serial muse Posted January 31, 2007 Posted January 31, 2007 Yeah, that was my mindset as well. I also told her that while I'm all ears if she wants to talk about it, I'd rather focus my time and energy on forming new, pleasant memories with her than reliving bad stuff from her past. She didn't fully agree with that. That's interesting...I wonder if she somehow took that as a rejection of her. Obviously that's not what you intended, but I wonder if a previous BF or anyone else reacted in a way that made her hypersensitive to rejection by men as a result of the rape. So that she saw wanting to talk to you as a sign of trust, and therefore cycled into anger, bitterness and rejection when you said you didn't want to relive it with her. (Not that you meant it that way.)
Author tanbark813 Posted January 31, 2007 Author Posted January 31, 2007 Given her experiences, I think it's natural for her to have some behaviors towards men/dating/etc. and memories that trigger her experience. But it sounds like she's going off on your for things that aren't related to those "triggers," am I correct? I mean, what were you supposedly "doing wrong all weekend"? Yes. The stuff I was doing wrong is outlined in my post at the top of page 2. Not asking her details about the rape was another thing she thought I was in the wrong about. For example, I have a problem with "jack rabbit" sex because THAT is a trigger for me of what I personally experienced. I also have a complete inability to have sex with a guy who's intoxicated if I'm not as well. For other girls, you can't touch their neck. Walk behind them. Wear a beanie. Follow me? Those are the sorts of triggers where you should be "understanding." I can't think of anything specific actions like that that she's freaked out about or asked me not to do. While it's a horrible experience, it's just like any other in the sense that you can't use it as an excuse for being a ****head. Unfortunately, many people play the martyr role and expect you to tolerate levels of bulls*t that you never would with anyone else just because they deserve a "politeness handicap" on the account they were assaulted. It's a horrible experience, and something that the victim has to deal with in life... it will obviously make relationships (particularly physical relationships) with men a little more difficult/awkward/different/whatever. But by no means does it give the victim free license to behave as she is. Yeah, that's basically what I was saying to her at the end of the conversation. I am, actually, willing to give her a little more leeway given her experience but there's still a limit. But telling her that pissed her off enough that she just hung up on me. In addition, your description of her emotional sounds very up and down, up and down...with very high peaks and very low-lows. The general affect of a rape victim is depression...low, low, low, and for a very long time. I suspect she might also have some sort of manic disorder that may have been triggered by this trauma. Yeah. She tends to be pretty bubbly and energetic when things are cool but she can quickly change to being extremely emotional and sad.
Author tanbark813 Posted January 31, 2007 Author Posted January 31, 2007 That's interesting...I wonder if she somehow took that as a rejection of her. Obviously that's not what you intended, but I wonder if a previous BF or anyone else reacted in a way that made her hypersensitive to rejection by men as a result of the rape. So that she saw wanting to talk to you as a sign of trust, and therefore cycled into anger, bitterness and rejection when you said you didn't want to relive it with her. (Not that you meant it that way.) Hmm.. It's possible that the past bf she referred to as selfish didn't want to talk about it and she took it that way. That's a complete stab in the dark though. No idea if that's the case.
Star Gazer Posted January 31, 2007 Posted January 31, 2007 TB, it sounds like every aspect of your relationship revolves around her rape. Have you lost a parent/friend/close family member? A job? Had a serious illness? Been seriously injured in an accident? Been beaten up by a huge bully? Been jumped by some punks outside of a bar? God forbid you ever do. Not trying to equate her experience with any of these, but she's using her experience as an excuse for poor behavior and REAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALLY bad communication.
Author tanbark813 Posted January 31, 2007 Author Posted January 31, 2007 I finally heard back from her today. It was just a one paragraph email. It was pleasant but basically said that she wishes things would have turned out different and "It is frustrating to like someone so much, but feel at the same time like they just don't understand you. I wish there had been that understanding." Oh well. I guess that's that.
Art_Critic Posted January 31, 2007 Posted January 31, 2007 I kinda thought you did understand her pretty well... You have even made adjustments for her past.. Do you think her perception of the relationship is skewed ? or even things maybe got confusing for her and she doesn't see things the same way as you ? Sorry Tan.. I wish I could actually give you advice.. but I can't.. How do you feel about her ?.. Is there anything that is worth fighting for ?
