actually telling the OW... From what I've seen the OW goes NC and the MM keeps calling... and calling.... and calling... and calling... and texting... and did I mention calling... I agree. OW go in NC all the time...but the man can't handle it. And wives want to think it's the OW that is chasing but the man pursues quite often.
casoria99 Posted February 7, 2007 Posted February 7, 2007 I think that, perhaps, in the END persons such as myself (EX-MM just disappeared) don't know WHAT to think so in order to comfort ourselves we dig in our heels and begin to analyze every word, nuance and gesture. This is not uncommon via any break-up, is it? One's mind searches and searches for something for comfort, especially when one is an emotional MESS? We need to believe that there must have been some redeeming factor, something to which we can cling other than just the F OFF notice (or lack there of). Perhaps later one may come to an understanding that one has been "played" / "abused"/ "fooled"--or even that the subject of one's desire is just GONE for whatever reasons, etc. but one does not wish to feel the fool at initial the impact of the break-up. I feel that it's just normal to want to feel loved when "love" leaves even if one makes irational excuses or genuinely believes that love is/was a factor. This may be one aspect of how one emotionally SURVIVES the loss. And surviving the loss is immediate lest we all swirl the proverbial drain and go down to places we can't get back up! Better for one to kick and scream believing one was loved than having to face that one was less than loved. Later, maybe months or years, one may know better--but it's a process and every one is different in how they handle their process. Sigh...we all do our best, don't we? Wow! Very well stated. I needed to read this. I created a post about no contact and what it was. I wrote in my post that I don't have closure because he gave me the F Off and I am taking the middle finger as a "get out of jail" card and ready to roll the dice for my own life now. But I did say that I was looking for some appreciation, but what you wrote is exactly how I am feeling right now. I am looking for some redeeming factor to say that the time spent was worth it. And right now, I don't see it but I am surviving!
frannie Posted February 7, 2007 Posted February 7, 2007 Why is it that when MM tells the OW he loves her and that his marriage is miserable, the OW is convinced that the MM is telling her the truth and that he only lies to his wife, but, when the MM wants to go NC or he tells the OW that he is happy with his wife and he doesn't say he loves the OW, he is covering up something and there has to be another truth behind his words? It takes a lot to get me convinced of anything. I've never blindly accepted anything MM has said to me... it's been hard the whole way, especially reading a lot of the threads on here about how they're all liars, if he lies to her he'll lie to you because he's a liar... over and over and over. Apparently 'once a cheater always a cheater' only applies if he ends up with the OW, which is ironic, eh? If he cheated ON you once, he'll cheat ON you again... nope don't see that one very often. If my MM said he wanted to work on his marriage and wanted NC I'd respect it, not contact him, and hope that what he was doing would make him happy in the end. Truly. I think that if an OW gets the 'Please leave us alone we love each other and want you out of our lives' email... well it's not hard to see where that one is coming from, is it..? Plenty of men stay married for reasons other than their stated 'yes, I love you and want to work on the marriage'. A couple of men on Separation and Divorce are talking about exactly that right now. FAKING IT to continue the marriage, because they don't want to lose their children. It happens.
sadbuttrue Posted February 7, 2007 Posted February 7, 2007 i truly believe my MM is unhappy at home, and yet he is unwilling to leave his children. i love him and want to be with him terribly, but if he wanted to make things better between him and his W i would totally respect that. i want him to be happy above all else, and since he is planning on staying with her forever, he should find happiness there. i do realize that finding happiness with her would mean the end of us. i think there are always sacrifices made when there is love between two people.
pricillia Posted February 8, 2007 Posted February 8, 2007 Hey BTDT, so many people on this forum could learn so much from you. I guess there are a few that are not ready for that type of education. Here now we don't need your education... just support and discussion, everyone has to go through things on thier own before they realize what the truth actually is.
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