CaliGuy Posted January 31, 2007 Posted January 31, 2007 I finally heard back from her today. It was just a one paragraph email. It was pleasant but basically said that she wishes things would have turned out different and "It is frustrating to like someone so much, but feel at the same time like they just don't understand you. I wish there had been that understanding." Oh well. I guess that's that. IMHO, this is a blessing in disguise for you. If it's this bad now imagine how much worse it would be if you were really serious. Until she's over it she won't be dating material for anyone. Like I said, I don't think she is a bad person, just not in a position to date. She's going to think (and rightfully so) that no man can understand her. Until she lets go of it she won't be ready.
Author tanbark813 Posted January 31, 2007 Author Posted January 31, 2007 Do you think her perception of the relationship is skewed ? or even things maybe got confusing for her and she doesn't see things the same way as you ? I'm sure that's the case. But I also think that two people in a relationship usually view the relationship as a whole at least a little differently. It's probably just a little more pronounced in this case. How do you feel about her ?.. Is there anything that is worth fighting for ? I like her a lot. Aside from this issue, which is a pretty big one, pretty much everything else was cool and we had a lot in common. I don't think I'd necessarily fight for the relationship though, partially due to pride and partially because past experience has taught me that that's generally fruitless.
Author tanbark813 Posted January 31, 2007 Author Posted January 31, 2007 She's going to think (and rightfully so) that no man can understand her. Until she lets go of it she won't be ready. Yeah, I agree.
alphamale Posted January 31, 2007 Posted January 31, 2007 TB813....stay the **** away from this chick. She's totally messed up and she'll suck you down into her own hell-hole.
Author tanbark813 Posted January 31, 2007 Author Posted January 31, 2007 TB813....stay the **** away from this chick. She's totally messed up and she'll suck you down into her own hell-hole. Well that may be a bit exaggerated but I do think things will be easier with a girl who's more stable.
alphamale Posted January 31, 2007 Posted January 31, 2007 Well that may be a bit exaggerated but I do think things will be easier with a girl who's more stable. dude stay away from this broad...i mean it.
Star Gazer Posted January 31, 2007 Posted January 31, 2007 I finally heard back from her today. It was just a one paragraph email. It was pleasant but basically said that she wishes things would have turned out different and "It is frustrating to like someone so much, but feel at the same time like they just don't understand you. I wish there had been that understanding." Oh well. I guess that's that. So she's BLAMING YOU? That's not cool. She sounds very passive-aggressive.
Author tanbark813 Posted January 31, 2007 Author Posted January 31, 2007 I wrote her back and basically said that I think she still has some issues to work through, that 5 weeks isn't enough time to fully understand someone, and that I'll miss her too. Then she jumped on IM and got mad that I was being hurtful.
nicki Posted January 31, 2007 Posted January 31, 2007 Hey, Tan, sorry to hear about what happened. It's no surprise. She kind of set things up to turn out this way, whether she realizes it or not. I have experienced quite a bit of abuse in my life, and I have done the same thing with men. I couldn't trust anyone, most of all myself to judge a good man. No doubt things WILL be easier with a more stable woman. What helped me heal WAS the constant patient love of people around me. I needed someone to love me even when I was acting very unlovable. It was a kind of "test" that I put men through....not saying it was right, just what I did. My sister rescued me from my behavior by asking me what i NEEDED. I tended to discount what I needed as not normal, or as too much. My sister told me that it didn't matter. I needed what I needed and I had to be upfront about it...and go find people who could give that to me. In my case, I needed unconditional love and constant reassurance, as well as complete honesty and transparency in the relationship. Many guys simply couldn't give me that. That was okay. I had to find the right guy and let him know what my needs were. Then I had to let him decide if he wanted to take that on. I understood not every guy would be able to do that....it's a big job, and you really need to love the woman in order to get a long term payoff. So, you did the best you could. From all of your posts here, I know you are a sensitive and thoughtful person. Let yourself off the hook on this one.
Art_Critic Posted January 31, 2007 Posted January 31, 2007 So she's BLAMING YOU? That's not cool. She sounds very passive-aggressive. This is an interesting view point.. I didn't read her email that way until I re-read it.. Now I do see what SG sees... She did blame you for not understanding her instead of accepting that things just didn't work out.. Maybe you need to back away from her at this point.. I see this going up in smoke quickly
Touche Posted January 31, 2007 Posted January 31, 2007 Yep, StarGazer took the words out of my mouth...drama queen. And my feeling is that she was like that before the rape. I always say that a good relationship shouldn't/doesn't need so much "work." I think you handled it just fine. Look we ALL have baggage of some sort...whether it's a rape, abuse or something else. There's still a good way and a bad way to handle things. She obviously doesn't know how to act appropriately in a relationship. With the right girl you won't have to constantly prove yourself worthy or have to jump through hoops. You'll see.
Author tanbark813 Posted January 31, 2007 Author Posted January 31, 2007 My sister rescued me from my behavior by asking me what i NEEDED. I tended to discount what I needed as not normal, or as too much. My sister told me that it didn't matter. I needed what I needed and I had to be upfront about it...and go find people who could give that to me. In my case, I needed unconditional love and constant reassurance, as well as complete honesty and transparency in the relationship. Many guys simply couldn't give me that. That was okay. I had to find the right guy and let him know what my needs were. Then I had to let him decide if he wanted to take that on. I understood not every guy would be able to do that....it's a big job, and you really need to love the woman in order to get a long term payoff. Yeah, before she logged off IM she said something about needing to be with someone who can give her that understanding. I don't think she's yet at the place to be able to make that clear though. So, you did the best you could. From all of your posts here, I know you are a sensitive and thoughtful person. Let yourself off the hook on this one. Thanks.
Touche Posted January 31, 2007 Posted January 31, 2007 I wrote her back and basically said that I think she still has some issues to work through, that 5 weeks isn't enough time to fully understand someone, and that I'll miss her too. Then she jumped on IM and got mad that I was being hurtful. She sounds really immature. Guess she wanted you to beg her or something. I'm with the others...no great loss here. You can do better.
Author tanbark813 Posted January 31, 2007 Author Posted January 31, 2007 Maybe you need to back away from her at this point.. I see this going up in smoke quickly Yeah, that final IM convo just now was the last little bit of each of us saying what we need to. There aren't any hateful feelings but it's done now. Yep, StarGazer took the words out of my mouth...drama queen. And my feeling is that she was like that before the rape. I always say that a good relationship shouldn't/doesn't need so much "work." I think you handled it just fine. Look we ALL have baggage of some sort...whether it's a rape, abuse or something else. There's still a good way and a bad way to handle things. She obviously doesn't know how to act appropriately in a relationship. With the right girl you won't have to constantly prove yourself worthy or have to jump through hoops. You'll see. Thanks. And I agree.
stace79 Posted January 31, 2007 Posted January 31, 2007 My suggestion would be that she see a counselor herself. My rape was almost nine years ago, and I am still dealing with after-effects, including nightmares and not being able to accept that it wasn't all my fault. Just because she works as a victim advocate does not mean she has dealt with her own emotions and trauma. Other than that, I don't think there is much to do. Rape victims can act pretty irrationally and illogically...I should know. Blaming them or telling them to "get over it" just doesn't work...healing is on their own time, and that can vary so much from person to person. I think being supportive is very important, but sometimes there is not enough support anyone could give to make a victim feel better. Maybe you could even look into attending a counseling session with her once in awhile to work on things together?
Author tanbark813 Posted January 31, 2007 Author Posted January 31, 2007 My suggestion would be that she see a counselor herself. Yeah, I suggested that in my reply email when I said that I think she still has some issues to work through but she got offended by that. Maybe you could even look into attending a counseling session with her once in awhile to work on things together? I'd be down for that if she wanted to work things out but she doesn't want to see me anymore.
dropdeadlegs Posted January 31, 2007 Posted January 31, 2007 Yeah, I suggested that in my reply email when I said that I think she still has some issues to work through but she got offended by that. I'd be down for that if she wanted to work things out but she doesn't want to see me anymore. Looks like she missed out on something good from here. Didn't she hear you sing? *melting*
CaliGuy Posted January 31, 2007 Posted January 31, 2007 Then she jumped on IM and got mad that I was being hurtful. Do you see what I mean, TB? She's still angry and resentful at what happened (and she does have a right to be) but it seems to me that her needs outweigh everything, including yours. That's a win/lose situation. She wins, you lose. The only good deals in life are win/win.
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